Hey ! So, Combo Priest is way too strong right now. This deck has never been better than average, and with the lost of Shadow Vision I thought it'd be hard to even be competitive again. But right now, it's just steamrolling on everything. Half my games yesterday (12/26) were against that deck in top legend.
Also, just preemptively saying that I'm not salty because I lost to it or anything, I've been on both sides of this non-sense. Made my run to legend last week from rank 3 to legend with a 12-0 run. Every game felt completely ridiculous and like my opponents had 0 chance to do anything about my plays. And ofc I feel the same way facing it, it's like Priest always have a crazy oppening.
So I was thinking, what made this average deck suddenly SO powerfull in Salvior of Uldum ? I thought a lot about all the cards in this deck and what cards could deserve a change to make this deck more fair. No hard changes like 2 mana nerfs or anything, but just very slight changes to a couple cards.
This is what I came up with and I think it doesn't destroy the deck at all, doesn't change his gameplan or anything, but it could give other decks a slightly better chance to face this absolute monster that is Combo Priest :
- Neferset Ritualist : Only fully heal ONE friendly minion instead of the two adjacent. When I was playing the deck, the most satisfying and unfair feeling I had was healing two minions with that and a Northshire on the board. Idk, it feels like when you do that, you win the game. Healing one minion would still make this card a great card, but limit the abuse of total board control + draw it provides with Northshire.
- Injured Tol'vir : Just remove the taunt tag. I think it's one of the other reasons Priest snowballs the control of the board so hard n the early game and stops any kind of hope for your opponent to do anything. When you have a 6 health taunt by turn 2/3 protecting your Clerics/Lightwardens against another board centric deck, the game is pretty much instantly win. Removing the taunt tag would still give Priest a really good heal-synergy target on turn 2 which is very good, but at least this would give other decks a chance to trade Priest's things.
And that's it. I think these two changes are pretty reasonable and would make Priest a little bit less steamrolling the entire meta.
Agree with most of the above. Full healing 2 minions is over the top with Priest synergies, especially considering premium 2-drop stats. Also on Tol'Vir, being able to curve into Blademaster and circle both if the opponent can't deal with the former is a huge blow out against aggressive decks, while also presenting 2 potential threats against slower decks. That said I think there's another important piece that you have overlooked in High Priest Amet. 7 health on a four-drop is one thing but when its a must-kill that snowballs as hard as Amet does, 7 is way too high. Houndmaster Shaw was pushing it as a 3/6 but killing Amet on curve is completely unachievable in most situations, and with Neferset Ritualist/Circle cutting about it isn't even necessarily safe to just put damage into it to weaken the effect. Even if you do manage to kill Amet off (usually costing you a decent amount of your board) Psychopomp being a potential back up the following turn is devastating.
Cards that snowball this hard should be relatively easy to remove, making it a gamble to play them. Amet is pretty safe to just drop onto most turn 4 boards and you can be pretty confident he will be around next turn.
Priest seems to be all reward and no risk at the moment.
I think divine spirit and inner fire Are the issue. Nothing like spending all of your turns killing minions to have the one minion you spared turn into a 26/26.
Been an auto win for highlander hunter. The key to beating combo Priest is controlling their ability to complete quests (IE not doing damage the first few turns and avoiding situations where they can damage and heal minions) and killing a relatively small number of minions.
I think it’s a matchup a lot of people play poorly against.
It's too strong no doubt. Cleric needs to go but priest needs other good options to replace it or it'll just die. If you want to beat priest until then, play control shaman lol. Hunter is pretty even too at least
And it's all the fault of Divine spirit, but hey,, let's nerf Extra Arms instead, just because.
Let's not let Priest be a slightly snowbally buff-based deck, but instead remove that aspect but keep around the out of the blue OTK that can happen as soon as turn 5.
Guess we'll have to wait until the rotation for them to finally remove Divine Spirit (or just rework it)
just the existence of "doubling" any stat is problematic, especially when you slap it onto a 2-mana spell
Been an auto win for highlander hunter. The key to beating combo Priest is controlling their ability to complete quests (IE not doing damage the first few turns and avoiding situations where they can damage and heal minions) and killing a relatively small number of minions.
I think it’s a matchup a lot of people play poorly against.
combo priest doesn't even play quest...that's like the shitty version, ofc that one'S easy to beat
Divine Spirit is the biggest problem. Take that out and the deck is still competitive, but not broken. You could still buff to have a larger minion, but not a 28/28 minion on turn 4/5
The problem has always been Divine/Inner fire, not some neutral minions that synergise with healing. If Priest can create lots of impossible to kill minions because their health is so high (the 2/7 legendary is a big problem for this), sure, whatever, but the fact that they suddenly oneshot you is the problem.
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
With all due respect you have no idea what you're talking about. Show me some data that supports your argument, and I'll counter that it isn't even a tier 1 deck right now. Best decks of all time, SMH...
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If you thought you knew what you think I know, then you'd know I knew you knew I know.
If divine spirit / inner fire are the problem, why have they not been a problem for years ? It's not like combo priest has ever really been a thing, and even when Shadow Visions and and the 2/3 elemental were in the set it was far from being as good as it is now.
I really thing the problem comes from the new neutral cards. A 2/6 taunt on turn 2, as well as a minion that can full heal 2 other minions on a 2/3 for 2 body are the things that prevent any deck from keeping Priest off the board. It's when Priest is impossible to push off the board that Divine Spirit/Inner Fire become a problem.
@Moonunite : Yeah I've been thinking about Amet too, and although I think it's pretty broken, it's a legendary therefore it's only one copy in the deck and not something you have to consistantly face. The problem is a deck that can afford to have a top curve with three 4-mana cards (and Bwomsamdi) : this makes their early game super consistant, and the fact that's it's almost impossible to keep them from having a board because of the neutrals I mentionned (as well as Psycopomp but this one seems fair). Also, for some reason, they are able to draw their entire deck by turn 10. It's very rare to just be able to fatigue their ressources and take the board for yourself, and unfortunately this is the only gameplan any deck has against Combo Priest.
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
With all due respect you have no idea what you're talking about. Show me some data that supports your argument, and I'll counter that it isn't even a tier 1 deck right now. Best decks of all time, SMH...
Not even a tier 1 deck ? I think we're not living in the same universe.
"Like others have said, without divine spirit we would not have this conversation." Divine Spirit has been here for years and it has never been a problem like it is today. Ofc you can destroy the deck by nerfing Divine Spirit to the ground, the point of my post is to lower down the powerlevel of the deck without having to nerf classic cards that have never been a problem before (or maybe once, in one other meta, where another combo priest was maybe high tier 2 at best).
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
With all due respect you have no idea what you're talking about. Show me some data that supports your argument, and I'll counter that it isn't even a tier 1 deck right now. Best decks of all time, SMH...
VS rates it best deck in the game, it is in every GM lineup and almost always protected. There's is lot of data that it is this best deck in the game.
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
With all due respect you have no idea what you're talking about. Show me some data that supports your argument, and I'll counter that it isn't even a tier 1 deck right now. Best decks of all time, SMH...
Not even a tier 1 deck ? I think we're not living in the same universe.
"Like others have said, without divine spirit we would not have this conversation." Divine Spirit has been here for years and it has never been a problem like it is today. Ofc you can destroy the deck by nerfing Divine Spirit to the ground, the point of my post is to lower down the powerlevel of the deck without having to nerf classic cards that have never been a problem before (or maybe once, in one other meta, where another combo priest was maybe high tier 2 at best).
if you don't change basic cards every now and then, you will always keep running in the same issues every expansion. There is nothing wrong with changing those cards for a healthy game.
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
With all due respect you have no idea what you're talking about. Show me some data that supports your argument, and I'll counter that it isn't even a tier 1 deck right now. Best decks of all time, SMH...
Not even a tier 1 deck ? I think we're not living in the same universe.
"Like others have said, without divine spirit we would not have this conversation." Divine Spirit has been here for years and it has never been a problem like it is today. Ofc you can destroy the deck by nerfing Divine Spirit to the ground, the point of my post is to lower down the powerlevel of the deck without having to nerf classic cards that have never been a problem before (or maybe once, in one other meta, where another combo priest was maybe high tier 2 at best).
if you don't change basic cards every now and then, you will always keep running in the same issues every expansion. There is nothing wrong with changing those cards for a healthy game.
I'm not against changing basic cards. But Divine Spirit in particular has not been a problem in ROS meta. Not a problem in Rastakhan. Not a problem in Boomsday. Not a problem in any meta for years. Actually, since I started playing Hearthstone (not long before league of explorers), Divine Spirit has NEVER been a problem. It has been, once, part of a Combo Priest deck that was tier 2 at best.
No why suddenly would this card need a nerf ? I understand just raping the deck by changing Divine Spirit to 4 mana seems like the ez way to deal with the problem, but really there are ways to lower the powerlevel of the deck without completely destroy it.
I climbed to Legend last month with Quest Shaman annihilating Combo Priests , (65% win rate against them). I was running 1 plague of murloc, 1 earthshock and 2 vulperas though and not the Mutate package that everyone runs now. Currently playing Control Shaman with Zentimo, which singlehandedly kills Combo priest if drawn. I have no intention on climbing Legend this season, just enjoying making Priest players miserable(2 earthshocks, 2 hex, 2 earthquakes, 2 hagatha's schemes, come and face me you little Priest scum :P )
The problem with Combo Prist is that in this expansion it has gained:
- A 1 minion that gives +0/2 (which is as powerful as a lackey)
-The 2/3 taunt which can heal up to 1 2/6
-A minion which heals completely. This is insane because just with a 4/1 in play, you can easily heal it to a 4/7 or a 4/9, use one Divine Spirit and win the game. This problem would persist even if it just healed one minion. And you cannot count on a Taunt minion because of the 0 cost silence.
The solution: probably Divine Spirit should go to the Hall of Fame and maybe the Cleric go back to 2 mana, as it was initially planned, since its draw potential is too strong to be a one cost card.
Hey ! So, Combo Priest is way too strong right now. This deck has never been better than average, and with the lost of Shadow Vision I thought it'd be hard to even be competitive again. But right now, it's just steamrolling on everything. Half my games yesterday (12/26) were against that deck in top legend.
Also, just preemptively saying that I'm not salty because I lost to it or anything, I've been on both sides of this non-sense. Made my run to legend last week from rank 3 to legend with a 12-0 run. Every game felt completely ridiculous and like my opponents had 0 chance to do anything about my plays. And ofc I feel the same way facing it, it's like Priest always have a crazy oppening.
So I was thinking, what made this average deck suddenly SO powerfull in Salvior of Uldum ? I thought a lot about all the cards in this deck and what cards could deserve a change to make this deck more fair. No hard changes like 2 mana nerfs or anything, but just very slight changes to a couple cards.
This is what I came up with and I think it doesn't destroy the deck at all, doesn't change his gameplan or anything, but it could give other decks a slightly better chance to face this absolute monster that is Combo Priest :
- Neferset Ritualist : Only fully heal ONE friendly minion instead of the two adjacent. When I was playing the deck, the most satisfying and unfair feeling I had was healing two minions with that and a Northshire on the board. Idk, it feels like when you do that, you win the game. Healing one minion would still make this card a great card, but limit the abuse of total board control + draw it provides with Northshire.
- Injured Tol'vir : Just remove the taunt tag. I think it's one of the other reasons Priest snowballs the control of the board so hard n the early game and stops any kind of hope for your opponent to do anything. When you have a 6 health taunt by turn 2/3 protecting your Clerics/Lightwardens against another board centric deck, the game is pretty much instantly win. Removing the taunt tag would still give Priest a really good heal-synergy target on turn 2 which is very good, but at least this would give other decks a chance to trade Priest's things.
And that's it. I think these two changes are pretty reasonable and would make Priest a little bit less steamrolling the entire meta.
Agree with most of the above. Full healing 2 minions is over the top with Priest synergies, especially considering premium 2-drop stats. Also on Tol'Vir, being able to curve into Blademaster and circle both if the opponent can't deal with the former is a huge blow out against aggressive decks, while also presenting 2 potential threats against slower decks. That said I think there's another important piece that you have overlooked in High Priest Amet. 7 health on a four-drop is one thing but when its a must-kill that snowballs as hard as Amet does, 7 is way too high. Houndmaster Shaw was pushing it as a 3/6 but killing Amet on curve is completely unachievable in most situations, and with Neferset Ritualist/Circle cutting about it isn't even necessarily safe to just put damage into it to weaken the effect. Even if you do manage to kill Amet off (usually costing you a decent amount of your board) Psychopomp being a potential back up the following turn is devastating.
Cards that snowball this hard should be relatively easy to remove, making it a gamble to play them. Amet is pretty safe to just drop onto most turn 4 boards and you can be pretty confident he will be around next turn.
Priest seems to be all reward and no risk at the moment.
I think divine spirit and inner fire Are the issue. Nothing like spending all of your turns killing minions to have the one minion you spared turn into a 26/26.
Fel magic support Squad
Been an auto win for highlander hunter. The key to beating combo Priest is controlling their ability to complete quests (IE not doing damage the first few turns and avoiding situations where they can damage and heal minions) and killing a relatively small number of minions.
I think it’s a matchup a lot of people play poorly against.
It's too strong no doubt. Cleric needs to go but priest needs other good options to replace it or it'll just die. If you want to beat priest until then, play control shaman lol. Hunter is pretty even too at least
And it's all the fault of Divine spirit, but hey,, let's nerf Extra Arms instead, just because.
Let's not let Priest be a slightly snowbally buff-based deck, but instead remove that aspect but keep around the out of the blue OTK that can happen as soon as turn 5.
Guess we'll have to wait until the rotation for them to finally remove Divine Spirit (or just rework it)
just the existence of "doubling" any stat is problematic, especially when you slap it onto a 2-mana spell
I tried having fun once. It was awful.
combo priest doesn't even play quest...that's like the shitty version, ofc that one'S easy to beat
I tried having fun once. It was awful.
Divine Spirit is the biggest problem. Take that out and the deck is still competitive, but not broken. You could still buff to have a larger minion, but not a 28/28 minion on turn 4/5
The problem has always been Divine/Inner fire, not some neutral minions that synergise with healing. If Priest can create lots of impossible to kill minions because their health is so high (the 2/7 legendary is a big problem for this), sure, whatever, but the fact that they suddenly oneshot you is the problem.
Current Aggro/Combo Priest is probably one of the best decks of all time, insane early game presence and late game finisher. Good thing is most people on ladder suck at the deck or are playing Shaman.
With all due respect you have no idea what you're talking about. Show me some data that supports your argument, and I'll counter that it isn't even a tier 1 deck right now. Best decks of all time, SMH...
If you thought you knew what you think I know, then you'd know I knew you knew I know.
If divine spirit / inner fire are the problem, why have they not been a problem for years ? It's not like combo priest has ever really been a thing, and even when Shadow Visions and and the 2/3 elemental were in the set it was far from being as good as it is now.
I really thing the problem comes from the new neutral cards. A 2/6 taunt on turn 2, as well as a minion that can full heal 2 other minions on a 2/3 for 2 body are the things that prevent any deck from keeping Priest off the board. It's when Priest is impossible to push off the board that Divine Spirit/Inner Fire become a problem.
@Moonunite : Yeah I've been thinking about Amet too, and although I think it's pretty broken, it's a legendary therefore it's only one copy in the deck and not something you have to consistantly face. The problem is a deck that can afford to have a top curve with three 4-mana cards (and Bwomsamdi) : this makes their early game super consistant, and the fact that's it's almost impossible to keep them from having a board because of the neutrals I mentionned (as well as Psycopomp but this one seems fair). Also, for some reason, they are able to draw their entire deck by turn 10.
It's very rare to just be able to fatigue their ressources and take the board for yourself, and unfortunately this is the only gameplan any deck has against Combo Priest.
Like others have said, without divine spirit we would not have this conversation.
Not even a tier 1 deck ? I think we're not living in the same universe.
"Like others have said, without divine spirit we would not have this conversation." Divine Spirit has been here for years and it has never been a problem like it is today. Ofc you can destroy the deck by nerfing Divine Spirit to the ground, the point of my post is to lower down the powerlevel of the deck without having to nerf classic cards that have never been a problem before (or maybe once, in one other meta, where another combo priest was maybe high tier 2 at best).
VS rates it best deck in the game, it is in every GM lineup and almost always protected. There's is lot of data that it is this best deck in the game.
if you don't change basic cards every now and then, you will always keep running in the same issues every expansion. There is nothing wrong with changing those cards for a healthy game.
I'm not against changing basic cards. But Divine Spirit in particular has not been a problem in ROS meta. Not a problem in Rastakhan. Not a problem in Boomsday. Not a problem in any meta for years. Actually, since I started playing Hearthstone (not long before league of explorers), Divine Spirit has NEVER been a problem. It has been, once, part of a Combo Priest deck that was tier 2 at best.
No why suddenly would this card need a nerf ? I understand just raping the deck by changing Divine Spirit to 4 mana seems like the ez way to deal with the problem, but really there are ways to lower the powerlevel of the deck without completely destroy it.
I climbed to Legend last month with Quest Shaman annihilating Combo Priests , (65% win rate against them). I was running 1 plague of murloc, 1 earthshock and 2 vulperas though and not the Mutate package that everyone runs now. Currently playing Control Shaman with Zentimo, which singlehandedly kills Combo priest if drawn. I have no intention on climbing Legend this season, just enjoying making Priest players miserable(2 earthshocks, 2 hex, 2 earthquakes, 2 hagatha's schemes, come and face me you little Priest scum :P )
What about upping Cleric to two mana?
Part of the problem is being unable to clear him so early with support landing on the following turns.
The problem with Combo Prist is that in this expansion it has gained:
- A 1 minion that gives +0/2 (which is as powerful as a lackey)
-The 2/3 taunt which can heal up to 1 2/6
-A minion which heals completely. This is insane because just with a 4/1 in play, you can easily heal it to a 4/7 or a 4/9, use one Divine Spirit and win the game. This problem would persist even if it just healed one minion. And you cannot count on a Taunt minion because of the 0 cost silence.
The solution: probably Divine Spirit should go to the Hall of Fame and maybe the Cleric go back to 2 mana, as it was initially planned, since its draw potential is too strong to be a one cost card.