Okay first off I know we wont really know for sure what cards will work or not before we get to play with them, especially the Jade Lotus support cards and some of the Grimy Goons payoff cards might be tough to rate accurately, but I felt like giving it a go anyways, seemed like it would be fun and interesting.
So I'll give em all my expected competitive Standard constructed rating ranging from 0-6 and I'll add arena rating in parentheses.*
0 = Horribly bad, no chance of being played (Should almost never be picked) 1 = Really bad, most likely wont be played (Pretty damn bad and probably shouldn't be picked) 2 = Pretty bad, probably wont see play (Bad, should very rarely be picked) 3 = Okay, might see some play (Alright pick you usually wont feel too good about) 4 = Pretty good, probably will see some play (You'll be happy to pick at least one of this) 5 = Really good, will definitely see play (Super strong card you'll feel very good about getting) 6 = Crazy strong, will be winning games (You just came a little when you saw this pop up in your draft)
* Arena rating is not considering the new set appearance bonus which will make most of the faction themed cards a lot better due to higher chance of having synergy with your deck and for the reno-like cards I've assumed you already have several duplicates in your deck when they show up during your draft.
I arranged everything from lowest to highest constructed rating to give me a better overview and I can't help to notice that we sure got a lot of super crappy neutral minions from this expansion, both for constructed and for arena!
Clearly Rogue got the worst bunch of class cards while Priest got the best, it seems Mage also got quite a lot bad cards, probably due to arena balancing, Shaman didn't get too much good stuff either as expected while the rest of the classes overall got some pretty decent additions from this expansion.
In general I think we got way too many bad cards compared to good cards from MSG, but luckily most of the good cards are not good in aggro decks for a change so I guess I shouldn't complain too much.
Hope you found this interesting, let me know what you think and if you disagree on something feel free to leave a comment and I'll try to explain or maybe adjust the score.
What is Hearthstone to you? A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Topics like this just make you look silly when you're wrong a majority of the time.
Let's wait two damn days!!
Threads like these doesn't make OP look silly!
I hate when people who don't have the bravery to form an opinion for themselves dismiss other's bravery to do so and to add insult to injury they also say that they're "wasting their time" or "This thread is meaningless" or how you put it "It's silly" and there'r other worse accusations.
It's like voting, if you don't go to vote, you don't have the right to tell someone that they voted for the wrong guy in your opinion. MOREOVER to tell them that their vote is meaningless.
Someone who doesn't have the guts to form an opinion of his own in order to not be wrong is a coward and doesn't have the right to tell someone who does, things like these, period.
Nothing wrong with having an opinion. I think you misunderstood my message.
I do not believe that the OP is a coward or an idiot. I think that this much guesswork is liable to make him look dumb, but hey, it could make him look like a genius as well I suppose.
My point is this; there's literally 200 different topic. We get that everyone is excited about the new expansion. Why is everyone so determined to break down every card into a different tier and power ranking.
I guess im just more interested in threads with debates, creative discussions, and new insights than tier lists and such. But I concede. Post away lol.
Patches the Pirate - 3 (0) Hes a 6 in constructed for sure, hes the reason to play pirates (warrior).
Patches the Pirate is just a Stonetusk Boar if you draw him before playing a Pirate which is horribly bad and not great enough when you pull him from your deck to fully make up for the chance of drawing him before playing a Pirate. He might see some play though, but I doubt he'll stick around for long, so I rated him 3. I do believe Pirate Warrior will be a pretty strong deck, but I don't think Patches the Pirate will be played in it 1 month after release.
Do you usually play a lot of arena? Cause i think you missjudget a lot of cards, i want to give same example just to be clear:
Kazakus : I understand its conditional, but its bad just if you pick it last card, otherwise its gamewinning 4
Second-Rate Bruiser : this with no effect would be a 4 and the conditional upside is insane 4.5
Getaway Kodo : Its a pretty decent card, i don't know why you hate this, solid 3.5
Drakonid Operative : This is just too good even in arena, the effect can be relevant and insane 6
Backroom Bouncer : Why all this random 0? This is a 3, 2 if you are racist for the taurens
Sleep with the Fishes : You can't combo it like in constructed but if you hit a single minion you get a Frostbolt effect 4
Tanaris Hogchopper : Effect will NEVER be active, but I think you don't understand that a vanilla 4/4 its a 2.25
Yeah I do play a lot of arena! :P
I judged all the reno-like legendaries as if you already have 3-4 duplicates in your deck when they show up during your draft so Kazakus received such a low score as he's mostly judged by his stats and the fact you'll have 2 other legendaries to choose from.
Second-Rate Bruiser might be more like a 3 than a 2 when I think about it, but I wouldn't rate him a 4 as very often he'll just be a 5 mana 4/5 taunt which is like a 2, sometimes he'll be a 3 mana 4/5 which would make him a 4.5 I guess, since that will pretty much never happen early in arena, so because the consistency of a card is so important in arena I'd rate him a 3. (Will edit that)
Getaway Kodo is a much worse Duplicate, yes it costs 2 less mana, but it's in Paladin which means you'll often have tiny minions that would be horrible to proc this secret on and you only get 1 copy of the minion back to your hand so it doesn't create card advantage, it just swaps out your secret for a minion on your board that your opponent choose to give you. It would be played around the same way as Redemption, huge waste of a card slot I'm afraid.
Drakonid Operative was judged mostly as a 5 mana 5/6 dragon since it's not often you'll get to draft enough dragons that you'll reliably be able to activate it's ability. A 5 mana 5/6 Dragon would be a 4, but maybe I should've given it a 5 due to how good the effect is if you are able to activate it. (I'll edit that too)
Backroom Bouncer is just a 4 mana 4/4 that sometimes is a 5/4 or maybe on rare occations a 6/4, it's bad...really bad, worse than Ogre Magi in most decks, so you should probably never pick this card, worthy of a 0 rating IMO :P
Sleep with the Fishes is a highly conditional 3 mana deal 3 damage to a minion, at some very rare occations to 2 minions and sometimes to your own minions as well. It can't go face and it can be very hard to play without hitting one of your own minions or forcing you to make awkward trades in order to avoid that. Not a good pick in arena at all I'm afraid, might be played in Control Warrior as a 1-of, but not sure it's worth running even there.
Tanaris Hogchopper is a 4 mana 4/4, you never want to pick a 4 mana 4/4, it's really, really bad and worthy a 0 rating.
Why rating the Greater Healing Potion so high in Priest? You can't even Auchenai it... and why Pint sized Potion so low?
Greater Healing Potion is a very strong healing effect in 1 card, it will probably see some play to counter aggro decks, at least as a 1-of, worthy a 4 rating IMO.
Pint-Size Potion will in very most cases require you to combo it with another card to make it useful and when you use it to trade on board it will often be worse than Circle of Healing which is a card that can be used for a board clear with Auchenai Soulpriest, which is a card you'll often run anyways. You wont be running Shadow Word: Horror just to be able to combo it with this card, but you might run Cabal Shadow Priest which is why it got a rating of 2 instead of 1 or 0.
Well yeah I think this guy is pretty cool too, but he's just a 1 mana 1/1 which you will probably draw sometimes and might at some rare occations make your opponent draw late in the game, only reason I rated him 1 instead of 0 is the fact he's a Beast. You have to pay the cost of playing an incredibly crappy card in order to have the chance of making your opponent draw this instead of one of their other cards later in the game....it's not good....pretty troll though :P
Other changes I'll edit in are: Blastcrystal Potion up from 3 to 4 in constructed as I think it will be used as a 1-of in Reno decks. Sergeant Sally up from 3 to 4 in constructed as I think this will also see play in Renolock. Bomb Squad up from 2 to 3 in constructed as it might see some play in Evolve Shaman if that comes back with Doppelgangster and Big-Time Racketeer being strong additions as well. Shaku, the Collector up from 1 to 2 in arena as getting random class cards is usually pretty good for arena. Virmen Sensei down from 4 to 3 in arena as you wont always get a bunch of beasts in your draft.
What is Hearthstone to you? A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Hm, I have been saying this a lot lately but I really don't think Jade Idol is worth a 6. Its pretty slow, and when you shuffle it back into your deck you essentially just lost a card draw, which really means something.
Also Jade Idols really would work in a more Control Jade Druid, but it most likely will never reach the fatigue stage, and Druid removal sucks.
So later on if you're losing, you might want a Swipe or Moonglade Portal to spare you, but instead you got one of your 100 Jade Idols, either losing you another card draw or summoning a Jade Golem that doesn't have taunt to protect you.
Honestly for me it would be 3(4), This by itself can help in Arena more because you can out-muscle your opponent eventually.
If it was 2 mana and additionally drew a card, then it would be broken af imo
---
Also Daring Reporter seems like a really decent Arena card, since it would pressure your opponent when they want to hunt for their tempo swinging cards. I'd actually give it 1(3)
Hm, I have been saying this a lot lately but I really don't think Jade Idol is worth a 6. Its pretty slow, and when you shuffle it back into your deck you essentially just lost a card draw, which really means something.
Also Jade Idols really would work in a more Control Jade Druid, but it most likely will never reach the fatigue stage, and Druid removal sucks.
So later on if you're losing, you might want a Swipe or Moonglade Portal to spare you, but instead you got one of your 100 Jade Idols, either losing you another card draw or summoning a Jade Golem that doesn't have taunt to protect you.
Honestly for me it would be 3(4), This by itself can help in Arena more because you can out-muscle your opponent eventually.
If it was 2 mana and additionally drew a card, then it would be broken af imo
---
Also Daring Reporter seems like a really decent Arena card, since it would pressure your opponent when they want to hunt for their tempo swinging cards. I'd actually give it 1(3)
Daring Reporter wont be played in constructed as mill decks don't wanna give you good targets for your removal spells and in arena it will in most cases be a 4 mana 4/4 that's weak to silence, it's only redeeming quality is that it stops your opponent from drawing more cards that turn and is not a card they can just completely ignore, neither is The Boogeymonster, which is why it got a 1 instead of 0 in arena.
Jade Idol may indeed be a bit overhyped, but you would of course make sure to run it in a deck focused on Jade Golems and also include a lot of draw. The fact that Jade Blossom doesn't cycle at 10 mana is a detriment to the power of this card, but still summoning a Jade Golem for 1 mana seems pretty strong to me, especially when you can get an infinite amount of these cards in your deck. The first one you will of course use to summon a Jade Golem to get the ball running for your other Jade cards and the 2nd one you may use with Fandral Staghelm to get both effects or just use to fill your deck up with more of this card. Just playing this card by itself is a cheap way to lower the cost of your Arcane Giants while also furthering your Jade Golem strategy.
I theorized a deck list I think will work well here:
In arena card advantage is so important that you can't be spending your card just to shuffle more of it into your deck and even then you will just make it more likely for you to later topdeck a 1 mana 1/1 or 2/2....it's pretty bad in arena! :P
What is Hearthstone to you? A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
First of all: great work on the list, it is super nice to have such an overview and the possibility of discussing about cards whilst waiting for the expansion :).
While going through it I have the feeling that you rate situational cards / cards that are dependent on other cards rather highly. A few examples are Smuggler's Run - 5 (3) and Wickerflame Burnbristle - 5 (3). While i believe that when buffed the Burnbristle is rather cool its not that strong of a 3 drop unbuffed, and due to it being a legendary very inconsistent with that. Same goes for Smuggler's Run when playing 1st. You essentialy want to play this fast but lose alot of card value, if you dont have enough creatures in your main hand it becomes worse quite fast.
Also i think that Unlicensed Apothecary - 2 (1) is going to be a rather strong card. When playing control it forces the opponent to either deal with it or get their board wrecked. I am really excited for this one, and would therefore not rate it this low :) (but i could be biased).
Thx man :)
Yeah I was a bit unsure about those two cards actually, however I do believe that in a deck filled with over 20 minions you'll most likely have the Smuggler's Run be a 1 mana +3/+3 or better and in a deck revolving around buffing your minions that should be pretty sweet! Of course you can't just throw this into any deck, but in the right deck I think it's very strong!
Wickerflame Burnbristle should be quite good if it's buffed just once and in a deck revolving around buffing up your minions I think this will be quite easy to achieve, even not buffed it's not all that bad since it also heal you up. Worst against Mage and Priest, but pretty good against the rest of the classes I think.
The drawback on Unlicensed Apothecary is too harsh for a control deck and just insane for a zoo/aggro deck (since you'll play a lot more minions), if it was a 3 mana 5/5 Battlecry: Deal 5 damage to your hero. it would be pretty damn bad for control decks, but very good for aggro decks, this is basically that for a control deck, just a lot worse for an aggro deck. I don't think this will see much play :P
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
What is Hearthstone to you? A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Yeah this took really long to make, especially considering I'm using a super slow laptop, it took me about 3 hours I think, maybe even a little over :P
I wanted to list the classes purely based on how good class cards they've received from MSG, this is not to list how strong the classes will be overall after the expansion, this is basically just to see how well they've been treated by MSG in regards to class cards compared to eachother.
I haven't taken the tri-class cards or the neutrals much into consideration for this list as that would be a judgement of how powerful the different archetypes will be which is something I can't really judge with confidence without having tried them yet. However I did kind of consider the archetypes when valuating the different class cards though, so a lot of the higher rated cards are assuming those archetypes will be pretty good and a lot of the 3s are rated 3 just because there might be some low tier decks that may use those cards so it's not really an accurate prediction of class power increase post-expansion....just some ranking based on how good I think the class cards they received are.
If I were to consider tri-class and neutral cards then Mage and Warlock would be a lot higher due to Kazakus and other support for the reno archetypes also Druid didn't really get the healing that we wanted to support a slower meta so it wouldn't be ranked as 2nd since most of the cards that make Druid take 2nd place IMO is the class cards with Jade Golem synergy, Mistress of Mixtures might be more useful than I expect tho so maybe that deserves a spot in Druid decks, not sure....the Enchanted Raven turned out to be far worse than most had expected, it'snot really anywhere close to the power level of a 1 mana 2/3 aka Zombie Chow.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
What is Hearthstone to you? A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Hm, I have been saying this a lot lately but I really don't think Jade Idol is worth a 6. Its pretty slow, and when you shuffle it back into your deck you essentially just lost a card draw, which really means something.
Also Jade Idols really would work in a more Control Jade Druid, but it most likely will never reach the fatigue stage, and Druid removal sucks.
So later on if you're losing, you might want a Swipe or Moonglade Portal to spare you, but instead you got one of your 100 Jade Idols, either losing you another card draw or summoning a Jade Golem that doesn't have taunt to protect you.
Honestly for me it would be 3(4), This by itself can help in Arena more because you can out-muscle your opponent eventually.
If it was 2 mana and additionally drew a card, then it would be broken af imo
---
Also Daring Reporter seems like a really decent Arena card, since it would pressure your opponent when they want to hunt for their tempo swinging cards. I'd actually give it 1(3)
Daring Reporter wont be played in constructed as mill decks don't wanna give you good targets for your removal spells and in arena it will in most cases be a 4 mana 4/4 that's weak to silence, it's only redeeming quality is that it stops your opponent from drawing more cards that turn and is not a card they can just completely ignore, neither is The Boogeymonster, which is why it got a 1 instead of 0 in arena.
Jade Idol may indeed be a bit overhyped, but you would of course make sure to run it in a deck focused on Jade Golems and also include a lot of draw. The fact that Jade Blossom doesn't cycle at 10 mana is a detriment to the power of this card, but still summoning a Jade Golem for 1 mana seems pretty strong to me, especially when you can get an infinite amount of these cards in your deck. The first one you will of course use to summon a Jade Golem to get the ball running for your other Jade cards and the 2nd one you may use with Fandral Staghelm to get both effects or just use to fill your deck up with more of this card. Just playing this card by itself is a cheap way to lower the cost of your Arcane Giants while also furthering your Jade Golem strategy.
I theorized a deck list I think will work well here:
In arena card advantage is so important that you can't be spending your card just to shuffle more of it into your deck and even then you will just make it more likely for you to later topdeck a 1 mana 1/1 or 2/2....it's pretty bad in arena! :P
I get what you're saying about Daring Reporter. I also agree that you will probably never see it in Constructed. I was a little eager with the Arena score though because I know how scarce Silence will be in arena unless you're fighting a Priest.
Also I like your deck, but it is suffering the same weakness I was talking about with Jade Idol. There is very low card draw from your deck, which is going to be essential for the spell. I also notice an alarming lack of low cost minions. Even though you might mulligan for 1 Jade Idol, or even 2 and manage to shuffle it the 2nd into your deck, your opponent will probably already be swarming, and you're going to have to be on the defensive until mid-game. If they overwhelm you too much too early you'll never live long enough to get your Jade Golem to at least a 5/5. Raven Idol andWild Growth are good but even so you can't depend on only playing semi-big to big minions because then it only becomes a weaker Ramp Druid. Acolyte of Pain seems like an strong include for this deck, along with other strong early game minions.
Yeah I guess you're right about 0,1 and 2 being pretty much the same, I was thinking that as well after I finished rating them, but meh...there are slight differences^^
I saw your review, I think it seems a bit rushed, I get the feeling you just went with the first thought that came to mind and made a rash judgement on the card just to give it a rating, thus I don't agree with a lot of it, but hey we haven't tried the cards yet so who knows right? :P
Hm, I have been saying this a lot lately but I really don't think Jade Idol is worth a 6. Its pretty slow, and when you shuffle it back into your deck you essentially just lost a card draw, which really means something.
Also Jade Idols really would work in a more Control Jade Druid, but it most likely will never reach the fatigue stage, and Druid removal sucks.
So later on if you're losing, you might want a Swipe or Moonglade Portal to spare you, but instead you got one of your 100 Jade Idols, either losing you another card draw or summoning a Jade Golem that doesn't have taunt to protect you.
Honestly for me it would be 3(4), This by itself can help in Arena more because you can out-muscle your opponent eventually.
If it was 2 mana and additionally drew a card, then it would be broken af imo
---
Also Daring Reporter seems like a really decent Arena card, since it would pressure your opponent when they want to hunt for their tempo swinging cards. I'd actually give it 1(3)
Daring Reporter wont be played in constructed as mill decks don't wanna give you good targets for your removal spells and in arena it will in most cases be a 4 mana 4/4 that's weak to silence, it's only redeeming quality is that it stops your opponent from drawing more cards that turn and is not a card they can just completely ignore, neither is The Boogeymonster, which is why it got a 1 instead of 0 in arena.
Jade Idol may indeed be a bit overhyped, but you would of course make sure to run it in a deck focused on Jade Golems and also include a lot of draw. The fact that Jade Blossom doesn't cycle at 10 mana is a detriment to the power of this card, but still summoning a Jade Golem for 1 mana seems pretty strong to me, especially when you can get an infinite amount of these cards in your deck. The first one you will of course use to summon a Jade Golem to get the ball running for your other Jade cards and the 2nd one you may use with Fandral Staghelm to get both effects or just use to fill your deck up with more of this card. Just playing this card by itself is a cheap way to lower the cost of your Arcane Giants while also furthering your Jade Golem strategy.
I theorized a deck list I think will work well here:
In arena card advantage is so important that you can't be spending your card just to shuffle more of it into your deck and even then you will just make it more likely for you to later topdeck a 1 mana 1/1 or 2/2....it's pretty bad in arena! :P
I get what you're saying about Daring Reporter. I also agree that you will probably never see it in Constructed. I was a little eager with the Arena score though because I know how scarce Silence will be in arena unless you're fighting a Priest.
Also I like your deck, but it is suffering the same weakness I was talking about with Jade Idol. There is very low card draw from your deck, which is going to be essential for the spell. I also notice an alarming lack of low cost minions. Even though you might mulligan for 1 Jade Idol, or even 2 and manage to shuffle it the 2nd into your deck, your opponent will probably already be swarming, and you're going to have to be on the defensive until mid-game. If they overwhelm you too much too early you'll never live long enough to get your Jade Golem to at least a 5/5. Raven Idol andWild Growth are good but even so you can't depend on only playing semi-big to big minions because then it only becomes a weaker Ramp Druid. Acolyte of Pain seems like an strong include for this deck, along with other strong early game minions.
Well it is a ramp deck so it's not supposed to play early game minions, but maybe I could fit in 2 Mistress of Mixtures instead of the Lotus Agents which are there mostly in the hopes I get more Jade synergy or some survivability/flexibility. Don't forget that Jade Blossoms will let me jump from 3 to 5 mana while still helping out the Jade Golem synergy, take that into consideration as well as the fact that you'd want to keep 1 Jade Idol in opening hand and that I run 2 Innervates I think the early game should be consistent enough.
2x Nourish and 2x Azure Drake + sometimes cycling from Wrath and Wild Growth does give me quite a lot of draw I think, Raven Idol also helps with card advantage sometimes if you get to play it with Fandral Staghelm. I don't think card advantage will be too much of an issue, late game those Jade Idols will probably be crazy strong anyways, doesn't matter if you float a little mana.
I am a bit torn about how little taunt there is in the deck though, would've been nice to have like a Sunfury Protector and maybe an Ancient of War in there as well. Druid of the Claw probably wouldn't be too bad either.
What is Hearthstone to you? A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
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Okay first off I know we wont really know for sure what cards will work or not before we get to play with them, especially the Jade Lotus support cards and some of the Grimy Goons payoff cards might be tough to rate accurately, but I felt like giving it a go anyways, seemed like it would be fun and interesting.
So I'll give em all my expected competitive Standard constructed rating ranging from 0-6 and I'll add arena rating in parentheses.*
0 = Horribly bad, no chance of being played (Should almost never be picked)
1 = Really bad, most likely wont be played (Pretty damn bad and probably shouldn't be picked)
2 = Pretty bad, probably wont see play (Bad, should very rarely be picked)
3 = Okay, might see some play (Alright pick you usually wont feel too good about)
4 = Pretty good, probably will see some play (You'll be happy to pick at least one of this)
5 = Really good, will definitely see play (Super strong card you'll feel very good about getting)
6 = Crazy strong, will be winning games (You just came a little when you saw this pop up in your draft)
Druid:
Celestial Dreamer - 0 (2)
Lunar Visions - 1 (3)
Virmen Sensei - 1 (3)
Pilfered Power - 3 (1)
Mark of the Lotus - 4 (3)
Kun the Forgotten King - 4 (5)
Jade Blossom - 5 (1)
Jade Behemoth - 5 (2)
Jade Idol - 6 (2)
Hunter:
Piranha Launcher - 0 (2)
Hidden Cache - 2 (1)
Alleycat - 3 (2)
Knuckles - 4 (0)
Smuggler's Crate - 4 (1)
Trogg Beastrager - 4 (3)
Shaky Zipgunner - 4 (5)
Rat Pack - 6 (4)
Dispatch Kodo - 6 (6)
Mage:
Freezing Potion - 0 (0)
Greater Arcane Missiles - 0 (3)
Potion of Polymorph - 1 (0)
Kabal Crystal Runner - 2 (1)
Kabal Lackey - 3 (1)
Cryomancer - 3 (3)
Volcanic Potion - 4 (3)
Manic Soulcaster - 4 (4)
Inkmaster Solia - 6 (1)
Paladin:
Getaway Kodo - 1 (1)
Meanstreet Marshal - 2 (0)
Grimscale Chum - 3 (0)
Grimestreet Enforcer - 3 (3)
Small-Time Recruits - 4 (1)
Grimestreet Protector - 4 (6)
Smuggler's Run - 5 (3)
Wickerflame Burnbristle - 5 (3)
Grimestreet Outfitter - 5 (4)
Priest:
Pint-Size Potion - 2 (1)
Mana Geode - 3 (5)
Kabal Songstealer - 3 (5)
Greater Healing Potion - 4 (1)
Potion of Madness - 4 (5)
Kabal Talonpriest - 4 (6)
Raza the Chained - 5 (2)
Drakonid Operative - 6 (5)
Dragonfire Potion - 6 (5)
Rogue:
Shadow Sensei - 0 (1)
Gadgetzan Ferryman - 1 (2)
Shadow Rager - 1 (3)
Luckydo Buccaneer - 2 (1)
Lotus Assassin - 2 (6)
Shaku, the Collector - 3 (2)
Counterfeit Coin - 4 (0)
Jade Swarmer - 4 (1)
Jade Shuriken - 5 (3)
Shaman:
Finders Keepers - 0 (2)
Devolve - 2 (1)
Call in the Finishers - 2 (0)
Jade Claws - 3 (1)
Lotus Illusionist - 3 (5)
Jinyu Waterspeaker - 4 (2)
White Eyes - 4 (5)
Jade Chieftain - 5 (1)
Jade Lightning - 5 (2)
Warlock:
Bloodfury Potion - 0 (0)
Krul the Unshackled - 1 (0)
Seadevil Stinger - 2 (0)
Unlicensed Apothecary - 2 (1)
Crystalweaver - 3 (2)
Kabal Trafficker - 3 (6)
Blastcrystal Potion - 4 (4)
Felfire Potion - 5 (4)
Abyssal Enforcer - 5 (6)
Warrior:
I Know a Guy - 0 (3)
Public Defender - 2 (0)
Stolen Goods - 3 (0)
Sleep with the Fishes - 3 (1)
Brass Knuckles - 4 (3)
Grimy Gadgeteer - 4 (4)
Hobart Grapplehammer - 5 (1)
Alley Armorsmith - 5 (3)
Grimestreet Pawnbroker - 5 (4)
Tri-class:
Grimestreet Smuggler - 2 (3)
Jade Spirit - 3 (0)
Lotus Agents - 3 (4)
Grimestreet Informant - 3 (5)
Kabal Chemist - 3 (5)
Kabal Courier - 4 (5)
Don Han'Cho - 5 (3)
Kazakus - 6 (1)
Aya Blackpaw - 6 (2)
Neutral:
Backstreet Leper - 0 (0)
Blubber Baron - 0 (0)
Backroom Bouncer - 0 (0)
Worgen Greaser - 0 (0)
Tanaris Hogchopper - 0 (0)
Red Mana Wyrm - 0 (0)
Madam Goya - 0 (0)
Mayor Noggenfogger - 0 (0)
Daring Reporter - 0 (1)
Gadgetzan Socialite - 0 (1)
Grook Fu Master - 0 (1)
Hired Gun - 0 (2)
Kooky Chemist - 0 (2)
Wind-up Burglebot - 0 (2)
Friendly Bartender - 0 (3)
Toxic Sewer Ooze - 0 (3)
Ancient of Blossoms - 0 (3)
Leatherclad Hogleader - 0 (3)
Weasel Tunneler - 1 (0)
Dirty Rat - 1 (0)
Fel Orc Soulfiend - 1 (0)
Street Trickster - 1 (0)
Hozen Healer - 1 (2)
Streetwise Investigator - 1 (2)
Spiked Hogrider - 1 (3)
Defias Cleaner - 1 (3)
Finja, the Flying Star - 2 (0)
Naga Corsair - 2 (2)
Second-Rate Bruiser - 2 (3)
Auctionmaster Beardo - 2 (3)
Patches the Pirate - 3 (0)
Sergeant Sally - 3 (0)
Mistress of Mixtures - 3 (2)
Blowgill Sniper - 3 (2)
Genzo, the Shark - 3 (2)
Burgly Bully - 3 (2)
Big-Time Racketeer - 3 (3)
Bomb Squad - 3 (4)
Fight Promoter - 4 (0)
Small-Time Buccaneer - 4 (1)
Doppelgangster - 4 (1)
Wrathion - 5 (3)
* Arena rating is not considering the new set appearance bonus which will make most of the faction themed cards a lot better due to higher chance of having synergy with your deck and for the reno-like cards I've assumed you already have several duplicates in your deck when they show up during your draft.
I arranged everything from lowest to highest constructed rating to give me a better overview and I can't help to notice that we sure got a lot of super crappy neutral minions from this expansion, both for constructed and for arena!
Clearly Rogue got the worst bunch of class cards while Priest got the best, it seems Mage also got quite a lot bad cards, probably due to arena balancing, Shaman didn't get too much good stuff either as expected while the rest of the classes overall got some pretty decent additions from this expansion.
In general I think we got way too many bad cards compared to good cards from MSG, but luckily most of the good cards are not good in aggro decks for a change so I guess I shouldn't complain too much.
Hope you found this interesting, let me know what you think and if you disagree on something feel free to leave a comment and I'll try to explain or maybe adjust the score.
Edit:
Blastcrystal Potion up from 3 to 4.
Sergeant Sally up from 3 to 4.(reverted, changed my mind)Bomb Squad up from 2 to 3.
Shaku, the Collector up from 1 to 2 in arena.
Virmen Sensei down from 4 to 3 in arena.
Second-Rate Bruiser up from 2 to 3 in arena.
Drakonid Operative up from 4 to 5 in arena.
Mistress of Mixtures down from 4 to 3 *NEW*
Kabal Crystal Runner down from 3 to 2 *NEW*
What is Hearthstone to you?
A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Topics like this just make you look silly when you're wrong a majority of the time.
Let's wait two damn days!!
"As housecarl I am sworn to your service. I will protect you and all you own, with my life." - Lydia of Whiterun
Nothing wrong with having an opinion. I think you misunderstood my message.
I do not believe that the OP is a coward or an idiot. I think that this much guesswork is liable to make him look dumb, but hey, it could make him look like a genius as well I suppose.
My point is this; there's literally 200 different topic. We get that everyone is excited about the new expansion. Why is everyone so determined to break down every card into a different tier and power ranking.
Its two days away..
I'd think it was excitement for the expansion. It's really close to release, so some people would get excited for it. This is one way to show that.
I suppose. Nothing wrong with hype.
I guess im just more interested in threads with debates, creative discussions, and new insights than tier lists and such. But I concede. Post away lol.
That list must have taken a LOT of time to make!
Why rating the Greater Healing Potion so high in Priest? You can't even Auchenai it... and why Pint sized Potion so low?
How dare you give [card]Weasel Tunneler[/card] a 1.
He might see some play though, but I doubt he'll stick around for long, so I rated him 3.
I do believe Pirate Warrior will be a pretty strong deck, but I don't think Patches the Pirate will be played in it 1 month after release.
I judged all the reno-like legendaries as if you already have 3-4 duplicates in your deck when they show up during your draft so Kazakus received such a low score as he's mostly judged by his stats and the fact you'll have 2 other legendaries to choose from.
Second-Rate Bruiser might be more like a 3 than a 2 when I think about it, but I wouldn't rate him a 4 as very often he'll just be a 5 mana 4/5 taunt which is like a 2, sometimes he'll be a 3 mana 4/5 which would make him a 4.5 I guess, since that will pretty much never happen early in arena, so because the consistency of a card is so important in arena I'd rate him a 3. (Will edit that)
It would be played around the same way as Redemption, huge waste of a card slot I'm afraid.
It can't go face and it can be very hard to play without hitting one of your own minions or forcing you to make awkward trades in order to avoid that.
Not a good pick in arena at all I'm afraid, might be played in Control Warrior as a 1-of, but not sure it's worth running even there.
Pint-Size Potion will in very most cases require you to combo it with another card to make it useful and when you use it to trade on board it will often be worse than Circle of Healing which is a card that can be used for a board clear with Auchenai Soulpriest, which is a card you'll often run anyways.
You wont be running Shadow Word: Horror just to be able to combo it with this card, but you might run Cabal Shadow Priest which is why it got a rating of 2 instead of 1 or 0.
You have to pay the cost of playing an incredibly crappy card in order to have the chance of making your opponent draw this instead of one of their other cards later in the game....it's not good....pretty troll though :P
Blastcrystal Potion up from 3 to 4 in constructed as I think it will be used as a 1-of in Reno decks.
Sergeant Sally up from 3 to 4 in constructed as I think this will also see play in Renolock.
Bomb Squad up from 2 to 3 in constructed as it might see some play in Evolve Shaman if that comes back with Doppelgangster and Big-Time Racketeer being strong additions as well.
Shaku, the Collector up from 1 to 2 in arena as getting random class cards is usually pretty good for arena.
Virmen Sensei down from 4 to 3 in arena as you wont always get a bunch of beasts in your draft.
What is Hearthstone to you?
A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Thanks for the polite answers and explanations! Good work and good attitude!
Hm, I have been saying this a lot lately but I really don't think Jade Idol is worth a 6. Its pretty slow, and when you shuffle it back into your deck you essentially just lost a card draw, which really means something.
Also Jade Idols really would work in a more Control Jade Druid, but it most likely will never reach the fatigue stage, and Druid removal sucks.
So later on if you're losing, you might want a Swipe or Moonglade Portal to spare you, but instead you got one of your 100 Jade Idols, either losing you another card draw or summoning a Jade Golem that doesn't have taunt to protect you.
Honestly for me it would be 3(4), This by itself can help in Arena more because you can out-muscle your opponent eventually.
If it was 2 mana and additionally drew a card, then it would be broken af imo
---
Also Daring Reporter seems like a really decent Arena card, since it would pressure your opponent when they want to hunt for their tempo swinging cards. I'd actually give it 1(3)
The fact that Jade Blossom doesn't cycle at 10 mana is a detriment to the power of this card, but still summoning a Jade Golem for 1 mana seems pretty strong to me, especially when you can get an infinite amount of these cards in your deck.
The first one you will of course use to summon a Jade Golem to get the ball running for your other Jade cards and the 2nd one you may use with Fandral Staghelm to get both effects or just use to fill your deck up with more of this card.
Just playing this card by itself is a cheap way to lower the cost of your Arcane Giants while also furthering your Jade Golem strategy.
I theorized a deck list I think will work well here:
What is Hearthstone to you?
A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
Worst against Mage and Priest, but pretty good against the rest of the classes I think.
What is Hearthstone to you?
A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
That looks like it took a lot of time and thought.
first post TROOOOOLLLLLLLLLLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Fucking internet lol
Yeah this took really long to make, especially considering I'm using a super slow laptop, it took me about 3 hours I think, maybe even a little over :P
I wanted to list the classes purely based on how good class cards they've received from MSG, this is not to list how strong the classes will be overall after the expansion, this is basically just to see how well they've been treated by MSG in regards to class cards compared to eachother.
1. Priest
2. Druid
3. Hunter
4. Warrior
5. Paladin
6. Warlock
7. Shaman
8. Mage
9. Rogue
I haven't taken the tri-class cards or the neutrals much into consideration for this list as that would be a judgement of how powerful the different archetypes will be which is something I can't really judge with confidence without having tried them yet.
However I did kind of consider the archetypes when valuating the different class cards though, so a lot of the higher rated cards are assuming those archetypes will be pretty good and a lot of the 3s are rated 3 just because there might be some low tier decks that may use those cards so it's not really an accurate prediction of class power increase post-expansion....just some ranking based on how good I think the class cards they received are.
If I were to consider tri-class and neutral cards then Mage and Warlock would be a lot higher due to Kazakus and other support for the reno archetypes also Druid didn't really get the healing that we wanted to support a slower meta so it wouldn't be ranked as 2nd since most of the cards that make Druid take 2nd place IMO is the class cards with Jade Golem synergy, Mistress of Mixtures might be more useful than I expect tho so maybe that deserves a spot in Druid decks, not sure....the Enchanted Raven turned out to be far worse than most had expected, it'snot really anywhere close to the power level of a 1 mana 2/3 aka Zombie Chow.
What is Hearthstone to you?
A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?
I also did a overview on the new cards, I think some of your ratings are pretty off. Check my review, I also gave reasons for the ratings.
Also why 6 categories? 0, 1, 2 are basically the same: bad
I think 0-5 is almost too much
http://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-discussion/179167-complete-gadgetzan-set-review
Don't forget that Jade Blossoms will let me jump from 3 to 5 mana while still helping out the Jade Golem synergy, take that into consideration as well as the fact that you'd want to keep 1 Jade Idol in opening hand and that I run 2 Innervates I think the early game should be consistent enough.
2x Nourish and 2x Azure Drake + sometimes cycling from Wrath and Wild Growth does give me quite a lot of draw I think, Raven Idol also helps with card advantage sometimes if you get to play it with Fandral Staghelm.
I don't think card advantage will be too much of an issue, late game those Jade Idols will probably be crazy strong anyways, doesn't matter if you float a little mana.
What is Hearthstone to you?
A fun and semi-competitive game with wacky effects and crazy RNG outcomes or just a card game you wanna grind as many wins you can get as fast as possible in?