I keep seeing Activate The Obelisk on ladder, and dear god.. This card is so fucking abysmally designed.
When it pairs against most kinds of control decks, more often than not, the counter is to just refrain from damage till you either have a lethal combo, or the priest is fatigued.
It's not the strongest deck on the ladder, but dear god is it so fucking boring to play against. It's worse than mono blue MTG decks. Almost every Quest Priest game is just a drawn out mess until either the Priest burns out their removal, gets unlucky with revives, or gets fatigued.
The activation criteria just really sucks too.. It's so easy for a lot of decks to counter by quite literally just not taking damage, not dealing damage, and removing the priest minions as they appear. It forces the priest to play almost entirely reactively instead of proactively.
It could be easily fixed by changing the activation requirement to something on the lines of buffing the health of their minions by X. At least this way, the Priest quest isn't entirely reactive to the opponent being an idiot.
And before some dumb fucking degenerate replies with "QueST PRieST DoeSNT NeeD a NeRF!! HUUURRRRR". Read the fucking title and post. Rework =\= Nerf.
While I agree the quest is likely the worst designed, there are decks that can play with it proactively. There are a couple of self damage minions, and some that also damage your own hero. There is also the priest 4 drops that heals the opponent for 5 when it dies, another consideration.
There are actually ways to play with the quest in a proactive manner, but anything other than Rez priest is just trash at the moment.
I think most people would agree with you, and furthermore priest mains would love an entire class rework. And if not a rework, commit to a direction. Priest's butter is spread so thin that no one really gets to enjoy any of it. Support for steals, heals, or shadow form would be awesome. The latter preferably as we are long overdue for a shadowform deck. It's a classic card, and has literally not a single support card.
The latter preferably as we are long overdue for a shadowform deck. It's a classic card, and has literally not a single support card.
Ever since they've introduced hero cards and quests that upgrade your hero power... shadow form is just... strange. It' provides no tempo and doesn't generate card value; all it gives you is a slightly more powerful hero power. It'd make more sense as a legendary spell that provides you with some tempo in addition to altering your hero power.
But I agree, a rework to a lot of the classic/basic priest cards would be very much appreciated. I'd honestly just cut the 'steal' effect from priests, and probably focus on more pro-active healing and board-based strategies. Generating cool minions also seems very priest-y since their hero power is so focused on trading.
In terms of the priest quest... I think it's fine. The environment surrounding it's a bit frustrating, but the quest itself is fine. I think it's more that it gets put in that super irritating res priest deck that's basically just using it as a late game win con if your res strategy fails.
I quitted HS long ago. Wasn't priests tier 4 when it was introduced? What has changed to make it OP? When I played it seemed like one of the worsts quests.
>>Ever since they've introduced hero cards and quests that upgrade your hero power... shadow form is just... strange. It' provides no tempo and doesn't generate card value; all it gives you is a slightly more powerful hero power. It'd make more sense as a legendary spell that provides you with some tempo in addition to altering your hero power.
Shadown form could cost 0 mana and it would still be bullshit.
But I agree, a rework to a lot of the classic/basic priest cards would be very much appreciated. I'd honestly just cut the 'steal' effect from priests, and probably focus on more pro-active healing and board-based strategies. Generating cool minions also seems very priest-y since their hero power is so focused on trading.
In terms of the priest quest... I think it's fine. The environment surrounding it's a bit frustrating, but the quest itself is fine. I think it's more that it gets put in that super irritating res priest deck that's basically just using it as a late game win con if your res strategy fails.
The thing is, a complete rework of the class likely won't happen. Especially with Hearthstone's abysmal rate of balancing, and conformity to traditional TCG values (despite not having the T part). I agree Priest needs one. Their classic set sucks.
Im even doubtful we'd see a rework of the spell before it rotates into Wild. But it's feasible. And while I agree it would be fine in a different environment, it's just just so toxic and non interactive in the current Priest set.
I quitted HS long ago. Wasn't priests tier 4 when it was introduced? What has changed to make it OP? When I played it seemed like one of the worsts quests.
>>Ever since they've introduced hero cards and quests that upgrade your hero power... shadow form is just... strange. It' provides no tempo and doesn't generate card value; all it gives you is a slightly more powerful hero power. It'd make more sense as a legendary spell that provides you with some tempo in addition to altering your hero power.
Shadown form could cost 0 mana and it would still be bullshit.
They have a single good deck, which revolves around using the ressurrect mechanic to constantly revive strong mid-range to expensive minions with good battlecries. The spells available to them forbid them from tainting their deck with low cost minions, because the wording on their spells is so broad, and the risk of ressing a weak minion just destroys their tempo.
They also run 4 AoE removal spells, and two copies of a 'kill random enemy minion' taunt deathrattle.
So the best way to beat them is to just stall the quest, since they have a lot of removal, no quest interaction, and only 4 big swing cards that exhaust them after they're removed. But beating the class through fatigue in every. Single. Game. Is so fucking brain destroyingly boring.
I think the quest is fine, buffing priest isn’t going help. They have a lot of tools to be successful.
I like countering quest priests decks turning by not attacking for numerous turns and turning minions into sheep. They need some weakness. And they have it.
I think the quest is fine, buffing priest isn’t going help. They have a lot of tools to be successful.
I like countering quest priests decks turning by not attacking for numerous turns and turning minions into sheep. They need some weakness. And they have it.
No one said Priest needs buffs. They need a rework.
And regardless of whether or not you like uninteractive games, it goes against game philosophy.
The card is just bad design as it just takes healing which a Priest is going to do anyways and enhances it. It makes games extremely boring and non-creative as far as game play is concerned. The cost of it is just wrong. If they made the cost 4 to play and the requirement heal 20 to activate, then it would make for some interesting deck design. I would be fine with the current cost if it healed 3 and game +1/+1. The Druid quest and the Shaman quest are also of that same bad design mindset.
I think the real problem with Priest is that they effectively run with 10 instant kills in their deck if the player takes 2 copies (Shadow Word: Death, Shadow Word: Pain, Time Rip, Plague of Death, and Mind Control - I effectively destroy your copy and conjure a copy of my own). I would argue that they also have the best mass damage cards out there. It just makes the whole class over powered and forces players to make homogeneous decks and limits player choice if they want to be successful. Thematically it's an abysmal choice as well I know the traditional D&D Clerics had Powerword: Kill, they weren't vessels of destruction typically. You should give Priests one instant death card; this seems to be more the venue of the Rogue or Warlock (why don't they have more instant death cards?).
Stop designing by the mentality of "Wouldn't it be cool if....."
Okay, my rant is either over or it has just begun.
This post is 3 months old. I haven't seen the Priest quest since AoO launched. (Maybe one time) Healing 15 is a ton of healing. Playing the quest turn 1 is a big downside (loss of card from your mulligan, loss of tempo on turn 1).
Playing the quest on turn 1 is often bad but not because of loss of tempo (Rez Priest anyway skips the first 3-4 turns very often), it just informs your opponent early enough that they shouldn't go face too early
15 isn't that much healing really, especially when you have 1 cost cards that heal three and let you Discover a Spell. First turn is often a Mulligan anyways, and games should not be won/lost in round 1. This also doesn't address the other problems with Priest character in general (creativity, thematic and OP).
You lose out on a draw. Against any fast aggro deck that can really limit your options. The quest is fine, and 15 healing is a lot, renew doesn't change that and is a lot worse than Divine Hymn was. The quest is only especially good against really greedy or slow decks.
...and uh... what problems with priest? Thematically it's about healing, playing for board and removal. They have no face damage outside of some neutral cards so of course they have lots of removal options, And priest is not OP.
I usually just damage them and push through. Any card theyre using to heal is a card theyre not using to develop their board. Usually by the time their quest gets activated their health would be too low for it to provide any significant value.
Priest is badly designed but it's not the only non-interactive deck. The quest warlock decks running around also are boring and non-interactive. Same with druid decks. Quest warlock might be the newest cancer though. They just play through their deck until they OTK you and unless you can kill them fast they will OTK you and there isn't really anything you can do (they are running alex now in high legend so they take you down to 15 too to guarantee lethal). Aggressive decks like murloc paladin do well though. The thing is they heal so much that it's very hard to kill them. They also heal for about 4 per turn on average through nether breath and drawing the 4/6 so there is really no chance to win but you have to play a long game anyway. Just like playing vs priest. It's a very very very hard deck to play but when played by someone an expert in it, I think it could win almost every game, especially the newest version. I mean some streamers are seeing absurd win rates.
I tend to play janky decks against other janky decks - so can't speak for it at competitive levels right now - but yeah, it's one of the easiest quests to get around. As my decks are usually midrange or slower, I just refrain from doing that early 1-2 damage per turn with whatever 1/2 drop I get, and wait until I'm doing at least 4+ a turn to actually make it worthwhile. Depending on the deck - I run a lot of janky combos like OTK hunter and paladin - I just won't attack at all. Played against a priest yesterday who even ended up healing me to get 2 progress on their quest, as I just wouldn't peg him below 30 in the early game (I think they did actually activate their quest in this particular game, but by that time I was well and truly in control of the board, and a 2 mana +3/+3 buff each turn wasn't going to change that anytime soon).
It also doesn't help that Galakrond's hero power is much better for priest's current playstyle (IMO), and Galakrond's battlecry is brilliant - and I don't believe the quest is good enough to have for only a short amount of time before you drop Galakrond (and definitely not good enough to overwrite Galakrond's power).
This post is 3 months old. I haven't seen the Priest quest since AoO launched. (Maybe one time) Healing 15 is a ton of healing. Playing the quest turn 1 is a big downside (loss of card from your mulligan, loss of tempo on turn 1).
Res Priest (which almost always runs quest) was top 3 in popularity for over a month after AoO. You did see it on Ladder.
I stopped playing because the deck slowed down the average game length from 5-10 minutes to 20+ minutes. But it seems to have since dropped down to about #7 in popularity on HSReplay.
Galakrond is likely better. But this thread was never about power level. It waa about how atrociously slow the quest is.
Yes. Im aware you can counter it by not playing anything. But that was my literal exact point. Its just such a fucking bore to play against. The game got so fucking boring because of res priest that I just stopped playing.
I used to play HS on my lunch breaks and during slow downtime at work. But res priest slowed game length to boring 30 minute games that i just uninstalled it.
Blizz *could* have balanced it. But they stated in a Q&A that while they're aware of how boring it is to play against, they were making so much money from crafts due to its high cost and popularity that they kept it.
Im not even protesting the game or anything.. The game just became so boring that i play Legends of Runeterra on lunchbreaks instead
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I keep seeing Activate The Obelisk on ladder, and dear god.. This card is so fucking abysmally designed.
When it pairs against most kinds of control decks, more often than not, the counter is to just refrain from damage till you either have a lethal combo, or the priest is fatigued.
It's not the strongest deck on the ladder, but dear god is it so fucking boring to play against. It's worse than mono blue MTG decks. Almost every Quest Priest game is just a drawn out mess until either the Priest burns out their removal, gets unlucky with revives, or gets fatigued.
The activation criteria just really sucks too.. It's so easy for a lot of decks to counter by quite literally just not taking damage, not dealing damage, and removing the priest minions as they appear. It forces the priest to play almost entirely reactively instead of proactively.
It could be easily fixed by changing the activation requirement to something on the lines of buffing the health of their minions by X. At least this way, the Priest quest isn't entirely reactive to the opponent being an idiot.
And before some dumb fucking degenerate replies with "QueST PRieST DoeSNT NeeD a NeRF!! HUUURRRRR". Read the fucking title and post. Rework =\= Nerf.
I think damaging priest is still viable as a tactic. You just have to consider. Priests often decide to heal up for 2 mana instead of playing cards.
While I agree the quest is likely the worst designed, there are decks that can play with it proactively. There are a couple of self damage minions, and some that also damage your own hero. There is also the priest 4 drops that heals the opponent for 5 when it dies, another consideration.
There are actually ways to play with the quest in a proactive manner, but anything other than Rez priest is just trash at the moment.
I think most people would agree with you, and furthermore priest mains would love an entire class rework. And if not a rework, commit to a direction. Priest's butter is spread so thin that no one really gets to enjoy any of it. Support for steals, heals, or shadow form would be awesome. The latter preferably as we are long overdue for a shadowform deck. It's a classic card, and has literally not a single support card.
Ever since they've introduced hero cards and quests that upgrade your hero power... shadow form is just... strange. It' provides no tempo and doesn't generate card value; all it gives you is a slightly more powerful hero power. It'd make more sense as a legendary spell that provides you with some tempo in addition to altering your hero power.
But I agree, a rework to a lot of the classic/basic priest cards would be very much appreciated. I'd honestly just cut the 'steal' effect from priests, and probably focus on more pro-active healing and board-based strategies. Generating cool minions also seems very priest-y since their hero power is so focused on trading.
In terms of the priest quest... I think it's fine. The environment surrounding it's a bit frustrating, but the quest itself is fine. I think it's more that it gets put in that super irritating res priest deck that's basically just using it as a late game win con if your res strategy fails.
I quitted HS long ago. Wasn't priests tier 4 when it was introduced? What has changed to make it OP? When I played it seemed like one of the worsts quests.
The thing is, a complete rework of the class likely won't happen. Especially with Hearthstone's abysmal rate of balancing, and conformity to traditional TCG values (despite not having the T part). I agree Priest needs one. Their classic set sucks.
Im even doubtful we'd see a rework of the spell before it rotates into Wild. But it's feasible. And while I agree it would be fine in a different environment, it's just just so toxic and non interactive in the current Priest set.
They have a single good deck, which revolves around using the ressurrect mechanic to constantly revive strong mid-range to expensive minions with good battlecries. The spells available to them forbid them from tainting their deck with low cost minions, because the wording on their spells is so broad, and the risk of ressing a weak minion just destroys their tempo.
They also run 4 AoE removal spells, and two copies of a 'kill random enemy minion' taunt deathrattle.
So the best way to beat them is to just stall the quest, since they have a lot of removal, no quest interaction, and only 4 big swing cards that exhaust them after they're removed. But beating the class through fatigue in every. Single. Game. Is so fucking brain destroyingly boring.
I think the quest is fine, buffing priest isn’t going help. They have a lot of tools to be successful.
I like countering quest priests decks turning by not attacking for numerous turns and turning minions into sheep. They need some weakness. And they have it.
No one said Priest needs buffs. They need a rework.
And regardless of whether or not you like uninteractive games, it goes against game philosophy.
Nothing in Hearthstone is worse than mono blue in mtg.
The card is just bad design as it just takes healing which a Priest is going to do anyways and enhances it. It makes games extremely boring and non-creative as far as game play is concerned. The cost of it is just wrong. If they made the cost 4 to play and the requirement heal 20 to activate, then it would make for some interesting deck design. I would be fine with the current cost if it healed 3 and game +1/+1. The Druid quest and the Shaman quest are also of that same bad design mindset.
I think the real problem with Priest is that they effectively run with 10 instant kills in their deck if the player takes 2 copies (Shadow Word: Death, Shadow Word: Pain, Time Rip, Plague of Death, and Mind Control - I effectively destroy your copy and conjure a copy of my own). I would argue that they also have the best mass damage cards out there. It just makes the whole class over powered and forces players to make homogeneous decks and limits player choice if they want to be successful. Thematically it's an abysmal choice as well I know the traditional D&D Clerics had Powerword: Kill, they weren't vessels of destruction typically. You should give Priests one instant death card; this seems to be more the venue of the Rogue or Warlock (why don't they have more instant death cards?).
Stop designing by the mentality of "Wouldn't it be cool if....."
Okay, my rant is either over or it has just begun.
The only playable quest of all 9.
Yes, sure, need to be trash like everyone else... >_>
Ah, the sweet, sweet memories. And people think rez priest is oppressing.
This post is 3 months old. I haven't seen the Priest quest since AoO launched. (Maybe one time) Healing 15 is a ton of healing. Playing the quest turn 1 is a big downside (loss of card from your mulligan, loss of tempo on turn 1).
Playing the quest on turn 1 is often bad but not because of loss of tempo (Rez Priest anyway skips the first 3-4 turns very often), it just informs your opponent early enough that they shouldn't go face too early
15 isn't that much healing really, especially when you have 1 cost cards that heal three and let you Discover a Spell. First turn is often a Mulligan anyways, and games should not be won/lost in round 1. This also doesn't address the other problems with Priest character in general (creativity, thematic and OP).
You lose out on a draw. Against any fast aggro deck that can really limit your options. The quest is fine, and 15 healing is a lot, renew doesn't change that and is a lot worse than Divine Hymn was. The quest is only especially good against really greedy or slow decks.
...and uh... what problems with priest? Thematically it's about healing, playing for board and removal. They have no face damage outside of some neutral cards so of course they have lots of removal options, And priest is not OP.
I usually just damage them and push through. Any card theyre using to heal is a card theyre not using to develop their board. Usually by the time their quest gets activated their health would be too low for it to provide any significant value.
Priest is badly designed but it's not the only non-interactive deck. The quest warlock decks running around also are boring and non-interactive. Same with druid decks. Quest warlock might be the newest cancer though. They just play through their deck until they OTK you and unless you can kill them fast they will OTK you and there isn't really anything you can do (they are running alex now in high legend so they take you down to 15 too to guarantee lethal). Aggressive decks like murloc paladin do well though. The thing is they heal so much that it's very hard to kill them. They also heal for about 4 per turn on average through nether breath and drawing the 4/6 so there is really no chance to win but you have to play a long game anyway. Just like playing vs priest. It's a very very very hard deck to play but when played by someone an expert in it, I think it could win almost every game, especially the newest version. I mean some streamers are seeing absurd win rates.
I tend to play janky decks against other janky decks - so can't speak for it at competitive levels right now - but yeah, it's one of the easiest quests to get around. As my decks are usually midrange or slower, I just refrain from doing that early 1-2 damage per turn with whatever 1/2 drop I get, and wait until I'm doing at least 4+ a turn to actually make it worthwhile. Depending on the deck - I run a lot of janky combos like OTK hunter and paladin - I just won't attack at all. Played against a priest yesterday who even ended up healing me to get 2 progress on their quest, as I just wouldn't peg him below 30 in the early game (I think they did actually activate their quest in this particular game, but by that time I was well and truly in control of the board, and a 2 mana +3/+3 buff each turn wasn't going to change that anytime soon).
It also doesn't help that Galakrond's hero power is much better for priest's current playstyle (IMO), and Galakrond's battlecry is brilliant - and I don't believe the quest is good enough to have for only a short amount of time before you drop Galakrond (and definitely not good enough to overwrite Galakrond's power).
Res Priest (which almost always runs quest) was top 3 in popularity for over a month after AoO. You did see it on Ladder.
I stopped playing because the deck slowed down the average game length from 5-10 minutes to 20+ minutes. But it seems to have since dropped down to about #7 in popularity on HSReplay.
Galakrond is likely better. But this thread was never about power level. It waa about how atrociously slow the quest is.
Yes. Im aware you can counter it by not playing anything. But that was my literal exact point. Its just such a fucking bore to play against. The game got so fucking boring because of res priest that I just stopped playing.
I used to play HS on my lunch breaks and during slow downtime at work. But res priest slowed game length to boring 30 minute games that i just uninstalled it.
Blizz *could* have balanced it. But they stated in a Q&A that while they're aware of how boring it is to play against, they were making so much money from crafts due to its high cost and popularity that they kept it.
Im not even protesting the game or anything.. The game just became so boring that i play Legends of Runeterra on lunchbreaks instead