I know its being compared to Dirty Rat and Deathlord and whether it is better or worse than those cards is up for debate.
But here is the thing, THIS IS IN STANDARD while the other two are not. And combo disruption cards have been underestimated by the community when they have been revealed in the past but ended up being invaluable when fighting against combo decks. And if combo decks in standard start being a problem (looking at Jepetto Joybuzz), at least control decks actually have an option now instead literally just waiting to die.
Now this one is a nice "twist". I guess it will be almost an auto-include in basically every controlish deck and maybe most combo decks.
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“If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange these apples then you and I will still each have one apple. But if you have an idea and I have an idea and we exchange these ideas, then each of us will have two ideas.” ― George Bernard Shaw
EU Legend: S52 (ZooHeal Lock); S76 (Highlander Hunter);
IMO it is worse because it's more dangerous to play it on curve when you don't have on board the means to dispose of the worst case scenario minion. And it's highly unlikely you'll have a big killer on board by turn 4. In Deathlord's case you had some time to build up countermeasures because the opponent had to kill it first and the summoned minion wouldn't be able to attack until the following turn. Here the opponent gets to attack right off the bat. And as for the silencing aspect, to my knowledge combo decks don't run silences at the moment.
I was going to say, that you don't have to play Hecklebot on turn 4 necessarily, but doing so your opponent might draw their win-condition before you actually play the mech. So you have a point there, but if you top-deck the mech after turn 8 or so, it would be stronger than a regular Deathlord, as it will summon the minion right away and you will have good chances to answer the opponent's threat (Shield Slam. Shadow Word: Death, Fourbidden Words etc). You can also play the mech on turn 4 and pull the bad boy out. The chances of your opponent having exactly the burn to kill you (if we are talking about Malygos type of decks) would be small and not every win-condition has massive stats like Mecha'thun.
But everything depends on the opponent you are facing and on the card draw RNG, so I can't argue any further. As for your last comment - you have a point there as well.
Can't find the comment, but someone in this thread made a very good point in this being incredible in a future Bomb Warrior deck. While it might be more unpredictable overall in terms of combo breaking abilities (except for decks using very few, specific minions), it can be utilized in more and different ways than either Dirty Rat or Deathlord. It curves into Zilliax, takes the opponent closer to fatigue AND increases the probability of them drawing more of the (I assume) many bombs you've put in their deck. This alongside Blastmaster Boom, Clockwork Goblin and Wrenchcalibur will make for a really exciting Warrior deck!
i feel this card is much more RNG dependent than Dirty Rat. There is no telling if important combo piece is still in deck. On the other hand you can easily see if combo piece is in the hand. Lets say we have dirty rat playing vs mecha'thun lock. you hold on to it almost till the end of the game, when you see Galvanizer being played you know Mecha'thun is in opponent hand. Of course good players will try to counter that by holding few spare minions in their hand so rat wouldn't pull combo piece often reducing odds to 50% or 33%.
In this newly revealed card everything depends on how many "non combo minions" there are in the deck. The more minions the smaller chance for Heclebot to pull it out. The longer we wait the bigger chances opponent will gather on pieces needed. On the other hand unlike Deathlord you can easier react to what should be pulled out of opponent deck dur to hecklebot having battlecry effect instead deathrattle. It put your opponet in to the fatigue faster.
I would rate this card not as good as Dirty Rat but better than Deathlord If combo decks should be a thing this card will be included.
That this is a good anti-combo and anti-control (in terms of fatigue) tech, it is and that's undeniable. It will see tons of play just like the aforementionted cards are heavily used in wild. The only thing I am not sure of is whether this is going to create frustrating moments for combo players. I remember some people hating on Dirty Rat, because it was an auto-loss if it targeted the right minion and the same effect kinda occurs here. True, the chances of pulling a cheap cycle minion are really high and you can't do anything, if the enemy's win-condition is in their hand (except with Mojomaster Zihi), but dunno. I can still see some people making posts and complaining about the mech's design.
Inb4 since there isn't going to be a hand-disruptive tool, I believe Zihi will continue to see play next expansion.
Totally agree with you! I like hearthstone the mechanics the archetypes etc. But is this card just ruin combo decks, and every aggro and midrange autoinclude this rare, that will be a bit boring imho. We should never counter a deck archetype with one card.
khadgar says "your cards that summon minions summon twice as many". This is not your opponents card, so it SHOULDN'T summon a copy. That being said its hearthstone, so who knows lol
A lot of people are saying that this is "worse dirty rat." Well, no shit. Dirty Rat is broken. It's actually a bad card for the game. I hope we don't see something like it ever again.
A lot of people are also saying that this is "worse deathlord." That's true against Aggro. But you don't play this because of aggro. So stop. It's actually better against control because it's "consistent. "
This is a Gnomeferatu/Deathlord hybrid. To a certain extent, in the appropriate match up, you just windmill this and pray. But it's neutral, and that's better than nothing.
Eh... it's not bad, I guess, but really depends on the meta how useful this will be in the end. I think Dirty Rat and Deathlord were better overall, but you take what you get. Better this than nothing at all. And against aggro decks, it's pretty big.
Dirty rat could be timed to hit combo pieces, this is much more random. Play this and it pulls out novice engineer against exodia mage....
I am not so afraid of hitting endgame minions because you don't normaly play this without hex-effects or hard removal in hand. Against agro you could but then the taunt body is strong enough. I am just afraid it is not certain enough of a disruption against combo decks.
Well, we don't want combo dead. Dirty rat could be saved, and cards like mechathun require you to only be holding combo pieces, meaning a new one would always hit an essential minion. This is needed tech, but doesn't lead to an auto win vs. Combo.
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I know its being compared to Dirty Rat and Deathlord and whether it is better or worse than those cards is up for debate.
But here is the thing, THIS IS IN STANDARD while the other two are not. And combo disruption cards have been underestimated by the community when they have been revealed in the past but ended up being invaluable when fighting against combo decks. And if combo decks in standard start being a problem (looking at Jepetto Joybuzz), at least control decks actually have an option now instead literally just waiting to die.
Now this one is a nice "twist". I guess it will be almost an auto-include in basically every controlish deck and maybe most combo decks.
“If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange these apples then you and I will still each have one apple. But if you have an idea and I have an idea and we exchange these ideas, then each of us will have two ideas.” ― George Bernard Shaw
EU Legend: S52 (ZooHeal Lock); S76 (Highlander Hunter);
I was going to say, that you don't have to play Hecklebot on turn 4 necessarily, but doing so your opponent might draw their win-condition before you actually play the mech. So you have a point there, but if you top-deck the mech after turn 8 or so, it would be stronger than a regular Deathlord, as it will summon the minion right away and you will have good chances to answer the opponent's threat (Shield Slam. Shadow Word: Death, Fourbidden Words etc). You can also play the mech on turn 4 and pull the bad boy out. The chances of your opponent having exactly the burn to kill you (if we are talking about Malygos type of decks) would be small and not every win-condition has massive stats like Mecha'thun.
But everything depends on the opponent you are facing and on the card draw RNG, so I can't argue any further. As for your last comment - you have a point there as well.
Can't find the comment, but someone in this thread made a very good point in this being incredible in a future Bomb Warrior deck. While it might be more unpredictable overall in terms of combo breaking abilities (except for decks using very few, specific minions), it can be utilized in more and different ways than either Dirty Rat or Deathlord. It curves into Zilliax, takes the opponent closer to fatigue AND increases the probability of them drawing more of the (I assume) many bombs you've put in their deck. This alongside Blastmaster Boom, Clockwork Goblin and Wrenchcalibur will make for a really exciting Warrior deck!
It would turn the 6/10 Divine Shield, Taunt, Lifesteal, Rush monstrosity on turn six back into a humble 3/8.
i feel this card is much more RNG dependent than Dirty Rat. There is no telling if important combo piece is still in deck. On the other hand you can easily see if combo piece is in the hand. Lets say we have dirty rat playing vs mecha'thun lock. you hold on to it almost till the end of the game, when you see Galvanizer being played you know Mecha'thun is in opponent hand. Of course good players will try to counter that by holding few spare minions in their hand so rat wouldn't pull combo piece often reducing odds to 50% or 33%.
In this newly revealed card everything depends on how many "non combo minions" there are in the deck. The more minions the smaller chance for Heclebot to pull it out. The longer we wait the bigger chances opponent will gather on pieces needed. On the other hand unlike Deathlord you can easier react to what should be pulled out of opponent deck dur to hecklebot having battlecry effect instead deathrattle. It put your opponet in to the fatigue faster.
I would rate this card not as good as Dirty Rat but better than Deathlord If combo decks should be a thing this card will be included.
Totally agree with you! I like hearthstone the mechanics the archetypes etc. But is this card just ruin combo decks, and every aggro and midrange autoinclude this rare, that will be a bit boring imho. We should never counter a deck archetype with one card.
khadgar says "your cards that summon minions summon twice as many". This is not your opponents card, so it SHOULDN'T summon a copy. That being said its hearthstone, so who knows lol
Great card! Helps thin out the deck for more boom bot fun!
this card should be epic!
Now what if
someone will play this card 5-10 times a game being able to kill or freeze or hex all the minions...
How strong is that? lol
Coz u know there will be some of these archetypes very soon.
hearthpwn: those older sets were super broken!!
also hearthpwn: these reprints are not as good as those old broken cards, wtf
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The quality of this card is really metadependant, but on first glance it seems pretty decent!
Yours truly, but mine only.
A lot of people are saying that this is "worse dirty rat."
Well, no shit. Dirty Rat is broken. It's actually a bad card for the game. I hope we don't see something like it ever again.
A lot of people are also saying that this is "worse deathlord."
That's true against Aggro. But you don't play this because of aggro. So stop.
It's actually better against control because it's "consistent. "
This is a Gnomeferatu/Deathlord hybrid.
To a certain extent, in the appropriate match up, you just windmill this and pray.
But it's neutral, and that's better than nothing.
Eh... it's not bad, I guess, but really depends on the meta how useful this will be in the end. I think Dirty Rat and Deathlord were better overall, but you take what you get. Better this than nothing at all. And against aggro decks, it's pretty big.
Deathlord is back!
Awesome. Dirty rat and Death Knight. But mech, combo destroyer, but good on its own. You can magnetize Zulliax on it, for example.
You're right, and as a Mech, Dr. Boom Mad Genius can discover it. Sickkkkkk.
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This will be meta imo. Brings back control. Not sure who will use it but a Mech within Mech Warrior cant be wrong.
Well, we don't want combo dead. Dirty rat could be saved, and cards like mechathun require you to only be holding combo pieces, meaning a new one would always hit an essential minion. This is needed tech, but doesn't lead to an auto win vs. Combo.