The reason they unnerfed Raza is mystery to me but anyway.
This is the reason why Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should discover the cards you pick to pull from hand. The cards would get better not against particular deck but would help even to pull battlecry minions and against aggro. It wouldn't be OP because there are decks that simply doesn't care about that as Big Priest, Big Shaman and any big deck, deathrattle decks. Those cards would be dead in some matchups anyway.
As you see in screenshot "Play Dirty Rat, there are plenty of ways to disrupt, play that tech..." it doesn't work. I got screwed anyway and lost. So what is my payoff for teching Dirty Rat? Surprise! None! I wasted slot that sucks against aggro, big decks and doesn't help anyway against combo. You still could get for discover different minions that you don't care to pull if opponent has enough minions in hand or doesn't have it yet. So it would still not be 100% but better than "you have one chance in 14 000 000 000 chances to win".
ATTACHMENTS
Screen Shot 2021-04-23 at 01.28.29
Screen Shot 2021-04-23 at 01.28.34
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
Honestly when I read this on front page I thought it was gonna be "Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should be core set" now with that I'd agree totally, but with your actual argument no one will ever agree or they will play those in every match in wild and they'd become the most broken cards ever.
Honestly when I read this on front page I thought it was gonna be "Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should be core set" now with that I'd agree totally, but with your actual argument no one will ever agree or they will play those in every match in wild and they'd become the most broken cards ever.
I actually agree with both sentiments; Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should both be in the Core Set and both be buffed to pick cards in your opponent's hand. The cards are basically worthless in 90% of matchups, only really serving you well against decks like Raza Priest or APM Mage, the latter of which is sometimes still okay post Dirty Rat depending on which variant they play.
There currently exists a card that does discover a card in your opponents hand, and it shuffles it away into their deck. Star Student Stelina does this, and didn't see any play for almost a year, and I still don't think she sees play now.
If they could both select 1 of 3 cards in your opponents hands to rip away they'd be pretty good! Maybe nerf Rats Health since his "downside" isn't such a downside anymore. Cards should be strong, especially in Wild where things are as insane as they are.
Dirty Rat often sees play in wild, and if it was given ability to discover which card to pull it would kill all combo and even lots of reno decks. It would be ran in aggro decks as well in order to counter enemy reno. You don't want a 2 mana discard enemy wincodition to exist in the game.
Dirty Rat often sees play in wild, and if it was given ability to discover which card to pull it would kill all combo and even lots of reno decks. It would be ran in aggro decks as well in order to counter enemy reno. You don't want a 2 mana discard enemy wincodition to exist in the game.
Heaven forbid any of the blatantly overpowered Highlander cards have a card that counters them. Highlander isn't even a restriction anymore. This is coming out angrier than I really am. I'm not angry at you, I'm angry at the system man.
In seriousness I do think that Highlander cards are generally overpowered, and the more counterplay we have for them the better. Like yeah, actually, I do want a card that rips Reno out of my opponent's hand when I'm playing aggro. It's a 1-card "everything you've done up until this point isn't relevant anymore" card, it feels terrible and has no real downside anymore. Also, I'd rather have tech cards like these actually become better, stronger - not completely irrelevant and terrible in non-combo matchups. If somebody Dirty Rats out my Corpsetaker sure I'd be super bummed! But fair's fair, I'm also running Dirty Rat and I could get their op minion too. It's a give and take.
Besides, it's not 100% guaranteed to hit what you need it to in every matchup - that might be true in decks like APM Mage that only have 3/4 minions, but frankly that's perfectly acceptable to me because that deck makes me frown haha.
Dirty Rat often sees play in wild, and if it was given ability to discover which card to pull it would kill all combo and even lots of reno decks. It would be ran in aggro decks as well in order to counter enemy reno. You don't want a 2 mana discard enemy wincodition to exist in the game.
Heaven forbid any of the blatantly overpowered Highlander cards have a card that counters them. Highlander isn't even a restriction anymore. This is coming out angrier than I really am. I'm not angry at you, I'm angry at the system man.
In seriousness I do think that Highlander cards are generally overpowered, and the more counterplay we have for them the better. Like yeah, actually, I do want a card that rips Reno out of my opponent's hand when I'm playing aggro. It's a 1-card "everything you've done up until this point isn't relevant anymore" card, it feels terrible and has no real downside anymore. Also, I'd rather have tech cards like these actually become better, stronger - not completely irrelevant and terrible in non-combo matchups. If somebody Dirty Rats out my Corpsetaker sure I'd be super bummed! But fair's fair, I'm also running Dirty Rat and I could get their op minion too. It's a give and take.
Besides, it's not 100% guaranteed to hit what you need it to in every matchup - that might be true in decks like APM Mage that only have 3/4 minions, but frankly that's perfectly acceptable to me because that deck makes me frown haha.
What you're suggesting would be okay but on a legendary which you can have only 1 of in your deck. Then it would be balanced, like you said Star Student Stelina that does it except she puts it back into the deck. Also the legendary should be neutral not like what they did with Tickatus and Star Student Stelina
Dirty Rat often sees play in wild, and if it was given ability to discover which card to pull it would kill all combo and even lots of reno decks. It would be ran in aggro decks as well in order to counter enemy reno. You don't want a 2 mana discard enemy wincodition to exist in the game.
There are already cards that are run in every deck... There haven't been a game where Rogue didn't play Secret Passage or Priest deck without Psychic Scream, druid deck without Lightning Bloom, Paladin without Hand of A'dal etc.
With the speed and power of wild then they would just become on par. You could lower Rats health so it isn't as thick as now. Saboteur is 6 mana 5/6...
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
What you're suggesting would be okay but on a legendary which you can have only 1 of in your deck. Then it would be balanced, like you said Star Student Stelina that does it except she puts it back into the deck. Also the legendary should be neutral not like what they did with Tickatus and Star Student Stelina
I agree the effects would be powerful, and the stats/cost of the cards would maybe need to be adjusted, but even then not too much. Star Student Stelina doesn't do enough, her cost and statline are awkward and the deck would rather play proactively anyways, rather than run a tech card that's so clunky. In terms of experimentation, I like what she does, but she proves that you need "more" than what she provides in order for a card that serves that purpose to be playable.
Not to mention Dirty Rat, if under these hypothetical changes, would still need more investment on the player using it to capitalize off of its use. You'd need to have had a developed board to trade into their Mozaki, Master Duelist for example - though cards like Reno or Raza you could just ignore anyways.
I think it's good and fair for a card that powerful to exist that counters those cards. Control/Combo don't have enough neutral counters that are accessible to Aggro/Midrange. We have like, Loatheb. Cult Neophyte and a few others, but slowing down isn't enough all the time. Aggro has the most "counters" in the game. Taunt slows down aggro's game plan. AoE slows them down, sometimes it's so good against aggro they have no choice but to concede. Healing slows them down/makes a win impossible (depending on their game state). Aggro has all these tools used against it - maybe it should be allowed a few stronger tools than it has. Again, this hypothetical Dirty Rat isn't 100% consistent against every combo/Highlander deck.
Unseen saboteur is fine with discover, still not a card that would be played in every deck, not even close. Wouldn't make any difference to the wild format. It's still a card that loses you the game when played 90% of the time. Maybe i'm missing something ?
However dirty rat with discover would completely change Hearthstone's landscape. The game would now be dominated by control decks, and as fun as that sounds, that wouldn't be more balanced, just very different. Minion based decks would be full of huge value oriented minions so they don't instantly lose the game on a turn 2 dirty rat. Aggro vs control matchups would be even more polarized, as aggro would generally lose instantly to a turn 2 dirty rat, but almost certainly win if the opponent didn't draw dirty rat, aggro decks would then become midrange decks to be slightly more resilient against the meta dirty rat control decks, as they won't need such a low curve against huge greedy decks anymore and will prefer more impactful cards, face hunter would play King Krush for the first time ever, spell oriented decks would become more popular and minion oriented decks less popular, battlecry wouldn't be the most common keyword anymore, quest mage, renolock and rez priest won't care about dirty rat and would still haunt the lower ranks.
Other than making the game completely new again, I don't see the point. Could be fun at some point though, long and greedy control matchups are by far the most entertaining. If you want a 2/6 taunt dirty rat that can discover 3 cards to exist, and not be the centerpiece of the game, it should realistically cost at least 5 mana, probably 6 or 7, and it would still destroy many decks at that mana cost.
Dirty Rat's power level is exactly where it needs to be. If it were to discover the card in the opponent's hand that it pulls then it would be an absolute menace. I understand the feeling of not getting any value from it, especially against big shaman or recruit warrior, but you have to think about about the different levels of the game that it would impact. You have to take into account every scenario. A card like that would be too strong, even for a legendary. If you're looking to disrupt combos or take away your opponents options, then play disruption DH or literally any Mill class.
Nobody is going to agree that it should receive that buff. The fact that the minion it pulls or the spell that Unseen Saboteur picks is up to chance is the only way you can balance their effects. They're the kind of cards that could either pay off extremely well or end up backfiring, but that's the price you pay for potentially ruining their chances of winning at 2-mana.
You're absolutely right. Maybe Bloodstinger could say "weakest" or "strongest" minion in their hand (in reference to their attack).
Actually, that's another way to potentially buff Dirty Rat that isn't a discover effect. It also provides premeditative counterplay for whomever is combo, just keep a minion in hand that Dirty Rat would pull instead of your combo piece. Or one of your disposable ones. It's not exactly a horizontal power adjustment, since having specific targets does make it better, but it isn't as overt and game warping (like you described) as Discover would be.
Dirty Rat often sees play in wild, and if it was given ability to discover which card to pull it would kill all combo and even lots of reno decks. It would be ran in aggro decks as well in order to counter enemy reno. You don't want a 2 mana discard enemy wincodition to exist in the game.
I wouldn't want it to become MTG style of broken hand disruption as you said, but if your deck wincondition revolves around few or one card well than time to change something up your deck (used argument from tickatus posts, that when removing 5 cards from your deck loses you the game). I know that getting controlled hand disruption is strong but still your opponent doesn't show you his whole hand. But there are many decks that don't care or would actually help them when you pull any minion from their hand.
With all the comments often made "Wild is wild" I think it would deserve buffed card like Dirty Rat make it 2/4 taunt so it doesn't have as such high HP. But depending on RNG it is really starting to be really unreliable. Still it wouldn't be 100% reliable.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
If you ever change Dirty Rat to a Discover effect, you would have to reduce its stats to a 2/4 at the very least. Just imagine aggro players using it as a 8-stat 2-drop that pulls a potentially weak minion from the opponent's hand.
That being said, I would like to see it in the core set.
To me, controlled hand disruption, in general, feels rather bad in other card games because it's basically like using a Counterspell and just saying a big fat Nope! to your opponent.
If this will be a thing, all I will play are decks like big priest. My Togwaggle druid is not doing very well already, but with rat like this it is basically an auto win against my deck unless I play the combo early or they have their rat in the bottom of their deck, 2 mana card should not win games.
To me, controlled hand disruption, in general, feels rather bad in other card games because it's basically like using a Counterspell and just saying a big fat Nope! to your opponent.
In a game with no good disruption and no instant interaction OTK and combo decks are exactly the same as this. It is bad in card games because you just play solitaire and then boom, you win on the spot with your opponent being unable to counter it by any means. That's the big fat nope too! Don't make your wincondition based on one card.
Or I have suggestion make Dirty Rat discover 3 minions from your opponents starting deck total not only from hand, you pick one. If they have it in their hand pull it. But it would be way to weak probably.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
If this will be a thing, all I will play are decks like big priest. My Togwaggle druid is not doing very well already, but with rat like this it is basically an auto win against my deck unless I play the combo early or they have their rat in the bottom of their deck, 2 mana card should not win games.
Funny how I had to immediately think about Prince Keleseth when reading this. There have been plenty of cards that pretty much win the game on the spot in the right situation and just cost 2 or even less.
If this will be a thing, all I will play are decks like big priest. My Togwaggle druid is not doing very well already, but with rat like this it is basically an auto win against my deck unless I play the combo early or they have their rat in the bottom of their deck, 2 mana card should not win games.
Funny how I had to immediately think about Prince Keleseth when reading this. There have been plenty of cards that pretty much win the game on the spot in the right situation and just cost 2 or even less.
I did not see him in ages and all I wanted to say, I do not enjoy cards with absurdly strong effects with low mana cost.
If this will be a thing, all I will play are decks like big priest. My Togwaggle druid is not doing very well already, but with rat like this it is basically an auto win against my deck unless I play the combo early or they have their rat in the bottom of their deck, 2 mana card should not win games.
Funny how I had to immediately think about Prince Keleseth when reading this. There have been plenty of cards that pretty much win the game on the spot in the right situation and just cost 2 or even less.
I did not see him in ages and all I wanted to say, I do not enjoy cards with absurdly strong effects with low mana cost.
Oh I totally agree with that, Keleseth was just an example from another meta. That's also what I meant with my comment about controlled hand disruption. I have played games like MtG and competitors where there is very targeted hand removal for 1-2 mana. I think that this is much worse for a game than an 8+ mana combo that you need to set up or something like Mechathun. Removing cards from the opponent's starting hand is scary in general.
Regarding a change to Dirty Rat, Guidance has shown that a "look at two cards"-ability would be an option. Why not change Dirty Rat to "look at two minions from your opponent's hand and play one of them". Discover seems too strong to me, but I don't think that there is a particular problem with Dirty Rat anyway.
If this will be a thing, all I will play are decks like big priest. My Togwaggle druid is not doing very well already, but with rat like this it is basically an auto win against my deck unless I play the combo early or they have their rat in the bottom of their deck, 2 mana card should not win games.
Funny how I had to immediately think about Prince Keleseth when reading this. There have been plenty of cards that pretty much win the game on the spot in the right situation and just cost 2 or even less.
I did not see him in ages and all I wanted to say, I do not enjoy cards with absurdly strong effects with low mana cost.
Oh I totally agree with that, Keleseth was just an example from another meta. That's also what I meant with my comment about controlled hand disruption. I have played games like MtG and competitors where there is very targeted hand removal for 1-2 mana. I think that this is much worse for a game than an 8+ mana combo that you need to set up or something like Mechathun. Removing cards from the opponent's starting hand is scary in general.
Regarding a change to Dirty Rat, Guidance has shown that a "look at two cards"-ability would be an option. Why not change Dirty Rat to "look at two minions from your opponent's hand and play one of them". Discover seems too strong to me, but I don't think that there is a particular problem with Dirty Rat anyway.
You make it sound like the combo decks take ages to set up and wait for turn 10 to happen. Druids play 8+ mana combos by turn 5 and Mages ends up with full hand, empty deck and 5 mana in a tray while you are dead. There are Odd Paladins, secret Mages, big Priests, demon Warlocks with Gul'dan and big demons. They all wouldn't much mind playing you Dirty Rat anyway. And still it isn't guaranteed of seeing the card you want in the discover when opponent has many minions in hand.
And of course reduce it health to 4 so it isn't as bulky. I love to play combo decks from time to time, Reno decks, value decks so everyone would be free to use it against me as well. Don't forget you could play Dirty Rat to pull Dirty Rat so you won't get screwed yourself.
Also you can't always play Dirt Rat anyway, sometimes you don't have means of destroying the minion and can screw you anyway.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
The reason they unnerfed Raza is mystery to me but anyway.
This is the reason why Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should discover the cards you pick to pull from hand. The cards would get better not against particular deck but would help even to pull battlecry minions and against aggro. It wouldn't be OP because there are decks that simply doesn't care about that as Big Priest, Big Shaman and any big deck, deathrattle decks. Those cards would be dead in some matchups anyway.
As you see in screenshot "Play Dirty Rat, there are plenty of ways to disrupt, play that tech..." it doesn't work. I got screwed anyway and lost. So what is my payoff for teching Dirty Rat? Surprise! None! I wasted slot that sucks against aggro, big decks and doesn't help anyway against combo. You still could get for discover different minions that you don't care to pull if opponent has enough minions in hand or doesn't have it yet. So it would still not be 100% but better than "you have one chance in 14 000 000 000 chances to win".
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
Honestly when I read this on front page I thought it was gonna be "Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should be core set" now with that I'd agree totally, but with your actual argument no one will ever agree or they will play those in every match in wild and they'd become the most broken cards ever.
I actually agree with both sentiments; Dirty Rat and Unseen Saboteur should both be in the Core Set and both be buffed to pick cards in your opponent's hand. The cards are basically worthless in 90% of matchups, only really serving you well against decks like Raza Priest or APM Mage, the latter of which is sometimes still okay post Dirty Rat depending on which variant they play.
There currently exists a card that does discover a card in your opponents hand, and it shuffles it away into their deck. Star Student Stelina does this, and didn't see any play for almost a year, and I still don't think she sees play now.
If they could both select 1 of 3 cards in your opponents hands to rip away they'd be pretty good! Maybe nerf Rats Health since his "downside" isn't such a downside anymore. Cards should be strong, especially in Wild where things are as insane as they are.
please don't bully my son
Dirty Rat often sees play in wild, and if it was given ability to discover which card to pull it would kill all combo and even lots of reno decks.
It would be ran in aggro decks as well in order to counter enemy reno.
You don't want a 2 mana discard enemy wincodition to exist in the game.
Heaven forbid any of the blatantly overpowered Highlander cards have a card that counters them. Highlander isn't even a restriction anymore. This is coming out angrier than I really am. I'm not angry at you, I'm angry at the system man.
In seriousness I do think that Highlander cards are generally overpowered, and the more counterplay we have for them the better. Like yeah, actually, I do want a card that rips Reno out of my opponent's hand when I'm playing aggro. It's a 1-card "everything you've done up until this point isn't relevant anymore" card, it feels terrible and has no real downside anymore. Also, I'd rather have tech cards like these actually become better, stronger - not completely irrelevant and terrible in non-combo matchups. If somebody Dirty Rats out my Corpsetaker sure I'd be super bummed! But fair's fair, I'm also running Dirty Rat and I could get their op minion too. It's a give and take.
Besides, it's not 100% guaranteed to hit what you need it to in every matchup - that might be true in decks like APM Mage that only have 3/4 minions, but frankly that's perfectly acceptable to me because that deck makes me frown haha.
please don't bully my son
What you're suggesting would be okay but on a legendary which you can have only 1 of in your deck. Then it would be balanced, like you said Star Student Stelina that does it except she puts it back into the deck. Also the legendary should be neutral not like what they did with Tickatus and Star Student Stelina
There are already cards that are run in every deck... There haven't been a game where Rogue didn't play Secret Passage or Priest deck without Psychic Scream, druid deck without Lightning Bloom, Paladin without Hand of A'dal etc.
With the speed and power of wild then they would just become on par. You could lower Rats health so it isn't as thick as now. Saboteur is 6 mana 5/6...
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
I agree the effects would be powerful, and the stats/cost of the cards would maybe need to be adjusted, but even then not too much. Star Student Stelina doesn't do enough, her cost and statline are awkward and the deck would rather play proactively anyways, rather than run a tech card that's so clunky. In terms of experimentation, I like what she does, but she proves that you need "more" than what she provides in order for a card that serves that purpose to be playable.
Not to mention Dirty Rat, if under these hypothetical changes, would still need more investment on the player using it to capitalize off of its use. You'd need to have had a developed board to trade into their Mozaki, Master Duelist for example - though cards like Reno or Raza you could just ignore anyways.
I think it's good and fair for a card that powerful to exist that counters those cards. Control/Combo don't have enough neutral counters that are accessible to Aggro/Midrange. We have like, Loatheb. Cult Neophyte and a few others, but slowing down isn't enough all the time. Aggro has the most "counters" in the game. Taunt slows down aggro's game plan. AoE slows them down, sometimes it's so good against aggro they have no choice but to concede. Healing slows them down/makes a win impossible (depending on their game state). Aggro has all these tools used against it - maybe it should be allowed a few stronger tools than it has. Again, this hypothetical Dirty Rat isn't 100% consistent against every combo/Highlander deck.
please don't bully my son
Unseen saboteur is fine with discover, still not a card that would be played in every deck, not even close. Wouldn't make any difference to the wild format. It's still a card that loses you the game when played 90% of the time. Maybe i'm missing something ?
However dirty rat with discover would completely change Hearthstone's landscape. The game would now be dominated by control decks, and as fun as that sounds, that wouldn't be more balanced, just very different. Minion based decks would be full of huge value oriented minions so they don't instantly lose the game on a turn 2 dirty rat. Aggro vs control matchups would be even more polarized, as aggro would generally lose instantly to a turn 2 dirty rat, but almost certainly win if the opponent didn't draw dirty rat, aggro decks would then become midrange decks to be slightly more resilient against the meta dirty rat control decks, as they won't need such a low curve against huge greedy decks anymore and will prefer more impactful cards, face hunter would play King Krush for the first time ever, spell oriented decks would become more popular and minion oriented decks less popular, battlecry wouldn't be the most common keyword anymore, quest mage, renolock and rez priest won't care about dirty rat and would still haunt the lower ranks.
Other than making the game completely new again, I don't see the point. Could be fun at some point though, long and greedy control matchups are by far the most entertaining. If you want a 2/6 taunt dirty rat that can discover 3 cards to exist, and not be the centerpiece of the game, it should realistically cost at least 5 mana, probably 6 or 7, and it would still destroy many decks at that mana cost.
How about my boy Wild Bloodstinger ? No buff for him ? Poisonous ?
Dirty Rat's power level is exactly where it needs to be. If it were to discover the card in the opponent's hand that it pulls then it would be an absolute menace. I understand the feeling of not getting any value from it, especially against big shaman or recruit warrior, but you have to think about about the different levels of the game that it would impact. You have to take into account every scenario. A card like that would be too strong, even for a legendary. If you're looking to disrupt combos or take away your opponents options, then play disruption DH or literally any Mill class.
Nobody is going to agree that it should receive that buff. The fact that the minion it pulls or the spell that Unseen Saboteur picks is up to chance is the only way you can balance their effects. They're the kind of cards that could either pay off extremely well or end up backfiring, but that's the price you pay for potentially ruining their chances of winning at 2-mana.
You're absolutely right. Maybe Bloodstinger could say "weakest" or "strongest" minion in their hand (in reference to their attack).
Actually, that's another way to potentially buff Dirty Rat that isn't a discover effect. It also provides premeditative counterplay for whomever is combo, just keep a minion in hand that Dirty Rat would pull instead of your combo piece. Or one of your disposable ones. It's not exactly a horizontal power adjustment, since having specific targets does make it better, but it isn't as overt and game warping (like you described) as Discover would be.
please don't bully my son
I wouldn't want it to become MTG style of broken hand disruption as you said, but if your deck wincondition revolves around few or one card well than time to change something up your deck (used argument from tickatus posts, that when removing 5 cards from your deck loses you the game). I know that getting controlled hand disruption is strong but still your opponent doesn't show you his whole hand. But there are many decks that don't care or would actually help them when you pull any minion from their hand.
With all the comments often made "Wild is wild" I think it would deserve buffed card like Dirty Rat make it 2/4 taunt so it doesn't have as such high HP. But depending on RNG it is really starting to be really unreliable. Still it wouldn't be 100% reliable.
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
If you ever change Dirty Rat to a Discover effect, you would have to reduce its stats to a 2/4 at the very least. Just imagine aggro players using it as a 8-stat 2-drop that pulls a potentially weak minion from the opponent's hand.
That being said, I would like to see it in the core set.
To me, controlled hand disruption, in general, feels rather bad in other card games because it's basically like using a Counterspell and just saying a big fat Nope! to your opponent.
If this will be a thing, all I will play are decks like big priest. My Togwaggle druid is not doing very well already, but with rat like this it is basically an auto win against my deck unless I play the combo early or they have their rat in the bottom of their deck, 2 mana card should not win games.
In a game with no good disruption and no instant interaction OTK and combo decks are exactly the same as this. It is bad in card games because you just play solitaire and then boom, you win on the spot with your opponent being unable to counter it by any means. That's the big fat nope too! Don't make your wincondition based on one card.
Or I have suggestion make Dirty Rat discover 3 minions from your opponents starting deck total not only from hand, you pick one. If they have it in their hand pull it. But it would be way to weak probably.
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"
Funny how I had to immediately think about Prince Keleseth when reading this. There have been plenty of cards that pretty much win the game on the spot in the right situation and just cost 2 or even less.
I did not see him in ages and all I wanted to say, I do not enjoy cards with absurdly strong effects with low mana cost.
Oh I totally agree with that, Keleseth was just an example from another meta. That's also what I meant with my comment about controlled hand disruption. I have played games like MtG and competitors where there is very targeted hand removal for 1-2 mana. I think that this is much worse for a game than an 8+ mana combo that you need to set up or something like Mechathun. Removing cards from the opponent's starting hand is scary in general.
Regarding a change to Dirty Rat, Guidance has shown that a "look at two cards"-ability would be an option. Why not change Dirty Rat to "look at two minions from your opponent's hand and play one of them". Discover seems too strong to me, but I don't think that there is a particular problem with Dirty Rat anyway.
You are crazy, it would be way too strong and run in majority of decks.
You make it sound like the combo decks take ages to set up and wait for turn 10 to happen. Druids play 8+ mana combos by turn 5 and Mages ends up with full hand, empty deck and 5 mana in a tray while you are dead. There are Odd Paladins, secret Mages, big Priests, demon Warlocks with Gul'dan and big demons. They all wouldn't much mind playing you Dirty Rat anyway. And still it isn't guaranteed of seeing the card you want in the discover when opponent has many minions in hand.
And of course reduce it health to 4 so it isn't as bulky. I love to play combo decks from time to time, Reno decks, value decks so everyone would be free to use it against me as well. Don't forget you could play Dirty Rat to pull Dirty Rat so you won't get screwed yourself.
Also you can't always play Dirt Rat anyway, sometimes you don't have means of destroying the minion and can screw you anyway.
"Minion to minion the basic of all combats, only a fool trusts his win to an OTK"