Well equality at 2 mana is really strong. But paladin's problem has always been other AOE damage. I mean, they have equality + cons or pyro. That's it... Other classes have so much more options to deal with a board. Being able to only run two boardclears is what justified that low mana cost of the effect..
This nerf came out of nowhere - Equality was never a good card by itself, but increaing its mana cost by 2 makes it unplayable.
It is still a really good card...
No, it's not. What Blizzard did this time with Equality is 100% unethical. Can't believe some people here are ok with this, says a lot about our decadent society... :(
Genn Greymane and Mr. Baku the Mooneater should have been 10 mana cards with 1/1 stats. Instead, not only they give you incredible advantage, but they also have decent stats
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
NINE Packs opened with 2 legendaries inside insofar
Harsh nerf. It's true that, at 4 mana, Equality + Wild Pyromancer combo is very strong and cheap. But Equality is a card that doesn't do anything on its own. And the combo may clear everything most of the time but divine shield minions survive to it. What if those were behind taunts and you can't reach them to remove the divine shield? If you don't have a weapon or divine shield minions of your own then you can't do anything about those. Even if small, there are drawbacks to the combo. At such a high mana cost it will be almost impossible to survive until you can clear the board and even if you do survive and clear it, that's it. That's your whole turn. You will probably be in very bad shape. Then your opponent just finishes you off with a Leeroy Jenkins. Unless new board clears or cheaper cards with combo potential with Equality are released then Control Paladin will not work as well anymore. A huge unfair blow to those that just used their hard earned dust to craft those decks.
Harsh nerf. It's true that, at 4 mana, Equality + Wild Pyromancer combo is very strong and cheap. But Equality is a card that doesn't do anything on its own. And the combo may clear everything most of the time but divine shield minions survive to it. What if those were behind taunts and you can't reach them to remove the divine shield? If you don't have a weapon or divine shield minions of your own then you can't do anything about those. Even if small, there are drawbacks to the combo. At such a high mana cost it will be almost impossible to survive until you can clear the board and even if you do survive and clear it, that's it. That's your whole turn. You will probably be in very bad shape. Then your opponent just finishes you off with a Leeroy Jenkins. Unless new board clears or cheaper cards with combo potential with Equality are released then Control Paladin will not work as well anymore. A huge unfair blow to those that just used their hard earned dust to craft those decks.
Divine shield is a factor for any damage based board clear.
But Equality is a card that doesn't do anything on its own.
What? On it's own, equality deals X damage to all minions. This is among the most powerful effects in the game. Now, it finally costs what it should have always cost.
Equality doesn't say "this card can only be used with pyromancer." If you were only ever saving EQ to play with Pyro, you were using the card incorrectly.
This nerf came out of nowhere - Equality was never a good card by itself, but increaing its mana cost by 2 makes it unplayable.
It is still a really good card...
No, it's not. What Blizzard did this time with Equality is 100% unethical. Can't believe some people here are ok with this, says a lot about our decadent society... :(
Yes it is. "Change the health of all minions to 1" is a really powerful effect... REALLY powerful, and it has always been overtuned as hell at 2 mana. Furthermore you don't have to sit and wait to draw into Pyromancer or Consecration for the card to be worth anything. The class can crap out 1/1s for free that can challenge almost anything on the board thanks to this card, but people only think of it as a combo enabler and that is short sighted.
Equality can answer wide boards AND tall boards, and having to worry about putting 3 minions on the board, or playing a couple of buff spells as early as turn 4 is naff. An aggro or midrange deck can almost never push enough damage fast enough if they play around a 2 mana equality and can stand to straight up lose on the spot if they don't play around it.
This is just blatantly false. Even with two ice blocks and a 0 mana super siphon soul that can be bounced paladin wasn't anywhere near domination. Equality was good, it wasn't anything close to oppressive or game breaking or half of what this thread makes it out to be. Now paladin is at best getting a 6 mana, 2 card, damage based board clear. For 1 more mana and 1 less card priest gets a board clear that goes around deathrattle and divine shield. Paladin is now firmly in the classic priest camp where they are essentially 100% reliant on expansions to be viable. Almost all of their classic cards have crept out of viability. Aldor is never ran, truesilver is creeping there, blessing is always fringe at best, consecrate was only good with equality, Tirion is only good when you're discovering him...
This is just blatantly false. Even with two ice blocks and a 0 mana super siphon soul that can be bounced paladin wasn't anywhere near domination. Equality was good, it wasn't anything close to oppressive or game breaking or half of what this thread makes it out to be. Now paladin is at best getting a 6 mana, 2 card, damage based board clear. For 1 more mana and 1 less card priest gets a board clear that goes around deathrattle and divine shield. Paladin is now firmly in the classic priest camp where they are essentially 100% reliant on expansions to be viable. Almost all of their classic cards have crept out of viability. Aldor is never ran, truesilver is creeping there, blessing is always fringe at best, consecrate was only good with equality, Tirion is only good when you're discovering him...
On the other hand, psychic scream rotates, does not technically destroy the minions (which might be good or bad depending), and priest didn't pick up an amazing stall card like timeout. Which, and this is a stretch, I'll admit, might have factored into this nerf.
I'm really surprised people have an issue with this one. It's completely fine. I think it's just a psychological thing because it went up two mana when people are used to seeing things go up by one. Just a little sticker shock and everyone goes crazy.
I tried to touch on this a few places, but Odd Paladin and Equality not being three are unrelated. Classic and Basic cards that are so powerful they are in every archetype in every expansion is something that is very harmful to the goal of expansion metas feeling fresh and new. Equality at (3) mana in our playtesting didn't really solve this. The change to (4) was actually very jarring to us, but we wanted to try playtesting it in current and future environments anyway. After all those games, we felt like it was a reasonable option at (4) in control archetypes (now in in the future) but less reasonable in aggressive decks. That ideally where we'd like most cards to be, so (4) ended up being where we landed. If we thought (3) removed it from being in all paladin archetypes for the foreseeable future but Odd Paladin would get better in the short term, we would have just done that.
Which I think is a lazy cop out answer and complete bullshit. If "classic/basic cards that are so powerful they are in every archetype in every expansion" is a reason to nerf cards, does that then mean they don't want those cards to be part of a class's core identity?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
You most likely know this already but it doesn't deal damage. It places an enchantment on the minions that sets their health to one. If the minion is silenced then it's health is restored to its original state. Let's say you are playing against an Even Warlock. They place a giant on turn 4 and it is behind the 2/4 taunt. Currently, you can use Equality + Pyro to get rid of such a big threat. With the mana increase you can set them to one health so you can kill them easily on the next turn. Them the warlock uses Spellbreaker on the giant and now it's an 8/8 again.
This is obviously a hypothetical situation that won't happen most of the time and using Equality + Pyro on just two minions is highly inefficient. But what i'm saying is that just throwing out the spell isn't guaranteed to yield you any results. The Consecration and Wild Pyromancer (and maybe Avenging Wrath) combos are the best ways to capitalize immediately on the spell. But now its insanely slow. You won't have enough time to deal with early pressure anymore. As i said, Pyromancer is too cheap but Paladin's don't have any other fast ways of dealing with early aggression right now. With it costing 6 mana and a whole turn (without the guarantee that everything will die because of divine shields), you will most likely be dead before you can do anything.
I'm really surprised people have an issue with this one. It's completely fine. I think it's just a psychological thing because it went up two mana when people are used to seeing things go up by one. Just a little sticker shock and everyone goes crazy.
It’s not completely fine, it seriously weakens every future Control Paladin.
If Paladin would have ever gotten an aoe like Malestorm Portal or something, i could get behind a nerf . But due to the fact that Paladin never had good early game ( besides minibot and muster, or general aggro versions, but hey Divine Favour and Baku are no problem) they always fell behind, even a couple days ago I heard Theo saying something like; We keep Equality vs Hunter in case Hyena gets out of control. Well now Paladin has to wait two more turns I guess.... but I guess that’s completely fine.
I am sure Equality is done as a card for midrange Paladin decks (like Even Paladin was). I am not even sure it will be used in heavy control decks, although Paladin lacks alternatives for board clears. One single mana can already decrease the viability of a card and two mana surely does. And for a clear, equality is still a two card combo and affects your own board as well.
A pity that they could not make it 3 mana because of Odd Paladin (edit: Aparently that wasn't in their thought process, but I am convinced at 3 mana it would've been added to Odd lists). But at 4 mana I think it will be too expensive to be used. Equality consecrate is 8 mana and two cards... And only equality leaves the pressure on the board if you cannot trade with minions (which is the case if you are behind). So it is not a good catchup mechanism any more.
Edit2: I am fine with the change, not because i think the card will still be good or even decent, but simply because changing cards changes the meta (even if only a little bit). Ancient of Lore was the only change I found sad, but generally I got used to the fact that the nerfs mostly remove the respective cards from the metagame. People will adapt and the game can still be played. Likely with less OTK Paladins...
Very good change. You barely even need a full clear on turn 4. Still a valuable card for every control and midrange decks. It just cant be on same mana as Hunters Mark but having an AOE effect.
Well equality at 2 mana is really strong. But paladin's problem has always been other AOE damage. I mean, they have equality + cons or pyro. That's it... Other classes have so much more options to deal with a board. Being able to only run two boardclears is what justified that low mana cost of the effect..
This nerf came out of nowhere - Equality was never a good card by itself, but increaing its mana cost by 2 makes it unplayable.
It is still a really good card...
No, it's not. What Blizzard did this time with Equality is 100% unethical. Can't believe some people here are ok with this, says a lot about our decadent society... :(
Genn Greymane and Mr. Baku the Mooneater should have been 10 mana cards with 1/1 stats. Instead, not only they give you incredible advantage, but they also have decent stats
NINE Packs opened with 2 legendaries inside insofar
Harsh nerf. It's true that, at 4 mana, Equality + Wild Pyromancer combo is very strong and cheap. But Equality is a card that doesn't do anything on its own. And the combo may clear everything most of the time but divine shield minions survive to it. What if those were behind taunts and you can't reach them to remove the divine shield? If you don't have a weapon or divine shield minions of your own then you can't do anything about those. Even if small, there are drawbacks to the combo. At such a high mana cost it will be almost impossible to survive until you can clear the board and even if you do survive and clear it, that's it. That's your whole turn. You will probably be in very bad shape. Then your opponent just finishes you off with a Leeroy Jenkins. Unless new board clears or cheaper cards with combo potential with Equality are released then Control Paladin will not work as well anymore. A huge unfair blow to those that just used their hard earned dust to craft those decks.
I was planning to spend 5k dust on an otk pally deck. Good thing I waited. Blizzard cashes in with another meta change.
Ready for action
Divine shield is a factor for any damage based board clear.
What? On it's own, equality deals X damage to all minions. This is among the most powerful effects in the game. Now, it finally costs what it should have always cost.
Equality doesn't say "this card can only be used with pyromancer." If you were only ever saving EQ to play with Pyro, you were using the card incorrectly.
They should just HoF the card instead. Make another card with some sort of board clearing effect. This is an insane nerf.
Yes it is. "Change the health of all minions to 1" is a really powerful effect... REALLY powerful, and it has always been overtuned as hell at 2 mana. Furthermore you don't have to sit and wait to draw into Pyromancer or Consecration for the card to be worth anything. The class can crap out 1/1s for free that can challenge almost anything on the board thanks to this card, but people only think of it as a combo enabler and that is short sighted.
Equality can answer wide boards AND tall boards, and having to worry about putting 3 minions on the board, or playing a couple of buff spells as early as turn 4 is naff. An aggro or midrange deck can almost never push enough damage fast enough if they play around a 2 mana equality and can stand to straight up lose on the spot if they don't play around it.
This is just blatantly false. Even with two ice blocks and a 0 mana super siphon soul that can be bounced paladin wasn't anywhere near domination. Equality was good, it wasn't anything close to oppressive or game breaking or half of what this thread makes it out to be. Now paladin is at best getting a 6 mana, 2 card, damage based board clear. For 1 more mana and 1 less card priest gets a board clear that goes around deathrattle and divine shield. Paladin is now firmly in the classic priest camp where they are essentially 100% reliant on expansions to be viable. Almost all of their classic cards have crept out of viability. Aldor is never ran, truesilver is creeping there, blessing is always fringe at best, consecrate was only good with equality, Tirion is only good when you're discovering him...
On the other hand, psychic scream rotates, does not technically destroy the minions (which might be good or bad depending), and priest didn't pick up an amazing stall card like timeout. Which, and this is a stretch, I'll admit, might have factored into this nerf.
I'm really surprised people have an issue with this one. It's completely fine. I think it's just a psychological thing because it went up two mana when people are used to seeing things go up by one. Just a little sticker shock and everyone goes crazy.
Apparently this had nothing to do with Baku.
Which I think is a lazy cop out answer and complete bullshit. If "classic/basic cards that are so powerful they are in every archetype in every expansion" is a reason to nerf cards, does that then mean they don't want those cards to be part of a class's core identity?
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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You most likely know this already but it doesn't deal damage. It places an enchantment on the minions that sets their health to one. If the minion is silenced then it's health is restored to its original state. Let's say you are playing against an Even Warlock. They place a giant on turn 4 and it is behind the 2/4 taunt. Currently, you can use Equality + Pyro to get rid of such a big threat. With the mana increase you can set them to one health so you can kill them easily on the next turn. Them the warlock uses Spellbreaker on the giant and now it's an 8/8 again.
This is obviously a hypothetical situation that won't happen most of the time and using Equality + Pyro on just two minions is highly inefficient. But what i'm saying is that just throwing out the spell isn't guaranteed to yield you any results. The Consecration and Wild Pyromancer (and maybe Avenging Wrath) combos are the best ways to capitalize immediately on the spell. But now its insanely slow. You won't have enough time to deal with early pressure anymore. As i said, Pyromancer is too cheap but Paladin's don't have any other fast ways of dealing with early aggression right now. With it costing 6 mana and a whole turn (without the guarantee that everything will die because of divine shields), you will most likely be dead before you can do anything.
It’s not completely fine, it seriously weakens every future Control Paladin.
If Paladin would have ever gotten an aoe like Malestorm Portal or something, i could get behind a nerf . But due to the fact that Paladin never had good early game ( besides minibot and muster, or general aggro versions, but hey Divine Favour and Baku are no problem) they always fell behind, even a couple days ago I heard Theo saying something like; We keep Equality vs Hunter in case Hyena gets out of control. Well now Paladin has to wait two more turns I guess.... but I guess that’s completely fine.
I am sure Equality is done as a card for midrange Paladin decks (like Even Paladin was). I am not even sure it will be used in heavy control decks, although Paladin lacks alternatives for board clears. One single mana can already decrease the viability of a card and two mana surely does. And for a clear, equality is still a two card combo and affects your own board as well.
A pity that they could not make it 3 mana because of Odd Paladin (edit: Aparently that wasn't in their thought process, but I am convinced at 3 mana it would've been added to Odd lists). But at 4 mana I think it will be too expensive to be used. Equality consecrate is 8 mana and two cards... And only equality leaves the pressure on the board if you cannot trade with minions (which is the case if you are behind). So it is not a good catchup mechanism any more.
Edit2: I am fine with the change, not because i think the card will still be good or even decent, but simply because changing cards changes the meta (even if only a little bit). Ancient of Lore was the only change I found sad, but generally I got used to the fact that the nerfs mostly remove the respective cards from the metagame. People will adapt and the game can still be played. Likely with less OTK Paladins...
Very good change. You barely even need a full clear on turn 4. Still a valuable card for every control and midrange decks. It just cant be on same mana as Hunters Mark but having an AOE effect.
Hunter mark 2 mana for 1 minion this one 4 mana for all minions make sense though.
Paladin can stall still turn 6 in most case so I dont really see the problem. Turn 6 you more likely draw your pyro than turn 4 anyway