One more question - of course, everything depends on the board state, but do you really think, that we won't play around this secret, that we will mindlessly attack a Vilespine Slayer instead of, I don't know, the 2 mana flower, Patches or other garbage minions... The same way we tried to play around Getaway Kodo and to prevent the pala from getting another Tirion or Tarim (by pinging a 1/1 dude), the same way we will find a way to minimize the value out of the rogue's minions. So, people, don't look only at the circumstances, where the card will perform godlike, consider the other scenarios too. They won't be that rare, I can assure you that.
Giving trash minions to your Rogue opponent is another way to defuse the value they might otherwise get from the secret. Minions like Leeroy Jenkins or Cornered Sentry give 1/1's for you to kill, or use spells like Devolve, Hex, or Polymorph to transform a good minion before killing it. I still find the card interesting, but the more classes playing secrets the more likely Eater of Secrets sees play.
So..I guess rouge won't have it's own class identity but copy other classes identity? Huh...kinda makes sense now that I look at it that way.
Secrets for rouge kinda feels like lazy design choice if you ask me though. Why give Rouge actual secrets when they can be burgled from other classes? Lol.
Jokes aside, I'm almost certain that Shadowstep is better than this in almost every situation I can think of. Same goes comparing Betrayal and the other secret that got revealed. Rouge is only getting 3 secrets so you got a pretty good idea what secret it's gonna be especially if the final secret to be revealed is worth anything.
Kinda disappointed with what Rouge got so far..Miracle and Tempo for life? I hope not..
The main problem with this secret, as with all secrets, is that you have to put it in your deck. And then draw it. And then play it. This is why Mad Scientist and the 2/2 Paladin Murloc are so good.
At worst, this is a Getaway Kodo that gives you a combo activator. Better with Deathrattle or Jade Rogue than the Tempo archetypes. I think it's cool that you can't play it with Keleseth. It's just a shame that you have to put this card in your deck to use it.
Hex nerf made it far less appealing and Poly rarely sees play. Devolve or Eater seem like more likely issues. Regardless, a few fringe counters never stopped people from playing good cards before. I think the bigger counters to this will be opponents playing around the card. That's why I'm more interested in using this in must-remove situations like Emperor Thaurissan for OTK decks or even hilarious things like Barnes --> Ancient One combo.
Anyone says that card is bad is bad there are huge amounts of application for this card in rogue. Vilespine, SI7, Edwin, Valeera late game theres alot of interesting things you can do with this its like a better getaway kodo in a deck that already wants to run shadowstep but the loss of the minion hurts this lets you allow the trade to happen get the fetch and keep going. I think this card is prolly one of the best cards rogue has gotten in a long time. Do they kill it and trigger the secret or leave it and let you shadow step it.
Edit: Removed kelseth from listing here as remembered the cost down side however there are alot of practical applications for this in decks like miracle to make it strong even the arcane giant applications or reuse of swash bucklers for additional cards there are alot of practical applications to this.
miracle only play meaningful minions that want to normally be shadowstepped you play your big edwin peeping this, and then you can replay edwin when it's killed, or even si, or aucaneer or vileapine..
of course this dies not go into a tempoish deck like keleseth rogue(specially since this cost 2)
Whattahell is this? Pala secret is rare and does half of this one.. it only return minion to hand.. this also reduce his cost and it is only common? blizz plz.
Whattahell is this? Pala secret is rare and does half of this one.. it only return minion to hand.. this also reduce his cost and it is only common? blizz plz.
The paladin secret and be run with kelsath and is turn 1 able to play into your turn 2 minion also there are other perks to the sync with getaway kodo. I think this more plays around the fact of rogues combo sequence than anything which is why its good cause its encoraging them to not kill your minion because you want to shadow step it. Allowing you to get multiple uses out of minions like vilespine edwin and arcane giants its a miracle rogue card.
Last secret will determine will this card see any play. Also it doesn't instantly slot into any deck(only quest rogue perhaps but that deck is already too slow).
crap card. will do nothing against aggro/tempo and is not needed against slower decks.
SI7 and vile spine alone make it playable as they are often killed quickly after being played this basically nets you back your SI7 to keep tempo on your side. In miracle you could drop an arcane giant early if they pop it you get your giant back to use with valeera, it makes edwin double usable vs priest and other decks that will often remove him quickly if hes dropped early meaning you get a second use. Elise is another tool this can be used for generating a second Elise after shes killed and getting a second ungoro pack. Swashbuckler, Shadowcaster, Bonemare. There are lots of ways to get value out of this card commonly tun in rogue. Even questing adventurer draw out the removal replay the adventurer for 1 mana and get more spell chain going.
Depends if they let his death rattle keep him in play there are other cards i feel there is more value for it even so Xaril will get huge value out of this 2 battle crys 2 death rattles turns xaril into 4 spells. This is a really really strong potential card for miracle.
crap card. will do nothing against aggro/tempo and is not needed against slower decks.
SI7 and vile spine alone make it playable as they are often killed quickly after being played this basically nets you back your SI7 to keep tempo on your side. In miracle you could drop an arcane giant early if they pop it you get your giant back to use with valeera, it makes edwin double usable vs priest and other decks that will often remove him quickly if hes dropped early meaning you get a second use. Elise is another tool this can be used for generating a second Elise after shes killed and getting a second ungoro pack. Swashbuckler, Shadowcaster, Bonemare. There are lots of ways to get value out of this card commonly tun in rogue. Even questing adventurer draw out the removal replay the adventurer for 1 mana and get more spell chain going.
rogue does not Need a value tool. the last 3 years had always been the same.
1. cycle + survive
2. get your Combo and win
2014: cycle with auctioneer, get leeroy/shadowstep, burst him down
2015: cycle with sprint/auctioneer, kill Opponent with bladflury/oil Combo or malygos/thaurissan combo
2016: crappy Version of 2014
2017: well there is reason why miracle sees no play in tournaments this year.
íts not about value. rogue does not Need any value, they just a win condition. if your win condition is add another giant/questing/Edwin to your hand and you hope your Opponent cant deal with them next turn,well good luck playing rogue.
all that rogue Needs is a "non interactive" win condition thats how the class set is build around. and that Card certainly does not give this to them
So..I guess rouge won't have it's own class identity but copy other classes identity? Huh...kinda makes sense now that I look at it that way.
Secrets for rouge kinda feels like lazy design choice if you ask me though. Why give Rouge actual secrets when they can be burgled from other classes? Lol.
Jokes aside, I'm almost certain that Shadowstep is better than this in almost every situation I can think of. Same goes comparing Betrayal and the other secret that got revealed. Rouge is only getting 3 secrets so you got a pretty good idea what secret it's gonna be especially if the final secret to be revealed is worth anything.
Kinda disappointed with what Rouge got so far..Miracle and Tempo for life? I hope not..
The main problem with this secret, as with all secrets, is that you have to put it in your deck. And then draw it. And then play it. This is why Mad Scientist and the 2/2 Paladin Murloc are so good.
At worst, this is a Getaway Kodo that gives you a combo activator. Better with Deathrattle or Jade Rogue than the Tempo archetypes. I think it's cool that you can't play it with Keleseth. It's just a shame that you have to put this card in your deck to use it.
Enjoy your cheaper Vilepsines, friends. :)P
Enjoy your cheaper Vilepsines, friends. :)P
I think it will be the only playable secret, and because of it very easy to played around
Anyone says that card is bad is bad there are huge amounts of application for this card in rogue. Vilespine, SI7, Edwin, Valeera late game theres alot of interesting things you can do with this its like a better getaway kodo in a deck that already wants to run shadowstep but the loss of the minion hurts this lets you allow the trade to happen get the fetch and keep going. I think this card is prolly one of the best cards rogue has gotten in a long time. Do they kill it and trigger the secret or leave it and let you shadow step it.
Edit: Removed kelseth from listing here as remembered the cost down side however there are alot of practical applications for this in decks like miracle to make it strong even the arcane giant applications or reuse of swash bucklers for additional cards there are alot of practical applications to this.
miracle only play meaningful minions that want to normally be shadowstepped you play your big edwin peeping this, and then you can replay edwin when it's killed, or even si, or aucaneer or vileapine..
of course this dies not go into a tempoish deck like keleseth rogue(specially since this cost 2)
Whattahell is this? Pala secret is rare and does half of this one.. it only return minion to hand.. this also reduce his cost and it is only common? blizz plz.
crap card. will do nothing against aggro/tempo and is not needed against slower decks.
Last secret will determine will this card see any play. Also it doesn't instantly slot into any deck(only quest rogue perhaps but that deck is already too slow).
Can get pretty nuts with Sherazin, Corpse Flower.
Anger is the punishment we give ourselves for someone else's mistake.
Like it a lot. Now you get to play 2 Edwin Van Cleefs...
U have no clue about rogues