I was playing Warrior in Wild, mainly a control type deck with N'Zoth to resurrect all Deathrattle minions. But for some reason I face a Warlock using Demon Seed.
If I'm correct, Demon Seed is banned from Wild, isn't?
I was playing Warrior in Wild, mainly a control type deck with N'Zoth to resurrect all Deathrattle minions. But for some reason I face a Warlock using Demon Seed.
If I'm correct, Demon Seed is banned from Wild, isn't?
It is indeed banned, but your opponent was most likely using Whizbang the Wonderful which for some ungodly reason sometimes generates Demon Seed decks.
I think banned means you cannot add it to a wild deck, but if you build a standard deck (meaning all 30 cards are part of standard) then the system will not prevent you from queueing it in wild...
I think banned means you cannot add it to a wild deck, but if you build a standard deck (meaning all 30 cards are part of standard) then the system will not prevent you from queueing it in wild...
I've accidentally did that and been simply kicked out of queue without any explanations.
They need to unban Demon Seed and Stealer of Souls.
Exactly, only then will that mode return to be Wild again, as it was conceived ("you can play whatever cards you want as long as you have them in your collection"), otherwise that mode is nothing but a scam...
The fact of banning, nerfing or even not un-nerfing cards in Wild is a scandal since by doing so, its essence, its nature, its reason for being is unforgivably denied... But make no mistake, there is no hope, this company lost all trace of decency years ago.
They need to unban Demon Seed and Stealer of Souls.
Exactly, only then will that mode return to be Wild again, as it was conceived ("you can play whatever cards you want as long as you have them in your collection"), otherwise that mode is nothing but a scam...
The fact of banning, nerfing or even not un-nerfing cards in Wild is a scandal since by doing so, its essence, its nature, its reason for being is unforgivably denied... But make no mistake, there is no hope, this company lost all trace of decency years ago.
How many times must this topic be rehashed: The vast majority of Wild players I've encountered and heard from are totally fine with quality of life tweaks here and there. If you are some sort of purist like you seem to be claiming here, how much do you even play the mode? None? Would you actually do so if it was this crystalline thing you are describing?
I routinely get to Diamond 5 in both formats, and as it stands, Wild is healthier with Demon Seed banned. Honestly, I think some of the recent nerfs in Standard went too far (specifically Rogue) and some still didn't go far enough (I am so Goddamned tired of Quest Pirate Warrior in both formats). So Demon Seed is pretty far from a key thing to focus on in my mind.
I was playing Warrior in Wild, mainly a control type deck with N'Zoth to resurrect all Deathrattle minions. But for some reason I face a Warlock using Demon Seed.
If I'm correct, Demon Seed is banned from Wild, isn't?
It is indeed banned, but your opponent was most likely using Whizbang the Wonderful which for some ungodly reason sometimes generates Demon Seed decks.
Thanks
In fact, the opponent deck composition was similar to a standard warlock deck with the quest. So, it must be the Whizbang effect that allow him to play it in wild.
How many times must this topic be rehashed: The vast majority of Wild players I've encountered and heard from are totally fine with quality of life tweaks here and there. If you are some sort of purist like you seem to be claiming here, how much do you even play the mode? None? Would you actually do so if it was this crystalline thing you are describing?
I routinely get to Diamond 5 in both formats, and as it stands, Wild is healthier with Demon Seed banned. Honestly, I think some of the recent nerfs in Standard went too far (specifically Rogue) and some still didn't go far enough (I am so Goddamned tired of Quest Pirate Warrior in both formats). So Demon Seed is pretty far from a key thing to focus on in my mind.
Well, the truth is that I am very proud to admit that since Bli$$ard has slaughtered Wild mode (which was my main game mode) prostituting its reason for being (not allowing me playing with all cards in my collection), coupled with the fact that they have focused their efforts on game modes (such as Mercenaries or Battlegrounds) that have NOTHING to do with a collectible card game (which is what Hearthstone was supposed to be), or that to top it off, they no longer hide their sick urges to monetize every aspect of the game at the highest level, I barely play this game anymore or any of this greedy company and therefore I make much better use of my time (and my money).
Honestly, it causes me great sorrow and hurt, even embarrassment, to see how there are still many people dedicating their valuable time (and money) to such a base and unfortunate company. A pity, I feel sorry for all of them, I really hope they can realize soon of the enormous waste of time and money that Bli$$ard is causing them. In the meantime good luck, have my full support.
They need to unban Demon Seed and Stealer of Souls.
Exactly, only then will that mode return to be Wild again, as it was conceived ("you can play whatever cards you want as long as you have them in your collection"), otherwise that mode is nothing but a scam...
Well, that's a semantic argument. Not banning them would cause the power level to skyrocket, which would make it practically impossible for me to play Giant Mage.
Honestly, it causes me great sorrow and hurt, even embarrassment, to see how there are still many people dedicating their valuable time (and money) to such a base and unfortunate company. A pity, I feel sorry for all of them, I really hope they can realize soon of the enormous waste of time and money that Bli$$ard is causing them. In the meantime good luck, have my full support.
This is the very definition of a troll, folks. Claiming not to "waste time" on this game, claiming that even thinking about the game or the company causes immense emotional distress ... yet here they are, reading and posting on a FAN SITE dedicated to that very game and company.
Welcome to Ignore list oblivion.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Banning cards in wild is the lazy, kicking the can down the road band-aid for addressing real problems with cards, because you're gonna have to face the music when the card rotates out anyway.
What they need to do are backend/UI changes that allow for mutual exclusivity. For example, if you made The Demon Seed and Crystallizer mutually exclusive, you'd solve pretty much the main issue with that card in Wild. Mutual exclusivity would also go a long way to fixing other Wild issues as well as preventing more in the future.
Banning cards in wild is the lazy, kicking the can down the road band-aid for addressing real problems with cards, because you're gonna have to face the music when the card rotates out anyway.
What they need to do are backend/UI changes that allow for mutual exclusivity. For example, if you made The Demon Seed and Crystallizer mutually exclusive, you'd solve pretty much the main issue with that card in Wild. Mutual exclusivity would also go a long way to fixing other Wild issues as well as preventing more in the future.
There were other solutions I'd mentioned months ago that I'm amazed weren't considered. Such as the difference between the wording of "Take X damage on your turn" and "...each time your hero's Health changed during your turn". In this wording, 'Damage' and 'Health' are two totally different things: One rewards armor stacking and "damage" taking, without consequence. The other is the risk/reward gambit related to Warlock's identity.
Going back to Nefiret's comment, he doesn't think anything should change. Whereas I've posited before, that once cards are in the Wild bucket, changes should be able to be made without dust refunds and based on community feedback. I mean, at that point, why not? It's an exclusive club by definition and I'd LOVE a more hands on community design to guide the health of the meta, outside of the restrictions that the devs are under with making money through Standard and other formats.
Banning cards in wild is the lazy, kicking the can down the road band-aid for addressing real problems with cards, because you're gonna have to face the music when the card rotates out anyway.
What they need to do are backend/UI changes that allow for mutual exclusivity. For example, if you made The Demon Seed and Crystallizer mutually exclusive, you'd solve pretty much the main issue with that card in Wild. Mutual exclusivity would also go a long way to fixing other Wild issues as well as preventing more in the future.
Mostly this.
Not 100% sure about the specific implementation suggested, but any time a card gets banned from Wild is just going to cause infinitely more issues down the road.
As we can see with Nefiret, there definitely is a contingient who want to play their cards as-is in the Wild format, but when the mechanics of the card are so toxic as to render Wild unplayable (as Demon Seed and Soul Stealer did for the relatively brief time they were around) there almost is no way to reintroduce them without some massive fix to the underlying mechanics.
What I've always advocated for on the questline was that fatigue was just flat out removed from the equation, and that reflected damage had to come from cards or H.P. under either players control, rather than neutral game mechanics.
And for Stealer, really, what you need to do is just make it so that things costing health instead of mana aren't treated as damage that can be blocked with immune (or seed). As the mechanic works now, it just leaves the mechanic of "costs health instead of mana" at odds with the wording of other mechanics that do similar effects, but don't work that way. Reckless Flurry says you spend Armor, but it doesn't let you *not* lose armor if you're immune, so "spending health" should similarly be unreducible by immune.
How many times must this topic be rehashed: The vast majority of Wild players I've encountered and heard from are totally fine with quality of life tweaks here and there. If you are some sort of purist like you seem to be claiming here, how much do you even play the mode? None? Would you actually do so if it was this crystalline thing you are describing?
I routinely get to Diamond 5 in both formats, and as it stands, Wild is healthier with Demon Seed banned. Honestly, I think some of the recent nerfs in Standard went too far (specifically Rogue) and some still didn't go far enough (I am so Goddamned tired of Quest Pirate Warrior in both formats). So Demon Seed is pretty far from a key thing to focus on in my mind.
Well, the truth is that I am very proud to admit that since Bli$$ard has slaughtered Wild mode (which was my main game mode) prostituting its reason for being (not allowing me playing with all cards in my collection), coupled with the fact that they have focused their efforts on game modes (such as Mercenaries or Battlegrounds) that have NOTHING to do with a collectible card game (which is what Hearthstone was supposed to be), or that to top it off, they no longer hide their sick urges to monetize every aspect of the game at the highest level, I barely play this game anymore or any of this greedy company and therefore I make much better use of my time (and my money).
Honestly, it causes me great sorrow and hurt, even embarrassment, to see how there are still many people dedicating their valuable time (and money) to such a base and unfortunate company. A pity, I feel sorry for all of them, I really hope they can realize soon of the enormous waste of time and money that Bli$$ard is causing them. In the meantime good luck, have my full support.
I cannot imagine holding so much anger inside myself over a video game and still frequenting forums related to it. Why are you still here?
I mean, the immune effect itself needs a bit of an overhaul after what the Stealer did to wild. But if you want a bandaid fix, just unnerf stealer and increase its animation duration by 75-80%. You'll still do busted wild things, but won't have enough time to fully combo anymore.
As for the Seed, maybe change wording to life total decreasing. That way only first crystalizer counts to quest progression, and there's counterplay opportunity to delay them with armor vendors and NOT attacking their face while they have armor. Either way, Tamsin effect is problematic no matter what you do to the quest.
To the purists, remember when sniplock had positive matchups across the board except for mirror? Why would you want Wild to remain in such a trash fire state?
I cannot imagine holding so much anger inside myself over a video game and still frequenting forums related to it. Why are you still here?
Well the truth is that I have to confess that I suffer from a great addiction, as evidenced by all the amount of time and money (more than a thousand bucks) dedicated to this game, therefore I think I have my right to be critical and demanding.
It could seem strange but, while I try to get over my FOMO and unhook from this game step by step (something Blizzard itself is helping me a lot with), I admit that from time to time, I still read about how is going something that has taken up a lot of space in my life over the last years.
To the purists, remember when sniplock had positive matchups across the board except for mirror? Why would you want Wild to remain in such a trash fire state?
Let's see, the Wild mode was created so that we could play with ALL the cards that we had in our collection as they were originally created, not to try to be competitive... I mean, it shouldn't be a "serious" game mode, and therefore it would be necessary to evaluate if personal class/cards ban systems should be implemented or even if rewards should be received at all.
In my view, there should be three constructed game modes:
Standard: the "normal" constructed game mode, where we can use cards from this year and the previous one.
Casual (previously wild): the constructed game mode to play only for fun with whatever unnerfed cards we want as long as we had them in our collection; different or maybe no rewards; perhaps a system to exclude certain class/legendary we don't want to play against.
Wild (previously classic): a constructed game mode where we can play only with cards from specific sets (3 different ones for example) as they were designed; each MONTH those sets change randomly, so the meta would be always different.
Just a question.
I was playing Warrior in Wild, mainly a control type deck with N'Zoth to resurrect all Deathrattle minions. But for some reason I face a Warlock using Demon Seed.
If I'm correct, Demon Seed is banned from Wild, isn't?
It is indeed banned, but your opponent was most likely using Whizbang the Wonderful which for some ungodly reason sometimes generates Demon Seed decks.
I think banned means you cannot add it to a wild deck, but if you build a standard deck (meaning all 30 cards are part of standard) then the system will not prevent you from queueing it in wild...
no its whisbang 100%
They need to unban Demon Seed and Stealer of Souls.
no.
I've accidentally did that and been simply kicked out of queue without any explanations.
Exactly, only then will that mode return to be Wild again, as it was conceived ("you can play whatever cards you want as long as you have them in your collection"), otherwise that mode is nothing but a scam...
The fact of banning, nerfing or even not un-nerfing cards in Wild is a scandal since by doing so, its essence, its nature, its reason for being is unforgivably denied... But make no mistake, there is no hope, this company lost all trace of decency years ago.
How many times must this topic be rehashed: The vast majority of Wild players I've encountered and heard from are totally fine with quality of life tweaks here and there. If you are some sort of purist like you seem to be claiming here, how much do you even play the mode? None? Would you actually do so if it was this crystalline thing you are describing?
I routinely get to Diamond 5 in both formats, and as it stands, Wild is healthier with Demon Seed banned. Honestly, I think some of the recent nerfs in Standard went too far (specifically Rogue) and some still didn't go far enough (I am so Goddamned tired of Quest Pirate Warrior in both formats). So Demon Seed is pretty far from a key thing to focus on in my mind.
Thanks
In fact, the opponent deck composition was similar to a standard warlock deck with the quest. So, it must be the Whizbang effect that allow him to play it in wild.
Well, the truth is that I am very proud to admit that since Bli$$ard has slaughtered Wild mode (which was my main game mode) prostituting its reason for being (not allowing me playing with all cards in my collection), coupled with the fact that they have focused their efforts on game modes (such as Mercenaries or Battlegrounds) that have NOTHING to do with a collectible card game (which is what Hearthstone was supposed to be), or that to top it off, they no longer hide their sick urges to monetize every aspect of the game at the highest level, I barely play this game anymore or any of this greedy company and therefore I make much better use of my time (and my money).
Honestly, it causes me great sorrow and hurt, even embarrassment, to see how there are still many people dedicating their valuable time (and money) to such a base and unfortunate company. A pity, I feel sorry for all of them, I really hope they can realize soon of the enormous waste of time and money that Bli$$ard is causing them. In the meantime good luck, have my full support.
Well, that's a semantic argument. Not banning them would cause the power level to skyrocket, which would make it practically impossible for me to play Giant Mage.
Yes.
Because Demon Seed made so many cool cards finally playable, but now they're all dead again.
Cards like Hakkar, the Soulflayer, Ancient Shade, Riftcleaver or Chittering Tunneler
This is the very definition of a troll, folks. Claiming not to "waste time" on this game, claiming that even thinking about the game or the company causes immense emotional distress ... yet here they are, reading and posting on a FAN SITE dedicated to that very game and company.
Welcome to Ignore list oblivion.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Banning cards in wild is the lazy, kicking the can down the road band-aid for addressing real problems with cards, because you're gonna have to face the music when the card rotates out anyway.
What they need to do are backend/UI changes that allow for mutual exclusivity. For example, if you made The Demon Seed and Crystallizer mutually exclusive, you'd solve pretty much the main issue with that card in Wild. Mutual exclusivity would also go a long way to fixing other Wild issues as well as preventing more in the future.
There were other solutions I'd mentioned months ago that I'm amazed weren't considered. Such as the difference between the wording of "Take X damage on your turn" and "...each time your hero's Health changed during your turn". In this wording, 'Damage' and 'Health' are two totally different things: One rewards armor stacking and "damage" taking, without consequence. The other is the risk/reward gambit related to Warlock's identity.
Going back to Nefiret's comment, he doesn't think anything should change. Whereas I've posited before, that once cards are in the Wild bucket, changes should be able to be made without dust refunds and based on community feedback. I mean, at that point, why not? It's an exclusive club by definition and I'd LOVE a more hands on community design to guide the health of the meta, outside of the restrictions that the devs are under with making money through Standard and other formats.
Mostly this.
Not 100% sure about the specific implementation suggested, but any time a card gets banned from Wild is just going to cause infinitely more issues down the road.
As we can see with Nefiret, there definitely is a contingient who want to play their cards as-is in the Wild format, but when the mechanics of the card are so toxic as to render Wild unplayable (as Demon Seed and Soul Stealer did for the relatively brief time they were around) there almost is no way to reintroduce them without some massive fix to the underlying mechanics.
What I've always advocated for on the questline was that fatigue was just flat out removed from the equation, and that reflected damage had to come from cards or H.P. under either players control, rather than neutral game mechanics.
And for Stealer, really, what you need to do is just make it so that things costing health instead of mana aren't treated as damage that can be blocked with immune (or seed). As the mechanic works now, it just leaves the mechanic of "costs health instead of mana" at odds with the wording of other mechanics that do similar effects, but don't work that way. Reckless Flurry says you spend Armor, but it doesn't let you *not* lose armor if you're immune, so "spending health" should similarly be unreducible by immune.
I cannot imagine holding so much anger inside myself over a video game and still frequenting forums related to it. Why are you still here?
I mean, the immune effect itself needs a bit of an overhaul after what the Stealer did to wild. But if you want a bandaid fix, just unnerf stealer and increase its animation duration by 75-80%. You'll still do busted wild things, but won't have enough time to fully combo anymore.
As for the Seed, maybe change wording to life total decreasing. That way only first crystalizer counts to quest progression, and there's counterplay opportunity to delay them with armor vendors and NOT attacking their face while they have armor. Either way, Tamsin effect is problematic no matter what you do to the quest.
To the purists, remember when sniplock had positive matchups across the board except for mirror? Why would you want Wild to remain in such a trash fire state?
Well the truth is that I have to confess that I suffer from a great addiction, as evidenced by all the amount of time and money (more than a thousand bucks) dedicated to this game, therefore I think I have my right to be critical and demanding.
It could seem strange but, while I try to get over my FOMO and unhook from this game step by step (something Blizzard itself is helping me a lot with), I admit that from time to time, I still read about how is going something that has taken up a lot of space in my life over the last years.
Let's see, the Wild mode was created so that we could play with ALL the cards that we had in our collection as they were originally created, not to try to be competitive... I mean, it shouldn't be a "serious" game mode, and therefore it would be necessary to evaluate if personal class/cards ban systems should be implemented or even if rewards should be received at all.
In my view, there should be three constructed game modes: