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I have been using Rend and have found him very useful so far. Yes I can't always use him because of conditions but also there was the times I have amanged to kill legendaries and win a game where BGH would not have worked.
A lot depends on how you play, how you want to play and what you enjoy. I love the long game and he becomes useful the longer the game goes on.
Gups
I hate facehuntards #nuff said
...The problem is not the problem, the problem is your attitude to the problem.
Can anyone confirm this? I will run if he gets rid of Sylvanas without being stolen, because I see that bitch all the time and she ruins my day. (I play a druid) I would have to start running dragon cards tho... :(
This is incorrect, at his worst TBK is a 4/5 for 6 mana. Good point though bringing up this card, as I think RB and TBK are quite similar, you include them if you think you need them.
What generally annoys me in this thread is that people like Grumhul and Marthian downright the card on a sheer observatory basis not even giving it a try. It's a card that warrants creative deckbuilding and that's what's great about it.
Complete Horse-Hockey
Have you played dragon paladin? If you have, you will find it's hard to kill Emperor with dragon paladin. The only way to kill him is use equality + consecration combo. But it will backfire you since you always have a big minion. Well, you can use owl to shut him but that 5/5 body is troublesome.
Just notice, if you have legendary on board rend can destroy it
( like BGH that must destroy 7-attack minion if there is, no mattter frendly or no )
I've found Rend to be a very decent card if used in the right type of deck. Here's the one I hit legend with this season which uses Rend Blackhand: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/237123-legend-dragon-chapter-deck-guide
So it does have a condition, you have to not mind giving your opponent 2 cards. If I had some decent dragons, I'd definitely prefer Rend to Naturalize, as naturalize only works in mill, and I don't play that.
I do agree that we massively underrated this card.
-In Dragon decks, filling Rend's "If you're holding a Dragon" condition is a lot easier accomplished than we gave credit for. Players can usually pull this guy off on turn 8 easier than we thought without having to run too many big dragons.
"But your opponent can just kill it off with a PIloted Shredder!" first off, your opponent will rarely have a Shredder on the board when ending Turn 7. And while the four health does suck, you do get to decide when to put it on the board. If my opponent has Emperor T. and Loatheb on the board, for example, and this guy clears Emp and trades with Loatheb, that's great!!! And if you can play this and clear the rest of the board, 8 attack is still a WHOLE lot if your opponent doesn't have an answer, plus it could just get that BGH out of the way for your turn 9 Onyxia you're wanting to surprise your opponent with.
My biggest issue with it was "it's 8 mana and basically does what BGH does..." but there's a whole bunch of more targets than I anticipated. It's a key card in a mirror match because wrecking Ysera and Chromaggus so easily is awesome. It kills off Kel'Thuzad hidden behind taunts and the leftover body on Cenarius. Leftover Loathebs and Emperors can sometimes be hard to deal with, and don't even get me started on Tirion Fordring. It could be a better card against Dr. Balanced than BGH (if you run enough Dragons, of course) since you might be able to withstand the Boom Bot attacks. There are times where you don't mind killing a Sylvanas with this. It requires the attention of Archmage Antonidas, and those obnoxious taunted Jaraxxuses are wiped back into the void.
And of course, it can also kill the stuff BGH does better, too. :P
You countered your own point there.
Still, I don't think that Rend Blackhand has a place in druid. While druid needs hard removal, it doesn't use dragons. Even Alexstrasza, who works well with combo, isn't in druid. While there may be a return to really slow druid, I doubt it'll be more successful than the current combo archetype.
But paladin also lacks hard removal, and will probably use this in a late-game oriented dragon deck.
Incorrect, (sadly) she can steal minions with battlecries that kill her. Tested with Fire Elemental.
I think the main reason people think Rend is bad is because he is really restricted to Dragon decks. Therefore he doesn't hold value in most decks but he is amazing when you get him off. Taking out the almost too common Loatheb and Emperor Thaurissan can be a great board clear (as previously mentioned) He helps out in Paladin which has a great Dragon and lacks direct removal.
It could be that the effect of the battlecry is considered happening after the minion hits the board.
Battlecry→minion hits board→resolved effect of battlecry.
It does not seem consistent though considering mad scientist, and it makes Rend worse, as he was not slow, conditional and vulnerable enough already;-)
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
After playing with this card, I now think of it as "kill loatheb, empreror Thaurissan, Dr.Boom or Ysera". Which is common enough to swing games.
This logic is pretty flawed.
You don't have to kill a higher cost minion with Rend to get value, because since he kills a minion when he lands he's a two for one.
i.e., he kills the legendary card, and consumers whatever card(s) the opponent used to kill him. So, killing of Loatheb even though he's just a 5/5 is perfectly good value for Rend when you pull it off.
The reason you get the copy of the dude who killed scientist with it's effect in being summoned is quite simple, mirror entity triggers after the battlecry of a summoned dude. When scientist dies, he gets the secret out, and then it immediately triggers since you summoned a dude when mirror was up. It doesn't have anything to do with battlecry/deathrattle priorities. I believe it's what in Magic they call a stack.
I have been taken by surprise by Rend. I really thought he was going to suck horribly, but I've been on the receiving end of him a few times now and if you played a legend like Loatheb around turn 5 or 6, it's a powerful tempo swing. I'm not saying he rocks, but he is definitely more effective than I initially gave him credit for. With everyone running turn 5-8 legends, he has a target rich environment in the long game. If he was going to be better he just needs more health and lose the caveat of having to have a dragon in hand for the battlecry to work. What would have made him really cool to me is a deathrattle of summoning his mount, or a battlecry: if holding a dragon, summon his 8/4 mount to the field.
because the whole thing is far more complicated than it looks.
http://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Advanced_rulebook#Minion_summoning
Note that step 2 puts the minion on the board, step 7 resolves the battle cry and triggers the resolution of the death including the death rattle before continuing on and allowing the secret to trigger at step 8. As such the Mad Scientist can pull in a Mirror Image and have it copy the minion that killed it with a battle cry and Sylvanas can steal Rend if he kills her.
I think Rend isn't as bad a card as people are suggesting. He's not unplayable bad. He does require a dragon based deck and a slower meta with lots of legendaries. The slower meta with lots of legendaries sounds a lot like most tournaments where you can simply ban the face hunter and not have to deal with him. As others have said even if he just kills off a legendary and they trade a 4 or 5 drop into him or fireball him it's still worked out in your favor. They've lost 2 cards to your 1 card so you are ahead in that respect and an 8 attack minion demands an answer.
He's probably not going to be all that great on the ladder at lower levels or at the start of the season as there will be too much aggro around but may work at the higher levels and legend when the meta tends to slow as you actually need to win more than 50% of your games to progress since wins are no longer worth more than losses due to the win streak bonuses that will happen.
He's never going to be a good choice in the Arena because the conditions are too hard to meet. You aren't likely to see a lot of legendaries in opponents decks. You aren't likely to be holding dragons to activate it. In the arena it's just a really bad body.
Hogger is a 4/4 and a 2/2 taunt. Usually it's going to be an expensive Silver Hand Knight.
Ysera is too RNG dependent (and a bit too slow). if you get an Emerald Drake, it could go 2 for 1. But, if you get Dream, it won't.
Dr. Boom is the only card you mentioned that consistently goes 2 for 1, and it's in EVERY deck.
Rend Blackhand, if he triggers, will go 2 for 1. Even if he kills a Lorewalker Cho and is killed by Flamecannon, it's a 2 for 1. There's only a few situations where he triggers and still gets a 1 for 1 trade. Of course, that's if he triggers.
Rend's bad stats could be overlooked if there wasn't the dragon-holding condition. While the meta is indeed super aggressive and rushy, ladder is often filled with big-body legendaries (Tirion Fordring), which Rend can wreck easily. The necessity to hold a dragon to trigger his battlecry is however a real weakness.
Besides, Rend would be much more required if we saw hard to remove legendaries more often : Malygos, Ysera or even Kel'Thuzad on some occasion. In the current meta however, this is quite unlikely.
"My life... for Aiùr."