Weekly Card Design Competition 6.04 - Discussion Topic - Fan Creations - Hearthstone General - HearthPwn Forums

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Weekly Card Design Competition 6.04 - Discussion Topic

#275 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
Cogito_Ergo_Sum
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Quote from Teknician >>

Which should I submit?

Lady Deathwhisper is meant to mirror Kel'Thuzad as a lower cost lower stat minion that kind of poses more of an immediate threat than he does (minions potentially attacking twice in a turn).

Blood Shield : What gains Lifesteal?
Amani Bowman: Eh, it's okay I guess. The Lifesteal seems tacked on though.
Crystalsong Communer: WOW! You should definitely submit this card. It's extremely innovative, befitting of Druid's Attack theme, and just an all-around good card. It should be a 5/6 though so that it lasts longer (or maybe a 4/7. Up to you really).
Crystalsong Dryad: I think this can get out of hand too quickly. It's a fine idea, but it's not as good as the other Druid card.
Lady Deathwhisper: Too situational for a questionable effect.

Last edited by Cogito_Ergo_Sum on Jul 16, 2017

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#276 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)

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Quote from HenryXLII >>

Quote from LittleOgreHearthstone >>

Quote from LittleOgreHearthstone >>

I'm always having trouble with the stats and cost. Does this seem right? (I do not want it cost lower than 5 as there are already so many low cost minions for rogue).

Boopity bump .... need help with the cost and stats .......

I think it's stats are without a doubt on the weaker side. But it's kinda hard to say because we don't know how much life steal is worth yet. I would bump it's hp up by one, simply because the add a random pirate effect is not a very powerful effect.

Ok a 5/4 for 5 mana might be better. How about: Deathrattle: Summon a random Pirate. (similar wording from Piloted Shredder)

Maybe something like this ? (Now I think haveing 4 health is too much right?)

Last edited by LittleOgre on Jul 16, 2017

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#277 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from Teknician >>

Which should I submit?

If i'm completely honest, i'd say none of these (yet), but let's go step by step here:

Blood Shield: This does pretty much nothing for you except drawing a card. The way it's worded now it would likely give your hero Lifesteal during your opponents turn and there is almost no way for your hero to deal any damage when it's not your turn. I could imagine that you intended for it to give all your things - including minions - Lifesteal but as the secret triggers your opponent is already ignoring your board so why should he start trading and giving you heals after this has triggered?

Amani Bowman: A little contrary to Cogito, i actually think this is your most solid design out of the five. As the main big thing of Icecrown will likely be deathrattle instead of Lifesteal anyways, the Lifesteal feels less tacked on to me and more like a neat bonus creating a useful card that might work reasonably well with the theme of the upcoming expansion and the card pool of the Hunter class in general.
I'd say it needs just a little more polishing though: I believe it's a little understatted for its quite conditional effect - at least a 3/4 statline feels more adequate to me; The name could also be improved in my opinion as it neither really supports what the card does nor does it advertise any possible flavor - "Soulcharged Sniper" for example sounds more fancy and leaves more room for flavor-interpretation; Finally i think that the Lifesteal keyword should come first in the card text.

Crystalsong Communer: This is really too conditional as it's relying on a keyword that won't likely be a big thing anyway while also not even having that keyword itself. I guess outside of those facts it could maybe somehow work reasonably okay-ish but i definately don't get that WOW-feeling like Cogito and innovation is nice but not a real quality feature by itself.

Crystalsong Dryad: This suffers from the same issue as the Communer which is relying on a probably poorly represented keyword - but just if Lifesteal was a big thing at some point in the future, this type of effect would be grossly overpowered in my opinion. With the way you balanced this card it would probably still be fine balance-wise as it is highly expensive and offers only a frail body to sustain its aura effect (wich is actually quite weak) but in a theoretical world where Lifesteal is actually a thing this effect in general would offer a way to excessively gain mana and create obnoxiously huge tempo swings. I don't think we should aim for something like that.

Lady Deathwhisper: This again shares the same problem with the two Crystalsong minions and i believe this one is the weakest effect of the bunch as it also is highly conditional while offering no additional value (unlike KT) and 'only' providing the possibility to gain random additional trade value or damage bursts.

So Tl;dr: I think after some changes (including the name :D) the Bowman is the best of the bunch. However i believe that in this group of five he has quite poor competition so i'd probably think of at least 1-2 new cards to once more compare him to - but that is of course entirely up to you :)

Quote from LittleOgreHearthstone >>

Ok a 5/4 for 5 mana might be better. How about: Deathrattle: Summon a random Pirate. (similar wording from Piloted Shredder)

Maybe something like this ? (Now I think haveing 4 health is too much right?)

Remove the Stealth and give it 4 Health. That way it actually has some legitimate flavor - The walking corpse of a long deceased Pirate that sucks the life out of its enemies, trying to gather enough energy so it can one day finally be alive again.

I have to say though that i'm not a big fan of giving rogue an 'in-class' way of healing. It is sort of Rogue's identity to struggle quite a bit with restoring health while being much stronger on other fronts like comboing and bursting down the opponent (who would've guessed in a classic DD class?). And that also heavily shapes the way your matchups play out - when facing Rogue as well as playing it yourself.

So yeah - not really fond of this as a rogue card but the concept itself has its appeal.

Last edited by MrUncreative on Jul 16, 2017

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#278 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from Cogito_Ergo_Sum >>

Amani Bowman: Eh, it's okay I guess. The Lifesteal seems tacked on though.
Crystalsong Communer: WOW! You should definitely submit this card. It's extremely innovative, befitting of Druid's Attack theme, and just an all-around good card. It should be a 5/6 though so that it lasts longer (or maybe a 4/7. Up to you really).

Quote from MrUncreative >>

Quote from Teknician >>

Which should I submit?

Amani Bowman: A little contrary to Cogito, i actually think this is your most solid design out of the five. As the main big thing of Icecrown will likely be deathrattle instead of Lifesteal anyways, the Lifesteal feels less tacked on to me an more like a neat bonus creating a useful card that might work reasonably well with the theme of the upcoming expansion and the card pool of the Hunter class in general.
I'd say it needs just a little more polishing though: I believe it's a little understatted for its quite conditional effect - at least a 3/4 statline feels more adequate to me; The name could also be improved in my opinion as it neither really supports what the card does nor does it advertise and possible flavor - "Soulcharged Sniper" for example sounds more fancy and leaves more room for flavor-interpretation; Finally i think that the Lifesteal keayword should come first in the card text.

Crystalsong Communer: This is really too conditional as it's relying on a keyword that won't likely be a big thing anyway while also not even having that keyword itself. I guess outside of those facts it could maybe somehow work reasonably okay-ish but i definately don't get that WOW-feeling like Cogito and innovation is nice but not a real quality feature by itself.

So Tl;dr: I think after some changes (including the name :D) the Bowman is the best of the bunch. However i believe that in this group of five he has quite poor competition so i'd probably think of at least 1-2 new cards to once more compare him to - but that is of cours entirely up to you :)

Well, well, well. These are two very differing opinions. Here's what I'll say:

• Amani Bowman involved quite a bit less imagination to make then other cards (I just realized Blood Shield is useless), and was made in some ways as a filler card. Obviously the thematics and keyword placement could be changed, but it's a pseudo Knife Juggler with an extra effect. So when you think of it like that, it seems less impressive as a card... but do people even care if it's an effect that's been stolen from another card?

• Crystalsong Communer has more space in my heart because the effect really helps with Druid's theme of 'attack on one turn only'— the usual max is like 4 Attack in a turn, so this allows some crazy combos with Lifesteal minions. I know that there might no be that many Lifesteal minions, but I think the renewed prevalence of it in WotOG and its existence in GvG before that makes it likely that all classes will get at least one Lifesteal card, and there will be like 6 Lifesteal neutrals imo. Perhaps I'm wrong, but it's hard to say whether the effect is too conditional even when we don't have anything to compare it to.

With cards changed, here's what I have:

Not sure about other cards... Only things I can think of would be even more derivative effects... Still leaning towards Crystalsong though.

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#279 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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As we're almost at the eleventh hour again and i've still not come up with a satisfactory submission yet - let's try this once more.

Updated old ideas:

Some new ones:

I know i know, those whole three keywords on that mere 2 mana 1/1 Ghoul might look wildly out of place but let me give a quick explanation on why i think this is okay:

Think of Stonetusk Boar and Young Dragonhawk - those cards are allowed to have the charge/ windfury keyword without an increased cost because the value of those keywords decreases immensely as the minions have only frail 1/1 bodies. Especially windfury is affected by this as the first attack mostly has to target the face for the minion to even be able to attack again. And as Lifesteal also is not that powerful of a keyword in general, i believe the combination of those three is justifyable with only a cost increase of 1.
You could also think of this as a 2 mana minion that deals 1-2 damage by attacking and also heals your hero for 1-2.

I know however that it might be too easy to combo this at 2 mana. Those combos are usually accounted for by the inconsistency they often come with but maybe this case needs some special attention. Then there would also be the option to make it a 3 mana 1/2. Either way i'd love to hear some opinions on this. :)

Last edited by MrUncreative on Jul 16, 2017

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#280 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Overflowing Light seems a bit conditional and weird, given that you really only want to use it on enemy minions if you're in a pinch, and your own minions when you're behind on the board. It's bad because it offers nothing but Health which can easily be broken through by your opponent if it doesn't have attack. Something more similar to Velen's Chosen would be better, but it's still confusing as to when those minions gain Lifesteal—halfway through the attack animation? Tenris Murkblood is I think the best out of this set, as it is a very sticky card against 1 and 2 drops (repels anything below 3 damage). Bloodcrazed Ghoul is a bit gimmicky and vanilla— it's a really budget Al'Akir that, as you say, has too much combo potential. Val'kyr Shadowguard: Compare Questing Adventurer, and this seems a bit mundane. That card can gain stats much more quickly than this and the Lifesteal effect is only relevant if it can stay on the board, which it can't for this mana cost. Wouldn't see play I think.

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#281 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from Teknician >>

I've said "YOLO" and submitted this card. I could've done the other one but I figure cards with just the Lifesteal keyword on them are going to be pretty much the standard in the upcoming expansion, and coming up with interaction cards for them is more interesting, especially to make Druid able to use its minions to facilitate the hero itself to do single-target removal.

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#282 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)

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@MrUncreative. Thanks for your feedback. I could make it a neutral legendary of course to support Pirate in general. I will go for the 5/4 5 mana cost then.

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#284 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from MrUncreative >>

Updated old ideas:

Some new ones:

Overflowing Light: I don't think this is a good one, you want to put it on enemy minion with low attack to gain lifesteal? i think Flash Heal or Binding Heal is better. Maybe it'll be good give to your minion for OTK combo with Divine Spirit Inner Fire or put it on your taunt minion with Auchenai Soulpriest combo. but it's too conditional and it seems not fits with KotFT theme, i think this expansion will show more darkside card. How about some blood theme?

"Always remember that power is a double-edged blade. One side light, the other dark" it's time for darkside

Tenris Mirkblood : This is the best one i think, it'll be always in lifesteal deck like N'Zoth, the Corruptor on deathrattle deck

Blood Crazed Ghoul is a good card. I've think the similiar idea before. Naturally when we play lifesteal (even in RPG or MOBA), attack speed is the best combo with lifesteal, in hearthstone i think windfury is counted as attack speed. I like to share my idea before, the first one is to put Mega-Windfury with lifesteal and use v-07-tr-on as stats reference, but it's seems hard to balancing it because v-07-tr-on is a token and to summon it Mimiron's Head require another minion to transform into v-07-tr-on. (and i'm afraid people will bored with only keyword+keyword minion). The second idea is to make Fool's Bane as a minion, lifesteal minion with high health that can't attack hero but have unlimited attack as long there's an enemy minion on board.

Val'kyr Shadowguard also good i think. If this minion attacked/attacks a non-divine shield minion with 3-Attack, will it survive and become 3/1 or take fatal damage?

good card is not enough.. i'll go with the best one Tenris Mirkblood

Last edited by draquaza1470 on Jul 16, 2017

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Hi there..
#285 Jul 16, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Hello everybody.My english is not very good,would you tell me which description is more accurate,please? Thank you very much~!

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#286 Jul 17, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from ffinderous >>

Hello everybody.My english is not very good,would you tell me which description is more accurate,please? Thank you very much~!

so you want Holy Light count as lifesteal and heals you for 12 Health?

or healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal?

i think it'll be "card that restore health also trigger Lifesteal this turn only" because there's no healed word in hearthstone (cmiiw)

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Hi there..
#287 Jul 17, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Emm,I guess I want the second effect，healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal,how i should write the description?Thank you~

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#288 Jul 17, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from draquaza1470 >>

Quote from ffinderous >>

Hello everybody.My english is not very good,would you tell me which description is more accurate,please? Thank you very much~!

so you want Holy Light count as lifesteal and heals you for 12 Health?

or healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal?

i think it'll be "card that restore health also trigger Lifesteal this turn only" because there's no healed word in hearthstone (cmiiw)

Emm,I guess I want the second effect，healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal,how i should write the description?Thank you~

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#289 Jul 17, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Quote from ffinderous >>

Quote from draquaza1470 >>

Quote from ffinderous >>

Hello everybody.My english is not very good,would you tell me which description is more accurate,please? Thank you very much~!

so you want Holy Light count as lifesteal and heals you for 12 Health?

or healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal?

i think it'll be "card that restore health also trigger Lifesteal this turn only" because there's no healed word in hearthstone (cmiiw)

Emm,I guess I want the second effect，healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal, how i should write the description?Thank you~

so if you restore health on damaged lifesteal character, your hero restore the same amount, right?

perhaps it'll be "Restore health on Lifesteal minion will trigger Lifesteal this turn" or "card that restore health also trigger Lifesteal this turn" (english is not my native language too)

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Hi there..
#290 Jul 17, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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TFW you check your card's progression and it lost votes instead.

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#291 Jul 17, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
ffinderous
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Quote from draquaza1470 >>

Quote from ffinderous >>

Quote from draquaza1470 >>

Quote from ffinderous >>

Hello everybody.My english is not very good,would you tell me which description is more accurate,please? Thank you very much~!

so you want Holy Light count as lifesteal and heals you for 12 Health?

or healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal?

i think it'll be "card that restore health also trigger Lifesteal this turn only" because there's no healed word in hearthstone (cmiiw)

Emm,I guess I want the second effect，healing damaged lifesteal minion will trigger it's lifesteal, how i should write the description?Thank you~

so if you restore health on damaged lifesteal character, your hero restore the same amount, right?

perhaps it'll be "Restore health on Lifesteal minion will trigger Lifesteal this turn" or "card that restore health also trigger Lifesteal this turn" (english is not my native language too)

Oh...It seems my card in the submission post is lost and I can't edit it as well.Thank you all the same!

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#292 Jul 18, 2017 (Quest Rogue Nerf)
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Final Poll is now up!

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