That is a very good question! Placing a new card with some kind of confidence usually takes around a week, but it can happen sooner in very clear cases. Feedback appreciated as always!
This thread has been pretty quiet of late...SlydE what do you think of the following:
Maybe Stargazer Luna should be bumped up as she seeing a lot of play in Cyclone Mage?
Loti, Zentimo, Oblivitron, Commander Rhyssa and Houndmaster Shaw all kind of seem like they should be in Tier 3 to me, they are not core cards for the vast majority of decks they can be played in. Seem far more playable than anything else.
Akali, Jan'alai, War Master Voone, Mojomaster Zihi and The Boom Reaver are all in a weird spot, almost between 3 and 4.
This thread has been pretty quiet of late...SlydE what do you think of the following:
Maybe Stargazer Luna should be bumped up as she seeing a lot of play in Cyclone Mage?
Loti, Zentimo, Oblivitron, Commander Rhyssa and Houndmaster Shaw all kind of seem like they should be in Tier 3 to me, they are not core cards for the vast majority of decks they can be played in. Seem far more playable than anything else.
Akali, Jan'alai, War Master Voone, Mojomaster Zihi and The Boom Reaver are all in a weird spot, almost between 3 and 4.
Is Gral being played at all right now?
Just my two cents.
Thanks, I will check it out.
The OP is still being updated and people still read the OP.
EDIT: Houndmaster Shaw still has a very nice winrate and sees some play in several decks. Wardruid Loti is demoted to tier 3, not a staple in token druid and sees little play despite a decent winrate. Stargazer Luna Promoted from tier 3 to 2, nice catch. Zentimo is right between tier 2 and 3, he sees some play, aggro shaman is still ok, and I think he has good potential for the future. Gral, the Shark Demoted to tier 4, another nice catch.
I really think Chef Nomi and Zerek's Cloning Gallery need to be moved down into tier 4; Nomi's playmate has steadily declined and win rate has remained low due to stronger decks controlling the meta and Bomb Warrior directly countering it. Also I can't remember the last time I saw OTK priest with Cloning Gallery that actually had a good winrate now that Lesser Diamond Spellstone has been out of standard for a bit and with the upcoming move of Mind Blast to the HOF it's going to end up tier 5 in standard soon enough. It may have some synergy with Res-priest but that deck is so full to the gills its hard to fit it in and really get value out of it.
I really think Chef Nomi and Zerek's Cloning Gallery need to be moved down into tier 4; Nomi's playmate has steadily declined and win rate has remained low due to stronger decks controlling the meta and Bomb Warrior directly countering it. Also I can't remember the last time I saw OTK priest with Cloning Gallery that actually had a good winrate now that Lesser Diamond Spellstone has been out of standard for a bit and with the upcoming move of Mind Blast to the HOF it's going to end up tier 5 in standard soon enough. It may have some synergy with Res-priest but that deck is so full to the gills its hard to fit it in and really get value out of it.
Chef Nomi is still a decent option in tempo rogue and Nomi Priest is not completely out of it yet, so the card will stay in tier 3 for now.
Zerek's Cloning Gallery is in a very tough spot, though, demoted to tier 4 but history tells me moving cards like that to tier 5 is very risky.
I can not understand if hearthpwn closes or not (as per the official announcement) and therefore this forum too
It will not close. It is under a new management and mod team which acuired the site from curse/fandom. You can probably find out more about the process and where the old team is with some digging but not everything;-)
Time for a quick pre-release tier guess. This expansion marks the return of Quests, Highlander mechanics, and really questionable legendaries, but it does have some stand-outs.
Tier 1
Zephrys the Great - Like Reno Jackson and Kazakus before him, Zeph is the reason to exclude dupes from your deck. His effect will do everything from board clears to tempo plays and will even give you Sacrificial Pact if your opponent is Lord Jaraxxus! Sadly he is the real reason that cards like Naturalize and Vanish had to be banished to the Hall of Fame.
Tier 2
Bazaar Burglary - Decent reward and not that hard to complete, this quest is probably going to see some play in multiple rogue archetypes, not just thief rogue.
Corrupt the Waters - Double battlecries is an interesting ability to have on a hero power. Fortunately the quest is almost an auto-complete with all of those Lackeys running around.
Dark Pharaoh Tekahn - This kind of "For the rest of the game" effect is pretty powerful and turning 1/1s into 4/4s isn't to be taken lightly. The problem is though that you're only getting a total of 8 Lackeys from your deck. Is it enough? In fact, it is, even if you can only make use of a single upgraded Lackey. He'll shine in Magic Carpet zoo and may see play in other archetypes.
High Priest Amet - I am probably wrong to put him this high up but I believe this is the sleeper of the set. His effect is on summon which means that you can do crazy Reborn trades when he comes into play and end up with an obscenely healthy board. At the very least he will give us some memes.
Reno the Relicologist - People are complaining that he isn't as strong as old Reno Jackson and that's true, but they aren't focusing on the fact that his effect only affects the opponent's board. Look at how powerful Dyn-o-matic is currently and imagine that you don't have to care if your opponent has mechs or if you have friendly non-mechs. Dare I say that if you are against aggro you'll want to keep a 6 cost card in your mulligan.
Siamat - Nice and versatile without being too overpowering. Good all around but especially useful for highlander decks and Shudderwock fans.
Tier 3
Anka, the Buried - Will she be the Mecha'thun combo enabler? People will defeinitely be trying to figure that out.
Armagedillo - I think this will slide easily into the meta. Imagine a 6 mana 4/7 minion that said "If Zilliax is in your hand, give it +2/+2". Would you play it? You would certainly consider it. In wild with Fire Plume's Heart this is even better.
Dinotamer Brann - If you are trying to make use of Zephry, you may as well include new Brann. 7 mana for 10/12 worth of stats with 8/8 of it having charge isn't bad.
Elise the Enlightened - Probably the weakest Elise card but she is still viable. She isn't going to be a combo enabler but she can shore up part of a highlander deck's weakness.
Raid the Sky Temple - This actually has negative synergy with hand mage as they are trying to play an early Mountain Giant to hit it with Conjurer's Calling. So why the tier 3 placement? You can always mulligan the quest away, and it's not like you won't still have a chance to complete it later in the game even if you do.
Vessina - Good, but not as good as people think due to her not activating her own ability and probably not sticking on the board long enough to get use.
Tier 4
Activate the Obelisk - 15 health is a huge amount and it's almost positive that some of that healing will be a tempo loss which you may not be able to make up later after you get the admittedly decent reward. To make this quest work you will likely have to rely on AoE healing effects. On the plus side, Holy Nova could become part of the meta again.
King Phaoris - If you're playing the new mage quest in your Mana Cyclone deck, you can fill your board with random minions. Um, OK I guess.
Making Mummies - Yes the reward is great but to complete the quest you're going to have to draw and play several mediocre cards. Is it worth trying? Sure. You may even have fun with it. I mean Kibler enjoyed his Plot Twist warlock deck.
Sir Finley of the Sands - Baku the Mooneater has shown us that the best part of upgraded hero powers is at the beginning of the game. Instead of 3 of 8 choices, you'll get 3 of 9 choices now so it'll be even harder to get your preferred hero power for the situation. He's not bad, but he is too unreliable to be an auto-include in a Zephry deck.
Supreme Archaeology - This card isn't going to set the meta aflame. The reward is acceptable and the quest is able to be completed early enough if, and it's a big if, you are able to abuse Plot Twist. This could mark a return of handlock to the meta as long as they can reliably deal with both aggro and Conjurer's Calling.
Unseal the Vault - Remember how hyped people were over The Marsh Queen? Remember how it didn't succeed? This time won't be much different. Some insane genius will design a deck that will complete the quest by playing Zul'jin and create the next Pogo-rogue archetype for people to show disappointing results on ladder.
Hack the System - This card is just good enough for people to try it in wild pirate warrior and be subsequently disappointed.
Octosari - Drawing on Deathrattle has always been a potential liability and this will almost certainly overdraw you. Bad for control, too slow for aggro, can't even Treachery it in wild. This is a sari excuse for a card. Sari not sari.
Untapped Potential - With ramp nerfed to the ground, this is just a gradual tempo destruction for a dubious reward. Fandral Staghelm was viable back in the day but he isn't even being run in modern jade druid.
All in all not bad. Better than Rastakahn's Rumble but not as good as Boomsday Project. I look forward to playing with some of these cards.
Great list, you've definitely put some thought into this. Think your placements are pretty good except for a few exceptions
Reno: sorry - this is Tier 4 or 5 even imo. Dynomatic works well yes - which indicates you often only need to do 5 damage for a board clear. So 10 damage is unnecessary. Other considerations - dynomatic is a mech and has huge synergies with the Warrior decks he is used in, and has rush if you've played Dr. Boom. On top of all of that there is no deck restriction for dyno...sorry, I think Reno is complete garbage and possibly the most disappointing card in the set.
Untapped Potential: I think this is a Tier 2 / 3 card, very easy Quest to achieve and has amazing synergy with Starkeeper and Wardruid Loti. This will see lots of play imo, Fandral wasn't just viable he was used in almost every single Druid deck in standard and a clear Tier 1 legendary. I don't think Jade Druid or Nourish are that relevant to assessing this card.
Activate the Obelisk: I think this is a Tier 2 card personally but we'll see. It is way easier to heal 15 than people think and the reward if extremely good.
Apart from that think you nailed it, and will be interesting to see how it all plays out shortly!
Time for a quick pre-release tier guess. This expansion marks the return of Quests, Highlander mechanics, and really questionable legendaries, but it does have some stand-outs.
Tier 1
Zephrys the Great - Like Reno Jackson and Kazakus before him, Zeph is the reason to exclude dupes from your deck. His effect will do everything from board clears to tempo plays and will even give you Sacrificial Pact if your opponent is Lord Jaraxxus! Sadly he is the real reason that cards like Naturalize and Vanish had to be banished to the Hall of Fame.
Tier 2
Bazaar Burglary - Decent reward and not that hard to complete, this quest is probably going to see some play in multiple rogue archetypes, not just thief rogue.
Corrupt the Waters - Double battlecries is an interesting ability to have on a hero power. Fortunately the quest is almost an auto-complete with all of those Lackeys running around.
Dark Pharaoh Tekahn - This kind of "For the rest of the game" effect is pretty powerful and turning 1/1s into 4/4s isn't to be taken lightly. The problem is though that you're only getting a total of 8 Lackeys from your deck. Is it enough? In fact, it is, even if you can only make use of a single upgraded Lackey. He'll shine in Magic Carpet zoo and may see play in other archetypes.
High Priest Amet - I am probably wrong to put him this high up but I believe this is the sleeper of the set. His effect is on summon which means that you can do crazy Reborn trades when he comes into play and end up with an obscenely healthy board. At the very least he will give us some memes.
Reno the Relicologist - People are complaining that he isn't as strong as old Reno Jackson and that's true, but they aren't focusing on the fact that his effect only affects the opponent's board. Look at how powerful Dyn-o-matic is currently and imagine that you don't have to care if your opponent has mechs or if you have friendly non-mechs. Dare I say that if you are against aggro you'll want to keep a 6 cost card in your mulligan.
Siamat - Nice and versatile without being too overpowering. Good all around but especially useful for highlander decks and Shudderwock fans.
Tier 3
Anka, the Buried - Will she be the Mecha'thun combo enabler? People will defeinitely be trying to figure that out.
Armagedillo - I think this will slide easily into the meta. Imagine a 6 mana 4/7 minion that said "If Zilliax is in your hand, give it +2/+2". Would you play it? You would certainly consider it. In wild with Fire Plume's Heart this is even better.
Dinotamer Brann - If you are trying to make use of Zephry, you may as well include new Brann. 7 mana for 10/12 worth of stats with 8/8 of it having charge isn't bad.
Elise the Enlightened - Probably the weakest Elise card but she is still viable. She isn't going to be a combo enabler but she can shore up part of a highlander deck's weakness.
Raid the Sky Temple - This actually has negative synergy with hand mage as they are trying to play an early Mountain Giant to hit it with Conjurer's Calling. So why the tier 3 placement? You can always mulligan the quest away, and it's not like you won't still have a chance to complete it later in the game even if you do.
Vessina - Good, but not as good as people think due to her not activating her own ability and probably not sticking on the board long enough to get use.
Tier 4
Activate the Obelisk - 15 health is a huge amount and it's almost positive that some of that healing will be a tempo loss which you may not be able to make up later after you get the admittedly decent reward. To make this quest work you will likely have to rely on AoE healing effects. On the plus side, Holy Nova could become part of the meta again.
King Phaoris - If you're playing the new mage quest in your Mana Cyclone deck, you can fill your board with random minions. Um, OK I guess.
Making Mummies - Yes the reward is great but to complete the quest you're going to have to draw and play several mediocre cards. Is it worth trying? Sure. You may even have fun with it. I mean Kibler enjoyed his Plot Twist warlock deck.
Sir Finley of the Sands - Baku the Mooneater has shown us that the best part of upgraded hero powers is at the beginning of the game. Instead of 3 of 8 choices, you'll get 3 of 9 choices now so it'll be even harder to get your preferred hero power for the situation. He's not bad, but he is too unreliable to be an auto-include in a Zephry deck.
Supreme Archaeology - This card isn't going to set the meta aflame. The reward is acceptable and the quest is able to be completed early enough if, and it's a big if, you are able to abuse Plot Twist. This could mark a return of handlock to the meta as long as they can reliably deal with both aggro and Conjurer's Calling.
Unseal the Vault - Remember how hyped people were over The Marsh Queen? Remember how it didn't succeed? This time won't be much different. Some insane genius will design a deck that will complete the quest by playing Zul'jin and create the next Pogo-rogue archetype for people to show disappointing results on ladder.
Hack the System - This card is just good enough for people to try it in wild pirate warrior and be subsequently disappointed.
Octosari - Drawing on Deathrattle has always been a potential liability and this will almost certainly overdraw you. Bad for control, too slow for aggro, can't even Treachery it in wild. This is a sari excuse for a card. Sari not sari.
Untapped Potential - With ramp nerfed to the ground, this is just a gradual tempo destruction for a dubious reward. Fandral Staghelm was viable back in the day but he isn't even being run in modern jade druid.
All in all not bad. Better than Rastakahn's Rumble but not as good as Boomsday Project. I look forward to playing with some of these cards.
Thanks for your work, this is the time for juicy future "I told you so" moments, so predictions like these are very much appreciated;-)
Zephrys the Great is obviously super strong, but nobody knows how good highlander decks are in Standard atm and if one "perfect card" is enough of a reason to cut several very good ones. Standard decks are built around specific synergies in which 2-ofs are very important. I would guess it will end up in tier 2 in both formats but take that with a huge grain of salt...
Sir Finley of the Sands will not end up in tier 4 imo. Justicar Trueheart saw a fair bit of play when he was released and this guy has much better stats, lets you choose your HP and is cheaper, letting you HP twice if it comes down to it. I would not be surprised if this guy sneaks into several tier 1 decks.
Maybe I'm gonna be a little too Brainy Smurf-ish, but I have some suggestions for the Wild section:
Tier 1:
Mojomaster and Bloodmage I think not THAT good or commonly used. Mojo sometimes appear in Even Lock, but she's not that common.
Tier 2:
Rhyssa, Kangor's Endless Army, Prince Liam sees very little play, Tier 1-2 decks do not use them, they should go lower.
Stargazer Luna and Emperor I think are Tier 1 material. Stargazer is used in Quest Mage (one of the most popular and strongest deck since RoS) and in Tempo Mage, Emperor appears in Mecha'thun Warlock and in Big Priest (both of them popular and has a high winrate).
Tier 3:
Open the Waygate should jump up to Tier 2, if not to Tier 1. Skycap'n Kragg is not that good.
Tier 4:
I think Grumble sees more play than the other Legs in the Tier 4 section, I think he deserves the Tier 3 floor. Shudderwock uses him time to time.
Anomalus, Soggoth and Neptulon in the other hand - I think - should go lower.
Tier 5 looks good :)
These are just suggestions, not demands :D
Thanks for reading through and sorry for the accidental grammar mistakes!
Maybe I'm gonna be a little too Brainy Smurf-ish, but I have some suggestions for the Wild section:
Tier 1:
Mojomaster and Bloodmage I think not THAT good or commonly used. Mojo sometimes appear in Even Lock, but she's not that common.
Tier 2:
Rhyssa, Kangor's Endless Army, Prince Liam sees very little play, Tier 1-2 decks do not use them, they should go lower.
Stargazer Luna and Emperor I think are Tier 1 material. Stargazer is used in Quest Mage (one of the most popular and strongest deck since RoS) and in Tempo Mage, Emperor appears in Mecha'thun Warlock and in Big Priest (both of them popular and has a high winrate).
Tier 3:
Open the Waygate should jump up to Tier 2, if not to Tier 1. Skycap'n Kragg is not that good.
Tier 4:
I think Grumble sees more play than the other Legs in the Tier 4 section, I think he deserves the Tier 3 floor. Shudderwock uses him time to time.
Anomalus, Soggoth and Neptulon in the other hand - I think - should go lower.
Tier 5 looks good :)
These are just suggestions, not demands :D
Thanks for reading through and sorry for the accidental grammar mistakes!
Thanks, some of these takes some research to get right, especially since many of these cards are over and played considering their winrates, quest mage is more popular than it is strong, probably since it is a refreshing playstyle unique for the format.
Right now, Wardruid Loti is almost a staple in any druid deck, from token to highlander quest. I know it is a little early to say something like this, but I think she should be moved from tier 3 to tier 2.
Time for a quick pre-release tier guess. This expansion marks the return of Quests, Highlander mechanics, and really questionable legendaries, but it does have some stand-outs.
Tier 1
Zephrys the Great - Like Reno Jackson and Kazakus before him, Zeph is the reason to exclude dupes from your deck. His effect will do everything from board clears to tempo plays and will even give you Sacrificial Pact if your opponent is Lord Jaraxxus! Sadly he is the real reason that cards like Naturalize and Vanish had to be banished to the Hall of Fame.
Tier 2
Bazaar Burglary - Decent reward and not that hard to complete, this quest is probably going to see some play in multiple rogue archetypes, not just thief rogue.
Corrupt the Waters - Double battlecries is an interesting ability to have on a hero power. Fortunately the quest is almost an auto-complete with all of those Lackeys running around.
Dark Pharaoh Tekahn - This kind of "For the rest of the game" effect is pretty powerful and turning 1/1s into 4/4s isn't to be taken lightly. The problem is though that you're only getting a total of 8 Lackeys from your deck. Is it enough? In fact, it is, even if you can only make use of a single upgraded Lackey. He'll shine in Magic Carpet zoo and may see play in other archetypes.
High Priest Amet - I am probably wrong to put him this high up but I believe this is the sleeper of the set. His effect is on summon which means that you can do crazy Reborn trades when he comes into play and end up with an obscenely healthy board. At the very least he will give us some memes.
Reno the Relicologist - People are complaining that he isn't as strong as old Reno Jackson and that's true, but they aren't focusing on the fact that his effect only affects the opponent's board. Look at how powerful Dyn-o-matic is currently and imagine that you don't have to care if your opponent has mechs or if you have friendly non-mechs. Dare I say that if you are against aggro you'll want to keep a 6 cost card in your mulligan.
Siamat - Nice and versatile without being too overpowering. Good all around but especially useful for highlander decks and Shudderwock fans.
Tier 3
Anka, the Buried - Will she be the Mecha'thun combo enabler? People will defeinitely be trying to figure that out.
Armagedillo - I think this will slide easily into the meta. Imagine a 6 mana 4/7 minion that said "If Zilliax is in your hand, give it +2/+2". Would you play it? You would certainly consider it. In wild with Fire Plume's Heart this is even better.
Dinotamer Brann - If you are trying to make use of Zephry, you may as well include new Brann. 7 mana for 10/12 worth of stats with 8/8 of it having charge isn't bad.
Elise the Enlightened - Probably the weakest Elise card but she is still viable. She isn't going to be a combo enabler but she can shore up part of a highlander deck's weakness.
Raid the Sky Temple - This actually has negative synergy with hand mage as they are trying to play an early Mountain Giant to hit it with Conjurer's Calling. So why the tier 3 placement? You can always mulligan the quest away, and it's not like you won't still have a chance to complete it later in the game even if you do.
Vessina - Good, but not as good as people think due to her not activating her own ability and probably not sticking on the board long enough to get use.
Tier 4
Activate the Obelisk - 15 health is a huge amount and it's almost positive that some of that healing will be a tempo loss which you may not be able to make up later after you get the admittedly decent reward. To make this quest work you will likely have to rely on AoE healing effects. On the plus side, Holy Nova could become part of the meta again.
King Phaoris - If you're playing the new mage quest in your Mana Cyclone deck, you can fill your board with random minions. Um, OK I guess.
Making Mummies - Yes the reward is great but to complete the quest you're going to have to draw and play several mediocre cards. Is it worth trying? Sure. You may even have fun with it. I mean Kibler enjoyed his Plot Twist warlock deck.
Sir Finley of the Sands - Baku the Mooneater has shown us that the best part of upgraded hero powers is at the beginning of the game. Instead of 3 of 8 choices, you'll get 3 of 9 choices now so it'll be even harder to get your preferred hero power for the situation. He's not bad, but he is too unreliable to be an auto-include in a Zephry deck.
Supreme Archaeology - This card isn't going to set the meta aflame. The reward is acceptable and the quest is able to be completed early enough if, and it's a big if, you are able to abuse Plot Twist. This could mark a return of handlock to the meta as long as they can reliably deal with both aggro and Conjurer's Calling.
Unseal the Vault - Remember how hyped people were over The Marsh Queen? Remember how it didn't succeed? This time won't be much different. Some insane genius will design a deck that will complete the quest by playing Zul'jin and create the next Pogo-rogue archetype for people to show disappointing results on ladder.
Hack the System - This card is just good enough for people to try it in wild pirate warrior and be subsequently disappointed.
Octosari - Drawing on Deathrattle has always been a potential liability and this will almost certainly overdraw you. Bad for control, too slow for aggro, can't even Treachery it in wild. This is a sari excuse for a card. Sari not sari.
Untapped Potential - With ramp nerfed to the ground, this is just a gradual tempo destruction for a dubious reward. Fandral Staghelm was viable back in the day but he isn't even being run in modern jade druid.
All in all not bad. Better than Rastakahn's Rumble but not as good as Boomsday Project. I look forward to playing with some of these cards.
Wow. Somebody who actually likes boomsday like me xD
Terrorsquid66, To be fair, Boomsday's legendaries did get a post launch buff from the Rise of the Mech patch though (buffing Luna's Pocket Galaxy, The Storm Bringer, Flark's Boom-Zooka, and Dr. Morrigan as well as adding the amazing SN1P-SN4P) which even if you exclude the buffs, SN1P-SN4P alone raises the power level.
Anyway, we've had almost 3 days of Saviors of Uldum, and while the meta is by no means settled, we can look at some trends and at least see how wrong I was. It's still pretty early; craft at your own risk.
Quests are a fun thing as unlike other cards they always start in your hand unless you mulligan them away. This means that horseplay's hsreplay's played win rate may be pretty close to what the card's actual win rate is.
The winner of the "Worst quest in the set" goes to the warlock quest! Congratulations! While I personally didn't think it was good, I am a little disappointed that it's doing worse than the warrior quest... the one that I rated on par with the druid quest (yes Highwayman37, you were right there. I was still right with Reno though). The big winner here is the paladin quest with people early on realizing that the best way of making mummies use of it was to grit your teeth, play a bunch of bad reborn minions, and by turn 7 put down Mechano-Egg and start Making Mechies. This doesn't mean that the other quests are not worth playing, it just means that they have a lot of refinement to do. Shameless link.
So grats to all who got good quests. I got the warlock quest... just like I did in Un Goro... :P
So let's look at the Zephrey and the League of Singleton Explorers. I'm including the deck win rate here as well as just the played WR is decieving.
Highlander hunter and mage are doing pretty well. Druid is doing less so. What's going on with highlander paladin though? Highlander paladin isn't a thing, instead people are playing highroll paladin. Highroll paladin uses Prismatic Lens to pull out Tip the Scales and swap the costs with a minion (most likely a murloc) and flood the board early for a hopeful win. If that doesn't work, they fall back on using Zephry and Sir Finley and lastly Chef Nomi to try to pull out a win. This explains Sir Finley's low played win rate without having to think that he's just a terrible draw from Underbelly Angler.
So what are some other winners and losers? Armagedillo is the best performing card, but control warrior already had a great shell (hehe). King Phaoris and Siamat are the neutral legendaries to keep an eye on (performing roughly as well as Zephrey) and Vessina and Dark Pharaoh Tekahn are rounding out the top 5 of the rest. High Priest Amet is the last to have a positive deck and play WR. Colossus of the Moon has a high play WR but a low deck WR which is very odd as the most popular deck that runs it tries to cheat it to the board with Duel!. This may be an outlier.
Anka, the Buried is doing abysmal, which is not surprising in early experimental decks of this type. Octosari is also doing pretty badly which is probably explainable as no one knows what to do with it.
Recommended crafts? NONE! But... Zephrey if you want to play singleton decks, King Phaoris and Siamat if you want collection flexibility, any one of the top 5 quests (they are fun and are performing OK), Tekahn if you want to climb the ladder, and Armagedillo if you hate fun.
What tier will the 2 new classic legendaries be?
That is a very good question! Placing a new card with some kind of confidence usually takes around a week, but it can happen sooner in very clear cases. Feedback appreciated as always!
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
This thread has been pretty quiet of late...SlydE what do you think of the following:
Maybe Stargazer Luna should be bumped up as she seeing a lot of play in Cyclone Mage?
Loti, Zentimo, Oblivitron, Commander Rhyssa and Houndmaster Shaw all kind of seem like they should be in Tier 3 to me, they are not core cards for the vast majority of decks they can be played in. Seem far more playable than anything else.
Akali, Jan'alai, War Master Voone, Mojomaster Zihi and The Boom Reaver are all in a weird spot, almost between 3 and 4.
Is Gral being played at all right now?
Just my two cents.
Thanks, I will check it out.
The OP is still being updated and people still read the OP.
EDIT:
Houndmaster Shaw still has a very nice winrate and sees some play in several decks.
Wardruid Loti is demoted to tier 3, not a staple in token druid and sees little play despite a decent winrate.
Stargazer Luna Promoted from tier 3 to 2, nice catch.
Zentimo is right between tier 2 and 3, he sees some play, aggro shaman is still ok, and I think he has good potential for the future.
Gral, the Shark Demoted to tier 4, another nice catch.
Will check the rest later!
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
Oblivitron Demoted to tier 3.
Commander Rhyssa Demoted from tier 2 to 4, nice catch!
War Master Voone Tier 3 to 4
Jan'alai, the Dragonhawk Tier 3 to 4
The Boom Reaver Tier 3 to 4
Small updates for the Wild section:
Scargil Tier 2 to 1
SN1P-SN4P To tier 1
I will post here whenever I do changes in the future so they will be easier to see.
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/card-discussion/205920-legendary-tier-list-crafting-guide
Cool, thanks!
I really think Chef Nomi and Zerek's Cloning Gallery need to be moved down into tier 4; Nomi's playmate has steadily declined and win rate has remained low due to stronger decks controlling the meta and Bomb Warrior directly countering it. Also I can't remember the last time I saw OTK priest with Cloning Gallery that actually had a good winrate now that Lesser Diamond Spellstone has been out of standard for a bit and with the upcoming move of Mind Blast to the HOF it's going to end up tier 5 in standard soon enough. It may have some synergy with Res-priest but that deck is so full to the gills its hard to fit it in and really get value out of it.
Weekly Card Design Competition 10.15
Chef Nomi is still a decent option in tempo rogue and Nomi Priest is not completely out of it yet, so the card will stay in tier 3 for now.
Zerek's Cloning Gallery is in a very tough spot, though, demoted to tier 4 but history tells me moving cards like that to tier 5 is very risky.
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
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I can not understand if hearthpwn closes or not (as per the official announcement) and therefore this forum too
It will not close. It is under a new management and mod team which acuired the site from curse/fandom. You can probably find out more about the process and where the old team is with some digging but not everything;-)
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
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Time for a quick pre-release tier guess. This expansion marks the return of Quests, Highlander mechanics, and really questionable legendaries, but it does have some stand-outs.
Tier 1
Tier 2
Tier 3
Tier 4
Tier 5
All in all not bad. Better than Rastakahn's Rumble but not as good as Boomsday Project. I look forward to playing with some of these cards.
Great list, you've definitely put some thought into this. Think your placements are pretty good except for a few exceptions
Reno: sorry - this is Tier 4 or 5 even imo. Dynomatic works well yes - which indicates you often only need to do 5 damage for a board clear. So 10 damage is unnecessary. Other considerations - dynomatic is a mech and has huge synergies with the Warrior decks he is used in, and has rush if you've played Dr. Boom. On top of all of that there is no deck restriction for dyno...sorry, I think Reno is complete garbage and possibly the most disappointing card in the set.
Untapped Potential: I think this is a Tier 2 / 3 card, very easy Quest to achieve and has amazing synergy with Starkeeper and Wardruid Loti. This will see lots of play imo, Fandral wasn't just viable he was used in almost every single Druid deck in standard and a clear Tier 1 legendary. I don't think Jade Druid or Nourish are that relevant to assessing this card.
Activate the Obelisk: I think this is a Tier 2 card personally but we'll see. It is way easier to heal 15 than people think and the reward if extremely good.
Apart from that think you nailed it, and will be interesting to see how it all plays out shortly!
Thanks for your work, this is the time for juicy future "I told you so" moments, so predictions like these are very much appreciated;-)
Zephrys the Great is obviously super strong, but nobody knows how good highlander decks are in Standard atm and if one "perfect card" is enough of a reason to cut several very good ones. Standard decks are built around specific synergies in which 2-ofs are very important. I would guess it will end up in tier 2 in both formats but take that with a huge grain of salt...
Sir Finley of the Sands will not end up in tier 4 imo. Justicar Trueheart saw a fair bit of play when he was released and this guy has much better stats, lets you choose your HP and is cheaper, letting you HP twice if it comes down to it. I would not be surprised if this guy sneaks into several tier 1 decks.
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
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Maybe I'm gonna be a little too Brainy Smurf-ish, but I have some suggestions for the Wild section:
Tier 1:
Mojomaster and Bloodmage I think not THAT good or commonly used. Mojo sometimes appear in Even Lock, but she's not that common.
Tier 2:
Rhyssa, Kangor's Endless Army, Prince Liam sees very little play, Tier 1-2 decks do not use them, they should go lower.
Stargazer Luna and Emperor I think are Tier 1 material. Stargazer is used in Quest Mage (one of the most popular and strongest deck since RoS) and in Tempo Mage, Emperor appears in Mecha'thun Warlock and in Big Priest (both of them popular and has a high winrate).
Tier 3:
Open the Waygate should jump up to Tier 2, if not to Tier 1. Skycap'n Kragg is not that good.
Tier 4:
I think Grumble sees more play than the other Legs in the Tier 4 section, I think he deserves the Tier 3 floor. Shudderwock uses him time to time.
Anomalus, Soggoth and Neptulon in the other hand - I think - should go lower.
Tier 5 looks good :)
These are just suggestions, not demands :D
Thanks for reading through and sorry for the accidental grammar mistakes!
Obey C'Thun, Praise The Darkness, Pet Hakkar, the Soulflayer, Love Yogg-Saron, Hope's End
Thanks, some of these takes some research to get right, especially since many of these cards are over and played considering their winrates, quest mage is more popular than it is strong, probably since it is a refreshing playstyle unique for the format.
Anyway, your suggestions mostly make a lot of sense, so far:
Open the Waygate Tier 3 to 2
Bloodmage Thalnos Tier 1 to 2
Mojomaster Zihi Tier 1 to 2
Grumble, Worldshaker Tier 4 to 3
Skycap'n Kragg Tier 3 to 4
Editor of the Heartpwn Legendary Crafting Guide:
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Thanks for taking the suggestions! :)
Obey C'Thun, Praise The Darkness, Pet Hakkar, the Soulflayer, Love Yogg-Saron, Hope's End
Right now, Wardruid Loti is almost a staple in any druid deck, from token to highlander quest. I know it is a little early to say something like this, but I think she should be moved from tier 3 to tier 2.
Wow. Somebody who actually likes boomsday like me xD
Terrorsquid66, To be fair, Boomsday's legendaries did get a post launch buff from the Rise of the Mech patch though (buffing Luna's Pocket Galaxy, The Storm Bringer, Flark's Boom-Zooka, and Dr. Morrigan as well as adding the amazing SN1P-SN4P) which even if you exclude the buffs, SN1P-SN4P alone raises the power level.
Anyway, we've had almost 3 days of Saviors of Uldum, and while the meta is by no means settled, we can look at some trends and at least see how wrong I was. It's still pretty early; craft at your own risk.
Quests are a fun thing as unlike other cards they always start in your hand unless you mulligan them away. This means that
horseplay'shsreplay's played win rate may be pretty close to what the card's actual win rate is.The winner of the "Worst quest in the set" goes to the warlock quest! Congratulations! While I personally didn't think it was good, I am a little disappointed that it's doing worse than the warrior quest... the one that I rated on par with the druid quest (yes Highwayman37, you were right there. I was still right with Reno though). The big winner here is the paladin quest with people early on realizing that the best way of making
mummiesuse of it was to grit your teeth, play a bunch of bad reborn minions, and by turn 7 put down Mechano-Egg and start Making Mechies. This doesn't mean that the other quests are not worth playing, it just means that they have a lot of refinement to do. Shameless link.So grats to all who got good quests. I got the warlock quest... just like I did in Un Goro... :P
So let's look at the Zephrey and the League of Singleton Explorers. I'm including the deck win rate here as well as just the played WR is decieving.
Highlander hunter and mage are doing pretty well. Druid is doing less so. What's going on with highlander paladin though? Highlander paladin isn't a thing, instead people are playing highroll paladin. Highroll paladin uses Prismatic Lens to pull out Tip the Scales and swap the costs with a minion (most likely a murloc) and flood the board early for a hopeful win. If that doesn't work, they fall back on using Zephry and Sir Finley and lastly Chef Nomi to try to pull out a win. This explains Sir Finley's low played win rate without having to think that he's just a terrible draw from Underbelly Angler.
So what are some other winners and losers? Armagedillo is the best performing card, but control warrior already had a great shell (hehe). King Phaoris and Siamat are the neutral legendaries to keep an eye on (performing roughly as well as Zephrey) and Vessina and Dark Pharaoh Tekahn are rounding out the top 5 of the rest. High Priest Amet is the last to have a positive deck and play WR. Colossus of the Moon has a high play WR but a low deck WR which is very odd as the most popular deck that runs it tries to cheat it to the board with Duel!. This may be an outlier.
Anka, the Buried is doing abysmal, which is not surprising in early experimental decks of this type. Octosari is also doing pretty badly which is probably explainable as no one knows what to do with it.
Recommended crafts? NONE! But... Zephrey if you want to play singleton decks, King Phaoris and Siamat if you want collection flexibility, any one of the top 5 quests (they are fun and are performing OK), Tekahn if you want to climb the ladder, and Armagedillo if you hate fun.
Ha, yes I was way off base with Reno. Haven't looked at stats but nice to see that two of the Highlander decks are doing well.
King Phaoris is a big surprise, I don't think many thought that would be a good card.