This is a card for something like the Dragon Highlander decks we are inevitably going to see. It'll be good there...but mainly because you have to run 30 unique cards.
I'd be surprised if we see it do much else next format.
Cost reduction cards are -always- broken in some manner or form.
Just to highlight how silly this sentiment is (and this not being the first time it was stated) here are a few cards (incomplete list) with cost reducing effects that were (almost) never played:
Bottomline: Some cost-reduction effects are good, some are bad. It's not like every single time you can reduce the cost of something, it's super strong.
tl;dr Keleseth was good cause your deck was all minions, would an all dragon, or near all dragon deck work with this in it? Doubt it, overrated card.
Most people said exactly the same thing about building a deck with no 2-cost cards: "Can this ever work? Doubtful."
But the obvious (to me) answer to your rhetorical question is: Yes, in the expansion called Descent of Dragons, there will be enough playable Dragons to build a deck of mostly Dragons.
Any non-Dragon you decide to put into that deck is going to have Dragon synergy, and that synergy is going to be triggered pretty much every time. So it's not like you're super sad about paying full price for those non-Dragons. In most of the cards we've seen so far, those Dragon synergy effects are worth at least 2 mana.
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"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
It's playable at 4 mana. I don't think people really understand what meta defining actually means. It means a card that an entire deck will be around and people will need to play decks that counter it. This is not even close. First it only effects dragons in your deck and not hand. It's effect is going to be slow unless your deck has lots of draw. Even then for the stats it's playable but not great. Will mainly see play for combo decks. I think it will be too slow in the meta. If the card said hand and deck it would be a playable but far from an auto include in dragon decks.
No.
Meta-defining means: Define the meta. When dragon-decks are garbage, and by printing this card, all of a sudden everyone plays dragon decks, this card is meta-defining. The meta is the state of the game, which decks are played and which are not.
What you described is a build-around card, like C'Thun. There is a single card, usually powerful, so that you build you deck around it. But if no one plays said deck, it is not meta-defining.
Usually, powerful build-around cards happen to be meta-defining, but arent't necessarily. Frizz Kindleroost seems to be both.
Everybody is playing Dragon decks now? Seems like you are putting the cart before the horse.
C'thun decks "defined the meta" at the scrub ranks for about one week. The competitive players worked out there were much better options immediately. The lemmings took a bit longer to figure it out. But C'thun did NOT define the meta.
This card needs to stop being compared to Keleseth. Keleseth came down twice as early, and affected an entire deck full of aggro minions. That's where the power came from.
Frizz is nothing at all like Keleseth because it doesn't do anything aggressive. It comes down twice as late and the only cards of consequence that it buffs are mid-to-late game options.
Frizz should be compared to Luna's Pocket Galaxy. But I don't think we need to argue why Frizz is much less scary than buffed LPG because it should be pretty obvious.
Frizz will be good. Kalecgos on 8 or Alex on 7 is nothing to scoff at. But, at that point of the game, there are reasonable ways of responding...or you're already dead.
Looking forward to the Rogue shadowstep nonsense with this. 2 mana Ysera.
Its so likely to happen. Play this on turn 4, and Shadowstep it. Play it again on turn 5, and shadowstep,/play again. And then top deck Ysera on turn 6. Its magic. What could go wrong? Sure, your opponent probably just kills you since you have spent two turns doing basically nothing. But winning isn't important, is it?
Comments like this remind me that most HS players can't even get past rank 15.
Looking forward to the Rogue shadowstep nonsense with this. 2 mana Ysera.
The crazy 2-mana dragon combo highroll deck that eventually gets built will be garbage, but it'll be a meme/put on YouTube and that's something. I dunno if they run Ysera, I assume it will try to cheat out a crazy out of class dragon, clone it a whole bunch, reduce its cost, then draw a shit load of them.
it would make a good combo with Togwaggle's Scheme for late game in Rogue. you can even shadow step it and get -4 for a dozen big dragon. but i would use it as a plan B to a Galakrond Rogue and turn it into a dragon deck in late game
It's playable at 4 mana. I don't think people really understand what meta defining actually means. It means a card that an entire deck will be around and people will need to play decks that counter it. This is not even close. First it only effects dragons in your deck and not hand. It's effect is going to be slow unless your deck has lots of draw. Even then for the stats it's playable but not great. Will mainly see play for combo decks. I think it will be too slow in the meta. If the card said hand and deck it would be a playable but far from an auto include in dragon decks.
No.
Meta-defining means: Define the meta. When dragon-decks are garbage, and by printing this card, all of a sudden everyone plays dragon decks, this card is meta-defining. The meta is the state of the game, which decks are played and which are not.
What you described is a build-around card, like C'Thun. There is a single card, usually powerful, so that you build you deck around it. But if no one plays said deck, it is not meta-defining.
Usually, powerful build-around cards happen to be meta-defining, but arent't necessarily. Frizz Kindleroost seems to be both.
Everybody is playing Dragon decks now? Seems like you are putting the cart before the horse.
C'thun decks "defined the meta" at the scrub ranks for about one week. The competitive players worked out there were much better options immediately. The lemmings took a bit longer to figure it out. But C'thun did NOT define the meta.
Maybe you should read my comment before commenting.
I have not said that anyone would play dragon decks. I have not said that C'thun was meta defining.
I have just described the poll, and what meta-defining means. It mean's, that according to this poll, 71.8 % of people think, that because of this card (Frizz), people will play dragon decks. I have not rated any card.
The card text can be changed to: "If you play this on curve, you win the game"
Damn, the tempo tempo gain is HUGE! But it's a boost to value, too. Because you can combine your 9-10 Mana minions with other effects.
Save to craft on day 1, because you'll get your dust back. Not to mention, that they forgot the "not less than (1)" clause again.
You poke at their grammar, yet your grammar is poor in itself. How about you stop embarrassing yourself, you idiot? I mean, you missed out a full stop in your first sentence, for starters.
This cards kinda not that great. Could possibly see play in some type of highlander dragon deck or something like that. But def not broken or even close to meta defining.
Frizz just seems like something you'd just sprinkle in a dragon deck just for filler. I seriously doubt this card will win very many games, it's impact is nowhere near as swingy as even 7 mana LPG after being played and comes down too late and not enough minions to matter like Keleseth does.
This is a card for something like the Dragon Highlander decks we are inevitably going to see. It'll be good there...but mainly because you have to run 30 unique cards.
I'd be surprised if we see it do much else next format.
You probably play it in Hand/Dragon Warlock too since you draw so many cards you’re very likely to get your mana back.
The card text can be changed to: "If you play this on curve, you win the game"
Damn, the tempo tempo gain is HUGE! But it's a boost to value, too. Because you can combine your 9-10 Mana minions with other effects.
Save to craft on day 1, because you'll get your dust back. Not to mention, that they forgot the "not less than (1)" clause again.
You poke at their grammar, yet your grammar is poor in itself. How about you stop embarrassing yourself, you idiot? I mean, you missed out a full stop in your first sentence, for starters.
I don't poke anyone's grammar?! Because of my "not less than (1)" statement? You know that this refers to SN1P-SN4P combo?
It's a strange question to ask, but can anyone figure out what she actually says when played? I hear "blah blah eleven" (though I even doubt it's actually eleven) xD I tried to look up on HS gamepedia, but there are no quotes associated with her :c
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This is a card for something like the Dragon Highlander decks we are inevitably going to see. It'll be good there...but mainly because you have to run 30 unique cards.
I'd be surprised if we see it do much else next format.
Just to highlight how silly this sentiment is (and this not being the first time it was stated) here are a few cards (incomplete list) with cost reducing effects that were (almost) never played:
Pint-Sized Summoner (not since the nerf in Beta), Lunar Visions, Seadevil Stinger (very few people even tried Murloc Warlock), Corpse Widow, Leyline Manipulator (aside from some experimental OTK decks that were played for a week or two), Shadowfiend (ignoring one particular Tavern Brawl), Helpless Hatchling, Cho'gall, Call Pet, and a few more there might have been.
Bottomline: Some cost-reduction effects are good, some are bad. It's not like every single time you can reduce the cost of something, it's super strong.
Most people said exactly the same thing about building a deck with no 2-cost cards: "Can this ever work? Doubtful."
But the obvious (to me) answer to your rhetorical question is: Yes, in the expansion called Descent of Dragons, there will be enough playable Dragons to build a deck of mostly Dragons.
Any non-Dragon you decide to put into that deck is going to have Dragon synergy, and that synergy is going to be triggered pretty much every time. So it's not like you're super sad about paying full price for those non-Dragons. In most of the cards we've seen so far, those Dragon synergy effects are worth at least 2 mana.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Everybody is playing Dragon decks now? Seems like you are putting the cart before the horse.
C'thun decks "defined the meta" at the scrub ranks for about one week. The competitive players worked out there were much better options immediately. The lemmings took a bit longer to figure it out. But C'thun did NOT define the meta.
This card needs to stop being compared to Keleseth. Keleseth came down twice as early, and affected an entire deck full of aggro minions. That's where the power came from.
Frizz is nothing at all like Keleseth because it doesn't do anything aggressive. It comes down twice as late and the only cards of consequence that it buffs are mid-to-late game options.
Frizz should be compared to Luna's Pocket Galaxy. But I don't think we need to argue why Frizz is much less scary than buffed LPG because it should be pretty obvious.
Frizz will be good. Kalecgos on 8 or Alex on 7 is nothing to scoff at. But, at that point of the game, there are reasonable ways of responding...or you're already dead.
Looking forward to the Rogue shadowstep nonsense with this. 2 mana Ysera.
Not as easy to chain shadowstep a 4 drop than a 2 drop without losing tempo though
Its so likely to happen. Play this on turn 4, and Shadowstep it. Play it again on turn 5, and shadowstep,/play again. And then top deck Ysera on turn 6. Its magic. What could go wrong? Sure, your opponent probably just kills you since you have spent two turns doing basically nothing. But winning isn't important, is it?
Comments like this remind me that most HS players can't even get past rank 15.
I don't think he meant doing all this on curve
The crazy 2-mana dragon combo highroll deck that eventually gets built will be garbage, but it'll be a meme/put on YouTube and that's something. I dunno if they run Ysera, I assume it will try to cheat out a crazy out of class dragon, clone it a whole bunch, reduce its cost, then draw a shit load of them.
Yup.. never EVER hit the dust all button.. I scored a lot during the conjurer call (golden copies) and luna pocket galaxy nerf
it would make a good combo with Togwaggle's Scheme for late game in Rogue. you can even shadow step it and get -4 for a dozen big dragon. but i would use it as a plan B to a Galakrond Rogue and turn it into a dragon deck in late game
Maybe you should read my comment before commenting.
I have not said that anyone would play dragon decks. I have not said that C'thun was meta defining.
I have just described the poll, and what meta-defining means. It mean's, that according to this poll, 71.8 % of people think, that because of this card (Frizz), people will play dragon decks. I have not rated any card.
You poke at their grammar, yet your grammar is poor in itself. How about you stop embarrassing yourself, you idiot? I mean, you missed out a full stop in your first sentence, for starters.
This cards kinda not that great. Could possibly see play in some type of highlander dragon deck or something like that. But def not broken or even close to meta defining.
Frizz just seems like something you'd just sprinkle in a dragon deck just for filler. I seriously doubt this card will win very many games, it's impact is nowhere near as swingy as even 7 mana LPG after being played and comes down too late and not enough minions to matter like Keleseth does.
You probably play it in Hand/Dragon Warlock too since you draw so many cards you’re very likely to get your mana back.
nerf before release PLS
I don't poke anyone's grammar?! Because of my "not less than (1)" statement? You know that this refers to SN1P-SN4P combo?
Additionally English is not my native language.
It's a strange question to ask, but can anyone figure out what she actually says when played? I hear "blah blah eleven" (though I even doubt it's actually eleven) xD I tried to look up on HS gamepedia, but there are no quotes associated with her :c