Hi there guys. Firstly, sorry for my English, not my language.
I know there are some "model decks" here, but the thing is I get a bit lost with that guides (plus that, as said, I don't really get everything in English). So, what I was looking for is advice for my current situation: I've started playing about a week ago, firstly I focused on getting a rogue cheap-combo-party deck (something similar to miracle but not so "miraculous"). That didn't seem to work for me (plus I need more must-have cards for that deck) so I decided to try something more of my gamestyle, a control deck with warlock. I think I'm looking for a hard taunt + removal spells deck, but as said I don't have much idea, so I could be wrong about my plans, maybe I need more aggression, or anything else.
The thing is, in the scenario of having the basic warlock cards (aka lvl 10 cards), which ones should be the first non-basics to go (both warlock and neutrals)?
Have to add, I'd like a deck involving Jaraxxus late game, does that synergize well with this style of control-deck?
And that's all, if you can just tell the most must-have-cards to get now, or give me a link where I can look for that, I'd appreciate it.
Again, sorry for my English, tried my best. Thank you very much :)
Hi there guys. Firstly, sorry for my English, not my language.
I know there are some "model decks" here, but the thing is I get a bit lost with that guides (plus that, as said, I don't really get everything in English). So, what I was looking for is advice for my current situation: I've started playing about a week ago, firstly I focused on getting a rogue cheap-combo-party deck (something similar to miracle but not so "miraculous"). That didn't seem to work for me (plus I need more must-have cards for that deck) so I decided to try something more of my gamestyle, a control deck with warlock. I think I'm looking for a hard taunt + removal spells deck, but as said I don't have much idea, so I could be wrong about my plans, maybe I need more aggression, or anything else.
The thing is, in the scenario of having the basic warlock cards (aka lvl 10 cards), which ones should be the first non-basics to go (both warlock and neutrals)?
Have to add, I'd like a deck involving Jaraxxus late game, does that synergize well with this style of control-deck?
And that's all, if you can just tell the most must-have-cards to get now, or give me a link where I can look for that, I'd appreciate it.
Again, sorry for my English, tried my best. Thank you very much :)
I main Warlock Control,doing stuff atm so I can't help you now but you can find me on ManaGrind's TeamSpeak (hearthstoneplayers.com)
The thing is, in the scenario of having the basic warlock cards (aka lvl 10 cards), which ones should be the first non-basics to go (both warlock and neutrals)?
Basically all the rares that are above and also you want to use healing minions (Voodoo,Farseer,Darkscale,Elune) so that you can keep using your hero power to draw cards. Also you can use 1 Defender of Argus to give the healing minions taunt one and gain more board control (Darkscale + Argus is just brutal)
Have to add, I'd like a deck involving Jaraxxus late game, does that synergize well with this style of control-deck?
Lord Jaraxxus is working properly only with the Control archetype because in order to play him and make him actually work,you need to have either an empty board or a clear board advantage over your opponent because you are wasting 1 turn in order to play him and if your opponent is ahead in the game your are basically giving him the game,which means that Lord Jaraxxus "Locks you games" *pun intended* rather than win you games and that's the reason that nobody should overreact and say that he's overpowered.
if you can just tell the most must-have-cards to get now, or give me a link where I can look for that, I'd appreciate it.
The must have cards are the rares in the list above,when you complete your budget version the other must have cards are: Lord Jaraxxus,Alexstrasza,Hogger,Sylvanas,The Black Knight,Baron Geddon
OK, thanks a lot again! I'm starting to create some of them following your advice :3
This healing minions go x2 or just x1 in the deck? Cause I'm going x2 but I'm not sure about it :O
Thank you!
2 of those and also try to add 1 Blood Imp, its buff can cause a lot of trouble to your opponent cause it will be harder for him to kill your taunt minions.
There's also another warlock control advice thread in the deck sharing forums you might want to check out!
If you are refering to me,I had some games and talked to that guy (he wanted to see my healing control deck) and I think he tweaked his deck a bit after our games.
if you can just tell the most must-have-cards to get now, or give me a link where I can look for that, I'd appreciate it.
The must have cards are the rares in the list above,when you complete your budget version the other must have cards are: Lord Jaraxxus,Alexstrasza,Hogger,Sylvanas,The Black Knight,Baron Geddon
Was just reading through this thread, as I'm an avid lock player, and noticed that Baron Geddon is one of your "must haves"
Just curious, why is that? He was one of the first legendaries I opened post-wipe and I've kept him around simply because I don't know what I would use the dust to make... But he doesn't seem to fit into any decks (I can think of) well. But would love to know how others use him.
Let's talk a bit of control. Firstly, is the spell:minion ratio, you do want a bigger than average pool of spells to trade while capitalizing on the Warlock's hero power. These include, but are not limited to - hellfire, soul siphon, shadowbolt, shadow flame, (most of these choices are dependent on the minion composition of your deck) demonfire, soulfire, mortal coin, and drain life. With all these spells, some spell power is not bad: Kobold and Thalnos. After that, look for some reliable minions to establish board presence: Pit Lord, Yeti, Sylvanas, Fen Creeper, Twilight Drake, Harvest Golem, Senjin, Dread Infernal. Your early game consists of drops that keep you ahead or atleast even: Loot Hoarder, Flame Imp, Voidwalker, Sunfury. Two general counters: Ooze, Spellbreaker, Owl, Jones. Late game, you pick your win condition: Ysera, Alexandra, Jrax, Ragnaros.
Honestly, control is dust heavy. To recap, take the strong warlock early game, choose the type of spell-control you prefer, match your minions to it, add in some general counters, choose a Supported win condition. I don't like Jrax as a win condition IMO, he belongs in his own deck that is also control, but focuses on a bigger safety net post summon. Twisting Nether -> INFERNO! Is the single coolest thing in game.
P.s.this website has some horrible mobile formatting at times
Thanks a lot for all your posts! Right now i'm using a deck like this, gonna put a * in that cards I'm not really sure to have in my deck, or which are the ones that I would drop for another cards/suggestions:
(Here I know I should maybe swap to have some heal minions x2 instead of x1, so I suppose I gotta drop the Grunt, even tho I really like it when I get him early, but maybe he's out of place in this deck...?)
Thanks a lot for all your posts! Right now i'm using a deck like this, gonna put a * in that cards I'm not really sure to have in my deck, or which are the ones that I would drop for another cards/suggestions:
(Here I know I should maybe swap to have some heal minions x2 instead of x1, so I suppose I gotta drop the Grunt, even tho I really like it when I get him early, but maybe he's out of place in this deck...?)
Suggestions? Thanks a lot in advance! :)
Remove both * spells IMO.
As for the minions, if you remove the 2 spells add 2 grizzlies, if not,remove the grunt and maybe argus of them. Also if you have argent commander or portals you should definitely put them in for the time being,which means that you have to remove the * spells and grunt+argus.
So I totally remove the 2-mana cards (demonfire and grunt), and go for Life Tap or 1-mana cost cards in turn 2?
Just asking cause I don't know if that can be good, I tend to read a lot of times about the "magical mana curve" so I'm not sure if that lack of 2mana-cards could hurt too much. In your experience is that fine then? I can understand that you can do other things in turn 2 and go for some drops/spells in 3, yeh.
And can we conclude that Twisting Nether is worth the space in deck? Cause I can disenchant some stuff and go for it, but I don't think I've had so many times where Twisting could have save my game.
So I totally remove the 2-mana cards (demonfire and grunt), and go for Life Tap or 1-mana cost cards in turn 2?
Just asking cause I don't know if that can be good, I tend to read a lot of times about the "magical mana curve" so I'm not sure if that lack of 2mana-cards could hurt too much. In your experience is that fine then? I can understand that you can do other things in turn 2 and go for some drops/spells in 3, yeh.
And can we conclude that Twisting Nether is worth the space in deck? Cause I can disenchant some stuff and go for it, but I don't think I've had so many times where Twisting could have save my game.
(Jeez, sorry for my English xD)
Thanks :3
Mana curve is not a big deal when you have a control deck and a lot of draw power,so yeah you mostly life tap on turn 2 and this works really well with farseer because you only need to take at least 1 more dmg from your enemy so that you can play him on turn 3 without losing any healing value.
OK then. My question now is, I can disenchant Velen (priest legendary, cause I just hate the priest thematic and won't play him) and get above 1600 dust, so I can craft one legendary.
Which one would you choose in my deck? I personally love Ysera, and I find her quite funny with that dream-cards, so I think she's a really good finisher summon. But maybe Alexstrasza is better. I'm thinking in a scenario where I place Jaraxxus, I could get some hits in that "lost turn", so maybe Alexstrasza can be a heal back or drop enemy to 15. Thing is then I don't have a taunt/removal after that, so I am open to eat shit again next turn (that could happen with both Alex and Ysera). The other option is Deathwing, for a nice removal and fat minion... if you know they don't have more removals I think it tends to be gg. I can use it before/after Jaraxxus as well. And my last option is Ragnaros, which is a 8 mana so I can drop him with a infernal after summoning Jaraxxus. I like Ragnaros cause even if silenced is a motherfucking 8/8, which is nice, and with not silences it can be a pain in the ass.
So, could I get some opinions?
- Deathwing
- Ragnaros
- Ysera
- Alexstrasza
I'll have to get some low cost legens later, like Hogger/Black Knight, but as said I think that for now I prefer a late game big monster.
I personally think Demonfire is one of the best Warlock spells, a 2 mana 2 damage that can also double as a buff is amazing, not really a fan of Drain Life, the health gain is nice, but if you're playing control, you're very far from needing to find a way to regen life as the number of threats on the board is always low and when you play it well, the fact that your opponent has to deal with the threat you present as well as trying to keep up in card advantage, there's little they can do directly to you (especially with Jaraxxus and Alexstrasza as a saving grace). Maybe if you're running Hellfires, I can see the merit in it, but one extra mana can be the difference between tapping or not, and I'll gladly see to it that I take card advantage over life in a control deck 90% of the time.
As for your win condition in a control deck, Deathwing is far from my favorite. Ysera or Ragnaros is your best bet for being able to push to end the game whereas Alexstrasza doubles as a defensive card. I would say there's three ways to approach this: Ragnaros for the full power of a bomb card, where you will essentially end the game when playing it as a finisher. Ysera if you prefer to play it safe with card advantage and slowly finish off your opponent (the card is also safer as you get a guaranteed +1 from the turn you play it), and Alexstrasza as the safer alternative of the three, it doubles as a heal, a decent 8/8 minion, and has some sick synergy in a Jrax deck.
Mana curve is always a big deal, period. If you're saying that having a lack of a low-end on the curve is okay, I adamantly believe that this is wrong. The better low end of a curve you have, the more options open up to be able to tap and push card advantage early game. Warlock essentially lacks board clear unless you run Hellfire or Shadowflame, if you don't run either and if you don't have a safety net early game, things end very quickly.
Twisting Nether belongs more to a deck with Jaraxxus imo, board clear is great, but you do want a somewhat of a contingency plan to avoid being overwhelmed even post-nether. I think this relies more on experience to decide, if you are able to find that you're not using all your removal late game and you have a Siphon Soul/Shadowbolt or two to counter any play once you Nether, it's a good way to push for the final moments of the game.
My experience playing Jaraxxus with too much healing and control is that I always found myself at an HP deficit after playing Jrax, where I've essentially lost myself the game playing him, because, 15 health isn't much. I think Warlock control needs to be aggressive with their cards and use Jrax as a contingency plan if things fail. If you play too passively with your heals or play too many heals, your opponent can keep up because there's really no threat present, and they'll prep for late to take out your win conditions.
Thanks a lot for all that information! I'm really average player, so I'm sitting at platinum II (if I remember well), but I've made important additions to the deck after my last ranked game, so I'll have to go and see what happens now. I'm yet to add, as said, one of that legendaries. But I'm not really sure after your explanation about which one should I choose.
As said, the one I like (in "enjoyment terms") the most is Ysera, and when I've faced her I've thought she's quite tough, and some dream-cards are really good. But Ysera doesn't have much damage herself as a finisher minion. I like Deathwing too, but I think that 10 cost can hurt many times, and if they have some hidden removal it can be too bad for me. I think Ragnaros can be strong and fun too, but I tend not to like randomness, cause I get really frustrated when things don't work "as intended" ("Ooooh, got you there... but no!", sad panda face). And Alexstrasza, I don't find her very funny to play, but as you said, she's probably the safest and could be the all around best one in more situations. Things would be between Ysera or Alex.
But I'll probably have to go for Alexstrasza if I want improvements and I'll have time to check the others in a future!
Both Frostwolf Grunt and Farseer seem really random minions to have in this deck, in my opinion, also having Voodoo just for a 2 hp heal doesn't seem that great for me..
As for spells, if you are running Jaraxxus then you might want to run twisting nether, and besides the Power Overwhelming + demonfire combo, you don't have anything great to demonfire(besides jarx infernals also)
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Hi there guys. Firstly, sorry for my English, not my language.
I know there are some "model decks" here, but the thing is I get a bit lost with that guides (plus that, as said, I don't really get everything in English). So, what I was looking for is advice for my current situation: I've started playing about a week ago, firstly I focused on getting a rogue cheap-combo-party deck (something similar to miracle but not so "miraculous"). That didn't seem to work for me (plus I need more must-have cards for that deck) so I decided to try something more of my gamestyle, a control deck with warlock. I think I'm looking for a hard taunt + removal spells deck, but as said I don't have much idea, so I could be wrong about my plans, maybe I need more aggression, or anything else.
The thing is, in the scenario of having the basic warlock cards (aka lvl 10 cards), which ones should be the first non-basics to go (both warlock and neutrals)?
Have to add, I'd like a deck involving Jaraxxus late game, does that synergize well with this style of control-deck?
And that's all, if you can just tell the most must-have-cards to get now, or give me a link where I can look for that, I'd appreciate it.
Again, sorry for my English, tried my best. Thank you very much :)
I main Warlock Control,doing stuff atm so I can't help you now but you can find me on ManaGrind's TeamSpeak (hearthstoneplayers.com)
Oh! I appreciate it, the problem is that if I can't speak English properly via writing, TeamSpeak is too much for me :P
I have checked the website but I can't find a warlock guide, is it supposed to have one??
Thank you very much, any tips/links will be appreciated :3
2 Drain Life 2 Hellfire 1 Mortal Coil 2 Shadow Bolt 2 Siphon Soul 2 Soulfire 2 Voidwalker 2 Abomination 2 Sen'jin Shieldmasta' 2 Sunwalker 1 Power Overwhelming / 1 Shadowflame / 1 Twisting Nether (<--- Depending on your playstyle)
*Remove something for Demonfire if you want but I don't recommend it cause you are going to lose some of your direct damage options.
This is the core of a budget warlock control.
Basically all the rares that are above and also you want to use healing minions (Voodoo,Farseer,Darkscale,Elune) so that you can keep using your hero power to draw cards. Also you can use 1 Defender of Argus to give the healing minions taunt one and gain more board control (Darkscale + Argus is just brutal)
Lord Jaraxxus is working properly only with the Control archetype because in order to play him and make him actually work,you need to have either an empty board or a clear board advantage over your opponent because you are wasting 1 turn in order to play him and if your opponent is ahead in the game your are basically giving him the game,which means that Lord Jaraxxus "Locks you games" *pun intended* rather than win you games and that's the reason that nobody should overreact and say that he's overpowered.
The must have cards are the rares in the list above,when you complete your budget version the other must have cards are: Lord Jaraxxus,Alexstrasza,Hogger,Sylvanas,The Black Knight,Baron Geddon
Guy, this is what I wanted! Thank you so much, I'll follow this tips til I get all that stuff (will take some time!)
Thanks again :)
About the Healing Minions,the value looks something like that: Farseer>Darkscale>Voodoo=Elune(depending on your needs)
OK, thanks a lot again! I'm starting to create some of them following your advice :3
This healing minions go x2 or just x1 in the deck? Cause I'm going x2 but I'm not sure about it :O
Thank you!
2 of those and also try to add 1 Blood Imp, its buff can cause a lot of trouble to your opponent cause it will be harder for him to kill your taunt minions.
There's also another warlock control advice thread in the deck sharing forums you might want to check out!
http://www.youtube.com/user/vtxaishi
You're not going crazy, I edit 2~3 times each post
If you are refering to me,I had some games and talked to that guy (he wanted to see my healing control deck) and I think he tweaked his deck a bit after our games.
Was just reading through this thread, as I'm an avid lock player, and noticed that Baron Geddon is one of your "must haves"
Just curious, why is that? He was one of the first legendaries I opened post-wipe and I've kept him around simply because I don't know what I would use the dust to make... But he doesn't seem to fit into any decks (I can think of) well. But would love to know how others use him.
Thanks
I couldn't copy and past it on my mobile, but here it is
http://www.youtube.com/user/vtxaishi
You're not going crazy, I edit 2~3 times each post
Thanks a lot for all your posts! Right now i'm using a deck like this, gonna put a * in that cards I'm not really sure to have in my deck, or which are the ones that I would drop for another cards/suggestions:
Spells:
Soulfire x2
Mortal Coil x1
Power Overwhelming x1
* Demonfire x1
Drain Life x2
Shadow Bolt x2
Hellfire x2
* Shadowflame x1
Siphon Soul x2
(Doubts with that spells are because if I gotta put a Twisting Nether in my deck, what should I drop? Is Twisting Nether really worth it btw?)
Minions:
Voidwalker x2
Voodoo x1
Blood Imp x1
* Frostwolf Grunt x1
Farseer x2
Sen'Jin x2
Defender of Argus x1
Abomination x2
Darkscale x1
Sunwalker x2
Jaraxxus x1
(Here I know I should maybe swap to have some heal minions x2 instead of x1, so I suppose I gotta drop the Grunt, even tho I really like it when I get him early, but maybe he's out of place in this deck...?)
Suggestions? Thanks a lot in advance! :)
Remove both * spells IMO.
As for the minions, if you remove the 2 spells add 2 grizzlies, if not,remove the grunt and maybe argus of them. Also if you have argent commander or portals you should definitely put them in for the time being,which means that you have to remove the * spells and grunt+argus.
So I totally remove the 2-mana cards (demonfire and grunt), and go for Life Tap or 1-mana cost cards in turn 2?
Just asking cause I don't know if that can be good, I tend to read a lot of times about the "magical mana curve" so I'm not sure if that lack of 2mana-cards could hurt too much. In your experience is that fine then? I can understand that you can do other things in turn 2 and go for some drops/spells in 3, yeh.
And can we conclude that Twisting Nether is worth the space in deck? Cause I can disenchant some stuff and go for it, but I don't think I've had so many times where Twisting could have save my game.
(Jeez, sorry for my English xD)
Thanks :3
Mana curve is not a big deal when you have a control deck and a lot of draw power,so yeah you mostly life tap on turn 2 and this works really well with farseer because you only need to take at least 1 more dmg from your enemy so that you can play him on turn 3 without losing any healing value.
OK then. My question now is, I can disenchant Velen (priest legendary, cause I just hate the priest thematic and won't play him) and get above 1600 dust, so I can craft one legendary.
Which one would you choose in my deck? I personally love Ysera, and I find her quite funny with that dream-cards, so I think she's a really good finisher summon. But maybe Alexstrasza is better. I'm thinking in a scenario where I place Jaraxxus, I could get some hits in that "lost turn", so maybe Alexstrasza can be a heal back or drop enemy to 15. Thing is then I don't have a taunt/removal after that, so I am open to eat shit again next turn (that could happen with both Alex and Ysera). The other option is Deathwing, for a nice removal and fat minion... if you know they don't have more removals I think it tends to be gg. I can use it before/after Jaraxxus as well. And my last option is Ragnaros, which is a 8 mana so I can drop him with a infernal after summoning Jaraxxus. I like Ragnaros cause even if silenced is a motherfucking 8/8, which is nice, and with not silences it can be a pain in the ass.
So, could I get some opinions?
- Deathwing
- Ragnaros
- Ysera
- Alexstrasza
I'll have to get some low cost legens later, like Hogger/Black Knight, but as said I think that for now I prefer a late game big monster.
Thanks a lot for your time ^^
I personally think Demonfire is one of the best Warlock spells, a 2 mana 2 damage that can also double as a buff is amazing, not really a fan of Drain Life, the health gain is nice, but if you're playing control, you're very far from needing to find a way to regen life as the number of threats on the board is always low and when you play it well, the fact that your opponent has to deal with the threat you present as well as trying to keep up in card advantage, there's little they can do directly to you (especially with Jaraxxus and Alexstrasza as a saving grace). Maybe if you're running Hellfires, I can see the merit in it, but one extra mana can be the difference between tapping or not, and I'll gladly see to it that I take card advantage over life in a control deck 90% of the time.
As for your win condition in a control deck, Deathwing is far from my favorite. Ysera or Ragnaros is your best bet for being able to push to end the game whereas Alexstrasza doubles as a defensive card. I would say there's three ways to approach this: Ragnaros for the full power of a bomb card, where you will essentially end the game when playing it as a finisher. Ysera if you prefer to play it safe with card advantage and slowly finish off your opponent (the card is also safer as you get a guaranteed +1 from the turn you play it), and Alexstrasza as the safer alternative of the three, it doubles as a heal, a decent 8/8 minion, and has some sick synergy in a Jrax deck.
Mana curve is always a big deal, period. If you're saying that having a lack of a low-end on the curve is okay, I adamantly believe that this is wrong. The better low end of a curve you have, the more options open up to be able to tap and push card advantage early game. Warlock essentially lacks board clear unless you run Hellfire or Shadowflame, if you don't run either and if you don't have a safety net early game, things end very quickly.
Twisting Nether belongs more to a deck with Jaraxxus imo, board clear is great, but you do want a somewhat of a contingency plan to avoid being overwhelmed even post-nether. I think this relies more on experience to decide, if you are able to find that you're not using all your removal late game and you have a Siphon Soul/Shadowbolt or two to counter any play once you Nether, it's a good way to push for the final moments of the game.
My experience playing Jaraxxus with too much healing and control is that I always found myself at an HP deficit after playing Jrax, where I've essentially lost myself the game playing him, because, 15 health isn't much. I think Warlock control needs to be aggressive with their cards and use Jrax as a contingency plan if things fail. If you play too passively with your heals or play too many heals, your opponent can keep up because there's really no threat present, and they'll prep for late to take out your win conditions.
Just my two cents. How has the deck been?
http://www.youtube.com/user/vtxaishi
You're not going crazy, I edit 2~3 times each post
Thanks a lot for all that information! I'm really average player, so I'm sitting at platinum II (if I remember well), but I've made important additions to the deck after my last ranked game, so I'll have to go and see what happens now. I'm yet to add, as said, one of that legendaries. But I'm not really sure after your explanation about which one should I choose.
As said, the one I like (in "enjoyment terms") the most is Ysera, and when I've faced her I've thought she's quite tough, and some dream-cards are really good. But Ysera doesn't have much damage herself as a finisher minion. I like Deathwing too, but I think that 10 cost can hurt many times, and if they have some hidden removal it can be too bad for me. I think Ragnaros can be strong and fun too, but I tend not to like randomness, cause I get really frustrated when things don't work "as intended" ("Ooooh, got you there... but no!", sad panda face). And Alexstrasza, I don't find her very funny to play, but as you said, she's probably the safest and could be the all around best one in more situations. Things would be between Ysera or Alex.
But I'll probably have to go for Alexstrasza if I want improvements and I'll have time to check the others in a future!
Clicking on crafting in 3, 2, 1....... D:
Both Frostwolf Grunt and Farseer seem really random minions to have in this deck, in my opinion, also having Voodoo just for a 2 hp heal doesn't seem that great for me..
As for spells, if you are running Jaraxxus then you might want to run twisting nether, and besides the Power Overwhelming + demonfire combo, you don't have anything great to demonfire(besides jarx infernals also)