I personally don't have a problem with him. His versatility is quite well balanced against his stats. He's a silence magnet if there's no other way to remove him in my games. He can be a smothering presence if his baseline stats get boosted (Buff paladin, Rush Warrior) or if you can't interact with him (Rogue bounce shenanigans) otherwise I think he's a well designed card.
Plus he IS Dr Boom's personal bodyguard...so he need to be top draw in some respect!
I'm not gonna say I dislike this card, from a design perspective it makes sense to have a minion like this in the game. The boomsday Project had to have some essence of power come out of it. Out of the set this really is the only card that strikes me with some trouble though. The auto-include aspect of cards is usually where I go to when deciding why I think a card is out of balance, and I think I finally settled on this card being ever so slightly too much. Auto-include in control, auto-include in combo, any deck that utilizes Corpsetaker needs this card, and plenty of off-meta mech decks happily utilize it (though if it had a home at any mana or stat or description this would clearly be the place). I want to know what you all think. Is a 5 mana 3/2 rush, lifesteal, divine shield, taunt, magnetic too much? Is it one keyword too big? Two? Is it too cost effective for what it offers? Let me know what you think and keep these cards in mind when you compare its stats and effects:
I'm sure someone has mentioned this, but just in case:
If you're going to base nerfs on projected new cards in yet-to-be-released sets, you have to give equal weight to the certain rotations of other sets. That's a long way of saying that Corpsetaker is no longer in standard, and that fact clearly lowers the meta-wide power of Zilliax.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
Zilliax is probably one of the best and balanced minions released ever. It is auto-include in many decks, cause it fits in many archetypes, thats what makes it great. Its not like Rag, where you auto-include it, but only for one purpose. Zilliax is cool cause it lets you include it for different reasons.
Zilliax is probably one of the best and balanced minions released ever. It is auto-include in many decks, cause it fits in many archetypes, thats what makes it great. Its not like Rag, where you auto-include it, but only for one purpose. Zilliax is cool cause it lets you include it for different reasons.
Hyperbole. The first sentence is just logically not true. And a key that opens many locks is a good key so by that token you are saying it is very powerful, but doesnt exist for one purpose? The purpose is stall, it exists for stall and stall alone. Whether that stall is small or big is up to how the opponent can answer but its even more similar to rag versus other cards in the sense of it really does accomplish only one thing albeit a little worse. I'm making a point that the card is on a watchlist for me. It already gets played a lot and likely will get played more. I just want to bring it attention now before the absolute hailstorm of threads and comments beg for its nerf when its the top played 5 drop after rotation.
In my opinion the card seems to be fine. It is a balanced card which is not over-centralizing to the meta, it is not a "I win when I play this" card, and it is a legendary so you can only run one copy of it in a deck. Zilliax does not even appear in every single deck.
The only issue that I see players having a problem with this card is that it is used a lot. Good cards are always going to get played a lot. But if we are going to start 'taking a look' at cards that are not broken but are just played a lot and they end up getting nerfed to an unplayable state or hall of famed, than maybe players should not complain about getting weak expansions full of garbage cards because any good cards are going to get nerfed even if they are balanced.
I am all for balance changes in hearthstone but we must not overdo it, because too many balance changes can be just as unhealthy to a game as no balance changes. We must not get to the point where players are calling for balance changes to a card just because we lost to it in a match. We don't want to be reduced to just playing with mediocre or meme cards. But this is just my opinion, I am certainly not an expert.
"Zilliax does not even appear in every single deck."
He appears in a vast majority of them.
And most of the decks that DON'T ruin Zilliax either collapse or die on rotation.
So we're very much in a cause for concern here.
And you constantly ignore what myself and others are saying, and I'm going to start increasing the text size on my posts because I'm getting tired of people not reading what I type. NERFING ZILLIAX IS NOT THE ONLY SOLUTION TO HIS OVEREXPOSURE IN THE METAGAME. IT'S LITERALLY NOT EVEN THE SOLUTION I WANT. FIVE DROPS MORE SUITABLE FOR FASTER MIDRANGE DECKS CAN BE PRINTED SO THEY ARE RUN INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, SO HE DOESN'T FEEL LIKE AN AUTO-INCLUDE IN 90% OF DECKS ANYMORE, THOSE DECKS WILL RUN THE NEW BETTER STATTED BETTER EFFECT FIVE DROP INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, BRINGING HIS USAGE DOWN DRASTICALLY.
Do I need to go up to text size 20 before this finally sinks in?
"Zilliax does not even appear in every single deck."
He appears in a vast majority of them.
And most of the decks that DON'T ruin Zilliax either collapse or die on rotation.
So we're very much in a cause for concern here.
And you constantly ignore what myself and others are saying, and I'm going to start increasing the text size on my posts because I'm getting tired of people not reading what I type. NERFING ZILLIAX IS NOT THE ONLY SOLUTION TO HIS OVEREXPOSURE IN THE METAGAME. IT'S LITERALLY NOT EVEN THE SOLUTION I WANT. FIVE DROPS MORE SUITABLE FOR FASTER MIDRANGE DECKS CAN BE PRINTED SO THEY ARE RUN INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, SO HE DOESN'T FEEL LIKE AN AUTO-INCLUDE IN 90% OF DECKS ANYMORE, THOSE DECKS WILL RUN THE NEW BETTER STATTED BETTER EFFECT FIVE DROP INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, BRINGING HIS USAGE DOWN DRASTICALLY.
Do I need to go up to text size 20 before this finally sinks in?
Honestly I really agree. Although he is ever so slightly off, I think there is just a limit to a good answer as to where it can change to not be a 5 mana flex pick. So yes I am all about printing cards that help shape and define the meta that are equally good options for different styles of decks that allow for more variability. Just hearing his entrance emote makes me shutter at this point because I hear it SO MUCH EVERYDAY AND I DON'T EVEN PLAY IT 95% OF THE TIME I HEAR IT.
Correction: I said before it will be the most played 5 drop, however it is now and has been for a while the most played CARD in the game period. It also is up in "played" statistics as high as cards such as Tar Creeper and Fire Fly. Currently Zilliax is in 32.7% of ALL decks in the game. Not just the ones it is applicable to- ALL. 1 in 3 chance to run into it in standard.
"Zilliax does not even appear in every single deck."
He appears in a vast majority of them.
And most of the decks that DON'T ruin Zilliax either collapse or die on rotation.
So we're very much in a cause for concern here.
And you constantly ignore what myself and others are saying, and I'm going to start increasing the text size on my posts because I'm getting tired of people not reading what I type. NERFING ZILLIAX IS NOT THE ONLY SOLUTION TO HIS OVEREXPOSURE IN THE METAGAME. IT'S LITERALLY NOT EVEN THE SOLUTION I WANT. FIVE DROPS MORE SUITABLE FOR FASTER MIDRANGE DECKS CAN BE PRINTED SO THEY ARE RUN INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, SO HE DOESN'T FEEL LIKE AN AUTO-INCLUDE IN 90% OF DECKS ANYMORE, THOSE DECKS WILL RUN THE NEW BETTER STATTED BETTER EFFECT FIVE DROP INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, BRINGING HIS USAGE DOWN DRASTICALLY.
Do I need to go up to text size 20 before this finally sinks in?
Didn't even read your original message in the first place, I was only responding to the OP's original message so you can drop the font size. Yes printing better five drops would be great for the game, but what if these five drops end up becoming just as popular as zilliax? Than you have the exact same problem again.
I think we need more game modes because only having standard and wild gets incredibly boring. I am generally surprised that an option of having more formats in hearthstone has not been explored such as making actual game modes out of some of the more popular tavern brawls that we have had and actually having single player content similar to the dungeon runs that actually give you rewards. I feel that a reason why people complain about the meta or cards is because hearthstone in general gets boring. The game gets very old very fast because of a lack of variety and you end up playing against the same old decks and the same old cards over and over again whether you are playing standard or wild.
And if some newer decks arises from the new expansion, sooner or later you will start to get sick of seeing them over and over again. So why not have more game modes available to keep players interested? We have seen other tcgs have multiple formats and single player content that actually rewards players, so why can't Hearthstone?
Question. As popular as he already is, does Zilliax become “the best of the rest” once rotation happens? No one knows what coming, but out of what’s left, he seems to be the one card everyone fancies.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Grammar is the difference between knowing your crap, and knowing you’re crap.
"Yes printing better five drops would be great for the game, but what if these five drops end up becoming just as popular as zilliax?"
You're telling me if we print multiple strong cards at Zilliax's mana cost then those cards will also be in 33% of all decks ever built alongside him, who will still be in a third of all decks in the meta.
I really hope you realize what an insane proposition that is. The more strong competition there is for cards at a certain mana cost, the less often those cards actually get run. That's just how it works. Basic supply and demand principles.
"We have seen other tcgs have multiple formats and single player content that actually rewards players, so why can't Hearthstone?"
Then I'm going to point out the obvious elephant in the room- What actually ARE these great new formats that are going to diversify Hearthstone for the better? What sets will be allowed, what minions or spells will be allowed, etc etc. If you're going to propose an idea I feel like you need to elaborate a lot more than "hey new formats would be cool." Okay. New formats, like what?
"Question. As popular as he already is, does Zilliax become “the best of the rest” once rotation happens? No one knows what coming, but out of what’s left, he seems to be the one card everyone fancies."
That's a big reason why this thread has come up. That 33% in all decks number is only going to go up after rotation. Zilliax really isn't a broken card by any means, it's just that he's EVERYWHERE, bordering on an auto-include card that goes into nearly every deck, and it's only going to get worse after rotation.
I personally don't have a problem with him. His versatility is quite well balanced against his stats. He's a silence magnet if there's no other way to remove him in my games. He can be a smothering presence if his baseline stats get boosted (Buff paladin, Rush Warrior) or if you can't interact with him (Rogue bounce shenanigans) otherwise I think he's a well designed card.
Plus he IS Dr Boom's personal bodyguard...so he need to be top draw in some respect!
Golden Hero Collections thus far; -
Europe: Druid, Hunter, Paladin, Mage, Priest, Rogue, Shaman, Warlock, Warrior (9/9)
Americas: Druid, Mage, Paladin Shaman (4/9)
Everywhere else: Workin on it.. (0/9)
Are you seriously complaining about Zilliax??? This has to be a joke... Are you an aggro player or what?
Many people say we control players never stop complaining, but aggro players' complaints are usually the most ridiculous shit ever by far...
I actually wouldn't mind if they demagnetized him. But that's just one man's opinion =)
I'm sure someone has mentioned this, but just in case:
If you're going to base nerfs on projected new cards in yet-to-be-released sets, you have to give equal weight to the certain rotations of other sets. That's a long way of saying that Corpsetaker is no longer in standard, and that fact clearly lowers the meta-wide power of Zilliax.
Helpful Clarification on Forbidden Topics for Hearthstone Forums:
Enjoying Americans winning in the Olympics is forbidden because it is political. A 14 plus page discussion of state-sponsored lawsuits against a multi-national corporation based on harassment, discrimination, and wrongful death allegations is apparently not political enough to raise an issue.
Zilliax is fine. Usually a two pump chump at 2 health. Only time I ever saw him really get crazy is when I was running a Pally Mech deck.
Grammar is the difference between knowing your crap, and knowing you’re crap.
A .gif is worth a thousand words.
Zilliax is probably one of the best and balanced minions released ever. It is auto-include in many decks, cause it fits in many archetypes, thats what makes it great. Its not like Rag, where you auto-include it, but only for one purpose. Zilliax is cool cause it lets you include it for different reasons.
- Click Here To Join Us On Discord! -
Hyperbole. The first sentence is just logically not true. And a key that opens many locks is a good key so by that token you are saying it is very powerful, but doesnt exist for one purpose? The purpose is stall, it exists for stall and stall alone. Whether that stall is small or big is up to how the opponent can answer but its even more similar to rag versus other cards in the sense of it really does accomplish only one thing albeit a little worse. I'm making a point that the card is on a watchlist for me. It already gets played a lot and likely will get played more. I just want to bring it attention now before the absolute hailstorm of threads and comments beg for its nerf when its the top played 5 drop after rotation.
In my opinion the card seems to be fine. It is a balanced card which is not over-centralizing to the meta, it is not a "I win when I play this" card, and it is a legendary so you can only run one copy of it in a deck. Zilliax does not even appear in every single deck.
The only issue that I see players having a problem with this card is that it is used a lot. Good cards are always going to get played a lot. But if we are going to start 'taking a look' at cards that are not broken but are just played a lot and they end up getting nerfed to an unplayable state or hall of famed, than maybe players should not complain about getting weak expansions full of garbage cards because any good cards are going to get nerfed even if they are balanced.
I am all for balance changes in hearthstone but we must not overdo it, because too many balance changes can be just as unhealthy to a game as no balance changes. We must not get to the point where players are calling for balance changes to a card just because we lost to it in a match. We don't want to be reduced to just playing with mediocre or meme cards. But this is just my opinion, I am certainly not an expert.
balanced imo just very very versatile
"Zilliax does not even appear in every single deck."
He appears in a vast majority of them.
And most of the decks that DON'T ruin Zilliax either collapse or die on rotation.
So we're very much in a cause for concern here.
And you constantly ignore what myself and others are saying, and I'm going to start increasing the text size on my posts because I'm getting tired of people not reading what I type. NERFING ZILLIAX IS NOT THE ONLY SOLUTION TO HIS OVEREXPOSURE IN THE METAGAME. IT'S LITERALLY NOT EVEN THE SOLUTION I WANT. FIVE DROPS MORE SUITABLE FOR FASTER MIDRANGE DECKS CAN BE PRINTED SO THEY ARE RUN INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, SO HE DOESN'T FEEL LIKE AN AUTO-INCLUDE IN 90% OF DECKS ANYMORE, THOSE DECKS WILL RUN THE NEW BETTER STATTED BETTER EFFECT FIVE DROP INSTEAD OF ZILLIAX, BRINGING HIS USAGE DOWN DRASTICALLY.
Do I need to go up to text size 20 before this finally sinks in?
Honestly I really agree. Although he is ever so slightly off, I think there is just a limit to a good answer as to where it can change to not be a 5 mana flex pick. So yes I am all about printing cards that help shape and define the meta that are equally good options for different styles of decks that allow for more variability. Just hearing his entrance emote makes me shutter at this point because I hear it SO MUCH EVERYDAY AND I DON'T EVEN PLAY IT 95% OF THE TIME I HEAR IT.
Is Zilliax a Humanoid from year 2121?
Correction: I said before it will be the most played 5 drop, however it is now and has been for a while the most played CARD in the game period. It also is up in "played" statistics as high as cards such as Tar Creeper and Fire Fly. Currently Zilliax is in 32.7% of ALL decks in the game. Not just the ones it is applicable to- ALL. 1 in 3 chance to run into it in standard.
Didn't even read your original message in the first place, I was only responding to the OP's original message so you can drop the font size. Yes printing better five drops would be great for the game, but what if these five drops end up becoming just as popular as zilliax? Than you have the exact same problem again.
I think we need more game modes because only having standard and wild gets incredibly boring. I am generally surprised that an option of having more formats in hearthstone has not been explored such as making actual game modes out of some of the more popular tavern brawls that we have had and actually having single player content similar to the dungeon runs that actually give you rewards. I feel that a reason why people complain about the meta or cards is because hearthstone in general gets boring. The game gets very old very fast because of a lack of variety and you end up playing against the same old decks and the same old cards over and over again whether you are playing standard or wild.
And if some newer decks arises from the new expansion, sooner or later you will start to get sick of seeing them over and over again. So why not have more game modes available to keep players interested? We have seen other tcgs have multiple formats and single player content that actually rewards players, so why can't Hearthstone?
Question. As popular as he already is, does Zilliax become “the best of the rest” once rotation happens? No one knows what coming, but out of what’s left, he seems to be the one card everyone fancies.
Grammar is the difference between knowing your crap, and knowing you’re crap.
A .gif is worth a thousand words.
"Yes printing better five drops would be great for the game, but what if these five drops end up becoming just as popular as zilliax?"
You're telling me if we print multiple strong cards at Zilliax's mana cost then those cards will also be in 33% of all decks ever built alongside him, who will still be in a third of all decks in the meta.
I really hope you realize what an insane proposition that is. The more strong competition there is for cards at a certain mana cost, the less often those cards actually get run. That's just how it works. Basic supply and demand principles.
"We have seen other tcgs have multiple formats and single player content that actually rewards players, so why can't Hearthstone?"
Then I'm going to point out the obvious elephant in the room- What actually ARE these great new formats that are going to diversify Hearthstone for the better? What sets will be allowed, what minions or spells will be allowed, etc etc. If you're going to propose an idea I feel like you need to elaborate a lot more than "hey new formats would be cool." Okay. New formats, like what?
"Question. As popular as he already is, does Zilliax become “the best of the rest” once rotation happens? No one knows what coming, but out of what’s left, he seems to be the one card everyone fancies."
That's a big reason why this thread has come up. That 33% in all decks number is only going to go up after rotation. Zilliax really isn't a broken card by any means, it's just that he's EVERYWHERE, bordering on an auto-include card that goes into nearly every deck, and it's only going to get worse after rotation.
"In the year 5555
Your arms are hanging limp at your side
Your legs got nothing to do
Some machine's doing that for you"
Zilliax does seem like he belongs in a post-singularity world, with nano and mech-augmented humanity.