Legendary Tier List & Crafting Guide

#769 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
Kovachut
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Quote from V3RGO >>

I would also listen to the mod's opinion if I were you.

However, even though that I also see Zavas as a safe dust, can you wait 2 more months before DE her? It's not that she will be changed, so you could get some extra dust out of her, BUT imho since with the next expansion the post-rotation time will come, since, in order for the losses to be compensated, there will be a lot of new power-house ones, I just think, that it would be better to wait until then and see how the card pool will look like. Maybe, just maybe there will be a card, which will act as the missing link the same way Patches the Pirate made pirate warrior viable and even highly competitive; as the crucial piece, which will start the whole discard engine. Maybe warlock will finally get a card, which will make the discard mechanic a bit more controllable.

Maybe, maybe not, but we can't really foresee what the future warlock cards will look like, that's why it's more logical for me to wait. If you really need that dust, in order to craft something good, then yeah, ignore this post and just follow your intuition.

Last edited by Kovachut on Jan 22, 2018

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#770 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
ronintje
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Quote from V3RGO >>

I wouldn't bother to much about those stats.
Thats what people voted before the release of the set and somehow people love voting up terrible cards.
Not sure if its trolling or wishfull thinking, but that set definatly didn't turn out to be as good as people expected for Warlock.

The card hardly sees play and i doubt anything will change in the future.

Safe dust.

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#772 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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I got Elise the Trailblazer, any good archetipe or deck to fit her in?

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#773 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from MarianoVqz >>

I got Elise the Trailblazer, any good archetipe or deck to fit her in?

Gratz, she's one of the good ones.

Well, the first thing I can thing of are some control decks - priest (including Highlander), Mage, Warlock, people also use her in some value ones as well. Tbh she was way more popular back in Un'goro, but now people found other ways to gain value (cubelock, dead man's hand for example) or the value just wasn't needed, when you care about rushing your opponents. Against Raza priest you don't really care, if you will out-value them by having more cards in hand, they just have to find their winning combo, there a lot of aggro decks as well and yeah...

In other words - imho you can make a decent control/value deck out of her, especially in wild, but I'm sure, than in the next expansion there will be a lot more opportunities for slower control decks and thus there will be available slots for Elise.

Last edited by Kovachut on Jan 22, 2018

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#774 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
Sagitario
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Quote from Kovachut >>

Quote from MarianoVqz >>

I got Elise the Trailblazer, any good archetipe or deck to fit her in?

Gratz, she's one of the good ones.

Well, the first thing I can thing of are some control decks - priest (including Highlander), Mage, Warlock, people also use her in some value ones as well. Tbh she was way more popular back in Un'goro, but now people found other ways to gain value (cubelock, dead man's hand for example) or the value just wasn't needed, when you care about rushing your opponents. Against Raza priest you don't really care, if you will out-value them by having more cards in hand, they just have to find their winning combo, there a lot of aggro decks as well and yeah...

In other words - imho you can make a decent control/value deck out of her, especially in wild, but I'm sure, than in the next expansion there will be a lot more opportunities for slower control decks and thus there will be available slots for Elise.

Thanks for the response and time bro. As you said, I was thinking about using her in a Reno Priest deck, but I also was thinking about giving that spot to Nexus-Champion Saraad. I guess I'll have to test her out and decide whether or not to craft Nexus!

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#775 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from MarianoVqz >>

Mmm, if wild is your place and (reno)priest is your game, then I think Nexus is better, because it fits that deck better.

Elise is more of a standard thing - she's decent, but I don't think, that she can compete with what older cards could achieve. In priest she does her job at best, because you can find the pack early and multiply it by playing Shadow Visions. But that's what a normal control priest would do - in Reno however, since you can abuse the ability to push the button constantly without spending any additional mana, I just think, that Nexus will be a bigger threat for your opponent. He's a bit slower, because he has to be used only after you change into Anduin and play Raza, despite that I think he is a better inclusion.

Maybe, maybe I'm wrong, I don't play wild, not to mention I don't have the cards needed to build a highlander priest, so you could ask for more opinions. Both of the aforementioned legendaries are listed in the tier 2 category, so both are safe crafts. Maybe Elise is a bit more universal value-granting card, since the other classes can't benefit from Nexus that much, so there is that. Like I said - it depends what deck(s) you aim to play.

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#776 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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https://hsreplay.net/cards/#text=elise, nexus&gameType=RANKED_WILD&playerClass=PRIEST

https://hsreplay.net/cards/#text=elise, nexus&gameType=RANKED_WILD

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#777 Jan 22, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
Sagitario
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Quote from Kovachut >>

https://hsreplay.net/cards/#text=elise, nexus&gameType=RANKED_WILD&playerClass=PRIEST

https://hsreplay.net/cards/#text=elise, nexus&gameType=RANKED_WILD

Well, that just leant the table towards Nexus! I forgot you could check those stats, i'm gonna visit that often when in doubt about crafts. Thanks again!

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#780 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from MarianoVqz >>

1) Today I was a bit in a hurry, I only had time to copy/paste the link.

2) Ehm, not quite. While the statistic does show a bigger win-rate for the champion after being played, take a look at the other criteria (% being played, % in played decks and deck win-rate featuring those cards) and see that the things are a bit more complicated.

This just reminds me of Ultimate Infestation versus Spreading Plague back before the nerfs. I have seen people linking statistics from hsreplay and comparing those two cards. The first one had a high win-rate, while the second one showed a number slightly above 50%. See the link here - https://hsreplay.net/cards/#text=infestation, plague&gameType=RANKED_WILD&playerClass=DRUID&showSparse=yes - but just imagine this was before the change. So we had a little discussion, some people claimed, that since SP didn't have a high win-rate, it shouldn't be considered as a problematic card. Then there were others, who gave a more accurate explanation for the numbers - UI had a high win-rate percentage, a bigger one than SP, only because you could play it, only when you were already winning. If you played SP, that means you were in a bad shape and if you didn't had other tools in your disposal, if you were low on health and the opponent already had an immense board, there was little you could to to stop them.

Why I'm saying is, is the following: Nexus has a bigger win-rate than Elise, because this means that you were already winning, since in order to play him you also have to play Anduin (with Raza). But look at the other criteria - this card isn't played that much, because if you are in a tough spot, this is the last card you want to summon on the board, especially against aggro, as it doesn't do anything to help you (unless you get some killer AoE, but this means relying on RNG).

I pasted those links here, because I wanted to supply you with a bit more objective opinion (in the form of statistics). Kinda disappointed, that you didn't get much attention for your crafting question.

{edit} I hope I didn't confuse you that much, I will express my opinion quickly:

- Elise - gratz for getting her, she is a strong value-generating card, especially in priest. In terms of power level, she can be considered as a standard material.
- Nexus - fits Raza better, he is one of those must-kill cards, but he can be risky and slow sometimes. So be cautious.

Last edited by Kovachut on Jan 23, 2018

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#781 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from SavageSoul1 >>

1) About Zola - she is a good card imho, she just can't pull through in this meta. I know, that if I had a very valuable minion (talking about control decks), then I would gladly make another copy of it, without having to bounce it back and sacrifice my tempo. This goes for minions with good battlecry/deathrattle or end-of-turn effect (why not combo ones while you are at it). But since most of the decks are aggro ones, since the current control decks have a win-condition around a specific proactive combo (cubelock, Raza as well, though that's more of a combo deck but nvm, Jade dudu's Jade idol) playing the long game isn't that beneficial, for now. Dunno for wild, this is my opinion for standard.

There are also other decks, combo ones, which feature Zola. DannyJi mentioned QR, I can also say quest-giants mage. As for wild, there are a lot more possibilities to be explored, but I'm not experienced in there. My personal favourite, although not really a highly competitive deck, but still an amazing one here - the Dane's Zola shadowcaster deck.

2) Darkness - meme card. Always has been and I don't think something can change it soon. It isn't a counter to Razapriest, firstly because the probability of finding it and playing it before Raza is just a small one (unreliable) and secondly - you just delay the game, if they draw 2 of the candles, then RIP. I personally play the Darkness in combination with my Valeera DK deck, because I love making wacky combos. Other than that...

3) Paladin legendaries - there are a lot of safe crafts. Tirion, Ragnaros Tarim, the weapon, before burnbristle was one of them too. You won't regret the craft.

As for your golden The Beast - sadly, I also think, that there won't be a nerf, which will give you 3200 dust. Yeah, this legendary is a safe DE, I would kinda wait for the next expansion or until I see the set, if I were you. This won't be because there might be something to support that chunk of stats, but because you might find something more shiny to craft. Just a bro tip.

Last edited by Kovachut on Jan 23, 2018

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#782 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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I just packed Skull of the Man'ari is it worth it to keep seeing that the only real deck it's seen play in is cubelock?

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#783 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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I'd say keep it if you like Warlock. It should have usefulness in future expansions for sure. Again, only if you see yourself liking Warlock in the future.

I've got Dragon Soul, Druid quest, Warrior quest, Krul the Unshackled, also Clutchmother Zavas. Should I disenchant any of those? I'm like 95% sure I should de druid quest, but it was the first quest I got in a pack, so I feel attached to it lol. I'm wondering if I should craft Prince Keleseth. Do you think he'll still be prominent in rogue decks in the future? Rogue has always been one of my favorite classes, it's my only golden so far (I guess because it was my main back in WoW days haha). I just feel like Keleseth might be a little clunky in the future. Right now he works especially because of the Pirate captain + patches turn 3 followup play I think. I could be completely wrong though.

Last edited by Anatak89 on Jan 23, 2018

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#784 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from Anatak89 >>

1) An unpopular opinion, but imho Dragon Soul is a weapon with a lot of potential. If you have some time, read some of my posts here. Imho the problem with this weapon is the popularity of Raza priest, maybe also other priest decks, which have a more aggressive push. And also - it's obviously obvious how building a deck only around one card will lead to its collapse. Don't DE it, maybe miracle priest or some variations will get some needed support next expansion and they could become popular.

2) As for the Dudu quest - meh, kinda for casual decks only, I personally think it's a safe dust, but if you feel like playing it, then keep it.

3) Taunt quest - it's still one of the good quests. It would be a shame to DE, I think it's highly likely that control/taunt warrior will make a comeback next expansion.

4) Krul - meh, I'm a warlock, who mainly plays in standard. Dunno for you, but I won't feel attached to this legendary, not when warlock found other ways to cheat out the demons. I would DE him.

5) Zavas - my only advice - wait for the next expansion. It's just better to wait just a little bit, so that you will be 100% sure you will be doing the right thing. For now she is a save dust, but we can't be sure, that warlock won't get anything related to the disco mechanic.

6) About Keleseth - good points. It's true, that Patches helps tempo and aggro decks a lot, so removing that tempo advantage, well ... Maybe adding 2 drops in order to increase your deck consistency will turn out to be profitable again. I can't really help you out on this question, you are also aware of this risk, so I think we both now, that waiting 2 more months will be worth it. Even if Kele turns out to be useful, you won't have lost anything at the end, you would have only waited patiently.

Last edited by Kovachut on Jan 23, 2018

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#785 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Still you better keep it.. Since Cubelock is going to be very strong after rotation.. + New expansion coming as well

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#786 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from Anatak89 >>

I'd say keep it if you like Warlock. It should have usefulness in future expansions for sure. Again, only if you see yourself liking Warlock in the future.

I've got Dragon Soul, Druid quest, Warrior quest, Krul the Unshackled, also Clutchmother Zavas. Should I disenchant any of those? I'm like 95% sure I should de druid quest, but it was the first quest I got in a pack, so I feel attached to it lol. I'm wondering if I should craft Prince Keleseth. Do you think he'll still be prominent in rogue decks in the future? Rogue has always been one of my favorite classes, it's my only golden so far (I guess because it was my main back in WoW days haha). I just feel like Keleseth might be a little clunky in the future. Right now he works especially because of the Pirate captain + patches turn 3 followup play I think. I could be completely wrong though.

Dragon Soul is a super clunky card. It might see play in the future if Priest gets some more low cost spells in future expansions. But as of right now, it just doesn't have the immediate impact that a card like Aluneth has, nor does it match up to the sheer power of a Skull of the Menari. If you don't need the dust right now just keep it around, if you need the last bit of dust to make a Death Knight or something go ahead and disenchant it.

Druid quest, much like the Hunter quest, is just a design that doesn't work. By the time you've played enough 5 attack minions to claim your reward, you're probably going to have enough mana to play whatever cards you topdeck anyway. The text reads "400 dust".

Warrior quest was actually one of the best performing quests during the months after UnGoro. With a bunch of stuff like Jades likely rotating and the abundance of good taunts available to warrior, it has potential to come back as one of the go-to control decks.

Krul isn't actually as bad as people say he is. In Wild he's a decent tech option to cheat out combos like Mal'Gains+Voidlord if you're unlucky with your Voidcaller pulls (plus it's a pretty nice Voidcaller target in itself). If you plan to play wild at any point, keep him.

Zavas and discard warlock are going downhill (not that they were any good to begin with). Silverware Golem is rotating and that's probably discardlock's best card. Unless disco gets tons of support next expansion I don't see Zavas getting played.

You still have 3 months before the next set and standard rotation. That's plenty of time for the card to do work. If Keleseth can be the difference between legend and rank 3 or something, you wont regret the decision one bit.

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#787 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from palpitoad93 >>

Quote from Anatak89 >>

I'd say keep it if you like Warlock. It should have usefulness in future expansions for sure. Again, only if you see yourself liking Warlock in the future.

I've got Dragon Soul, Druid quest, Warrior quest, Krul the Unshackled, also Clutchmother Zavas. Should I disenchant any of those? I'm like 95% sure I should de druid quest, but it was the first quest I got in a pack, so I feel attached to it lol. I'm wondering if I should craft Prince Keleseth. Do you think he'll still be prominent in rogue decks in the future? Rogue has always been one of my favorite classes, it's my only golden so far (I guess because it was my main back in WoW days haha). I just feel like Keleseth might be a little clunky in the future. Right now he works especially because of the Pirate captain + patches turn 3 followup play I think. I could be completely wrong though.

Quote from Kovachut >>

Quote from Anatak89 >>

Thanks for the two well thought out responses! I think I'll probably craft Keleseth. The only reason I threw the warrior quest in there was because most of the taunt decks tend to be a little expensive (for example, I'm still missing The Lich King as well haha). I do kinda think Dragon Soul could have potential one day, but I believe I would also need to craft Lyra the Sunshard. I could also just craft Lyra now instead of Keleseth and try to play these dragon priests (without Dragon Soul, I know). If I craft Keleseth now, I can wait to accumulate some more dust for the next expansion and then just craft Lyra if a fun deck idea pops up. I might de both Krul and Zavas, simply because one - I have never really played or enjoyed warlock and two - I already have Skull of Manari which kinda makes Krul obsolete, and the Warlock dk for cheating out more demons if I ever choose to play warlock... I just keep on opening warlock legendaries even though I never play it lol.

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#788 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from palpitoad93 >>

Not so important, but Malchezaar's Imp is the real deal. His absence will be the biggest hit, which disco decks will take in April.

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#789 Jan 23, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Quote from Kovachut >>

Quote from palpitoad93 >>

Not so important, but Malchezaar's Imp is the real deal. His absence will be the biggest hit, which disco decks will take in April.

Oh for sure. If cards as powerful as Malchezaar's Imp and Silverware Golem couldn't make this archetype work, I think we can officially call the experiment a bust. Now if only Blizzard will realize this with Freeze Shaman...

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#790 Jan 24, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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I was wondering what you guys think is better in Cubelock, Prince Taldaram or Spiritsinger Umbra. I'm leaning toward the Prince, because I think it's a little more versatile. Please share your opinion.

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"A bargain forged in blood and shadow"
#791 Jan 24, 2018 (Kobolds Patch)
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Prince Taldaram is overrated, Spiritsinger Umbra is way better.

Notes: Misclick
Last edited by SlydE on Jan 24, 2018

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