I've actually even put a Skulking Geist in my control evolve/token Shaman deck haha.
Honestly, I'm probably 50/50 vs druid so far. I have a lot more trouble vs the highlander Kaza/Raza/DK priest... That's where the real bs is haha.
And how is your ..Evolve spell doing ? It takes you much to realize that you don't have it anymore after you play Geist?
You are like the second guy I saw here saying that it works well with Evolve Shaman. The fuck ? It's all RNG , so there is a very high change that you didn't even used 1 Evolve, let alone 2, before you get Geist. So then what?
Thrall DK helps a lot in that matchups. They have no removal for big minions, once you evolve for good it's over for them
I just did a turn 4 Ultimate Infestation and then snowballed like crazy and some people are trying say that druid is fine atm?
Well a lot of strong decks can highroll. Another example is Murloc Paladin from Un'Goro (they can do the same now as well) by going Vilefin Inquisitor/Murloc Tidecaller turn 1, into Rockpool Hunter / Hydrologist (worse option, but allows your murlocs to curve out), into Murloc Warleader on 3 and finally Gentle Megasaur on 4 which is gg on the spot unless your opponent draws the nuts and its more consistent then the turn 4 UI. Besides how often can you get all the Ramp necessary and UI by turn 4?
I am sure you are talking about TempoStorm. Those are arbitrary ratings made by Hearthstone pro players affiliated with TempoStorm, whose owner, Reynad, has been very negative on Druid of late, surely you can see that these ratings are very biased. In fact, the only very good decks in that list are Jade Druid and Aggro Druid. A more realistic resource to use for that is Vicious Syndicate's Data Reaper Live feature and eventually the Report when it comes out, where you can clearly see that Murloc Paladin and Pirate Warrior have higher winrates than any Druid deck (with Ramp and Malygos Druid not even considered to be top archetypes). This site also happens to track games to provide its statistics and not the opinions of pro players (I hope you can agree that facts are a more realistic measure).
Jade Druid and Aggro Druid are definitely Tier 1, but talks of Tier S are just Reynad pushing his salty narrative on all of us and trying to enforce that Druid needs to be nerfed to the ground even though its not overperforming. It is true though that if Jade Druid keeps performing very well they may nerf it to the ground for the same reasons they did Quest Rogue (basically building the meta around itself), but we first need to see if this situation will last for long in the first place, its only been a week into a new expansion, which pushed a lot of Control decks and experimentation with unrefined Control decks that can be reliably punished by Jade Druid.
In the end this attitude displayed by the community isn't positive at all. The more people and sites like TempoStorm push that Druid is broken the more likely it is that more people will play it (even though actual statistics from sites that track games don't support this), to exploit its strength, which will in turn lead to the people complaining about it to feel even worse about facing so many of them. In fact, if this continues Druid will definitely be nerfed, but you will get about 1 month of Druidstone first, for Blizzard to treat this case just like they did with Quest Rogue (i.e. strong deck that doesn't overperform, but because its being run by a lot of people and causing frustration to a lot of people is eventually nerfed).
I honestly think hearthstone is currently in one of it's worst meta's since the GvG days. It's sad to think that because of how overwhelmingly powerfull the current teir 1 decks are, threads like this have to exsist..
Druid is beatable, but for a higher percentage of players it's clearly too hard.. I feel blizzard need to start doing a community test environment before releasing new expansions in the future... It takes the community under a week to find anything overpowered and un-fun..
Yep. This expansion skyrocketed the power creep to unhealthy levels. Anyone who says it's OK is playing a broken deck and doesnt want to not win anymore
I've been playing evolve to lately and if you don't Mulligan into evolves and the minions to combo you're going to fall so far behind.
Druid was just given the ultimate Swiss army knife card with UI. Even with shit draw you just draw or ramp into it and overwhelm.
With shaman you devolve their buffed taunts and fingers crossed they don't refill their hand. I'm about 50/50 evolve against druid and I'm a mutli time legend player with 1k+ wins on shaman. That's not good, imagine your more casual or inexperienced player...
It is weird, my 2 last games vs jade druid I win with...
QUEST ROGUE!!!
Forget the old quest rogue trying complete the quest fast as possible, the quest is like your very late win condition, no more weak bounce minions only shadowstep, you play with the DK, Vanish, Shadowcaster, Firefly and Doomsayer.
The plan is draw, play minions, remove until you play the DK, in turn 10 the opponent have a full size board of big minions, you vanish and put 2 doomsayers for be sure you get an empty board in your turn, in your turn Shadowcaster combo itself and all 1/1 copies turn 5/5 because the quest, with duplicates saps you play big minions much more faster can opponent can replace, and win.
It is weird, my 2 last games vs jade druid I win with...
QUEST ROGUE!!!
Forget the old quest rogue trying complete the quest fast as possible, the quest is like your very late win condition, no more weak bounce minions only shadowstep, you play with the DK, Vanish, Shadowcaster, Firefly and Doomsayer.
The plan is draw, play minions, remove until you play the DK, in turn 10 the opponent have a full size board of big minions, you vanish and put 2 doomsayers for be sure you get an empty board in your turn, in your turn Shadowcaster combo itself and all 1/1 copies turn 5/5 because the quest, with duplicates saps you play big minions much more faster can opponent can replace, and win.
I would love to try that if I had the DK and the Quest... :(
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The Roshambo to Hearthstone. Please be nice. Don't insult or be mad at someone for throwing Rock.
Because Druid is a good control class. If you play Pirate Warrior which takes no skill at all, you're going to lose. Besides, I've found Druid to be fairly easy to beat. If you're playing against the Taunt style control druid, it's easy. Priest makes a mockery of them it seems with dragonfire potion, mass dispel, and any other impactful AoE. Plus, if you have fairly big minions yourself, it's even easier. It seems to be about value in a mirror matchup against control decks.
It is weird, my 2 last games vs jade druid I win with...
QUEST ROGUE!!!
I'm glad that this deck is being explored a bit post nerf. Usually a strong deck that gets hit by the nerf bat gets abandoned, then a few months later it gets revisited and people find that it's still a strong deck if played a different way. I can't tell you how many times miracle rogue and freeze mage went through that cycle from beta to it's current state.
Hearthstone released its Knight of the Frozen Throne expansion last week, and while it always takes some time for the metagame to truly be sorted out, one conclusion can already be drawn. Druid is strong. That’s not news, as rain or shine Druid is always strong in Hearthstone, but with Frozen Throne, Druid has reached a new level of power that hasn’t been seen in a very long time, and little else can compete.
Unlike Journey to Un’Goro there isn’t one deck or card you can necessarily point to with Druid and say “this is the problem,” like you could with Caverns Below Rogue (win rates aside, it was a clear blight upon the game). But the entire Druid class, which has always been powerful, has been given new tools that combine with its old tools for some truly unstoppable decks. And something may need to change as a result.
Here are the problem cards according to the amateur and pro Hearthstone community, as well as what I’ve personally experienced on the ladder.
1. ULTIMATE INFESTATION[/b]
I mean, you can just read that text and probably understand why it’s an issue right there. This is essentially “good Yogg-Saron” where all the effects are fantastic instead of anything that can hurt you. Instantly kill a minion, deal potentially lethal damage, summon a tough body, refill your hand for aggro or Jade Decks. It’s pretty crazy, even at the maximum mana cost, and it’s already being compared to a pre-nerf Call of the Wild for Hunter.
2. SPREADING PLAGUE
Spreading Plague is both the ultimate anti-aggro tool, creating an entire board of impassable taunts against those decks, but also the perfect addition to the already strong Token/Aggro Druid thanks to cards like Mark of the Lotus and the new Strongshell Scavenger, which gives all Taunt minions +2/+2. You can easily end up with a board full of 1/5s, 2/6s or 3/7s with taunt by turn five or six, and getting past it (and not run over by it) is exhausting.
3. Lich King[b]
It may seem weird to put a neutral legendary in here, as everyone has access to the Lich King, but because of Druid’s ramping abilities, getting more mana faster than all other classes with cards like Wild Growth, Innervate, Jade Blossom and Nourish, you can easily get a Lich King on turn 5/6/7 while everyone else has to wait until turn 8. Given how powerful the card is, and can be even if you only get one card from it, this is a big problem when it shows up early in many Druid decks, and the class benefits from the strong neutral disproportionately.
4. INNERVATE
It’s the quintessential Druid card from the classic set, but now in the wake of Frozen Throne, arguments are being made that it should be retired. In addition to being able to get out strong cards quickly like the ones we’re seeing above, Innervate has been making trouble for a while now, pumping out turn 1 Vicious Fledglings or turn 2 Bittertide Hydras. It may even be holding high mana minions back in general, because they just benefit Druid too much with this card’s existence. I have loved ramp Druid and Innvervate specifically for years (Druid is the only class I have 500 wins in for a golden portrait) but even I have to agree that Innvervate by itself is making Druid just too strong, and that couldn’t be more evident than what we’re seeing with Frozen Throne. Pro Hearthstone player Reynad recently made a great video arguing for Innervate to be moved to the “Hall of Fame” and out of standard play.
Will Blizzard change anything? Usually they move very slowly with nerfs, taking months or even years to address problem cards. But depending on how things go, Druid may be getting cut down to size soon enough.[u][/u]
Blizzard will address to this fast I believe because the competition with other card games now is more than ever and Blizzard dont want to lose more players to other games.
Why people feel the need to open a new thread each time they want to rant about Druid (this time) when there are tons of the already open? Please, use the search function or at last simply look at the recent threads histroy before opening a new one.
Anyway, on topic, the only real "broken" thing that should be addressed is Innervate and I'm saying this since years not from KotFT: each card's balance is tuned around it's effect and it's mana cost; Innervate simply mess with the mana cost making otherwise good/strong cards broken while allowing them to be played earlier. It should be given a drawback effect in order to balance its free ramp effect.
I agree with everything, but you are literally running over exhausted ground now. The stats will show how much of a problem druid is. My advice is to either stop playing untile they fix it, or play druid yourself, increasing the number of druids on ladder and accelerating a change.
Why people feel the need to open a new thread each time they want to rant about Druid (this time) when there are tons of the already open? Please, use the search function or at last simply look at the recent threads histroy before opening a new one.
Anyway, on topic, the only real "broken" thing that should be addressed is Innervate and I'm saying this since years not from KotFT: each card's balance is tuned around it's effect and it's mana cost; Innervate simply mess with the mana cost making otherwise good/strong cards broken while allowing them to be played earlier. And that as absolutly no downside to such an istant and free ramp!
Different people have differentl view point. For this instance, I'm expressing my view point
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It's unbeatable but it is drawable.
A 15 turn game vs DK Miracle ROgue(as me) which ended in a draw because of Ultimate Infestation.
https://hsreplay.net/replay/RDysAStz6Y4gXFMxzAVCvT
Check out my entry for this week's Card Design Competition. Vote for it if you like it.
Tier S:
Jade Druid, Ramp Druid, Aggro Druid, Token Druid, Malygos Druid
Nuff said. Nerf it to the ground.
I've been playing evolve to lately and if you don't Mulligan into evolves and the minions to combo you're going to fall so far behind.
Druid was just given the ultimate Swiss army knife card with UI. Even with shit draw you just draw or ramp into it and overwhelm.
With shaman you devolve their buffed taunts and fingers crossed they don't refill their hand. I'm about 50/50 evolve against druid and I'm a mutli time legend player with 1k+ wins on shaman. That's not good, imagine your more casual or inexperienced player...
Dog is playing a Control Warlock atm rank 124, with Geist and he is farming those druids.
It is weird, my 2 last games vs jade druid I win with...
QUEST ROGUE!!!
Forget the old quest rogue trying complete the quest fast as possible, the quest is like your very late win condition, no more weak bounce minions only shadowstep, you play with the DK, Vanish, Shadowcaster, Firefly and Doomsayer.
The plan is draw, play minions, remove until you play the DK, in turn 10 the opponent have a full size board of big minions, you vanish and put 2 doomsayers for be sure you get an empty board in your turn, in your turn Shadowcaster combo itself and all 1/1 copies turn 5/5 because the quest, with duplicates saps you play big minions much more faster can opponent can replace, and win.
Quest mage did the job for me.
Free Coaching For Beginners
The Roshambo to Hearthstone. Please be nice. Don't insult or be mad at someone for throwing Rock.
Because Druid is a good control class. If you play Pirate Warrior which takes no skill at all, you're going to lose. Besides, I've found Druid to be fairly easy to beat. If you're playing against the Taunt style control druid, it's easy. Priest makes a mockery of them it seems with dragonfire potion, mass dispel, and any other impactful AoE. Plus, if you have fairly big minions yourself, it's even easier. It seems to be about value in a mirror matchup against control decks.
Unbeatable my as% i'm 4-4 with it at rank 12
just join them. btw are you playing pirate warrior? and you loose to a taunt? no way.!
Hearthstone released its Knight of the Frozen Throne expansion last week, and while it always takes some time for the metagame to truly be sorted out, one conclusion can already be drawn. Druid is strong. That’s not news, as rain or shine Druid is always strong in Hearthstone, but with Frozen Throne, Druid has reached a new level of power that hasn’t been seen in a very long time, and little else can compete.
Unlike Journey to Un’Goro there isn’t one deck or card you can necessarily point to with Druid and say “this is the problem,” like you could with Caverns Below Rogue (win rates aside, it was a clear blight upon the game). But the entire Druid class, which has always been powerful, has been given new tools that combine with its old tools for some truly unstoppable decks. And something may need to change as a result.
Here are the problem cards according to the amateur and pro Hearthstone community, as well as what I’ve personally experienced on the ladder.
1. ULTIMATE INFESTATION[/b]
I mean, you can just read that text and probably understand why it’s an issue right there. This is essentially “good Yogg-Saron” where all the effects are fantastic instead of anything that can hurt you. Instantly kill a minion, deal potentially lethal damage, summon a tough body, refill your hand for aggro or Jade Decks. It’s pretty crazy, even at the maximum mana cost, and it’s already being compared to a pre-nerf Call of the Wild for Hunter.
2. SPREADING PLAGUE
Spreading Plague is both the ultimate anti-aggro tool, creating an entire board of impassable taunts against those decks, but also the perfect addition to the already strong Token/Aggro Druid thanks to cards like Mark of the Lotus and the new Strongshell Scavenger, which gives all Taunt minions +2/+2. You can easily end up with a board full of 1/5s, 2/6s or 3/7s with taunt by turn five or six, and getting past it (and not run over by it) is exhausting.
3. Lich King[b]
It may seem weird to put a neutral legendary in here, as everyone has access to the Lich King, but because of Druid’s ramping abilities, getting more mana faster than all other classes with cards like Wild Growth, Innervate, Jade Blossom and Nourish, you can easily get a Lich King on turn 5/6/7 while everyone else has to wait until turn 8. Given how powerful the card is, and can be even if you only get one card from it, this is a big problem when it shows up early in many Druid decks, and the class benefits from the strong neutral disproportionately.
4. INNERVATE
It’s the quintessential Druid card from the classic set, but now in the wake of Frozen Throne, arguments are being made that it should be retired. In addition to being able to get out strong cards quickly like the ones we’re seeing above, Innervate has been making trouble for a while now, pumping out turn 1 Vicious Fledglings or turn 2 Bittertide Hydras. It may even be holding high mana minions back in general, because they just benefit Druid too much with this card’s existence. I have loved ramp Druid and Innvervate specifically for years (Druid is the only class I have 500 wins in for a golden portrait) but even I have to agree that Innvervate by itself is making Druid just too strong, and that couldn’t be more evident than what we’re seeing with Frozen Throne. Pro Hearthstone player Reynad recently made a great video arguing for Innervate to be moved to the “Hall of Fame” and out of standard play.
Will Blizzard change anything? Usually they move very slowly with nerfs, taking months or even years to address problem cards. But depending on how things go, Druid may be getting cut down to size soon enough.[u][/u]
Share your thoughts on this article!
Adapted from www.Forbes.com
Blizzard will address to this fast I believe because the competition with other card games now is more than ever and Blizzard dont want to lose more players to other games.
Why people feel the need to open a new thread each time they want to rant about Druid (this time) when there are tons of the already open? Please, use the search function or at last simply look at the recent threads histroy before opening a new one.
Anyway, on topic, the only real "broken" thing that should be addressed is Innervate and I'm saying this since years not from KotFT: each card's balance is tuned around it's effect and it's mana cost; Innervate simply mess with the mana cost making otherwise good/strong cards broken while allowing them to be played earlier. It should be given a drawback effect in order to balance its free ramp effect.
For what profit is it to a man, if he gains the world and loses his own soul?
I agree with everything, but you are literally running over exhausted ground now. The stats will show how much of a problem druid is. My advice is to either stop playing untile they fix it, or play druid yourself, increasing the number of druids on ladder and accelerating a change.