So the scenario - clean board, or just a small minion on your side, 4 mana, Yeti and Gnomish Inventor in hand. Should you play Yeti first or Gnomish first?
Thought process -
Yeti first:
Yeti is there to trade/go for face, so you want to play Yeti first to get the summoning sickness over with while your opponent's side is still clear. The value of Gnomish is mostly in the card draw, so next turn you can still get full value - imagine if your opponent passed, Yeti would do 2 more damage to the face compared with Gnomish.
Gnomish first:
The body of a Yeti is a pretty valuable thing, so it's better to hedge your bets with Gnomish. The body is less valuable, so you don't risk single target removal as much, and anyway there's nothing on the board for a Yeti to take care of at the moment. Better to just play Gnomish in case he decides to play a 2/X minion, maybe you'll get a better card for your 5 drop.
I agree with mudjmc, that is way to generic of a question for a good answer / debate. The amount of cards in hand, what other cards in hand, your class, the opponents class all this would need to be accounted for before you could really debate the pros/cons.
I'd generally say Chillwind Yeti first on turn 4. The 5 health is a harder remove at that exact point in the game, which is what makes it a valuable card. Unless you really, really need the card draw, Gnomish Inventor can be saved until a later turn.
I agree with PoeticStanziel; also, I feel that in general a card draw is more valuable if getting it isn't going to leave you with zero mana, so you have the possibility of immediately playing the drawn card if appropriate.
I agree with mudjmc, that is way to generic of a question for a good answer / debate. The amount of cards in hand, what other cards in hand, your class, the opponents class all this would need to be accounted for before you could really debate the pros/cons.
Add in your caveats then! If hand size below 3, Gnomish first? I really started this topic just to see how people think about their 4 drop. Every game is different, obviously, but all else being equal, you should have a game plan going in, and modify according to the situation.
The purpose of having card draw is finding a play (for this turn & the turns after). On turn 4 we already have a strong play which is Chillwind Yeti, so we can save the card draw for later turns. As we all know, Yeti is difficult to remove as it only dies to Hex, Fireball, Poly in that 3 - 4 mana range (Rogue can do combos, but then she'll waste more than 1 cards) and no matter what happens, we benefit from that: I'm sure you have stronger minions than Yeti that he'll wish he could use those cards on them instead.
Could also look at it this way: playing Yeti gives you much more tempo than playing the Gnomish (because the card draw are most of the time useless for the turn, even if you draw Backstab or Hunter's Mark - because the opponent's board is empty).
Also always play Yeti when vs a Priest and gives out a maniac laugh.
I understand you come from the mentality to bait out removal. The thing is Yeti is a large enough threat to use big removal, so the Yeti himself should be a good bait for your late minions. Consider Gnomish to be a card draw plus a body to deal with small minions is better in my opinion.
Honestly it depends on your goal. If your goal is to establish dominant board control, and you've already wiped out the enemy's board, play the Gnomish Inventor. Why? Because your opponent is fishing for answers, and he'll use any that he gets as soon as he gets them -- which means in order to maintain control, you want to have more threats in your hand than he has answers, which means you put something that can tick the clock down (Gnome's 2 attack can handle that job) and that increases the potential for you to maintain control by potentially drawing another threat.
If your goal is to kill the opponent without concern for board control (maybe you have solid answers to whatever he might play in your hand, maybe he's low enough that a Yeti would put him on a 1-2 turn clock, whatever reason you have for heading for his face), go for the Yeti.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I looked at this card originally and I thought, you know, it's a card, and you play this card. The card will be that card that you play so you're playing a card. So, it is one thing to play a card. If you're opponent doesn't really have any cards, the card will screw up the card pretty hard, and that means it's a pretty good card.
Going for Yeti is going for board control, no matter how you think about it. A Gnomish inventor is only able to deal with some 2-mana minions straight away when your opponent makes a play, when a Yeti with a good 4 attack can deal with a wide range of minions, some even with 5, 6 mana. Say you put down a Gnomish Inventor, your opponent's next turn is an Azure Drake, and you realize that you should've put down the Yeti so it could deal with the Drake straight away and then you can play cards to strengthen your boards.
In the situation when you could deal with the Drake by using Swipe or Truesilver or other cards, the Yeti proves to be more valuable as it deals an extra 2 damage to the opponent's face.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I mean, I have moments of huge frustration because of my inability to express myself linguistically as clearly as I would like to."
Honestly it depends on your goal. If your goal is to establish dominant board control ... play the Gnomish Inventor.
That makes no sense at all, no matter the given situation. If the opponent plays a big minion on the turn following your Gnomish Inventor play, you'd better hope you have an answer in hand, or he's just taken control from you. Gnomish Inventor is only going to trade efficiently with 1, 2 and 3 mana minions (and not even all of those). A Yeti, on the other hand, will have a better shot of trading efficiently with most of the minions the opponent might play.
If you're going to play Gnomish on turn 4, you better be sure you have an answer in hand for whatever the opponent may play, otherwise you're going to quickly find yourself from a position where you could have taken a dominant position to one where you're playing catch-up.
This isn't always the best way to think about it, but imagine if you were up against someone who was in the exact same position as you. If you play Yeti against his Gnomish Inventor, he 1-1'd himself and you still have a 4/3 on board. Especially when you think of what people who like card draw tend to play on turn 5 (Azure Drake, Auctioneer, etc.) it does not leave them in a good position.
That's far over simplifying things, but as a turn 4 play, Yeti is just so nice.
What are we playing against? If it's something like Zoo, then I'll go for the Gnommish. Yeti isn't giving any advantage there, could be ignored - Gnommish will take out maybe 2 small minions + give you draw. You always want draw Vs the likes of Zoo. Against slower decks Yeti mostly.
What are we playing against? If it's something like Zoo, then I'll go for the Gnommish. Yeti isn't giving any advantage there, could be ignored - Gnommish will take out maybe 2 small minions + give you draw. You always want draw Vs the likes of Zoo. Against slower decks Yeti mostly.
Assuming you and your opponent are at 1 HP, assuming you are a mage/druid/hunter/rogue : i would go for hero power and win, especially if your opponent is a mage/druid/hunter/rogue... XD
Answer to the question without any other hint is just impossible.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
There is no cancer deck in hearthstone ! You are the Cancer !
IMO The most important question in this scenario is.. what is your turn 5 play? If you don't have a good one, you should probably opt for the card draw. If you have a 5-drop like Azure Drake then simply play the Yeti.
If you already have convenient plays why would you go for card draw?
What are we playing against? If it's something like Zoo, then I'll go for the Gnommish. Yeti isn't giving any advantage there, could be ignored - Gnommish will take out maybe 2 small minions + give you draw. You always want draw Vs the likes of Zoo. Against slower decks Yeti mostly.
While there are situations in which Inventor is better, it's pretty unlikely that any of those situations are turn four with empty board or board control.
Yeti, 85% of the time.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
So the scenario - clean board, or just a small minion on your side, 4 mana, Yeti and Gnomish Inventor in hand. Should you play Yeti first or Gnomish first?
Thought process -
Yeti first:
Yeti is there to trade/go for face, so you want to play Yeti first to get the summoning sickness over with while your opponent's side is still clear. The value of Gnomish is mostly in the card draw, so next turn you can still get full value - imagine if your opponent passed, Yeti would do 2 more damage to the face compared with Gnomish.
Gnomish first:
The body of a Yeti is a pretty valuable thing, so it's better to hedge your bets with Gnomish. The body is less valuable, so you don't risk single target removal as much, and anyway there's nothing on the board for a Yeti to take care of at the moment. Better to just play Gnomish in case he decides to play a 2/X minion, maybe you'll get a better card for your 5 drop.
I think this scenario needs more prior knowledge. Like; health, classes, type of deck, cards in hand, and so forth.
I agree with mudjmc, that is way to generic of a question for a good answer / debate. The amount of cards in hand, what other cards in hand, your class, the opponents class all this would need to be accounted for before you could really debate the pros/cons.
I'd generally say Chillwind Yeti first on turn 4. The 5 health is a harder remove at that exact point in the game, which is what makes it a valuable card. Unless you really, really need the card draw, Gnomish Inventor can be saved until a later turn.
Poetic.
I agree with PoeticStanziel; also, I feel that in general a card draw is more valuable if getting it isn't going to leave you with zero mana, so you have the possibility of immediately playing the drawn card if appropriate.
Add in your caveats then! If hand size below 3, Gnomish first? I really started this topic just to see how people think about their 4 drop. Every game is different, obviously, but all else being equal, you should have a game plan going in, and modify according to the situation.
The purpose of having card draw is finding a play (for this turn & the turns after). On turn 4 we already have a strong play which is Chillwind Yeti, so we can save the card draw for later turns. As we all know, Yeti is difficult to remove as it only dies to Hex, Fireball, Poly in that 3 - 4 mana range (Rogue can do combos, but then she'll waste more than 1 cards) and no matter what happens, we benefit from that: I'm sure you have stronger minions than Yeti that he'll wish he could use those cards on them instead.
Could also look at it this way: playing Yeti gives you much more tempo than playing the Gnomish (because the card draw are most of the time useless for the turn, even if you draw Backstab or Hunter's Mark - because the opponent's board is empty).
Also always play Yeti when vs a Priest and gives out a maniac laugh.
I understand you come from the mentality to bait out removal. The thing is Yeti is a large enough threat to use big removal, so the Yeti himself should be a good bait for your late minions. Consider Gnomish to be a card draw plus a body to deal with small minions is better in my opinion.
"I mean, I have moments of huge frustration because of my inability to express myself linguistically as clearly as I would like to."
David Gilmour
Yeti in ever single situation. Card draw is always card draw, yeti will almost always draw the opponent into an unfavourable play.
SWCCG World Champ- Star Wars CCG, best card game ever
Honestly it depends on your goal. If your goal is to establish dominant board control, and you've already wiped out the enemy's board, play the Gnomish Inventor. Why? Because your opponent is fishing for answers, and he'll use any that he gets as soon as he gets them -- which means in order to maintain control, you want to have more threats in your hand than he has answers, which means you put something that can tick the clock down (Gnome's 2 attack can handle that job) and that increases the potential for you to maintain control by potentially drawing another threat.
If your goal is to kill the opponent without concern for board control (maybe you have solid answers to whatever he might play in your hand, maybe he's low enough that a Yeti would put him on a 1-2 turn clock, whatever reason you have for heading for his face), go for the Yeti.
I looked at this card originally and I thought, you know, it's a card, and you play this card. The card will be that card that you play so you're playing a card. So, it is one thing to play a card. If you're opponent doesn't really have any cards, the card will screw up the card pretty hard, and that means it's a pretty good card.
Going for Yeti is going for board control, no matter how you think about it. A Gnomish inventor is only able to deal with some 2-mana minions straight away when your opponent makes a play, when a Yeti with a good 4 attack can deal with a wide range of minions, some even with 5, 6 mana. Say you put down a Gnomish Inventor, your opponent's next turn is an Azure Drake, and you realize that you should've put down the Yeti so it could deal with the Drake straight away and then you can play cards to strengthen your boards.
In the situation when you could deal with the Drake by using Swipe or Truesilver or other cards, the Yeti proves to be more valuable as it deals an extra 2 damage to the opponent's face.
"I mean, I have moments of huge frustration because of my inability to express myself linguistically as clearly as I would like to."
David Gilmour
That makes no sense at all, no matter the given situation. If the opponent plays a big minion on the turn following your Gnomish Inventor play, you'd better hope you have an answer in hand, or he's just taken control from you. Gnomish Inventor is only going to trade efficiently with 1, 2 and 3 mana minions (and not even all of those). A Yeti, on the other hand, will have a better shot of trading efficiently with most of the minions the opponent might play.
If you're going to play Gnomish on turn 4, you better be sure you have an answer in hand for whatever the opponent may play, otherwise you're going to quickly find yourself from a position where you could have taken a dominant position to one where you're playing catch-up.
Poetic.
This isn't always the best way to think about it, but imagine if you were up against someone who was in the exact same position as you. If you play Yeti against his Gnomish Inventor, he 1-1'd himself and you still have a 4/3 on board. Especially when you think of what people who like card draw tend to play on turn 5 (Azure Drake, Auctioneer, etc.) it does not leave them in a good position.
That's far over simplifying things, but as a turn 4 play, Yeti is just so nice.
Gnomish could easily be better vs. Shamen.
What are we playing against? If it's something like Zoo, then I'll go for the Gnommish. Yeti isn't giving any advantage there, could be ignored - Gnommish will take out maybe 2 small minions + give you draw. You always want draw Vs the likes of Zoo. Against slower decks Yeti mostly.
Unless they drop Feral Spirit.
Poetic.
Oh, really? Gnomish Inventor can be killed with Soulfire. Yeti can't.
Assuming you and your opponent are at 1 HP, assuming you are a mage/druid/hunter/rogue : i would go for hero power and win, especially if your opponent is a mage/druid/hunter/rogue... XD
Answer to the question without any other hint is just impossible.
There is no cancer deck in hearthstone ! You are the Cancer !
IMO The most important question in this scenario is.. what is your turn 5 play? If you don't have a good one, you should probably opt for the card draw. If you have a 5-drop like Azure Drake then simply play the Yeti.
If you already have convenient plays why would you go for card draw?
If the Zoo Soulfires Gnomish, you have probably won the game...
There is no cancer deck in hearthstone ! You are the Cancer !
While there are situations in which Inventor is better, it's pretty unlikely that any of those situations are turn four with empty board or board control.
Yeti, 85% of the time.