IMHO the coin should not be counted as a Spell so it can't counter Counter Spell or count for Yogg or Arcane Giant..etc, the Coin was meant to give a small balance to the player that started last.
EDIT : just convert it to a mana crystal, problem solved.
Another possible fix is " the next card you play cost 1 mana less"
Theorycally, The Coin should be a mana cryatal that you can use once a match. This is because your opponent goes first and he has an advantage on the board (1 minion more than you). It should n trigger effect of counterspell or gadgetzan auctioneer or action master beardo or yogg. It should just be a mana crystal
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"The flow of time is always cruel... its speed seems different for each person, but no one can change it... A thing that does not change with time is a memory of younger days..."
Hearthstone needs a serious Quality of Life update. I hope a sort of "Hearthstone 2.0" update will come and sort the core sets as a whole, make the Coin as a separate clickable object (like in ESL), make discard targetable etc...
But as everyone knows, Hearthstone is a small, indie game and these will not come because they don't make any money.
the Coin was meant to give a small advantage to the player that started last
It's meant to try to offset the natural advantage that going first already has and get it as close to even as we can get it to.
Even with all of the things it can do, it's still better to go first in nearly every matchup, in many cases by a hefty amount. In the few cases where it isn't it's very close.
If we ever get to a case where going second ends up with a radically higher win rate over going first we can look at the coin. So far that hasn't happened.
the Coin was meant to give a small advantage to the player that started last
It's meant to try to offset the natural advantage that going first already has and get it as close to even as we can get it to.
Even with all of the things it can do, it's still better to go first in nearly every matchup, in many cases by a hefty amount. In the few cases where it isn't it's very close.
If we ever get to a case where going second ends up with a radically higher win rate over going first we can look at the coin. So far that hasn't happened.
I mean it gives an advantage to second player. And playing it into Counterspell is actually discarding tempo advantage when you are already behind on tempo. So advantage is not even big enough to drive win percentage by 1%... if anything coin should be a bit more powerful not less powerful.
Of all the pretty gripes and moans on this site, this really ranks as one of them. Coin is a spell giving you an extra mana, with all the pros and cons that this entails - live with it, work with it, make it work for you, and you'll have made your own Quality of Life update.
I agree with OP, not for the reasons of counterspell, but for activators like Flamewaker and Mana Wyrm it's not fair when one person gets the activator when the other doesn't.
It probably doesn't matter in constructed as much, but it feels real bad in arena when your opponent gets a free trigger off of Gadgetzan Auctioneer or something.
This devolved pretty quickly. I must say, I've always kinda thought the coin shouldn't be a spell, and I play lots of miracle rogue. I'm always so happy when I go second as miracle rogue for that reason (obviously it's a combo activator too, but if it were just an unnamed card, it would still suffice as that).
Anyways, OP, I kinda agree with you, but at the same time, it's probably fine as it is (as shown by general win rates of starting with and without the coin).
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Twitch name: Anatak15 NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
Theorycally, The Coin should be a mana cryatal that you can use once a match. This is because your opponent goes first and he has an advantage on the board (1 minion more than you). It should n trigger effect of counterspell or gadgetzan auctioneer or action master beardo or yogg. It should just be a mana crystal
Exactly, just give you ONE MANA CRYSTAL and that's all.
Couldn't you have just necro'd one of the countless threads already saying the same exact hogwash? I guess it gives people a new chance to bash the idea and bash its supporters as mage players. It's a spell, deal.
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Blizzard has commented on the coin a few times. Basically no matter what your personal experience is with it the numbers shake out to about 50/50 win rate with the coin with a small advantage to those going first.
I agree, I always thought it was really annoying that for instance, playing as rogue is a big 50 50. If you start with the coin, you have a huuuge advantage against another rogue that didn't, because of combo cards. The outcome of games shouldn't be determined by a coin flip at the start of the game.
Then what should it be counted as, minion? Hero card? Weapon?? Also the point of secrets is countering them by thinking about which secret is up, if a secret has no good counter it should be hall of famed (AHEM ICE BLOCK AHEM)
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IMHO the coin should not be counted as a Spell so it can't counter Counter Spell or count for Yogg or Arcane Giant..etc, the Coin was meant to give a small balance to the player that started last.
EDIT : just convert it to a mana crystal, problem solved.
Another possible fix is " the next card you play cost 1 mana less"
Let me guess. You play Mage?
What good reasons do you have for The Coin not counting as a spell? I can think of some. "So it can't trigger Counterspell" isn't one of them.
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Counterfeit Coin is not a spell too. As well as Heroic Strike and Mortal Strike. Cabalist's Tome is a book. Etc. etc. etc.
All cards are balanced, but some cards are more balanced than others.
Yeah, totally agree. the coin should be a minion a deathknight or a weapon.
Theorycally, The Coin should be a mana cryatal that you can use once a match. This is because your opponent goes first and he has an advantage on the board (1 minion more than you). It should n trigger effect of counterspell or gadgetzan auctioneer or action master beardo or yogg. It should just be a mana crystal
"The flow of time is always cruel... its speed seems different for each person, but no one can change it... A thing that does not change with time is a memory of younger days..."
Hearthstone needs a serious Quality of Life update. I hope a sort of "Hearthstone 2.0" update will come and sort the core sets as a whole, make the Coin as a separate clickable object (like in ESL), make discard targetable etc...
But as everyone knows, Hearthstone is a small, indie game and these will not come because they don't make any money.
So we have another thread trying to derail the coin or what? The coin is fair...
It's meant to try to offset the natural advantage that going first already has and get it as close to even as we can get it to.
Even with all of the things it can do, it's still better to go first in nearly every matchup, in many cases by a hefty amount. In the few cases where it isn't it's very close.
If we ever get to a case where going second ends up with a radically higher win rate over going first we can look at the coin. So far that hasn't happened.
So no, nothing needs to be done about the coin.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
I mean it gives an advantage to second player. And playing it into Counterspell is actually discarding tempo advantage when you are already behind on tempo. So advantage is not even big enough to drive win percentage by 1%... if anything coin should be a bit more powerful not less powerful.
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Of all the pretty gripes and moans on this site, this really ranks as one of them. Coin is a spell giving you an extra mana, with all the pros and cons that this entails - live with it, work with it, make it work for you, and you'll have made your own Quality of Life update.
I agree with OP, not for the reasons of counterspell, but for activators like Flamewaker and Mana Wyrm it's not fair when one person gets the activator when the other doesn't.
It probably doesn't matter in constructed as much, but it feels real bad in arena when your opponent gets a free trigger off of Gadgetzan Auctioneer or something.
This devolved pretty quickly. I must say, I've always kinda thought the coin shouldn't be a spell, and I play lots of miracle rogue. I'm always so happy when I go second as miracle rogue for that reason (obviously it's a combo activator too, but if it were just an unnamed card, it would still suffice as that).
Anyways, OP, I kinda agree with you, but at the same time, it's probably fine as it is (as shown by general win rates of starting with and without the coin).
Twitch name: Anatak15
NA Legend Season 48, 49, 52, 53, 54, 74
Couldn't you have just necro'd one of the countless threads already saying the same exact hogwash? I guess it gives people a new chance to bash the idea and bash its supporters as mage players. It's a spell, deal.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Tell me a reason that isn't "waah it triggers my counterspell"
Blizzard has commented on the coin a few times. Basically no matter what your personal experience is with it the numbers shake out to about 50/50 win rate with the coin with a small advantage to those going first.
I agree, I always thought it was really annoying that for instance, playing as rogue is a big 50 50. If you start with the coin, you have a huuuge advantage against another rogue that didn't, because of combo cards. The outcome of games shouldn't be determined by a coin flip at the start of the game.
Then what should it be counted as, minion? Hero card? Weapon?? Also the point of secrets is countering them by thinking about which secret is up, if a secret has no good counter it should be hall of famed (AHEM ICE BLOCK AHEM)
Don't mind me just passing by