This is the Discussion Topic. The Submission Topic is here. (Please Read the Submission Topic first.)
Hey guys, this is your bog-standard Discussion Topic for our "Trials and Errors" Class Creation competition; the place to let your ideas run free. Share what's on your mind for your class and help each other to make the best cards you can, as is tradition!
To make sure that everything runs smoothly, we need to reserve the Submission Topic for submissions only. Everything else goes here. What is everything else, you might ask?
Rules or Process. Do you have a question about the competition's process? Do you need clarification about one of the entry requirements? Are you not sure whether your entry adhered to the rules? Ask here!
Feedback or Ideas. Do you have some ideas you'd like to run by others before settling on one? Do you need help balancing or wording your idea? Do you need help finding art that will fit your cards? Or do you just want feedback from the community on your entry? You're in the right place! Remember, although you are allowed to make minor tweaks to your entry after you've submitted it, you're only allowed one submission per competition, so make sure that you've settled on your idea for sure beforehand.
Discussion! Do you have thoughts on other people's ideas? Are there directions you don't like that you're seeing too many people take? Or directions you'd like to see more people take? Would you like to help others and contribute to a greater community understanding of Hearthstone design and balance? This is where you want to be!
All of that said, please refrain from the following:
Posting TONS of Ideas. We understand that this competition is light on mechanical restrictions and that you probably have a ton of potential ideas you'd like to share. However, this thread is going to become an absolute mess if everybody is posting a dozen different ideas. Please post not more than 3 distinct ideas at a time. Any more than that and we'll have to delete your post.
Advertising Your Entry. Please don't pop in here just to advertise your entry only to never be heard from again. This includes only asking short, generic, or insincere questions like "Thoughts?" or "Do you think this is balanced?". Yes, getting feedback on your idea is one of the purposes of this topic, but we're not just here for other people to help you. We're here for you all to help each other. 12 hours after this competition begins, there should be plenty of other posts here for you to give specific feedback or for you to comment on a trend. If you post your ideas for feedback after this time and do not also offer some form of substantial commentary, critique, or praise of others' work, you may find your post deleted.
Plagiarism. Many people post their ideas here before finalizing them in the submission topic. Directly plagiarizing those ideas to post in the submission topic yourself is absolutely not acceptable.
So, without further ado, have fun and get creating!
Mods really making my night by releasing this. Already had a Class Idea prior to the announcement so pretty happy no challenges up until Phase II (Even though I have Basic Set done so will most likely have to change some cards). Here's the idea so far:
The Magician
3 Variations of Hero Power Token:
Due to the 3rd variant being strictly stronger than the Warlock Hero Power, I made the other two variants. The first one is my favoured one but I wanted to hear some opinions on it.
The general idea of the class is that the Hero is a magician, though the whole flavor of the class is more so that of "Preformers". Be it acrobats, actors, clowns... anything goes really. Everyone loves impromptu shows but a practiced performance will more often than not come out much better than an improvised one. That is where the new keyword comes in: SCRIPT.
The main goal of this class thus far is deck manipulation with the main targetted archetypes being Control and Combo. A magician must always have control of the situation and be able to weave his tricks together for the performance to go smoothly! Right?
As I said I already have the Basic set that hasn't been affected by any Challenges so I'll post my 3 favorite cards out of them outside a spoiler and the rest in one.
I also have some Epic spells and two Legendaries made for the class. Most of them are planned for Classic (Apart from Hoodini) but you never know what the challenges will bring.
And a card that is just purely for the flavor but can also show the Script keyword abit:
I appreciate any feedback and will try respond to any people who post before I go to bed tonight!
As Cog said, Challenges (or I guess, thematically, Trials) will begin in Phase II. A specific complaint a few people raised about the last competition was one of the Phase I challenges which required you to have a unique keyword - this left some people stranded in later phases with a keyword that was either unexpectedly restrictive in its design space, or didn't work well with their overall vision for their class. I actually somewhat experienced this myself - my React keyword was a very last-minute addition to my class, and while it worked better for the class than I expected, it left it feeling cluttered and I didn't enjoy having to come up with new ways to use it for each expansion.
Obviously this could be solved by just not requiring a keyword as one of the Trials, but it got us thinking about the general philosophy behind the extra challenges, and we agreed that it's more fun to be allowed more freedom earlier on, when coming up with your class, and then to be challenged later on when you have your plans laid out.
Removing extra conditions from Phase I ensures that everybody goes in with a base design that they like, and then what happens from there is entirely on them. If their keyword doesn't pan out the way they want, that's their own fault now =P
This is all first-draft brainstorming, but I was thinking of making a Lich/Necromancer class with Kel'Thuzad as my character. This requires a major suspension of disbelief, because one would assume Curse of Naxxramas would not exist in its current form; why would they include Kel'Thuzad in the vanilla game, then make the first Adventure about him? This is what I have so far:
Early card ideas:
Frost Orb is basically Icicle. It would make far more sense as a Lich card, and indirectly implies Team 5 would come up with another replacement for Ice Block. I assume that would be an agreeable outcome, hence my decision to "retroactively" steal it.
Main themes are Freeze, Deathrattles, "if it survives"/"if it dies", and re/summoning things that have died. I do not have a unique Keyword; Freeze is my Keyword of choice. Functionally a cross between the Mage, Warlock, and Priest. Much like how the Hunter Hero Power pushes the character in an Aggro direction, the Lich's Hero Power pushes him in a Control direction (which I am okay with). I would later introduce new ways to interact with the Freeze, including Freezing your own minions for benefits (like Cryostasis and Moorabi, but in a class that can actually use them).
I know a Lich class made it all the way to the finale of HearthPwn's first class comp, but my approach appears to be dramatically different. My two major concerns are 1. People taking issue with the Freeze Hero Power, and 2. My depression is peaking/my self-esteem is at a nadir at the moment. Not feeling very high on myself and my idea :/
Behold, foolish interlopers! I am commanding this mortal to spread the will of the Scourge throughout the interwebs, encouraging you to seek out me, Archlich Kel'Thuzad! Now coming to you as the tenth class of Hearthstone!
I am a finalist in this Class Creation Competition, so if you could give it a look I would be greatly appreciative <3
Presenting my first (and only, so I really hope this works)... Battlemage.
Don't know I'll keep Set Ablaze as the Hero Power, but I needed something. Basically, this class in a lot of ways is a combination of Mage and Warrior. Some classes play with spells, others with weapons. Battlemage plays with both. Armor synergy like Warrior is also planned, hence the Hero Power. I don't have that now, but here's what I do have:
Theme: Minion position matters.
I reckon I'm going to get a lot of questions about how Split the Ground works, but... worth it. I know how to answer them.
Also featuring:
I already know people will like this more than my Time Traveler Quest. Remember Unlock the Rift?
Also weapons:
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Click the image to go to my custom Time Traveler class.
Here we have the Alchemist, a class that features the Transmute keyword, which lets you exchange cards you don't need for others that you might.
Ratsearcher is an example of how the keyword can target specific cards. I just realized it's busted with Prince Keleseth, so I'll probably change it to a 2/2/2 that fetches a 3-cost minion.
Appart from Transmute, the class will have other distinctive features, although I haven't thought of anyone yet :_D
Personally like the class idea! Im a sucker for Control oriented classes and may have some bias since i was really rooting for Freeze Shaman to succeed. On phone so got no idea how to quote and put it in spoiler and stuff so Ill give you a very bare bones version of my review on yourcards and stuff.
Firstly your Hero Power. I can see people thinking this is too strong and to some extent I agree. On average Hero Powers tend to give a 0-cost card worth of value (Compare Moonfire to Fireblast, Wisp to Silver Hand Recruit, etc.) and upgraded hero powers give 1-Mana worth of value. I’d say a freeze effect is worth around 0.5 Mana. By that logic it would be slightly on the stronger side. But if we look at Freezing Potion it’s a 0-Cost card. So while I think its slightly strong, I dont really have suggestions as to how to fix it as of yet.
Dark Resurgence - I like the flexibility of this card. It can be used as an Ancsestral Healing effect while also being used as a ping for 2 Damage. Think the Mana is alright as it is.
Rise Again - Another card I like because of how much more control it gives you than Ressurect. On that note I think it would be fine as a 2-cost spell since it still restricts you to when you can use it. Requiring you to have had a strong minion to have died the previous turn. You also can’t make whole archetypes with it like you could with Ressurect.
Onyxia - Can’t say this card has a “wow” factor for me. I dont really know what Dragons your class will have implemented into it but as of right now most strong Dragons are expensive so even if you wait a while to play this you’re likely getting around the same value as Classic Onyxia for 1 more mana and the cost of not being able it early in the game.
Icicle Crasher - Was initially confused by how this works. Since I think I got it now, my verdict is that its too strong. Due to how Freeze works, if you Attack with this minion then Freeze it, it will be Frozen for 2 turns. So for those 2 turns this minion will be ressumoned so to clear it it needs either a silence or for the opponent to go through 4/12 worth of stats before you get the chance to Freeze it again.
Phyllactery Keeper - I dont feel like this minion should have Taunt because to be able to use the Deathrattle, you would need it to survive till your own turn. If its a taunt, more likely than not on turn 7 the opponent will be able to deal witha 5/5 Taunt.
Here we have the Alchemist, a class that features the Transmute keyword, which lets you exchange cards you don't need for others that you might.
Ratsearcher is an example of how the keyword can target specific cards. I just realized it's busted with Prince Keleseth, so I'll probably change it to a 2/2/2 that fetches a 3-cost minion.
Appart from Transmute, the class will have other distinctive features, although I haven't thought of anyone yet :_D
Thoughts?
Well given that my class is also a Deck Manipulation class I like the idea alot. The keyword makes you really think when making the deck taking into account what each Transmute can draw you and when you want to transmute. The Hero Power would help deal with a bad mulligan and seems pretty balanced if not slightly underpowered. Though don’t know how you’d make it stronger without making it OP. Maybe decrease cost of Transmuted card by 1? Just a thought.
Personally like the class idea! Im a sucker for Control oriented classes and may have some bias since i was really rooting for Freeze Shaman to succeed. On phone so got no idea how to quote and put it in spoiler and stuff so Ill give you a very bare bones version of my review on yourcards and stuff.
Firstly your Hero Power. I can see people thinking this is too strong and to some extent I agree. On average Hero Powers tend to give a 0-cost card worth of value (Compare Moonfire to Fireblast, Wisp to Silver Hand Recruit, etc.) and upgraded hero powers give 1-Mana worth of value. I’d say a freeze effect is worth around 0.5 Mana. By that logic it would be slightly on the stronger side. But if we look at Freezing Potion it’s a 0-Cost card. So while I think its slightly strong, I dont really have suggestions as to how to fix it as of yet.
Dark Resurgence - I like the flexibility of this card. It can be used as an Ancsestral Healing effect while also being used as a ping for 2 Damage. Think the Mana is alright as it is.
Rise Again - Another card I like because of how much more control it gives you than Ressurect. On that note I think it would be fine as a 2-cost spell since it still restricts you to when you can use it. Requiring you to have had a strong minion to have died the previous turn. You also can’t make whole archetypes with it like you could with Ressurect.
Onyxia - Can’t say this card has a “wow” factor for me. I dont really know what Dragons your class will have implemented into it but as of right now most strong Dragons are expensive so even if you wait a while to play this you’re likely getting around the same value as Classic Onyxia for 1 more mana and the cost of not being able it early in the game.
Icicle Crasher - Was initially confused by how this works. Since I think I got it now, my verdict is that its too strong. Due to how Freeze works, if you Attack with this minion then Freeze it, it will be Frozen for 2 turns. So for those 2 turns this minion will be ressumoned so to clear it it needs either a silence or for the opponent to go through 4/12 worth of stats before you get the chance to Freeze it again.
Phyllactery Keeper - I dont feel like this minion should have Taunt because to be able to use the Deathrattle, you would need it to survive till your own turn. If its a taunt, more likely than not on turn 7 the opponent will be able to deal witha 5/5 Taunt.
Sorry for any typos, on my phone~
Wow, thanks for the feedback/review :) I'll just speak on some of them:
Onyxia is a Witchwood card, and my response to the lackluster Dragon Hunter we received (she was a Hunter card I re-purposed). I was/am hoping she implies a Dragon Lich archetype in the Witchwood expansion.
You are right in your understanding of Icicle Crasher's functionality: he is essentially a 2/12 Taunt if he was Frozen when killed the first time. Freezing him would require some other resource (like the Hero Power), so to pull it off you need to drop him on turn 6 or later.
I don't know if Phylactery Keeper was meant to have Taunt lol. I left that in there from a previous brainstorming. The idea is that she's AoE-proof: if you clear her at the same time as someone else, she comes back. It doesn't say "died this turn", so it means the other minion needs to die at the same time.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Behold, foolish interlopers! I am commanding this mortal to spread the will of the Scourge throughout the interwebs, encouraging you to seek out me, Archlich Kel'Thuzad! Now coming to you as the tenth class of Hearthstone!
I am a finalist in this Class Creation Competition, so if you could give it a look I would be greatly appreciative <3
Dont have time for a full review but thought I’d make a start on the cards I have questions/Suggestions about.
Firstly, love the idea of the class itself. A caster who isnt afraid to smack things with his face... just mwah. And Im a sucker for Control so it looks promising already in that regard. Now onto some of the cards.
Don’t have any glaring issues with the common cards in the top row. They are exactly that, common. Though I love the Chess Boss-esque Battlecry of the Dragon. Might be abit strong for its cost.
Since you said you know how to answer questions on the splitting board mechanic, here’s your first one~ Is the board split into two equal sides resulting in only 6 minion slots or will it be a 3/4 split. At any rate always loved the idea of altering the board so excited to see where this goes, if anywhere.
Meteor Shower looks okay but I think Icewielder is OP. For one it has vanilla stats for a strong effect. Secondly and this is the part I have a question about. The minion is technically Frozen on their turn before attacking so how long would the Freeze effect last? From what I remember of the Freeze mechanic they will be Frozen the turn they are summoned, your turned and their next turn. which seems like a lot of time but could just be me.
Havent seen all the spells to judge Quest and the weapons seem fine, the fire one being both more interesting and stronger in my opinion.
Well, back to a fire-themed class this season. I have a second class idea, though I want to see if this one pays off. I doubt it since the main mechanic is pretty unique to this class.
The Blacksmith
Blacksmiths are master craftsmen that use both their crafting skills and channelling of the element of fire to support their minions in battle.
This class fits a more supportive role, just like Priest does. To do this, it can grant its minions Armor. Just like on heroes, Armor is displayed over the minion's health and sucks up some of the damage the minion takes and breaks after that. Some minions can also take advantage of their armor and become more powerful through it.
Blacksmiths would look to take advantage of Armor to protect its minions to keep some board presence or to control the board through them.
Some of the mechanics I have planned for the class:
A more control-oriented playstile, with a hint of midrange (and possibly aggro).
Tanking and protecting minions.
Minion support through Armor.
Armor interaction.
Weapons.
Elementals.
Some example cards:
Thoughts? I'll be giving feedback out to whoever I can as soon as I can.
Dont have time for a full review but thought I’d make a start on the cards I have questions/Suggestions about.
Firstly, love the idea of the class itself. A caster who isnt afraid to smack things with his face... just mwah. And Im a sucker for Control so it looks promising already in that regard. Now onto some of the cards.
Don’t have any glaring issues with the common cards in the top row. They are exactly that, common. Though I love the Chess Boss-esque Battlecry of the Dragon. Might be abit strong for its cost.
Since you said you know how to answer questions on the splitting board mechanic, here’s your first one~ Is the board split into two equal sides resulting in only 6 minion slots or will it be a 3/4 split. At any rate always loved the idea of altering the board so excited to see where this goes, if anywhere.
Meteor Shower looks okay but I think Icewielder is OP. For one it has vanilla stats for a strong effect. Secondly and this is the part I have a question about. The minion is technically Frozen on their turn before attacking so how long would the Freeze effect last? From what I remember of the Freeze mechanic they will be Frozen the turn they are summoned, your turned and their next turn. which seems like a lot of time but could just be me.
Havent seen all the spells to judge Quest and the weapons seem fine, the fire one being both more interesting and stronger in my opinion.
Regarding what you said about Split the Ground, it will split it into 3/3, meaning 6 total minions. You can play minions to any side at any time, provided it's not full already.
As for Icewielder, Frozen minions will miss their next attack regardless of when they're Frozen. If you were to play a minion with Charge or Rush, it would be unfrozen at the end of your turn and it will be able to attack next turn. Other minions however would still stay Frozen on your next turn because of the summoning sickness.
Thank you for what you said about my class. I really like a lot of your Magician. Some of the stuff reminds me of my Time Traveler class (specifically Magic Trick: Disappear, Bribed Dealer, and Mad Shuffle), although there would need to be a lot of stuff to interact with the bottom of the deck if Script is going to work.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Click the image to go to my custom Time Traveler class.
Aye, the goal is definitely to include a lot of Script synergy in the sets that allow for it since the Basic set does not. An idea I have now apart from the fact that you can put cards at the bottom of your deck is perhaps a spell (1 or 2 Mana, depending on balance) that treats the next card you play that turn as if it was drawn from the bottom of the deck. This could also be implemented in a Legendaries spell or something.
As for your class and similarities. I was pretty much mi since CCC#3 so I haven’t really seen entries for CCC#4 but I just took a quick glance and the cards really are similar if not identical. I’ll avoid looking at your class any further so that if I ever think of any ideas they can be my own. Cause even if our classes are similar that would be no fun. (It’s scary how we got pretty much same ideas almost word for word though. x3)
Well, this competition couldn't have landed on a worse time. Phase I I'm going to be really busy with some lab assignments for uni, and phase II will be right in the middle of exams. This will be fun :)
Anyway, here's my class - The Psychonaut:
Masters of the mind, they use their psychic power in tandem with their acrobatics to bring down their foes. Basically a weird combination between priest and rogue.
Some cards:
Phychic Manipulator - A cheaper, but slower Faceless Manipulator. Initially I wanted it to be a straight-up 4 mana faceless, but I figured it's too strong.
Levitate - This basically works like stealth, except you don't take damage from AoEs either. The card can still be targeted by buff, transform and destroy effects however. Like with Stealth, if the minion has Taunt. it will be ignored.
Phychic save - The class has secrets, 0-mana ones at that. They're very weak, however, and will most of the time hurt your hero.
Countershock - The kind of stuff you can expect this class to do with attack: have it last during your opponent's turn, but not being able to attack.
Psychus Oblongatus - A behemoth of a minion that will use something else to remain alive before going down himself. Should've been a beast.
Well, this competition couldn't have landed on a worse time. Phase I I'm going to be really busy with some lab assignments for uni, and phase II will be right in the middle of exams. This will be fun :)
Anyway, here's my class - The Psychonaut:
Masters of the mind, they use their psychic power in tandem with their acrobatics to bring down their foes. Basically a weird combination between priest and rogue.
Some cards:
Phychic Manipulator - A cheaper, but slower Faceless Manipulator. Initially I wanted it to be a straight-up 4 mana faceless, but I figured it's too strong.
Levitate - This basically works like stealth, except you don't take damage from AoEs either. The card can still be targeted by buff, transform and destroy effects however. Like with Stealth, if the minion has Taunt. it will be ignored.
Phychic save - The class has secrets, 0-mana ones at that. They're very weak, however, and will most of the time hurt your hero.
Countershock - The kind of stuff you can expect this class to do with attack: have it last during your opponent's turn, but not being able to attack.
Psychus Oblongatus - A behemoth of a minion that will use something else to remain alive before going down himself. Should've been a beast.
Okay, so personally I'm on the fence with wether I like this class or not, so far I feel it lacks identity and uniqueness. Sure, it has alot of interactions with the start of your next turn, but I don't feel like you'll have enough of those across all expansions for that to be the only theme. I assume the hero power is a normal 0/2 with Taunt, so nothing special there, Shaman already has that since release so we can say it's decently balanced but doesn't have any flare or wow-factor.
As for the cards:
Psychic Manipulator - Before I go into balancing, just a personal preference for flavors sake is to change the name to "Faceless Something" Since the Faceless are a race and that's what the art depicts, though I get where you were going with the name. Just a pet peve. As for balance. I don't see anything wrong with it balance wise but I don't really like the card in itself. As you said it's a cheaper Faceless Manipulatorbut why would people pick this over Faceless? With a 3/2 statline it still dies to many AoEs commonly run in Standard Decks: Consecration, Blizzard, Holy Nova and even some strong minions that see play such as Primordial Drake. So chances are, unless it's the only minion on board and the minion you coppied isn't that strong, people will opt to clear it and you won't get the value for the effect. If you want to keep the concept of the deck I atleast suggest changing the statline to 2/3 instead of 3/2 so it survives most AoEs.
Levitate - I don't see much of a problem with the card itself, unsure of how the balance is so I'll leave it to others to judge the balance. What I don't like is the wording of the card. It's too clunky. Since you said the effect is basically stealth, why not make it something like: "Give a minion Stealth. It is Immune and can't attack until the start of your next turn." Unless you're against using the Stealth keyword completely.
Psychic Save - While the effect itself is fine, I don't know if I like the idea of 0-cost secrets. Essentially this is a Noble Sacrifice which costs Hero health while costing one less. Also since you can include many Secrets in a single deck, you have to think about their synergy with Gadgetzan Auctioneer and Secretkeeper. Personally I don't think 0-cost secrets will work.
Countershock - No real issues with this card. In essense it's just a worse Explosive Trap that the opponent doesn't even need to test for and doesn't prevent any damage against aggro. Sure it can discourage aggro from attacking but sometimes that's not enough since the damage still goes through.
Psychus Oblongatus - Essential has immune against damaging spells. I don't mind the idea but I feel like the opponent will just avoid this minion since from what you've shown so far this is not an aggro class so 7 Damage with 3 Health is probably not horribly scary and is very reliant on one of the sides having a high health minion. If you are playing against aggro this is most likely a dead card. (Could be imagining this one wrong but I think I'm right.)
Well, this competition couldn't have landed on a worse time. Phase I I'm going to be really busy with some lab assignments for uni, and phase II will be right in the middle of exams. This will be fun :)
Anyway, here's my class - The Psychonaut:
Masters of the mind, they use their psychic power in tandem with their acrobatics to bring down their foes. Basically a weird combination between priest and rogue.
Some cards:
Phychic Manipulator - A cheaper, but slower Faceless Manipulator. Initially I wanted it to be a straight-up 4 mana faceless, but I figured it's too strong.
Levitate - This basically works like stealth, except you don't take damage from AoEs either. The card can still be targeted by buff, transform and destroy effects however. Like with Stealth, if the minion has Taunt. it will be ignored.
Phychic save - The class has secrets, 0-mana ones at that. They're very weak, however, and will most of the time hurt your hero.
Countershock - The kind of stuff you can expect this class to do with attack: have it last during your opponent's turn, but not being able to attack.
Psychus Oblongatus - A behemoth of a minion that will use something else to remain alive before going down himself. Should've been a beast.
I'd reconsider making it a Psychonauts-themed class, as I feel you could easily run out of art to use in cards. You could probably get away with a Psychic class or something of the sorts. Not such a big deal, though, just something to keep in mind
You class doesn't really feel like it has an identity. I get the whole "protecting minions thing", but that in itself doesn't feel like something a Psychic-like class would do. That aside, you should specify the themes and mechanics of your class, and have a wider variety of effects that prove this.
Likewise, If your hero power does something, maybe you wanna show a card that interacts with it in some way. Also, do keep in mind that summoning a 0/2 with Taunt every turn can get annoying. The only reason Shaman could do it was randomly. Try to find a way around this.
The cards are alright but, like I said, they need a bit more diversity in effects and mechanics.
Well, back to a fire-themed class this season. I have a second class idea, though I want to see if this one pays off. I doubt it since the main mechanic is pretty unique to this class.
The Blacksmith
Blacksmiths are master craftsmen that use both their crafting skills and channelling of the element of fire to support their minions in battle.
This class fits a more supportive role, just like Priest does. To do this, it can grant its minions Armor. Just like on heroes, Armor is displayed over the minion's health and sucks up some of the damage the minion takes and breaks after that. Some minions can also take advantage of their armor and become more powerful through it.
Blacksmiths would look to take advantage of Armor to protect its minions to keep some board presence or to control the board through them.
Some of the mechanics I have planned for the class:
A more control-oriented playstile, with a hint of midrange (and possibly aggro).
Tanking and protecting minions.
Minion support through Armor.
Armor interaction.
Weapons.
Elementals.
Some example cards:
Thoughts? I'll be giving feedback out to whoever I can as soon as I can.
First of all, while I don't know how possible it is and how people will react to it, I love the idea of giving minions armor. I feel like the Hero Power is balanced when compared to the Priest one since you can't give yourself armor directly. No issues in that regard. As for the cards:
Blazing Hammer - Honestly, looking at it I'm not sure what the right way to balance it would be. It's probably fine as it is but I feel like as long as you have a minion it's a stronger Candleshot. Though the requirement of having a minion makes it balanced in my opinion.
Flaming Smash- Like the idea. Feel like it has good flavor provided it's a Basic card. In terms of balance I feel like this is well done as this is essential a two-in-one of Arcane Shot and Savagery but with the requirement of having a weapon for the Savagery part.
Last Resource - Would probably change the name to Last Resort but that's up to you. I like this card, I feel it's balanced and really feeds the theme of giving minions armor as it shows that there is flexibily with what you can do with that new mechanic.
Molten Armor - Alright card, fits the Basic set. It would probably be balanced even as a 2-Cost Spell. Just thinking of how it compares to cards like Mark of the Lotus and Power of the Wild which both give 2 stats to each minion.
Ironskin Guard - From the basic cards shown so far, I feel like this one is my favorite. Not really sure as to how it's doing on the balance front but I think it's fine. You took away 3 stats for the effects. Taunt is typically 1 mana and the effect looks fine at 2 mana. Really like the concept.
Overall, love the class idea and can't wait to see where this concept can go. Hopefully the response is positive and this is the idea you go through with. ^^
This is all first-draft brainstorming, but I was thinking of making a Lich/Necromancer class with Kel'Thuzad as my character. This requires a major suspension of disbelief, because one would assume Curse of Naxxramas would not exist in its current form; why would they include Kel'Thuzad in the vanilla game, then make the first Adventure about him? This is what I have so far:
Early card ideas:
Frost Orb is basically Icicle. It would make far more sense as a Lich card, and indirectly implies Team 5 would come up with another replacement for Ice Block. I assume that would be an agreeable outcome, hence my decision to "retroactively" steal it.
Main themes are Freeze, Deathrattles, "if it survives"/"if it dies", and re/summoning things that have died. I do not have a unique Keyword; Freeze is my Keyword of choice. Functionally a cross between the Mage, Warlock, and Priest. Much like how the Hunter Hero Power pushes the character in an Aggro direction, the Lich's Hero Power pushes him in a Control direction (which I am okay with). I would later introduce new ways to interact with the Freeze, including Freezing your own minions for benefits (like Cryostasis and Moorabi, but in a class that can actually use them).
I know a Lich class made it all the way to the finale of HearthPwn's first class comp, but my approach appears to be dramatically different. My two major concerns are 1. People taking issue with the Freeze Hero Power, and 2. My depression is peaking/my self-esteem is at a nadir at the moment. Not feeling very high on myself and my idea :/
This isn't really an issue, but why don't you go with a more blue-ish kind of border (e.g. Old DK or Witchdoctor). Fits better with the hero, hero-power, and ice-cards.
Here's an interesting idea, why don't you try making a card that deals damage and does something different depending on wether the minion survived or not. That way you can showcase two in one. Just throwing it out there.
I don't know how to feel about Ice Orb, it being basically Icicle. I'd avoid using that design and coming up with something else, but that's me.
AMr. Bigglesworth better be a legendary.
On the art side, they're all good, though I got some you might find useful at the least. You don't really have to change what you got, it's just to see if you find them useful.
Icicle Crasher - Here're more warcraft-y art pieces.
Icy touch - This ones are bit less gloomy.
I overall like it. What you've shown is simple enough to fit the first phase, so I'm eager to see what you come up with next.
This is the Discussion Topic. The Submission Topic is here.
(Please Read the Submission Topic first.)
Hey guys, this is your bog-standard Discussion Topic for our "Trials and Errors" Class Creation competition; the place to let your ideas run free. Share what's on your mind for your class and help each other to make the best cards you can, as is tradition!
To make sure that everything runs smoothly, we need to reserve the Submission Topic for submissions only. Everything else goes here. What is everything else, you might ask?
All of that said, please refrain from the following:
So, without further ado, have fun and get creating!
You can find me here! Good luck everyone!
No special rules this time?
In the submission thread, it states that challenges will only be used in Phase II and onwards. So that's neat :3.
Mods really making my night by releasing this.
Already had a Class Idea prior to the announcement so pretty happy no challenges up until Phase II (Even though I have Basic Set done so will most likely have to change some cards). Here's the idea so far:
The Magician
3 Variations of Hero Power Token:
Due to the 3rd variant being strictly stronger than the Warlock Hero Power, I made the other two variants. The first one is my favoured one but I wanted to hear some opinions on it.
The general idea of the class is that the Hero is a magician, though the whole flavor of the class is more so that of "Preformers". Be it acrobats, actors, clowns... anything goes really. Everyone loves impromptu shows but a practiced performance will more often than not come out much better than an improvised one. That is where the new keyword comes in: SCRIPT.
The main goal of this class thus far is deck manipulation with the main targetted archetypes being Control and Combo. A magician must always have control of the situation and be able to weave his tricks together for the performance to go smoothly! Right?
As I said I already have the Basic set that hasn't been affected by any Challenges so I'll post my 3 favorite cards out of them outside a spoiler and the rest in one.
I also have some Epic spells and two Legendaries made for the class. Most of them are planned for Classic (Apart from Hoodini) but you never know what the challenges will bring.
And a card that is just purely for the flavor but can also show the Script keyword abit:
I appreciate any feedback and will try respond to any people who post before I go to bed tonight!
Edit: Change Card sized abit.
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
As Cog said, Challenges (or I guess, thematically, Trials) will begin in Phase II. A specific complaint a few people raised about the last competition was one of the Phase I challenges which required you to have a unique keyword - this left some people stranded in later phases with a keyword that was either unexpectedly restrictive in its design space, or didn't work well with their overall vision for their class. I actually somewhat experienced this myself - my React keyword was a very last-minute addition to my class, and while it worked better for the class than I expected, it left it feeling cluttered and I didn't enjoy having to come up with new ways to use it for each expansion.
Obviously this could be solved by just not requiring a keyword as one of the Trials, but it got us thinking about the general philosophy behind the extra challenges, and we agreed that it's more fun to be allowed more freedom earlier on, when coming up with your class, and then to be challenged later on when you have your plans laid out.
Removing extra conditions from Phase I ensures that everybody goes in with a base design that they like, and then what happens from there is entirely on them. If their keyword doesn't pan out the way they want, that's their own fault now =P
You can find me here! Good luck everyone!
This is all first-draft brainstorming, but I was thinking of making a Lich/Necromancer class with Kel'Thuzad as my character. This requires a major suspension of disbelief, because one would assume Curse of Naxxramas would not exist in its current form; why would they include Kel'Thuzad in the vanilla game, then make the first Adventure about him? This is what I have so far:
Early card ideas:
Frost Orb is basically Icicle. It would make far more sense as a Lich card, and indirectly implies Team 5 would come up with another replacement for Ice Block. I assume that would be an agreeable outcome, hence my decision to "retroactively" steal it.
Main themes are Freeze, Deathrattles, "if it survives"/"if it dies", and re/summoning things that have died. I do not have a unique Keyword; Freeze is my Keyword of choice. Functionally a cross between the Mage, Warlock, and Priest. Much like how the Hunter Hero Power pushes the character in an Aggro direction, the Lich's Hero Power pushes him in a Control direction (which I am okay with). I would later introduce new ways to interact with the Freeze, including Freezing your own minions for benefits (like Cryostasis and Moorabi, but in a class that can actually use them).
I know a Lich class made it all the way to the finale of HearthPwn's first class comp, but my approach appears to be dramatically different. My two major concerns are 1. People taking issue with the Freeze Hero Power, and 2. My depression is peaking/my self-esteem is at a nadir at the moment. Not feeling very high on myself and my idea :/
Behold, foolish interlopers! I am commanding this mortal to spread the will of the Scourge throughout the interwebs, encouraging you to seek out me, Archlich Kel'Thuzad! Now coming to you as the tenth class of Hearthstone!
I am a finalist in this Class Creation Competition, so if you could give it a look I would be greatly appreciative <3
Presenting my first (and only, so I really hope this works)... Battlemage.
Don't know I'll keep Set Ablaze as the Hero Power, but I needed something. Basically, this class in a lot of ways is a combination of Mage and Warrior. Some classes play with spells, others with weapons. Battlemage plays with both. Armor synergy like Warrior is also planned, hence the Hero Power. I don't have that now, but here's what I do have:
Theme: Minion position matters.
I reckon I'm going to get a lot of questions about how Split the Ground works, but... worth it. I know how to answer them.
Also featuring:
I already know people will like this more than my Time Traveler Quest. Remember Unlock the Rift?
Also weapons:
Click the image to go to my custom Time Traveler class.
The AlchemistHere we have the Alchemist, a class that features the Transmute keyword, which lets you exchange cards you don't need for others that you might.
Ratsearcher is an example of how the keyword can target specific cards. I just realized it's busted with Prince Keleseth, so I'll probably change it to a 2/2/2 that fetches a 3-cost minion.
Appart from Transmute, the class will have other distinctive features, although I haven't thought of anyone yet :_D
Thoughts?
@linkblade91
Personally like the class idea! Im a sucker for Control oriented classes and may have some bias since i was really rooting for Freeze Shaman to succeed. On phone so got no idea how to quote and put it in spoiler and stuff so Ill give you a very bare bones version of my review on yourcards and stuff.
Firstly your Hero Power. I can see people thinking this is too strong and to some extent I agree. On average Hero Powers tend to give a 0-cost card worth of value (Compare Moonfire to Fireblast, Wisp to Silver Hand Recruit, etc.) and upgraded hero powers give 1-Mana worth of value. I’d say a freeze effect is worth around 0.5 Mana. By that logic it would be slightly on the stronger side. But if we look at Freezing Potion it’s a 0-Cost card. So while I think its slightly strong, I dont really have suggestions as to how to fix it as of yet.
Dark Resurgence - I like the flexibility of this card. It can be used as an Ancsestral Healing effect while also being used as a ping for 2 Damage. Think the Mana is alright as it is.
Rise Again - Another card I like because of how much more control it gives you than Ressurect. On that note I think it would be fine as a 2-cost spell since it still restricts you to when you can use it. Requiring you to have had a strong minion to have died the previous turn. You also can’t make whole archetypes with it like you could with Ressurect.
Onyxia - Can’t say this card has a “wow” factor for me. I dont really know what Dragons your class will have implemented into it but as of right now most strong Dragons are expensive so even if you wait a while to play this you’re likely getting around the same value as Classic Onyxia for 1 more mana and the cost of not being able it early in the game.
Icicle Crasher - Was initially confused by how this works. Since I think I got it now, my verdict is that its too strong. Due to how Freeze works, if you Attack with this minion then Freeze it, it will be Frozen for 2 turns. So for those 2 turns this minion will be ressumoned so to clear it it needs either a silence or for the opponent to go through 4/12 worth of stats before you get the chance to Freeze it again.
Phyllactery Keeper - I dont feel like this minion should have Taunt because to be able to use the Deathrattle, you would need it to survive till your own turn. If its a taunt, more likely than not on turn 7 the opponent will be able to deal witha 5/5 Taunt.
Sorry for any typos, on my phone~
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
Well given that my class is also a Deck Manipulation class I like the idea alot. The keyword makes you really think when making the deck taking into account what each Transmute can draw you and when you want to transmute. The Hero Power would help deal with a bad mulligan and seems pretty balanced if not slightly underpowered. Though don’t know how you’d make it stronger without making it OP. Maybe decrease cost of Transmuted card by 1? Just a thought.
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
Wow, thanks for the feedback/review :) I'll just speak on some of them:
Behold, foolish interlopers! I am commanding this mortal to spread the will of the Scourge throughout the interwebs, encouraging you to seek out me, Archlich Kel'Thuzad! Now coming to you as the tenth class of Hearthstone!
I am a finalist in this Class Creation Competition, so if you could give it a look I would be greatly appreciative <3
@Demonxz95
Dont have time for a full review but thought I’d make a start on the cards I have questions/Suggestions about.
Firstly, love the idea of the class itself. A caster who isnt afraid to smack things with his face... just mwah. And Im a sucker for Control so it looks promising already in that regard. Now onto some of the cards.
Don’t have any glaring issues with the common cards in the top row. They are exactly that, common. Though I love the Chess Boss-esque Battlecry of the Dragon. Might be abit strong for its cost.
Since you said you know how to answer questions on the splitting board mechanic, here’s your first one~ Is the board split into two equal sides resulting in only 6 minion slots or will it be a 3/4 split. At any rate always loved the idea of altering the board so excited to see where this goes, if anywhere.
Meteor Shower looks okay but I think Icewielder is OP. For one it has vanilla stats for a strong effect. Secondly and this is the part I have a question about. The minion is technically Frozen on their turn before attacking so how long would the Freeze effect last? From what I remember of the Freeze mechanic they will be Frozen the turn they are summoned, your turned and their next turn. which seems like a lot of time but could just be me.
Havent seen all the spells to judge Quest and the weapons seem fine, the fire one being both more interesting and stronger in my opinion.
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
Well, back to a fire-themed class this season. I have a second class idea, though I want to see if this one pays off. I doubt it since the main mechanic is pretty unique to this class.
The Blacksmith
Blacksmiths are master craftsmen that use both their crafting skills and channelling of the element of fire to support their minions in battle.
This class fits a more supportive role, just like Priest does. To do this, it can grant its minions Armor. Just like on heroes, Armor is displayed over the minion's health and sucks up some of the damage the minion takes and breaks after that. Some minions can also take advantage of their armor and become more powerful through it.
Blacksmiths would look to take advantage of Armor to protect its minions to keep some board presence or to control the board through them.
Some of the mechanics I have planned for the class:
Some example cards:
Thoughts? I'll be giving feedback out to whoever I can as soon as I can.
Regarding what you said about Split the Ground, it will split it into 3/3, meaning 6 total minions. You can play minions to any side at any time, provided it's not full already.
As for Icewielder, Frozen minions will miss their next attack regardless of when they're Frozen. If you were to play a minion with Charge or Rush, it would be unfrozen at the end of your turn and it will be able to attack next turn. Other minions however would still stay Frozen on your next turn because of the summoning sickness.
Thank you for what you said about my class. I really like a lot of your Magician. Some of the stuff reminds me of my Time Traveler class (specifically Magic Trick: Disappear, Bribed Dealer, and Mad Shuffle), although there would need to be a lot of stuff to interact with the bottom of the deck if Script is going to work.
Click the image to go to my custom Time Traveler class.
@Demonxz95
Aye, the goal is definitely to include a lot of Script synergy in the sets that allow for it since the Basic set does not. An idea I have now apart from the fact that you can put cards at the bottom of your deck is perhaps a spell (1 or 2 Mana, depending on balance) that treats the next card you play that turn as if it was drawn from the bottom of the deck. This could also be implemented in a Legendaries spell or something.
As for your class and similarities. I was pretty much mi since CCC#3 so I haven’t really seen entries for CCC#4 but I just took a quick glance and the cards really are similar if not identical. I’ll avoid looking at your class any further so that if I ever think of any ideas they can be my own. Cause even if our classes are similar that would be no fun. (It’s scary how we got pretty much same ideas almost word for word though. x3)
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
Well, this competition couldn't have landed on a worse time. Phase I I'm going to be really busy with some lab assignments for uni, and phase II will be right in the middle of exams. This will be fun :)
Anyway, here's my class - The Psychonaut:
Masters of the mind, they use their psychic power in tandem with their acrobatics to bring down their foes. Basically a weird combination between priest and rogue.
Some cards:
Phychic Manipulator - A cheaper, but slower Faceless Manipulator. Initially I wanted it to be a straight-up 4 mana faceless, but I figured it's too strong.
Levitate - This basically works like stealth, except you don't take damage from AoEs either. The card can still be targeted by buff, transform and destroy effects however. Like with Stealth, if the minion has Taunt. it will be ignored.
Phychic save - The class has secrets, 0-mana ones at that. They're very weak, however, and will most of the time hurt your hero.
Countershock - The kind of stuff you can expect this class to do with attack: have it last during your opponent's turn, but not being able to attack.
Psychus Oblongatus - A behemoth of a minion that will use something else to remain alive before going down himself. Should've been a beast.
Okay, so personally I'm on the fence with wether I like this class or not, so far I feel it lacks identity and uniqueness. Sure, it has alot of interactions with the start of your next turn, but I don't feel like you'll have enough of those across all expansions for that to be the only theme. I assume the hero power is a normal 0/2 with Taunt, so nothing special there, Shaman already has that since release so we can say it's decently balanced but doesn't have any flare or wow-factor.
As for the cards:
Psychic Manipulator - Before I go into balancing, just a personal preference for flavors sake is to change the name to "Faceless Something" Since the Faceless are a race and that's what the art depicts, though I get where you were going with the name. Just a pet peve. As for balance. I don't see anything wrong with it balance wise but I don't really like the card in itself. As you said it's a cheaper Faceless Manipulator but why would people pick this over Faceless? With a 3/2 statline it still dies to many AoEs commonly run in Standard Decks: Consecration, Blizzard, Holy Nova and even some strong minions that see play such as Primordial Drake. So chances are, unless it's the only minion on board and the minion you coppied isn't that strong, people will opt to clear it and you won't get the value for the effect. If you want to keep the concept of the deck I atleast suggest changing the statline to 2/3 instead of 3/2 so it survives most AoEs.
Levitate - I don't see much of a problem with the card itself, unsure of how the balance is so I'll leave it to others to judge the balance. What I don't like is the wording of the card. It's too clunky. Since you said the effect is basically stealth, why not make it something like: "Give a minion Stealth. It is Immune and can't attack until the start of your next turn." Unless you're against using the Stealth keyword completely.
Psychic Save - While the effect itself is fine, I don't know if I like the idea of 0-cost secrets. Essentially this is a Noble Sacrifice which costs Hero health while costing one less. Also since you can include many Secrets in a single deck, you have to think about their synergy with Gadgetzan Auctioneer and Secretkeeper. Personally I don't think 0-cost secrets will work.
Countershock - No real issues with this card. In essense it's just a worse Explosive Trap that the opponent doesn't even need to test for and doesn't prevent any damage against aggro. Sure it can discourage aggro from attacking but sometimes that's not enough since the damage still goes through.
Psychus Oblongatus - Essential has immune against damaging spells. I don't mind the idea but I feel like the opponent will just avoid this minion since from what you've shown so far this is not an aggro class so 7 Damage with 3 Health is probably not horribly scary and is very reliant on one of the sides having a high health minion. If you are playing against aggro this is most likely a dead card. (Could be imagining this one wrong but I think I'm right.)
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
First of all, while I don't know how possible it is and how people will react to it, I love the idea of giving minions armor. I feel like the Hero Power is balanced when compared to the Priest one since you can't give yourself armor directly. No issues in that regard. As for the cards:
Blazing Hammer - Honestly, looking at it I'm not sure what the right way to balance it would be. It's probably fine as it is but I feel like as long as you have a minion it's a stronger Candleshot. Though the requirement of having a minion makes it balanced in my opinion.
Flaming Smash - Like the idea. Feel like it has good flavor provided it's a Basic card. In terms of balance I feel like this is well done as this is essential a two-in-one of Arcane Shot and Savagery but with the requirement of having a weapon for the Savagery part.
Last Resource - Would probably change the name to Last Resort but that's up to you. I like this card, I feel it's balanced and really feeds the theme of giving minions armor as it shows that there is flexibily with what you can do with that new mechanic.
Molten Armor - Alright card, fits the Basic set. It would probably be balanced even as a 2-Cost Spell. Just thinking of how it compares to cards like Mark of the Lotus and Power of the Wild which both give 2 stats to each minion.
Ironskin Guard - From the basic cards shown so far, I feel like this one is my favorite. Not really sure as to how it's doing on the balance front but I think it's fine. You took away 3 stats for the effects. Taunt is typically 1 mana and the effect looks fine at 2 mana. Really like the concept.
Overall, love the class idea and can't wait to see where this concept can go. Hopefully the response is positive and this is the idea you go through with. ^^
Thank you Kanye,
Very Cool.
On the art side, they're all good, though I got some you might find useful at the least. You don't really have to change what you got, it's just to see if you find them useful.
Icicle Crasher - Here're more warcraft-y art pieces.
Icy touch - This ones are bit less gloomy.
I overall like it. What you've shown is simple enough to fit the first phase, so I'm eager to see what you come up with next.