I don't understand you genius people. Rogue will never have to play it as 1/2 because of its hero power. But at least there is a possibility that Warrior and Shaman haven't got the minion and weapon at the same time.
Why do you offer Rogue, really? Only Warrior plays a real pirate deck.
Make it a Battlecry, that way you need to have weapon before playing it, it doesn't kill the card, and it makes it fare. What do you think?
Feels too much like bloodsail raider. I also like the decision making involved (withholding attacking with a weapon to preserve the buff for another turn) and counterplay (ooze).
I can also see Bloodsail Raider getting nerfed to 2/2, it's really a 5/2 most of the time anyway making it a 2 mana ice ranger with pirate synergy.
Instead of calling for the nerfing of this stuff, people should call for more 2/3 mana aoe and draw engines that are incompatible with aggro. That use the best fix, but then we will just see a bunch of whining about how OP mid-range is (the whiners will just call it aggro anyway, since they are a bunch of morons).
Power creep isn't the answer. It will just break the meta completely. Nerf a few problem cards instead.
I like your idea, seems to apply balance to all relevant classes that run this little guy. I honestly think having it read gain +1 attack would be a fair nerf. Doesn't ruin the card but doesn't let it trade with all the 1 man 1/3 cards.
+1 instead of +2 would be a reasonable nerf and wouldn't be the nerf overkill that Bilizzard sometimes resorts to.
Yup, a 2/2 with pirate tag for 1 mana and getting patches with it is still absolutely insane.
A proposed nerf may not be a cry but its certainly at the very least talking casually to the heavens as opposed to stay on the ground discussing if its beneficial or not for the game.
I don't believe that the card, in isolation, is broken (I think I made that clear, and I expect many would disagree). What it allows on turn 1 and 2 is out of proportion with the rest of the game, because of other factors. It allows for a much stronger board state than Imp Gang Boss or Cogmaster, for multiple reasons. Brode/Ayala pretty much admitted as much (one could argue whether there was an outright admission). Assuming that this is a problem, and to combat this, there are multiple solutions; make the card weaker, make the things that make the card strong weaker, remove the card, or strengthen countermeasures somehow. Or leave it and let the meta, the Oozes and Harrison Joneses take care of it.
I think that some discussion of what is fundamentally the issue here is a good idea, and Hearthpwn is the place for some theoretical discussion. My idea was to limit what makes it strong (slightly increase the condition to bring its power level in line with other conditional 1-drops). Other people suggested that the problem is with what makes it strong - the availability of cheap and powerful weapons. Some people do cry to the heavens, it is, after all, and Internet forum :) So I think the discussion here does address the fundamentals of why it seems unbalanced (as defined as being in so many decks due to seeming so powerful) and theorises as to possible fixes.
As to the meta dealing with it - yes, it's possible for the meta to deal with it, and I've posted elsewhere about how Patches/STB is not the evil cancer that some make them out to be. But I also acknowledge that forcing the entire meta to respond to one or two cards (or "the Pirates Package") is pushing the spirit of the game somewhat. Hence the postulation of a very subtle nerf.
Small-time bucaneer should be nerfed because it's a neutral card and that means Rogue's can always buff if it they choose to do so. It's more powerful because they can reliably buff it on turn 2 if they wanted to. That means they can do turn 2 5 damage split into 3 (patches 1 + Bucaneer 3 + hero power 1), which makes it ridiculously overpowered.
This is by no means a salt thread. I believe that from what Blizzard said about the percent of decks using certain cards that Small Time Buccaneer will be nerfed.
I think an adequate nerf without sending the card into oblivion would be to change the text from "Has +2 attack while you have a weapon equipped" to "Gain +1 attack whenever you equip a weapon". Not only would this make it a 1/2 when played, but you would have to equip a new weapon in order to give it any bonus. No more sitting on rusty hook with 1 durability so your Buccaneers are 3/2's
It's something new and I don't think it would be too bad. Small Time Buccaneer has been the most gimped card I've seen since Grim Patron (gimped means the card is nearly impossible to balance without making it too OP or too bad). If you raise its attack or bonus attack, it has far too good of stats, and if you lower the attack buff it barely gets up past the general value carried by a 1 mana minion. If you lower its health it becomes way too easy to remove, but if you raise it it becomes something that you have to use turn 2 removal spells on and give way for the 2 drop cards that are inevitably going to come down. With your change, Small-Time Buccaneer would be really strong in Rogue since Rogues can equip weapons every turn if they want to, and it would bring the problem of being a card that acts as a turn 2 spell-magnet on an even worse level than what it is now, because if you can't get rid of it then it spirals completely out of control. I mean, it would lower the value of the card immediately after it being played, but it would give Pirate Warrior more power in the long run. And since Pirate Warrior's greatest weakness is that it doesn't have power in the long run, giving that to it could be risky...
I disagree with you about it being really strong in Rogue as they would have to waste an extra 2 mana every turn just to get +1 attack where that could be spent on progressing the board with other minions.
As for pirate warrior, I'm not quite sure what you mean by giving it more power in the long run. Typically I see at most 3 weapons in a game from them which would make it a 4/2 if it had been around long enough for all of those weapons to be equipped. Wouldn't that make it significantly weaker since most likely it will be dead before it even reaches 3/2?
I predict he will just become a 1/1(3/1 with weapon) so he dies to any ping, but is still powerful if he lives. You are getting a free patches anyway. Also some classes may cut STB for some other 1or 2 mana pirate.
I actually think it's patches that deserves the nerf(mostly because when you summon him on turn 1 with any other pirate, it's still insanely good), but at the same time I have no idea how to nerf the card enough without making it useless.
If you just take away charge, it will still be broken(I heard 1 mana 3/2's that summon a 1/1 are pretty good).
If you make it a 0/1 no one will play it.
If you remove pirate tag, it basically does nothing.
Maybe giving it 50% chance to come out of the deck when you play a pirate? I hate RNG as much as the next guy, but I actually see no other way.
Apparently people here are none to familiar with how nerfs work. Remember Starving Buzzard? No one could have guessed that. When the new version accidentally showed up on some servers early, people believed the posted pics to be a hoax. Same thing with Warsong Commander nerf round 2 - completely different card. It could wind up being a 3 drop 2/2 gain a weapon charge when everything is said and done.
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Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Apparently people here are none to familiar with how nerfs work. Remember Starving Buzzard? No one could have guessed that. When the new version accidentally showed up on some servers early, people believed the posted pics to be a hoax. Same thing with Warsong Commander nerf round 2 - completely different card. It could wind up being a 3 drop 2/2 gain a weapon charge when everything is said and done.
No one is actually expecting blizzard to handle the nerf properly(ie making the card balanced without actually destroying it), but we are free to say how we would do it right?
Ok. Blizzard should literally just make it a 3 mana 3/3. Its about the same power level as the first one, only bigger and bulkier. Its still strong but late enough so aggro couldn't use it as an auto-include.
Make him a 1mana 3/2 "Whenever you summon a pirate, give your opponent a mana crystal."
Make him a 1 mana situational 3/2 whenever you equip a weapon, give this minion -3/-0
Make hima a 1mana 3/2 "whenever you equip a weapon, give this minion -1/-1"
I like his stat line as a 1 mana 3/2. I think it enables aggro to exist. He needs a downside though. I think punishing aagressive play is better than making him unplayable
I don't understand you genius people. Rogue will never have to play it as 1/2 because of its hero power. But at least there is a possibility that Warrior and Shaman haven't got the minion and weapon at the same time.
Why do you offer Rogue, really? Only Warrior plays a real pirate deck.
"Sit and come relax, riddle off the mac. It's the patch."
Make it a Grimy Goons card (triclass) so that you avoid seeing it in Rogue and Shaman (the biggest deck so far)
Wouldn't simply removing the Pirate tag fix a lot of things?
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I don't think STB would be problematic without patches and vice versa.
So for this reason I really like the proposed removal of the pirate tag.
Of course with the art and the name and all, highly unlikely to happen.
Small-time bucaneer should be nerfed because it's a neutral card and that means Rogue's can always buff if it they choose to do so. It's more powerful because they can reliably buff it on turn 2 if they wanted to. That means they can do turn 2 5 damage split into 3 (patches 1 + Bucaneer 3 + hero power 1), which makes it ridiculously overpowered.
Check out my Frozen Throne Evolve Shaman deck:
http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/903345-new-evolve-shaman
This is by no means a salt thread. I believe that from what Blizzard said about the percent of decks using certain cards that Small Time Buccaneer will be nerfed.
I think an adequate nerf without sending the card into oblivion would be to change the text from "Has +2 attack while you have a weapon equipped" to "Gain +1 attack whenever you equip a weapon". Not only would this make it a 1/2 when played, but you would have to equip a new weapon in order to give it any bonus. No more sitting on rusty hook with 1 durability so your Buccaneers are 3/2's
What are your thoughts on this?
It's something new and I don't think it would be too bad. Small Time Buccaneer has been the most gimped card I've seen since Grim Patron (gimped means the card is nearly impossible to balance without making it too OP or too bad). If you raise its attack or bonus attack, it has far too good of stats, and if you lower the attack buff it barely gets up past the general value carried by a 1 mana minion. If you lower its health it becomes way too easy to remove, but if you raise it it becomes something that you have to use turn 2 removal spells on and give way for the 2 drop cards that are inevitably going to come down. With your change, Small-Time Buccaneer would be really strong in Rogue since Rogues can equip weapons every turn if they want to, and it would bring the problem of being a card that acts as a turn 2 spell-magnet on an even worse level than what it is now, because if you can't get rid of it then it spirals completely out of control. I mean, it would lower the value of the card immediately after it being played, but it would give Pirate Warrior more power in the long run. And since Pirate Warrior's greatest weakness is that it doesn't have power in the long run, giving that to it could be risky...
I disagree with you about it being really strong in Rogue as they would have to waste an extra 2 mana every turn just to get +1 attack where that could be spent on progressing the board with other minions.
As for pirate warrior, I'm not quite sure what you mean by giving it more power in the long run. Typically I see at most 3 weapons in a game from them which would make it a 4/2 if it had been around long enough for all of those weapons to be equipped. Wouldn't that make it significantly weaker since most likely it will be dead before it even reaches 3/2?
I predict he will just become a 1/1(3/1 with weapon) so he dies to any ping, but is still powerful if he lives. You are getting a free patches anyway. Also some classes may cut STB for some other 1or 2 mana pirate.
I actually think it's patches that deserves the nerf(mostly because when you summon him on turn 1 with any other pirate, it's still insanely good), but at the same time I have no idea how to nerf the card enough without making it useless.
If you just take away charge, it will still be broken(I heard 1 mana 3/2's that summon a 1/1 are pretty good).
If you make it a 0/1 no one will play it.
If you remove pirate tag, it basically does nothing.
Maybe giving it 50% chance to come out of the deck when you play a pirate? I hate RNG as much as the next guy, but I actually see no other way.
Apparently people here are none to familiar with how nerfs work. Remember Starving Buzzard? No one could have guessed that. When the new version accidentally showed up on some servers early, people believed the posted pics to be a hoax. Same thing with Warsong Commander nerf round 2 - completely different card. It could wind up being a 3 drop 2/2 gain a weapon charge when everything is said and done.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Maybe make it a 1/1 that gets +1/+1 when weapon equipped?
<3 & s('- ^)V
Ok. Blizzard should literally just make it a 3 mana 3/3. Its about the same power level as the first one, only bigger and bulkier. Its still strong but late enough so aggro couldn't use it as an auto-include.
Making it a rogue card only would alleviate the issue since rogues still mostly suck anyways.
Make him a 1mana 3/2 "Whenever you summon a pirate, give your opponent a mana crystal."
Make him a 1 mana situational 3/2 whenever you equip a weapon, give this minion -3/-0
Make hima a 1mana 3/2 "whenever you equip a weapon, give this minion -1/-1"
I like his stat line as a 1 mana 3/2. I think it enables aggro to exist. He needs a downside though. I think punishing aagressive play is better than making him unplayable
Just ideas i had.