Hearthpwn

I see a lot of people complaing about Ultimate Infestation, and it actually befuddles me, we finally have a 10 mana card that doesn't suck balls while  being stand-alone instead of build-around and is not dependant on the card pool, just think of it, the reason people never played high mana win conditions on the past  since the Yogg nerf is because all of them have sucked monkey balls, N'zoth doesn't revive any high quality deathrattle in standard because there aren't any, nzoth decks haven' been competitive in forever, c'thun is actually very unreliable, and y'shaarj is as likely to pull a taunt or a doomsayer because of random, while aggro kept getting broken  1 and 3 drops and  bitttertide hydra and massively powerful murloc and pirate sinergy which peaks at 4 mana .

Just think about it people no longer play aggro just because it's cheap, in fact unless you count token shamman, it's been long since aggro has been cheap,  token druid, Pirate warrior and murloc Paladin use a hefty amount of epics and legendaries, so why did people craft those aggro decks if their cost was similar to some control decks anyways?, the answer is easy, the ladder system rewards aggro, and the high mana win conditions are almost non-existant, people didn't craft control decks with high mana win conditions because objectively there was nothing to craft other than fun timmy builds , so we finally have a  stand-alone 10 mana card that's worth our time and investment and you guys are losing your heads,  when if anything every class should have a 10 drop with the power of Ultimate Infestation, aggro players have been having fun since forever with broken 1 drops,  it's time for players who enjoy high mana win conditions to have their turn at having fun.

Really I think that if the card were in anything other than Druid, it'd be super cool. The big deal is that it doesn't do anything too cool and isn't a win condition of its own, it just further enables the already powerful, already played to death Jade win condition.

I think more bonkers 9/10 cost cards would be cool. I very much liked Yogg, made the game exciting, and was on a bonkers power level (as a 10 mana card should be). Ultimate Infestation is just a card with lots of numbers The lets you further vomit vanilla stats on the board.

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

Quote from Infirc >>

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

 we've had 1 mana cards that literally read win the game, Stb,, undertaker, why can't we enjoy powerful 10 mana cards? and UI doesn't literally read win the game, it jsut gives you value, a lot of value, but it also makes you go near fatigue faster, in fact when jade rotates UI will have a very real weakness, powerful 10 mana cards should exist you have to draw into them anyways since you can't keep those in the mulligan unless you want to lose.

Quote from KeMT >>

Quote from Boethion >>

Quote from KeMT >>

 

 

 

Quote from Infirc >>

Quote from KeMT >>

 

 we've had 1 mana cards that literally read win the game, Stb,, undertaker, why can't we enjoy powerful 10 mana cards? and UI doesn't literally read win the game, it jsut gives you value, a lot of value, but it also makes you go near fatigue faster, in fact when jade rotates UI will have a very real weakness, powerful 10 mana cards should exist you have to draw into them anyways since you can't keep those in the mulligan unless you want to lose.

 Literally ? LITERALLY ?  Undertaker literally read win the game ? Small-Time Buccaneer literally read win the game ? and UI doesn't ?

Should I point out that the comparison with cards that were nerfed doesn't really help your argument ?

If you guys want cards that read "LOL I WIN" instead of cards that reward you for playing better then your opponent then yeah why not, if this is what you want the game to be, I do not.

In druid infestation is just silly. It strenghtens the reward of ramping and removes the backdraw.

Speaking about hypotheticals that do not exist is irrelevant. Asking for some semblance of balance isn't whining, however much many of you are trying to paint as such.

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

In the end, I would encourage anyone who thinks this card is so OP, play with it in a non-Jade deck and you will realize that it is Jade Druid that makes this card insane and not the other way around.

Quote from Boethion >>

Quote from byzants >>

In druid infestation is just silly. It strenghtens the reward of ramping and removes the backdraw.

Speaking about hypotheticals that do not exist is irrelevant. Asking for some semblance of balance isn't whining, however much many of you are trying to paint as such.

 You are very late to the party when you think Team5 cares about balance at this point. They even went out of their way to up the powercurve with KFT (they worked with a MTG designer on the set), so if anything we will see even crazier cards then Ultimate Infestation in the future and I'm all for it as long as they aren't random (we got enough overpowered RNG cards).

Quote from Garlic_Jr >>

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

In the end, I would encourage anyone who thinks this card is so OP, play with it in a non-Jade deck and you will realize that it is Jade Druid that makes this card insane and not the other way around.

I play it in 2 druid archetypes without Jade and it's still strong.
Case in point: http://www.hearthhead.com/decks/saftas-rank-1-legend-frozen-throne-midrange-token-druid

Srems like another card that was carelessly made for trying how will people react, rather than tested, drawing 5 cards is already insane, and it totally eleminates the drawback of ramping if you play that card, yogg did the same, and was netfed.

I think this card is too powerful for that, should draw max 3 cards  or maybe lower everything by 1 all around.

Quote from DoubleSummon >>

Srems like another card that was carelessly made for trying how will people react, rather than tested, drawing 5 cards is already insane, and it totally eleminates the drawback of ramping if you play that card, yogg did the same, and was netfed.

I think this card is too powerful for that, should draw max 3 cards  or maybe lower everything by 1 all around.

10 mana cards should be strong. They should almost win you the game, or otherwise they are not worth playing. This is a mistake that Blizzard have been making in the past, and it's about time they fix it.

The only issue I have is whether a class that's already strong needs such a strong card. If they gave it to hunter I would be very happy.

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from Garlic_Jr >>

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

In the end, I would encourage anyone who thinks this card is so OP, play with it in a non-Jade deck and you will realize that it is Jade Druid that makes this card insane and not the other way around.

I play it in 2 druid archetypes without Jade and it's still strong.
Case in point: http://www.hearthhead.com/decks/saftas-rank-1-legend-frozen-throne-midrange-token-druid

We are debating whether this card literally wins you the game

 

Quote from Garlic_Jr >>

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from Garlic_Jr >>

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from KeMT >>

No no no for god's sake NO !

We need less 10 mana cards that reads "win the game" , wining a game must be a reward for taking the right decisions from turn 1 to turn 10+, not surviving until you have 10 mana and win with an OP totally unbalanced card, games should go toward to player who handled their turns the best no to whomever draws their 10 mana card first.

In the end, I would encourage anyone who thinks this card is so OP, play with it in a non-Jade deck and you will realize that it is Jade Druid that makes this card insane and not the other way around.

I play it in 2 druid archetypes without Jade and it's still strong.
Case in point: http://www.hearthhead.com/decks/saftas-rank-1-legend-frozen-throne-midrange-token-druid

We are debating whether this card literally wins you the game

 

 I always agree with the hermaneutic philosophers on this; you should always recount the opposition's argument well enough for them to agree with it. The card does not literally win you the game, that isn't a debate. I'm not that interested in the present discussion per se, but I will say that Ultimate Infestation is almost an auto-include in any lategame druid deck.

Quote from achan1058 >>

10 mana cards should be strong. They should almost win you the game, or otherwise they are not worth playing. This is a mistake that Blizzard have been making in the past, and it's about time they fix it.

The only issue I have is whether a class that's already strong needs such a strong card. If they gave it to hunter I would be very happy.

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

 Well the main problem is that Hunter doesn't want to get to turn 10 and it probably can't get there consistently due to its card pool. Whereas, in Druid 10 mana cards will always be more prevalent than in other classes due to their ability to Ramp and thus get to 10 mana more consistently, which makes it so much more justifiable to run such cards in the first place.

Quote from achan1058 >>

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

 Well the main problem is that Hunter doesn't want to get to turn 10 and it probably can't get there consistently due to its card pool. Whereas, in Druid 10 mana cards will always be more prevalent than in other classes due to their ability to Ramp and thus get to 10 mana more consistently, which makes it so much more justifiable to run such cards in the first place.

 If there's a card strong enough to make them want to go to turn 10, they will. They just need to make CotW stronger so that it is worth 9 mana.

I agree with that completely. Call of the Wild should never have been nerfed.

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

Quote from achan1058 >>

Quote from TheRealMalfurion >>

 Well the main problem is that Hunter doesn't want to get to turn 10 and it probably can't get there consistently due to its card pool. Whereas, in Druid 10 mana cards will always be more prevalent than in other classes due to their ability to Ramp and thus get to 10 mana more consistently, which makes it so much more justifiable to run such cards in the first place.

 If there's a card strong enough to make them want to go to turn 10, they will. They just need to make CotW stronger so that it is worth 9 mana.

 I think they messed up with nerfing Call of the Wild, sure it was strong, but they literally made it unplayable, unless you are playing lategame Hunter, which they didn't support sufficiently with this expansion and expansions in the past. In fact cards like Call of the Wild show how bad nerfing cards can be for a class. At 8 mana I could see Midrange Hunter being much more powerful and at least a viable archetype for Hunter mains. This is precisely why I was against a nerf for it, but it seems that with enough whining the playerbase always gets what they want and its quite sad to see (and I am saying this as someone who almost doesn't play Hunter).