I want to say that I was always a fan of Combo decks like the old Miracle Rogue (Not the new one), Freeze Mage, OTK Warrior (Not as retarded as it was right before the nerf though.)
it was like a new wave of hope for me. The deck is amazing, fun and most important - it works!
So I've been thinking about it. All the new decks are mostly based on the "Turn-1, turn-2, turn-3..." factor. In pre-Naxx there were so many decks that were made by putting just a lot of combos in. Remember Reynads hunter with Tundra Rhino ? The old freeze Mage was also pretty fun (and difficult!) to play properly. The miracle rogue was also more complicated when it was just about 8 minions and 22 spells. It had style (Though was broken and then nerfed to bits). Now. What unites these 3 decks of the past? Game plan. They all had some sort of a unique game plan. It could've been a giant Leeroy burst, or a Stampede of beasts, or Alexstrasza . And don't get me wrong. Burst is bad. But it's bad if you can literaly burst your opponent on turn 5 or 6. When you have to wait for like 10 or 15 turns it's fine. Your opponent will have time to kill you or prepare for your burst. Now let's see what's the gameplan for today's tier 1 decks.
Mid-Range Shaman - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face. Repeat.
Miracle Rogue - play pirates. Hit face. Gadzhetzan + Conceal. Hit face.
Reno Warlock - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face. Now actually it's a pretty great deck. In good hands it's broken. In bad hands it's shit. I would kinda prefer the Old Handlock, but Reno it is.
Pirate Warrior - SMOrc.
Dragon/Control Priest - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face.
Reno Mage - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face. Also a pretty skillful deck though.
Druid - Jade is a retarded mechanic. The Malygos/Kun druid is a pretty cool deck to play.
Paladin - Skip turn 1. Hero power. Concede.
So, most of the decks have a pretty simular game plan. Imagine if you've replaced the artwork on different class cards, you wouldn't notice the difference (Kinda :P)
Classes lose their character, their soul. I don't know what's the problem exactly. I think it's because of the lack of mechanics in the game, we need more complicated card texts.
Let's look at other popular games like WoW or DotA 2, CS - their developers give players patches with buffs/nerfs like every month. Why Hearthstone can't have that? It's a DIGITAL card game. I'm sure that changing stats on a card is just changing like one variable. That's it. Maybe a little more than that, but Blizzard makes too much money to not have these things in perspective.
That's just my opinion. Write your own favourite decks from any period of Hearthstone history. Thanks! :D
If we're being really reductive, every deck in every card game plays like this: play monsters/minions, kill opponent's monsters/minions, attack for the win. That's just CCGs. And it's basically what you're saying.
I am playing reno priest since 4 days for the first time and I have to say that it is long ago that I was enjoying my games this much because every game feels different depending on your starting hand and the match up.
There are several ways and strategies to close a game and I often find myself roping just because I rly need to think about my next play and it never felt boring in any way.
I guess that you have not played all the decks you have mentioned.
I think your perception of linearity can be split in two parts:
1) simple & reliable is always a good recipe for success
2) your elaboration of linearity happens postumous. After the deck is already famous, and its mechanics simplified to general understanding.
Other than this, i totally disapprove regular cycles of buff-nerf. Just release more cards instead. I want to be sitting on a reliable collection: it is the first pre-requisite of any definition of collection.
The reason they don't go around making small tweaks to every card is because it isn't like other games in that regard. You've seen how changing just one stat on a card like Call of the Wild made it all but unplayable, changing even a single number on these cards make a bigger difference than you might expect.
I think the most fun (and overpowered-feeling) deck I've played in a long time is my Dragon Priest. So much so, in fact, that I ended up stopping playing it because the wins became a little boring at times - but it's my go-to for completing Priest quests.
but torn of player this forum hated combo deck. Posting combo deck op ask blizzard Nerf. Blizzard listen due to profits issue. Remove most otk deck.
they like to play brainless deck. 20 legendary +10 spell deck. Hope have perfect hand in starting and start drop high cost minion starting from turn 7. They have open threads to complain every deck in meta.
blizzard only listen by remove otk aspect. Vs other they still have chance when draw the good hand. Otk just make them auto loses when combo piece in hand.
but torn of player this forum hated combo deck. Posting combo deck op ask blizzard Nerf. Blizzard listen due to profits issue. Remove most otk deck.
they like to play brainless deck. 20 legendary +10 spell deck. Hope have perfect hand in starting and start drop high cost minion starting from turn 7. They have open threads to complain every deck in meta.
blizzard only listen by remove otk aspect. Vs other they still have chance when draw the good hand. Otk just make them auto loses when combo piece in hand.
Some exxtreme engrish skills in this post.
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This disclaimer Will cleanse any sense of innuendo or sarcasm From the comments that might actually make you think And will also insult your intelligence at the same time. So, if it sounds sarcastic, don't take it seriously. If it sounds dangerous, Do not try this at home or at all. And if it offends you, just don't read it.
I heard Kripp say something that I found really interesting, he basically said that blizzard tries to find that sweet spot where they can please everyone, new players and veteran players, but what end up happening is they release new simple cards (so the game is kept simple for the new players) that soon become the meta but any non meta deck is complete garbage because their game balancing sucks. So we end up with new players who can't win because they don't have the cards and veteran players who can't enjoy the game because the cards are too simple and the meta is boring.
Not the one I made. Although obviously dragons do feature rather heavily! ;-) There's quite a bit of strategy and decision making involved since yuo have to consider when best to play some of the more fun cards.
Either way I like it. :-) It's a good fall back option when you find you are on a downward trend and you need a couple of cheap wins to get back up again.
I particularly like the fact that there are now finally enough dragons in the collection that you have to actually consider which ones to include! *Shock!* :-P
Basically yeah, i think the game is kinda becoming a no-brainer. There are accasional games that do in fact require skill and some deeper knowledge of the game, but mostly it all comes to you or your opponent making a mistake. Or just getting a better draw. What's most important is playing a deck with a 50%+ winrate and you're fine. Legend makes no sense (I'm telling you that, because I reached it a couple of times and it's not even close to be called an achievement. And I got to like top 250, maybe if I tryharded I would reach #1). The game doesn't reward you for playing complicated strategies but instead rewards you when you play fast-paced and simple decks with high winrate.
I use a different deck every time I open HS, I'd get bored playing the same thing daily, even hourly! I can't imagine anything game-wise more mundane than net-decking whatever is "hot" and grinding it, same game over and over, just to ladder up a bit.
They aren't boring, they've just been played so much that all the optimal moves have been mapped out, and you can pretty much flow chart your way through it.
If you can flowchart with Miracle, you can flowchart any deck.
Sorry, english is not my native language. Maybe I wrote not exactly what I meant to write. I guess i just want this game to focus on skill. On variety of deckbuilding possibilities (Modern decks usually do not swap any cards, because we've already came up with the perfect list). They have the basic mechanics and they're fine with them. I can't call the Jade Golems "A new mechanic", It isn't as interactive as Combo or Battlecry. Old patron warrior was a very OP but also a very skillful deck. Why can't we have that?
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I want to say that I was always a fan of Combo decks like the old Miracle Rogue (Not the new one), Freeze Mage, OTK Warrior (Not as retarded as it was right before the nerf though.)
After taking a look at
So I've been thinking about it. All the new decks are mostly based on the "Turn-1, turn-2, turn-3..." factor. In pre-Naxx there were so many decks that were made by putting just a lot of combos in. Remember Reynads hunter with Tundra Rhino ? The old freeze Mage was also pretty fun (and difficult!) to play properly. The miracle rogue was also more complicated when it was just about 8 minions and 22 spells. It had style (Though was broken and then nerfed to bits). Now. What unites these 3 decks of the past? Game plan. They all had some sort of a unique game plan. It could've been a giant Leeroy burst, or a Stampede of beasts, or Alexstrasza . And don't get me wrong. Burst is bad. But it's bad if you can literaly burst your opponent on turn 5 or 6. When you have to wait for like 10 or 15 turns it's fine. Your opponent will have time to kill you or prepare for your burst. Now let's see what's the gameplan for today's tier 1 decks.
Mid-Range Shaman - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face. Repeat.
Miracle Rogue - play pirates. Hit face. Gadzhetzan + Conceal. Hit face.
Reno Warlock - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face. Now actually it's a pretty great deck. In good hands it's broken. In bad hands it's shit. I would kinda prefer the Old Handlock, but Reno it is.
Pirate Warrior - SMOrc.
Dragon/Control Priest - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face.
Reno Mage - play minions, clear your opponents minions with spells, hit face. Also a pretty skillful deck though.
Druid - Jade is a retarded mechanic. The Malygos/Kun druid is a pretty cool deck to play.
Paladin - Skip turn 1. Hero power. Concede.
So, most of the decks have a pretty simular game plan. Imagine if you've replaced the artwork on different class cards, you wouldn't notice the difference (Kinda :P)
Classes lose their character, their soul. I don't know what's the problem exactly. I think it's because of the lack of mechanics in the game, we need more complicated card texts.
Let's look at other popular games like WoW or DotA 2, CS - their developers give players patches with buffs/nerfs like every month. Why Hearthstone can't have that? It's a DIGITAL card game. I'm sure that changing stats on a card is just changing like one variable. That's it. Maybe a little more than that, but Blizzard makes too much money to not have these things in perspective.
That's just my opinion. Write your own favourite decks from any period of Hearthstone history. Thanks! :D
I think that secret pally was the most non-linear deck and complicated deck ever. Kappa
If we're being really reductive, every deck in every card game plays like this: play monsters/minions, kill opponent's monsters/minions, attack for the win. That's just CCGs. And it's basically what you're saying.
cannot understand your opinion..
I am playing reno priest since 4 days for the first time and I have to say that it is long ago that I was enjoying my games this much because every game feels different depending on your starting hand and the match up.
There are several ways and strategies to close a game and I often find myself roping just because I rly need to think about my next play and it never felt boring in any way.
I guess that you have not played all the decks you have mentioned.
I always hated combo decks. Imo, Nothing feels worse than losing to a freeze mage.
I think your perception of linearity can be split in two parts:
1) simple & reliable is always a good recipe for success
2) your elaboration of linearity happens postumous. After the deck is already famous, and its mechanics simplified to general understanding.
Other than this, i totally disapprove regular cycles of buff-nerf. Just release more cards instead. I want to be sitting on a reliable collection: it is the first pre-requisite of any definition of collection.
The reason they don't go around making small tweaks to every card is because it isn't like other games in that regard. You've seen how changing just one stat on a card like Call of the Wild made it all but unplayable, changing even a single number on these cards make a bigger difference than you might expect.
I think the most fun (and overpowered-feeling) deck I've played in a long time is my Dragon Priest.
So much so, in fact, that I ended up stopping playing it because the wins became a little boring at times - but it's my go-to for completing Priest quests.
isn't it just about playing dragons on curve ?
haha. Op like combo deck.
but torn of player this forum hated combo deck. Posting combo deck op ask blizzard Nerf. Blizzard listen due to profits issue. Remove most otk deck.
they like to play brainless deck. 20 legendary +10 spell deck. Hope have perfect hand in starting and start drop high cost minion starting from turn 7. They have open threads to complain every deck in meta.
blizzard only listen by remove otk aspect. Vs other they still have chance when draw the good hand. Otk just make them auto loses when combo piece in hand.
This disclaimer
Will cleanse any sense of innuendo or sarcasm
From the comments that might actually make you think
And will also insult your intelligence at the same time.
So, if it sounds sarcastic, don't take it seriously.
If it sounds dangerous,
Do not try this at home or at all.
And if it offends you, just don't read it.
I heard Kripp say something that I found really interesting, he basically said that blizzard tries to find that sweet spot where they can please everyone, new players and veteran players, but what end up happening is they release new simple cards (so the game is kept simple for the new players) that soon become the meta but any non meta deck is complete garbage because their game balancing sucks. So we end up with new players who can't win because they don't have the cards and veteran players who can't enjoy the game because the cards are too simple and the meta is boring.
BLIZZARD IS TRASH.
There's quite a bit of strategy and decision making involved since yuo have to consider when best to play some of the more fun cards.
It's a good fall back option when you find you are on a downward trend and you need a couple of cheap wins to get back up again.
I particularly like the fact that there are now finally enough dragons in the collection that you have to actually consider which ones to include! *Shock!* :-P
Well, I got Legend playing Miracle rogue in season 30. Maybe i don't know everything about this game, but at least I know something :D
Try this one then: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/716966-randomness-reno
Basically yeah, i think the game is kinda becoming a no-brainer. There are accasional games that do in fact require skill and some deeper knowledge of the game, but mostly it all comes to you or your opponent making a mistake. Or just getting a better draw. What's most important is playing a deck with a 50%+ winrate and you're fine. Legend makes no sense (I'm telling you that, because I reached it a couple of times and it's not even close to be called an achievement. And I got to like top 250, maybe if I tryharded I would reach #1). The game doesn't reward you for playing complicated strategies but instead rewards you when you play fast-paced and simple decks with high winrate.
To suit the players who run them ...
I use a different deck every time I open HS, I'd get bored playing the same thing daily, even hourly! I can't imagine anything game-wise more mundane than net-decking whatever is "hot" and grinding it, same game over and over, just to ladder up a bit.
They aren't boring, they've just been played so much that all the optimal moves have been mapped out, and you can pretty much flow chart your way through it.
If you can flowchart with Miracle, you can flowchart any deck.
Make the Card: The biggest thread on the site!
My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
Sorry, english is not my native language. Maybe I wrote not exactly what I meant to write. I guess i just want this game to focus on skill. On variety of deckbuilding possibilities (Modern decks usually do not swap any cards, because we've already came up with the perfect list). They have the basic mechanics and they're fine with them. I can't call the Jade Golems "A new mechanic", It isn't as interactive as Combo or Battlecry. Old patron warrior was a very OP but also a very skillful deck. Why can't we have that?