I was in a thread earlier, concerning balancing cards, and the Warsong edit that OP made was basically the same thing. Gave it some thought and put together my own version.
It costs a little more, but makes a little more sense, and helps push for a different style of Warsong, one that I feel is somewhat better than the version we had when Grim Patron was crazy.
EDIT: To make further sense of the ability I've written for this card, it was thought that "Whenever a friendly character attacks an enemy minion, that friendly character gets +2 Attack this turn" would sound better. This is basically what the card would do. The attack buff would come as damage dealt after dealing damage to an enemy minion, but only during your turn, of course.
SECOND EDIT: I uploaded an edit that is actually a bit better (balanced), and "much easier to understand".
I think it's a good idea, but also too confusing for hearthstone standards. A simpler version that gives all your minions a "poison" effect would be easier for players to use. To clarify, the "poison" keyword would replace the current text of "Destroy any minion damaged by this minion" on minions like Maexxna, emperor cobra, and patient assassin. It would be similar to acidmaw, but not a symmetrical overcosted POS like acid maw.
Does that only include Hero attacks? Or also minions controlled by that Hero?
It's a unique mechanic, not totally outside the realm of possibilities, but not sure if I would like this in the game or not. At least it doesn't trigger from their spells, or Whirlwind would be madness.
I think maybe a better wording could possibly be: "Whenever a friendly character attacks an enemy minion, that friendly character gets +2 Attack this turn." That's effectively the same thing, yes? It technically could enable other things that might look at attack power (BGH as a bad example since you obv wouldn't target your own minion), but to me it makes more sense to word it that way.
Btw, I saw that other thread, and I agree that the OP of that thread basically made it close to the same as pre-nerf (I realize summoning is not the same as playing so it wouldn't trigger Patrons like before, but still).
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Is there some case where "your minions get +2 attack" would end up with a different result? There might be one, I just can't think of it.
Considering raid leader is a neutral minion for 3 mana 2/2 that gives +1 attack... maybe this isn't too far off in terms of balance. Maybe.
Edit:
Oh, enemy minions, ok, nvm. Yeah, sure, this seems fairly fair. Maybe juuust a tiny bit too strong.
Edit 2:
Wow, now that I think of it a bit more, this is actually beautiful. The buff wouldn't affect trades your opponent does on his turn... This is a really interesting concept. Did you think of it as in working for your hero weapon attacks also benefit from it?
Now it sounds a bit complex for a basic card hahaha. But very nice.
I think it's a good idea, but also too confusing for hearthstone standards. A simpler version that gives all your minions a "poison" effect would be easier for players to use. To clarify, the "poison" keyword would replace the current text of "Destroy any minion damaged by this minion" on minions like Maexxna, emperor cobra, and patient assassin. It would be similar to acidmaw, but not a symmetrical overcosted POS like acid maw.
To say it's too confusing is the same, to me, as saying the cleave mechanic is too confusing. I mention the cleave mechanic because you can attack an Imp Gang Boss with a card that has this mechanic, and the imp that spawns dies as well. The reason is because it's a delay that's triggered when meeting certain conditions. The same thing happens when you play Blizzard, except the Blizzard doesn't kill the imp. The freeze comes secondarily, not first.
Does that only include Hero attacks? Or also minions controlled by that Hero?
It's a unique mechanic, not totally outside the realm of possibilities, but not sure if I would like this in the game or not. At least it doesn't trigger from their spells, or Whirlwind would be madness.
I think maybe a better wording could possibly be: "Whenever a friendly character attacks an enemy minion, that friendly character gets +2 Attack this turn." That's effectively the same thing, yes? It technically could enable other things that might look at attack power (BGH as a bad example since you obv wouldn't target your own minion), but to me it makes more sense to word it that way.
Btw, I saw that other thread, and I agree that the OP of that thread basically made it close to the same as pre-nerf (I realize summoning is not the same as playing so it wouldn't trigger Patrons like before, but still).
I was thinking on a variety of ways to convey exactly what I was attempting, while not getting it wrong. I ALMOST fucked it up by making Whirlwind crazy, in the same way you mentioned here.
Essentially, it would include attacks with your own hero as well. The reason for this is to reward players for taking the risk of taking more damage, while giving an indirect buff to cards like Mortal Strike. Your wording is definitely much better though, I feel.
Is there some case where "your minions get +2 attack" would end up with a different result? There might be one, I just can't think of it.
Considering raid leader is a neutral minion for 3 mana 2/2 that gives +1 attack... maybe this isn't too far off in terms of balance. Maybe.
Edit:
Oh, enemy minions, ok, nvm. Yeah, sure, this seems fairly fair. Maybe juuust a tiny bit too strong.
Edit 2:
Wow, now that I think of it a bit more, this is actually beautiful. The buff wouldn't affect trades your opponent does on his turn... This is a really interesting concept. Did you think of it as in working for your hero weapon attacks also benefit from it?
Now it sounds a bit complex for a basic card hahaha. But very nice.
It's meant to reward players for not going full aggro. I tried to keep from making it too complex in its' ability, the way it reads off, I wanted to make sure the idea was conveyed clearly to players. I am, however, going to be making an edit to the opening post, so that people know what's up in advance and don't find themselves confused by what I'm attempting to have people understand. You guys have been really helpful.
Also, I wanted to make sure the statline works with the mana cost. It's not meant to be crazy, and it's not meant to survive as easily against your opponent. The idea of Charge is completely squandered on this card, and Brodicus is kidding himself when telling people that we don't understand how good this is. What a joke.
re word to be: your minions get +2 attack when there attacking minions, this would make much more sense and prevent some buggy interactions.
Except I'm looking to have attacking with a weapon benefit from this as well, to fit with the theme of a morale boost on the battlefield from a high ranking officer in your army.
you could just have it target friendly characters, i'm starting to like the idea tho I feel this would make control a tier 2 or better deck.
Nah, I'm not sure control warrior would benefit too much from this. It runs 3 weapons and not that many minions, you don't usually have a big board playing that deck.
I'm note sure there is a deck out there that would straight out use this atm. Maybe dragon warrior. I guess a tempo based deck would be the perfect candidate.
i mean aggro decks having some sort of removal is not bad, that's how aggro decks work in most games, remove the cheap opponent creatures to protect your weenies and get more damage in, but Rusty Hook with this warsong may be way too much free removal
Here's how I would remake the card. Its basically the same thing as the pre-nerf version but is on "played" cards rather than summoned, stopping the grim patron combo after the first guy and on any other summoned tokens which were the real problems, but still preserving the spirit of the card.
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i mean aggro decks having some sort of removal is not bad, that's how aggro decks work in most games, remove the cheap opponent creatures to protect your weenies and get more damage in, but Rusty Hook with this warsong may be way too much free removal
That's a rather good point. I was wondering if it'd be too controversial of a card for decks if attacking with a hero attack buff or your weapon gives you a boost as well. So really that's much better. Do you think the card is appropriately stated and costed then if you're only getting the buff for your minions?
Here's how I would remake the card. Its basically the same thing as the pre-nerf version but is on "played" cards rather than summoned, stopping the grim patron combo after the first guy and on any other summoned tokens which were the real problems, but still preserving the spirit of the card.
Here's the problem with this edit: It doesn't negate the charge if their attack goes higher. The problem with patron wasn't the Patron alone, but rather the combo of Patron with Frothing Berserker. A 16+ attack frothing on turn 8 or 9 plus a slurry of 3 attack minions to clear any taunt in the way? And it was the same thing with Worgen OTKs. Two 8 attack wind fury minions or one 11-14 attack windfury minion are problems. It's not the playing alone but the burst of damage from increase.
Here's how I would remake the card. Its basically the same thing as the pre-nerf version but is on "played" cards rather than summoned, stopping the grim patron combo after the first guy and on any other summoned tokens which were the real problems, but still preserving the spirit of the card.
Here's the problem with this edit: It doesn't negate the charge if their attack goes higher. The problem with patron wasn't the Patron alone, but rather the combo of Patron with Frothing Berserker. A 16+ attack frothing on turn 8 or 9 plus a slurry of 3 attack minions to clear any taunt in the way? And it was the same thing with Worgen OTKs. Two 8 attack wind fury minions or one 11-14 attack windfury minion are problems. It's not the playing alone but the burst of damage from increase.
Yeah dude the Patrons were just an activator, it doesn't matter if they can charge. Warsong was broken as hell because of Frothing Berserker, and this edit wouldn't help that. OP's would. With a little rewording, the OP's buff would be great and not easily abusable
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I was in a thread earlier, concerning balancing cards, and the Warsong edit that OP made was basically the same thing. Gave it some thought and put together my own version.
It costs a little more, but makes a little more sense, and helps push for a different style of Warsong, one that I feel is somewhat better than the version we had when Grim Patron was crazy.
EDIT: To make further sense of the ability I've written for this card, it was thought that "Whenever a friendly character attacks an enemy minion, that friendly character gets +2 Attack this turn" would sound better. This is basically what the card would do. The attack buff would come as damage dealt after dealing damage to an enemy minion, but only during your turn, of course.
SECOND EDIT: I uploaded an edit that is actually a bit better (balanced), and "much easier to understand".
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To clarify, the version OP made was basically the same as the WC we had before the latest nerf of the card.
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So, something like, "Battlecry: You cannot attack the enemy Hero this turn. Give friendly characters +2/+0 until end of turn"
...or is that more wordy?
EDIT: Basically, it's a Savage Roar that can't attack heroes.
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I think it's a good idea, but also too confusing for hearthstone standards. A simpler version that gives all your minions a "poison" effect would be easier for players to use. To clarify, the "poison" keyword would replace the current text of "Destroy any minion damaged by this minion" on minions like Maexxna, emperor cobra, and patient assassin. It would be similar to acidmaw, but not a symmetrical overcosted POS like acid maw.
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Ah, it's a triggered effect. Did not realize that til now. Then, I would say it is fine where it is.
Howdy! [cardimg=gold ]Card Name[ /cardimg] (no space)
Hey, how's it going?
What's poppin,' player?
Does that only include Hero attacks? Or also minions controlled by that Hero?
It's a unique mechanic, not totally outside the realm of possibilities, but not sure if I would like this in the game or not. At least it doesn't trigger from their spells, or Whirlwind would be madness.
I think maybe a better wording could possibly be: "Whenever a friendly character attacks an enemy minion, that friendly character gets +2 Attack this turn." That's effectively the same thing, yes? It technically could enable other things that might look at attack power (BGH as a bad example since you obv wouldn't target your own minion), but to me it makes more sense to word it that way.
Btw, I saw that other thread, and I agree that the OP of that thread basically made it close to the same as pre-nerf (I realize summoning is not the same as playing so it wouldn't trigger Patrons like before, but still).
Nature is the Day.
Man is the Sun.
Woman is the Moon.
The Stone is the Sky.
The Art is the Way.
Is there some case where "your minions get +2 attack" would end up with a different result? There might be one, I just can't think of it.
Considering raid leader is a neutral minion for 3 mana 2/2 that gives +1 attack... maybe this isn't too far off in terms of balance. Maybe.
Edit:
Oh, enemy minions, ok, nvm. Yeah, sure, this seems fairly fair. Maybe juuust a tiny bit too strong.
Edit 2:
Wow, now that I think of it a bit more, this is actually beautiful. The buff wouldn't affect trades your opponent does on his turn... This is a really interesting concept. Did you think of it as in working for your hero weapon attacks also benefit from it?
Now it sounds a bit complex for a basic card hahaha. But very nice.
Come visit my Card Emporium. Strange things, you will find inside...
Come take the test, if you're daring. Feel free to show me your results in a message.
Come visit my Card Emporium. Strange things, you will find inside...
Come take the test, if you're daring. Feel free to show me your results in a message.
re word to be: your minions get +2 attack when there attacking minions, this would make much more sense and prevent some buggy interactions.
playing wild
~nomad
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you could just have it target friendly characters, i'm starting to like the idea tho I feel this would make control a tier 2 or better deck.
playing wild
~nomad
I'm note sure there is a deck out there that would straight out use this atm. Maybe dragon warrior. I guess a tempo based deck would be the perfect candidate.
why not "friendly characters get+2 attack until the end of this turn when they attack enemy minions"??
edit: it's probably too strong, aggro warrrior's N'Zoth's First Mate weapon suddenly becoming a free Fiery War Axe because Yolo without the help of Upgrade! or Bloodsail Cultist is probably even more broken than Spirit Claws.
i mean aggro decks having some sort of removal is not bad, that's how aggro decks work in most games, remove the cheap opponent creatures to protect your weenies and get more damage in, but Rusty Hook with this warsong may be way too much free removal
Here's how I would remake the card. Its basically the same thing as the pre-nerf version but is on "played" cards rather than summoned, stopping the grim patron combo after the first guy and on any other summoned tokens which were the real problems, but still preserving the spirit of the card.
JMAP94. The best way to love the artist is to love the art.
Come visit my Card Emporium. Strange things, you will find inside...
Come take the test, if you're daring. Feel free to show me your results in a message.
Well you can alleviate some of that with a "can't attack heroes this turn, similar to the spell "charge"
JMAP94. The best way to love the artist is to love the art.