Balancing already is reactive. Or non-existent (e.g., Dr. Boom). Basically, they are saying how they balance wild will be the same as how they balance the game right now. And wild is the game right now, so...
No, they are saying that they will balance standard as they do right now. And for wild they will have a "different tolerance" as Brode literally said. Which means they will care even less about balance as they already do (is that even possible?).
I'm sure wild will be playable at least in the first few months. But with every new adventure or expansion the chance is huge that wild will be broken forever. It's predestined to be broken over time. When designing new cards they will not take care of possible interactions with cards outside the Standard pool - at some point there is no way around. The upcoming nerfs only affect basic/classic cards because they limit "design space". They would also had to nerf GvG/Naxx cards if they had to take care of interactions in wild mode - but they don't. That's Blizzards way to make us switch to Standard entirely without making it too obvious. And that's why people complain.
Not to give people too much credit, but I feel like at least some are complaining because wild won't be the official mode - all the pros will have to play standard to earn Blizz points towards going to competitions, and all the major tournys will use standard.
I think it's a great compromise, and I'm one of the people who will only be playing standard.
Lovely how people always make their own interpretation of a post. They won't make wild available if it is broken. You can say a lot of bad things about blizzard, but they never release a broken game.
They've been releasing broken brawls for months now, which is the same flavour that "Wild" is gonna have: an unbalanced, "fun" light mode that nobody takes seriously and that isn't really supported or thought much about.
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When you dump something down the toilet it disappears while still existing in the sewers. Welcome to Wild mode, "it's not like they took our cards away".
the real reason why kids are complaining is that wild is not the main format. what those kids will do without their skilless secret paladin or the cancer parade from the naxx deathrattles? when the game becomes slower with more variety and without minions that stay forever on the board it will require more skill in trading + decisions. those who complain about wild actually like hearthstone as it now.....
im a f2p player and i will just dust everything i will get a ton of dust and still be competetive without paying a dime. the thing here is not money, its that they realise they lose their broken tools. sorry uther back to tier 3 where you belong
I don't even have to speculate that far to know Wild will not work in the long run. Since in the next update they are removing key cards in today's meta, it's very likely we'll be seeing reprints in the future. Unless they literally reprint the same card, i.e same name and stats but with a different art, it will be possible to have 4 copies of the "same" card in one deck. Can you imagine one deck running 4 Sludge Belchers, 4 Crackles, 4 Avenge, 2 Loatheb, etc?
I don't even have to speculate that far to know Wild will not work in the long run. Since in the next update they are removing key cards in today's meta, it's very likely we'll be seeing reprints in the future. Unless they literally reprint the same card, i.e same name and stats but with a different art, it will be possible to have 4 copies of the "same" card in one deck. Can you imagine one deck running 4 Sludge Belchers, 4 Crackles, 4 Avenge, 2 Loatheb, etc?
I'm not even going to play standard. I don't have hardly any TGT cards, so saying that the majority of cards I do have from GvG are not usable simply means I'm not going to be playing that.
the real reason why kids are complaining is that wild is not the main format. what those kids will do without their skilless secret paladin or the cancer parade from the naxx deathrattles? when the game becomes slower with more variety and without minions that stay forever on the board it will require more skill in trading + decisions.
Because HS Vanilla was the reign of control games, right? Please, if you don't know what you're talking about don't talk at all.
Also with the very poor dust-to-craft ratio of HS dusting all your GvG and Naxx cards will only take you so far, with time your collection will become more and more poor while you striving to rake in the dust for the next expansion. Which of course fully benefits Blizzard as people will be more inclined to pay for cards.
When you dump something down the toilet it disappears while still existing in the sewers. Welcome to Wild mode, "it's not like they took our cards away".
I don't even have to speculate that far to know Wild will not work in the long run. Since in the next update they are removing key cards in today's meta, it's very likely we'll be seeing reprints in the future. Unless they literally reprint the same card, i.e same name and stats but with a different art, it will be possible to have 4 copies of the "same" card in one deck. Can you imagine one deck running 4 Sludge Belchers, 4 Crackles, 4 Avenge, 2 Loatheb, etc?
can you give me a bit of what you are drinking?
It's called logic, sadly it can't be bought.
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When you dump something down the toilet it disappears while still existing in the sewers. Welcome to Wild mode, "it's not like they took our cards away".
It's going to be even easier cost-wise to get into Wild as well due to static crafting costs
Lol, what? Blizzard's dust-to-craft ratio is horrible, and new players won't even get the chance to buy packs and "be lucky", they'll have to hard craft every single one of the Naxx and GvG cards if they want to play Wild. And they won't.
Check how affordable those original Zendikar packs are and their fetchlands. Which, incidentally, carry most of the value of those boosters, because there's little else anyone gives a damn about owning in those sets, just as there will always be a relatively small amount of cards people need for actual Wild decks from any given set. For example, at some point people wouldn't even want the option of sorting through piles of unplayable mech synergy just to get their two piloted shredders that can be had for 80 dust.
Wild will exist and probably flourish for an expansion cycle, but after that the chances are that it'll be dead- since this is, after all, a casual game where F2P players who only play a few hours a week are the main playerbase, especially since the phone version was released, even if they aren't the ones Blizzard really cares ($$$) about. F2P players aren't going to play a mode where there's expansions that they can't get that are more powerful than their combos, since dust is so hard to get and realistically speaking, the number of people willing to craft an entire expansion's worth of good cards just for a declining mode (Especially since you can only craft gold adventure cards) is going to drop exponentially with each new cycle.
Plus, the people who have these cards and are keeping them are likely the ones who are in it for a reward, which Wild will inevitably provide less of than Standard, whether literally or just in terms of value from dust spent crafting cards.
I'm not complaining, its not like my opinion even matters to anyone, I'm just stating the facts about what's actually going to happen based on the information we have. Hell, having GvG and Naxx under a different tab in the store (with AMPLE warning for those worried about the players being dumb and giving money to Blizzard without knowing what they're buying) that's unlocked once a player has played long enough to probably be competent in their decision making abilities, would increase the longevity of the mode among the paying/constantly playing playerbase quite a lot- but instead, the only proof that Ben Brode doesn't think we're all drooling idiots who occasionally buy packs is that he finally trusts us with more deck slots, but even then not unlimited ones, which is honestly what I'm salty about (With Wild existing the need for infinite deck slots only multiplies in my head).
Tl;DR: Wild will die because of F2Ps' majority in the HS population, Wild will probably have worse rewards compared to entry cost so no incentive to play, and I rant about store tabs and deck slots.
Lovely how people always make their own interpretation of a post. They won't make wild available if it is broken. You can say a lot of bad things about blizzard, but they never release a broken game.
They've been releasing broken brawls for months now, which is the same flavour that "Wild" is gonna have: an unbalanced, "fun" light mode that nobody takes seriously and that isn't really supported or thought much about.
This.
I've already read dozens of posts from peopel who are condeming others who are Standard-oriented and who talk about the old cards as being a thing of the past as losers, kids, internet dwellers, pathetic, what have you. It seems they outnumber the whiners at this point, and they are twice as annoying.
Sorry, but I won't be playing Wild, and those cards are dead to me. It has nothing to do with tournaments, skill, or elitism. I'm just not going to build decks and spend time doing dailies to craft cards for a mode that the devs don't focus on.
Wild mode is the exact same way we play Hearthstone now. Standard if an entirely different mode . I don't understand this whining about cards being useless etc.
If you hate to see Unstable Portal, for exaple, being not playable on Standards, just play Wild! What's the problem?
Wild mode is the exact same way we play Hearthstone now. Standard if an entirely different mode . I don't understand this whining about cards being useless etc.
If you hate to see Unstable Portal, for exaple, being not playable on Standards, just play Wild! What's the problem?
I love the way people are ignoring the previous 2 pages of posts and keep posting the same stuff over and over.
Yes, wild will work the same way as our current ranked mode... for the first 4-5 months. Only with even more annoying secret paladins because there will be new strong paladin cards in the new expansion for sure and everyone who is annoyed of playing against these will switch to standard. A secret paladin fiesta, so much fun! Then the second new expansion will be released and if it contains a broken interaction with one of the GvG/Naxx cards then wild is dead. Blizzard won't care. They removed the GvG packs and Naxx from the store. Which means that a new player from now on will never be able to be competitive in wild mode - standard makes much more sense. So on the long run, wild mode will lose more and more players and die out. I'm sure Blizzard is aware of that, but why should they do anything about it? Standard is much more profitable for them.
I will keep all my GvG cards and I will play wild mode sometimes for sure, but it will be a joke comparing to standard.
The new Spring 2016 expansion will be designed based on the assumption that Shredder, Unstable Portal, Loatheb, Dr Boom, etc are no longer in the main meta (rotated from Standard). However, these cards are still available in Wild, and combined with the new cards that will be released to "compensate" for the lost of these cards in Standard Mode, we are looking at an nuclear explosion waiting to happen in Wild.
It will be an unbalanced mess with OP combinations everywhere. Not even talking about UTH+Buzzard type combos, just purely curving out a Shredder into a "insert crazy 5-drop here" will be enough to wreck games. It is just a matter of how many more expansions can Wild sustain before it goes out of control.
It's not that Wild won't be a thing. Wild will be a thing, it will be a messy and terrible thing. The community is just assuming that most players wouldn't want to play a crap mode that Wild will inevitably become.
Because with the absence of naxx and gvg in the shop.. Wild mode= desert mode .. Only people who have the cards now will play it.. Nobody will craft cards for that mode as long as they don't have everything on standard.
I love the way people are ignoring the previous 2 pages of posts and keep posting the same stuff over and over.
Yes, wild will work the same way as our current ranked mode... for the first 4-5 months. Only with even more annoying secret paladins because there will be new strong paladin cards in the new expansion for sure and everyone who is annoyed of playing against these will switch to standard. A secret paladin fiesta, so much fun! Then the second new expansion will be released and if it contains a broken interaction with one of the GvG/Naxx cards then wild is dead. Blizzard won't care. They removed the GvG packs and Naxx from the store. Which means that a new player from now on will never be able to be competitive in wild mode - standard makes much more sense. So on the long run, wild mode will lose more and more players and die out. I'm sure Blizzard is aware of that, but why should they do anything about it? Standard is much more profitable for them.
I will keep all my GvG cards and I will play wild mode sometimes for sure, but it will be a joke comparing to standard.
I also love how people are ignoring the previous 2 pages of posts and keep posting the same stuff all over and over.
As to your example: To make Secret Paladin stronger, you would need stronger cards. And to make Paladin viable in standard, he needs better early game, namely 2 and 3 drops. But this early game has to compete with Shielded Minibot , Muster for Battle and Piloted Shredder in wild. I personally doubt that Paladin will get stronger cards than these ones. And if he doesn't, Secret Paladin will stay the same in wild (as he would without format). Secret Paladin would only get a boost with a new powerful secret and that would not help Paladn in Standard at all.
Edit: Some more on your "Wild will die out" theory. It won't be impossible to craft a viable wild deck. Actually, it will even not be very expensive. Just make, for instance, a zoo deck. Imp-losion , Shredder, Haunted Creeper and Nerubian Egg and you're good to go. The rest is filled with classic/basic cards anyway. Okay, maybe long term you need two wild legendaries with Dr. Boom and Loatheb (although zoo will work without them), but a deck can only consist of 30 Cards. And not all of them Need to be from GvG or Naxx.
We don't pretend it won't exist, we know it won't. Based on experience with 4 different TCGs that implemented similar thing in one way or the other. For example YuGiOh has Traditional where there are no forbidden cards, 10 years of playing never I have ever seen or heard anyone playing it.
Blizzard even said it very clearly. They couldn't directly say: "Hey guys, we will delete half your collection and go f**k yourselves, new rules", cos it would cause a riot, instead they said: "Nothing will change if you don't want to, still ladder on Wild". Yeah right! Except they will removeold packs and adventures from shop. They also said they will nerf cards to fit Standard mode (=who cares what happens to Wild after that, we will fix everything for Standard) and new expansions will be standard oriented too (=who cares if something new will or will not be playable in Wild). All official tournaments also swap to Standard effective immediately after update.
Don't know what else you need... you want them to draw it to you? They can't say it directly cos of potential riot and massive quitting and reporting. People are not prone to change so easily, so they will make us feel nothing changed, but yeah, Wild is dead already and it's clear as a day, but you'll see for yourself in couple of months from now.
I don't get why people is so mad at Blizz for taking old packs and adventures from the store. First: you never know if they'll put them back some time in the future. Second: how fun could wild mode be if EVERYONE had ALL the cards ever made? How could you tell a Veteran from a Newbie? I'm happy with the change, I have all the cards and I hope to keep collecting them all, I pay good money for this and I know I'll be happy to meet people without, say, Dr. Boom or Malygos or anything... Isn't it this kind of thing that makes Mox and Black Lotus super powerful? What if EVERYONE could buy it like some random rare card?
We don't pretend it won't exist, we know it won't. Based on experience with 4 different TCGs that implemented similar thing in one way or the other. For example YuGiOh has Traditional where there are no forbidden cards, 10 years of playing never I have ever seen or heard anyone playing it.
Blizzard even said it very clearly. They couldn't directly say: "Hey guys, we will delete half your collection and go f**k yourselves, new rules", cos it would cause a riot, instead they said: "Nothing will change if you don't want to, still ladder on Wild". Yeah right! Except they will removeold packs and adventures from shop. They also said they will nerf cards to fit Standard mode (=who cares what happens to Wild after that, we will fix everything for Standard) and new expansions will be standard oriented too (=who cares if something new will or will not be playable in Wild). All official tournaments also swap to Standard effective immediately after update.
Don't know what else you need... you want them to draw it to you? They can't say it directly cos of potential riot and massive quitting and reporting. People are not prone to change so easily, so they will make us feel nothing changed, but yeah, Wild is dead already and it's clear as a day, but you'll see for yourself in couple of months from now.
I don't get why people is so mad at Blizz for taking old packs and adventures from the store. First: you never know if they'll put them back some time in the future. Second: how fun could wild mode be if EVERYONE had ALL the cards ever made? How could you tell a Veteran from a Newbie? I'm happy with the change, I have all the cards and I hope to keep collecting them all, I pay good money for this and I know I'll be happy to meet people without, say, Dr. Boom or Malygos or anything... Isn't it this kind of thing that makes Mox and Black Lotus super powerful? What if EVERYONE could buy it like some random rare card?
I agree that Blizzard could bring back the packs; however they will need to change the store interface. How long did extra deck slots take?
You will not be exclusive running Dr. Boom. Most people craft Dr. Boom now, rather than get him from a pack. New players will still be able to craft him. It will actually be cheaper to get some old Adventure cards - Mad Scientist, Flamewaker (when BRM rotates) - than it is now.
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Not to give people too much credit, but I feel like at least some are complaining because wild won't be the official mode - all the pros will have to play standard to earn Blizz points towards going to competitions, and all the major tournys will use standard.
I think it's a great compromise, and I'm one of the people who will only be playing standard.
When you dump something down the toilet it disappears while still existing in the sewers. Welcome to Wild mode, "it's not like they took our cards away".
the real reason why kids are complaining is that wild is not the main format. what those kids will do without their skilless secret paladin or the cancer parade from the naxx deathrattles? when the game becomes slower with more variety and without minions that stay forever on the board it will require more skill in trading + decisions. those who complain about wild actually like hearthstone as it now.....
im a f2p player and i will just dust everything i will get a ton of dust and still be competetive without paying a dime. the thing here is not money, its that they realise they lose their broken tools. sorry uther back to tier 3 where you belong
I don't even have to speculate that far to know Wild will not work in the long run. Since in the next update they are removing key cards in today's meta, it's very likely we'll be seeing reprints in the future. Unless they literally reprint the same card, i.e same name and stats but with a different art, it will be possible to have 4 copies of the "same" card in one deck. Can you imagine one deck running 4 Sludge Belchers, 4 Crackles, 4 Avenge, 2 Loatheb, etc?
I'm not even going to play standard. I don't have hardly any TGT cards, so saying that the majority of cards I do have from GvG are not usable simply means I'm not going to be playing that.
I like to make cards and discuss game balance.
I enjoy when "No similar decks were found."
My latest deck: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/1366184-scholomance-charge-rez-priest-wild
When you dump something down the toilet it disappears while still existing in the sewers. Welcome to Wild mode, "it's not like they took our cards away".
When you dump something down the toilet it disappears while still existing in the sewers. Welcome to Wild mode, "it's not like they took our cards away".
Wild will exist and probably flourish for an expansion cycle, but after that the chances are that it'll be dead- since this is, after all, a casual game where F2P players who only play a few hours a week are the main playerbase, especially since the phone version was released, even if they aren't the ones Blizzard really cares ($$$) about. F2P players aren't going to play a mode where there's expansions that they can't get that are more powerful than their combos, since dust is so hard to get and realistically speaking, the number of people willing to craft an entire expansion's worth of good cards just for a declining mode (Especially since you can only craft gold adventure cards) is going to drop exponentially with each new cycle.
Plus, the people who have these cards and are keeping them are likely the ones who are in it for a reward, which Wild will inevitably provide less of than Standard, whether literally or just in terms of value from dust spent crafting cards.
I'm not complaining, its not like my opinion even matters to anyone, I'm just stating the facts about what's actually going to happen based on the information we have. Hell, having GvG and Naxx under a different tab in the store (with AMPLE warning for those worried about the players being dumb and giving money to Blizzard without knowing what they're buying) that's unlocked once a player has played long enough to probably be competent in their decision making abilities, would increase the longevity of the mode among the paying/constantly playing playerbase quite a lot- but instead, the only proof that Ben Brode doesn't think we're all drooling idiots who occasionally buy packs is that he finally trusts us with more deck slots, but even then not unlimited ones, which is honestly what I'm salty about (With Wild existing the need for infinite deck slots only multiplies in my head).
Tl;DR: Wild will die because of F2Ps' majority in the HS population, Wild will probably have worse rewards compared to entry cost so no incentive to play, and I rant about store tabs and deck slots.
Wild mode is the exact same way we play Hearthstone now. Standard if an entirely different mode . I don't understand this whining about cards being useless etc.
If you hate to see Unstable Portal, for exaple, being not playable on Standards, just play Wild! What's the problem?
The new Spring 2016 expansion will be designed based on the assumption that Shredder, Unstable Portal, Loatheb, Dr Boom, etc are no longer in the main meta (rotated from Standard). However, these cards are still available in Wild, and combined with the new cards that will be released to "compensate" for the lost of these cards in Standard Mode, we are looking at an nuclear explosion waiting to happen in Wild.
It will be an unbalanced mess with OP combinations everywhere. Not even talking about UTH+Buzzard type combos, just purely curving out a Shredder into a "insert crazy 5-drop here" will be enough to wreck games. It is just a matter of how many more expansions can Wild sustain before it goes out of control.
It's not that Wild won't be a thing. Wild will be a thing, it will be a messy and terrible thing. The community is just assuming that most players wouldn't want to play a crap mode that Wild will inevitably become.
"Put your face in the light!" - Tirion Fordring
Do you enjoy playing against Secret Paladins over and over again? You will love Wild.
Otherwise not.
Because with the absence of naxx and gvg in the shop.. Wild mode= desert mode .. Only people who have the cards now will play it.. Nobody will craft cards for that mode as long as they don't have everything on standard.