I honestly had no idea Quest Rogue was so much of a problem, I've never lost to a Quest Rogue with Midrange Hunter.
For aggro and agressive midrange decks is not a problem, for anything a bit slower than that is the nightmares, a lost match from the start.
While 30/70% win rates against Crystal Rogue (see DataReaper links in signature) aren't great odds, I would argue that it is only a loss from the start if one doesn't plays to their outs or just intends to concede each time after the quest is played. However, people are free to concede hard matches or matches they just don't like if they choose to.
Meta would be more diverse, if this thing did not exist. Priest for example - only silence Priest is viable, cause dragon, control, kazakus just loose to QR.
I have a different perspective on the current meta - I think this is the most diverse meta we've had in a long time, even with the inclusion of Crystal Rogue, whose numbers have shrank since the start of the Un'Goro meta.
DataReaper (see links in signature) tracks four different archetypes for Priest; Each of those has enough recorded plays in their sample set to be considered statistically relevant, meaning that patterns inferred from that data can be accepted as plausibly representing the greater whole for which only Blizzard has the whole picture. While Priest struggles against Crystal Rogue in general, Silence Priest may simply have an easier time adjusting its play style and playing to its outs against Crystal Rogue.
Just played a QR who completed the quest on turn 2, with 1 mana leftover.
But nah, this isn't fucking broken as shit.
/s
just played a druid who played turn 1 innervate + innervate + coin into double fledgling so NERF DRUID NOW !
honestly... shit happens
Agreed, Fledgling should also be nerfed.
I think that you should l2p or consider to quit HS.
I think you should know what the fuck you're talking about.
I know what I am talking about. You mentioned in other thread that you are "struggling to break rank 15 in standard". You are salty af and instead of trying to improve your gameplay, you are giving the fault to the meta or single cards. That is why I am telling you to l2p or to quit HS. There is no other solution for you since this meta is healthy and nothing is going to be nerfed. If you suck in HS, you can just try to improve or quit but just being salty about meta, fledgling or quest rogue is not a solution.
Healthy in the general sense that there's a diversity of playable decks, but that doesn't mean every single card is completely fine and we shouldn't even be discussing whether or not they're too strong.
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
There are always cards that are above average in quality. If the meta is fairly diverse, you deal with them. It's not like you can't play those same cards anyway, if you think they are that good. There's no fun in all cards being exactly the same.
Anyway, the quest rogue is declining steadily. The matchups are just too polarizing.
Lol why is this still a topic? I wish I would be able to feed on Quest rogue a bit while laddering but instead I'm sitting in a corner crying while hitting my fifth freeze mage in a row.
Lol why is this still a topic? I wish I would be able to feed on Quest rogue a bit while laddering but instead I'm sitting in a corner crying while hitting my fifth freeze mage in a row.
Well Freeze Mage has a pretty decent MU against Quest Rogue so if you want to "feed" on them you should give it a try.... And this is still a thing cause Freeze Mage loses to Eater of Secrets while there's not an actual counter to Quest Rogue beside playing an Aggro Deck....
Lol why is this still a topic? I wish I would be able to feed on Quest rogue a bit while laddering but instead I'm sitting in a corner crying while hitting my fifth freeze mage in a row.
Well Freeze Mage has a pretty decent MU against Quest Rogue so if you want to "feed" on them you should give it a try.... And this is still a thing cause Freeze Mage loses to Eater of Secrets while there's not an actual counter to Quest Rogue beside playing an Aggro Deck....
My point was rather that there are almost no quest rogues on ladder anymore. I was quite happy with my druid last month with the occasional quest rogue encounters. Now all you face is freeze mage and shaman. With the former pissing me off when you see them fishing for answers and always random finding something.
Heck I did encounter 3 cuthun warrior this month and only 1 quest rouge. (Rank 8 ATM if that is relevant)
Lol why is this still a topic? I wish I would be able to feed on Quest rogue a bit while laddering but instead I'm sitting in a corner crying while hitting my fifth freeze mage in a row.
Well Freeze Mage has a pretty decent MU against Quest Rogue so if you want to "feed" on them you should give it a try.... And this is still a thing cause Freeze Mage loses to Eater of Secrets while there's not an actual counter to Quest Rogue beside playing an Aggro Deck....
My point was rather that there are almost no quest rogues on ladder anymore. I was quite happy with my druid last month with the occasional quest rogue encounters. Now all you face is freeze mage and shaman. With the former pissing me off when you see them fishing for answers and always random finding something.
Heck I did encounter 3 cuthun warrior this month and only 1 quest rouge. (Rank 8 ATM if that is relevant)
Yeah I agree that the number is decreasing but I doubt it'll ever stop seeing play completely and it's so damn awful to play against that even facing it once every couple of days makes you rage (At least that's how I feel, and I'm playing Freeze Mage so I'd rather face Rogues then Priests spamming healing).... If you're using a slower Deck you're most likely screwed just cause you got paired with them and not something else.... I think the main problem isn't that the card itself is overpowered... It's that like Jade Idol the card is poorly designed... It's effect makes is so that Control Decks basically can't stand a chance no matter what they do....
P.S. I'd love to play some mirror matches so since you dislike Freeze so much just send them all to me.... All the Mages I see are spamming Secrets and snowbally 1 drops I wouldn't mind a change....
@Prudence94, I didn't see any Rogue last month, though I haven't played as much last month as the month before. The statistical win loss rate in DataReaper against Crystal Rogue for most Control decks is around 30/70% at worst, so while the match up against Crystal Rogue can be hard, Control Decks can still win that match up if they play to their outs and adopt the right mindset.
I mean yeah if you're looking at it from a purely competitive stance and are looking to maximize your wr, you should absolutely play it out and try to win your 30% of the time vs QR with control.
But generally/big picture, a big part of the problem with QR is that it is not an interactive experience or an enjoyable one. It's very polarizing (complete quest, win. don't complete it, probably don't win), and pushes more decks towards aggro in order to counter it (which is why "QR isn't a top tier deck/has a low WR in the current meta" is a bad argument).
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
@SchruteBucks, Absolutely, if one doesn't want to play a given match up there is nothing forcing them to do so outside of ladder ranking necessities.
I mainly comment on the statistical side of things concerning WR and meta trends because I find that information interesting to discuss. Everything else is a matter of subjective personal opinion and experience.
Well I think generally, Blizzard wants HS to be an enjoyable experience for their users. Not everyone is thinking in terms of "this deck has an X% wr vs Quest Rogue, so the fact that my opponent has permanent 5/5s on turn 4 is not really a big deal in the bigger picture, because I can always play something different." Personally, once I hit 5 for the month I like to screw around with deck building and playing at low ranks, and I'm not thinking about my specific wr....but QR is an automatic concede for me because it's simply not fun to play against.
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
@Prudence94, I didn't see any Rogue last month, though I haven't played as much last month as the month before. The statistical win loss rate in DataReaper against Crystal Rogue for most Control decks is around 30/70% at worst, so while the match up against Crystal Rogue can be hard, Control Decks can still win that match up if they play to their outs and adopt the right mindset.
Yes you can win that MU but it doesn't really depend on what you do,it depends on whether or not they draw decently.... And before you say that I don't have the right mindset,I'd like to point out that I'm one of those crazy people that would play a whole wildFreeze Mage vs Control game even if the odds say 85/15 for the Warrior.... Let's say I'm playing Control Paladin (something that doesn't run Murlocs) and that they complete the quest on turn 6/7,by that time I might have 2 maybe 3 midsize minions on the board how am I supposed to deal with an endless stream of 5/5s? I mean,at this point the Rogue is at barely half it's HP and beside the minions on the board (Which will get traded as soon as they complete the Quest and after that happens you can forget about having board control) I have basically nothing to burst him down... How am I supposed to win? I might clear the board once,maybe twice but I'll eventually run out of resources and their minions are on average bigger than mine... You can't even overcommit to the board cause they have Vanish... My point is that you don't really have outs as a Control Deck unless you can afford to race them cause you have some sort of finisher (i.e. Gromm,Leeroy+Cold Blood).... If my win condition is something like N'zoth there's not much I can do.... I know I should pressure them but I can't (or at least not to point where I can kill them after losing the board) cause that's not what my Deck is supposed to do....
Just played a QR who completed the quest on turn 2, with 1 mana leftover.
But nah, this isn't fucking broken as shit.
/s
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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Healthy in the general sense that there's a diversity of playable decks, but that doesn't mean every single card is completely fine and we shouldn't even be discussing whether or not they're too strong.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
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There are always cards that are above average in quality. If the meta is fairly diverse, you deal with them. It's not like you can't play those same cards anyway, if you think they are that good. There's no fun in all cards being exactly the same.
Anyway, the quest rogue is declining steadily. The matchups are just too polarizing.
Lol why is this still a topic? I wish I would be able to feed on Quest rogue a bit while laddering but instead I'm sitting in a corner crying while hitting my fifth freeze mage in a row.
"この 先は 暗い 夜道 だけが も 知らない それでも信じて 進むんだ 星が その道 を 少し でも 照らしてくをるのを"
"この 先は 暗い 夜道 だけが も 知らない それでも信じて 進むんだ 星が その道 を 少し でも 照らしてくをるのを"
@Prudence94, I didn't see any Rogue last month, though I haven't played as much last month as the month before. The statistical win loss rate in DataReaper against Crystal Rogue for most Control decks is around 30/70% at worst, so while the match up against Crystal Rogue can be hard, Control Decks can still win that match up if they play to their outs and adopt the right mindset.
I mean yeah if you're looking at it from a purely competitive stance and are looking to maximize your wr, you should absolutely play it out and try to win your 30% of the time vs QR with control.
But generally/big picture, a big part of the problem with QR is that it is not an interactive experience or an enjoyable one. It's very polarizing (complete quest, win. don't complete it, probably don't win), and pushes more decks towards aggro in order to counter it (which is why "QR isn't a top tier deck/has a low WR in the current meta" is a bad argument).
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
@SchruteBucks, Absolutely, if one doesn't want to play a given match up there is nothing forcing them to do so outside of ladder ranking necessities.
I mainly comment on the statistical side of things concerning WR and meta trends because I find that information interesting to discuss. Everything else is a matter of subjective personal opinion and experience.
Well I think generally, Blizzard wants HS to be an enjoyable experience for their users. Not everyone is thinking in terms of "this deck has an X% wr vs Quest Rogue, so the fact that my opponent has permanent 5/5s on turn 4 is not really a big deal in the bigger picture, because I can always play something different." Personally, once I hit 5 for the month I like to screw around with deck building and playing at low ranks, and I'm not thinking about my specific wr....but QR is an automatic concede for me because it's simply not fun to play against.
Kaladin's RoS Set Review
Join me at Out of Cards!
Ya know what, the fact that this has over 1000 posts means its even more polarizing than pre-nerf Yogg-Saron...
Which as I just mentioned, was nerfed, even though he could lose the game.
Which means I hope this gets hit with the nerf hammer soon so that we can all move on.
"この 先は 暗い 夜道 だけが も 知らない それでも信じて 進むんだ 星が その道 を 少し でも 照らしてくをるのを"