so...let's get something over with before we start this thread...
i'm a pretty good player .. i started playing hearthstone right after gvg was released (roughly a year ago) and started taking interest in arena over ranked ..
after some months my skill level increased to the point that i got my first 12-0 with a low tier arena class (Warlock) ( i have screenshots but i dont know how to upload images on hearthpwn ! )
and started averaging like 6,7,8 wins sometimes way higher , odd times where the stars don't along and i get shitty rng i get like 5 wins or something
after blackrock released .. i stopped playing arena and started saving up gold for the expansion and played arena very rarely
then the grand tournament came about...this were everything got screwed
my lowest winrate used to be 5 with the shitiest deck in the world ...now i can hardly past 3 wins
sometimes i even get 2-3 or 1-3
so did arena became too much rng ??
or did the gap between the top teir classes (mages and paladins) and the lower tier ones (warlocks , shamans etc.) became too high and the game mode became too unbalanced
this is driving me insane ...
if anybody could offer some briefing or some info here it would be really appreciated ..
Luck is a fickle thing. For the past week, I've had really, really bad luck on my main account. I'm probably averaging somewhere between 3-4 wins.. but that was after a month of having a really big hot streak where I probably got 9 legendaries from arena runs. Just keep playing and know that it's luck when lose or when you win.
Btw, when I have managed to win 5 or 6 games, I end up getting 80 gold and a common card.. just overall baaaaaaaaad luck. And it seems like almost every opponent is topdecking against me. My last run was 2-3.. the first game was a Hunter who flared me on turn 3 after I played Mirror Entity + played a Silent Knight.
I’ve tried to adjust to a more value or control approach for TGT and generally play slower in this meta, but that’s not my style and my winrate fell significantly. In GVG/BRM I always liked the aggressive approach, so that’s what I’m doing now and its working in this meta for some classes. I have five 12 win results so far in TGT, three with Rogue, one with Paladin, and one with Warlock. I pretty much play Rogue or Warlock anytime it’s offered.
I’ve given up trying to learn how to draft Druid, Mage, Shaman, and Priest in this meta for now because I want to farm at a high winrate. Maybe OP is in the same situation as me and is only a strong player when going for the aggressive approach.
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4x Top 150 arena player #95 June 2017 6.80, #108 Aug 2017 7.67, #127 Feb 2018 Wildfest 7.7, #33 Nov 2018 7.53
HCT Challenger Finals qualifier: 2018 Season 1, 2, 3
Hm, why did you stop playing arena to save gold? If you averaged 6,7,8 wins, you should have been gaining gold by playing arena. Or at least it should have been +/- 0.
The meta in GvG was very different from the meta in TGT, so you probably haven't adapted yet. The meta is slower now, so very midrangy decks, which are neither aggressive in the earlygame, nor heavy on the lategame are doing worse. It's hard to say without knowing your decks or seeing how you play, but if you try to win on cardadvantage you need to draft more lategame right now.
RNG hasn't increased significantly, but the gaps between the classes have indeed increased a bit. Rogue and Paladin are on top, then Mage.
Still, you can get pretty high averages with every class ... except Warrior probably.
i just heared a new expansion was about to release so i didn't have the balls to spend one penny of my gold
and i dont think rouge and paladin are on top of mage ... i started playing arena daily a a weak ago... mage is by far the most common class i face in arena and the most powerful... an average mage deck can get far better results than a great rouge deck ...
paladin and mage are incomparable with the rest now ...since i very rarely meet other classes at high number of wins(which i dont reach alot btw)
I’ve tried to adjust to a more value or control approach for TGT and generally play slower in this meta, but that’s not my style and my winrate fell significantly. In GVG/BRM I always liked the aggressive approach, so that’s what I’m doing now and its working in this meta for some classes. I have five 12 win results so far in TGT, three with Rogue, one with Paladin, and one with Warlock. I pretty much play Rogue or Warlock anytime it’s offered.
I’ve given up trying to learn how to draft Druid, Mage, Shaman, and Priest in this meta for now because I want to farm at a high winrate. Maybe OP is in the same situation as me and is only a strong player when going for the aggressive approach.
5 12 wins since tgt came out!! thats pretty good ...but what do you say to a person who used to pull 12-11-10 wins maybe twice a day and now cant even get to 7 wins ?!?
I’ve tried to adjust to a more value or control approach for TGT and generally play slower in this meta, but that’s not my style and my winrate fell significantly. In GVG/BRM I always liked the aggressive approach, so that’s what I’m doing now and its working in this meta for some classes. I have five 12 win results so far in TGT, three with Rogue, one with Paladin, and one with Warlock. I pretty much play Rogue or Warlock anytime it’s offered.
I’ve given up trying to learn how to draft Druid, Mage, Shaman, and Priest in this meta for now because I want to farm at a high winrate. Maybe OP is in the same situation as me and is only a strong player when going for the aggressive approach.
5 12 wins since tgt came out!! thats pretty good ...but what do you say to a person who used to pull 12-11-10 wins maybe twice a day and now cant even get to 7 wins ?!?
Also, play the style and classes that you currently feel comfortable with and slowly over time learn the other classes.
And Paladin and Rogue are both better than Mage in TGT. There are lots of Mages because its a class a lot of people feel comfortable with and its still a very good tier 2 class.
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4x Top 150 arena player #95 June 2017 6.80, #108 Aug 2017 7.67, #127 Feb 2018 Wildfest 7.7, #33 Nov 2018 7.53
HCT Challenger Finals qualifier: 2018 Season 1, 2, 3
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
POPULARITY != QUALITY
Rogue was top tier arena class forever. It was mage>paladin>rogue>druid>everything else>warrior After tgt all that happened is that mage and pala swapped places and pala>mage.
But me, and lot of other players have best winrate over large amount of games with rogue over pala and mage, it compliments more tempo-agressive style better and draft is more consistent.
Popularity =/= success rate.
Some references to not talk from my a**:
Mageaverages 5.28 wins per arena with a 64.45% game win rate
21.67% of arenas played by our players are as Mage
Paladinaverages 5.07 wins per arena with a 63.41% game win rate 17.17% of arenas played by our players are as Paladin
Rogueaverages 4.99 wins per arena with a 63.03% game win rate 10.65% of arenas played by our players are as Rogue
Shamanaverages 4.91 wins per arena with a 62.61% game win rate 11.32% of arenas played by our players are as Shaman
Druidaverages 4.75 wins per arena with a 61.79% game win rate 11.92% of arenas played by our players are as Druid
Priestaverages 4.65 wins per arena with a 61.25% game win rate 9.03% of arenas played by our players are as Priest
Hunteraverages 4.64 wins per arena with a 61.21% game win rate 6.61% of arenas played by our players are as Hunter
Warlockaverages 4.52 wins per arena with a 60.61% game win rate 6.06% of arenas played by our players are as Warlock
Warrioraverages 4.51 wins per arena with a 60.47% game win rate 5.57% of arenas played by our players are as Warrior
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
Rogue was top tier arena class forever. It was mage>paladin>rogue>druid>everything else>warrior After tgt all that happened is that mage and pala swapped places and pala>mage.
But me, and lot of other players have best winrate over large amount of games with rogue over pala and mage, it compliments more tempo-agressive style better and draft is more consistent.
Popularity =/= success rate.
when i get to high wins and all i see is pala and mage doesn't mean they are the most popular ...
it means that they are the only classes the made it this far .. it means the most of the rouge players already lost 3 games ..
how does that make it the best class ?
it maybe the best class according to you .. that fine .. you seem to be confident in your rouge arena drafts .. but i am not and most people are not ...that doesn't make it the best class
iam sure warrior is somebody's best arena class too
There are REAL numbers across thousands of games for you.
Again - popularity != success rate
Your assumption of "not seeing class = it's bad" is just false. Accept it, it means it is less popular but very successful in hands of players who picks it. Deal with it.
And your try to accuse me "I am sure YOUR picks blah blah.." Yeah i brought statistics with me - you brought your "I don't see that class past 3-0"... So who here is deluding facts with own experience?
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
LOL, man. Rogue IS probably the best class in arena in the hands of a very good player, and you know why? Because as Kripparrian said in one of his recent videos (I recommend you to watch him), it counters paladins very hard, one of the most popular classes in arena. My average win rate with Rogue in arena now is around 9 wins... yeah, it is that good...
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
LOL, man. Rogue IS probably the best class in arena in the hands of a very good player, and you know why? Because as Kripparrian said in one of his recent videos (I recommend you to watch him), it counters paladins very hard, one of the most popular classes in arena. My average win rate with Rogue in arena now is around 9 wins... yeah, it is that good...
You must be a god. Seeing that in the arena is like seeing a unicorn
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
LOL, man. Rogue IS probably the best class in arena in the hands of a very good player, and you know why? Because as Kripparrian said in one of his recent videos (I recommend you to watch him), it counters paladins very hard, one of the most popular classes in arena. My average win rate with Rogue in arena now is around 9 wins... yeah, it is that good...
You must be a god. Seeing that in the arena is like seeing a unicorn
No, I'm not, but thanks for the comment :P. My average win rate with other classes is not that good, but I find Rogue to be insane in the current "arena meta", and I love that class since I started playing Hearthstone (well, almost in every medieval game I love rogues :P), so maybe having a lot of experience with it, also helps. I'm very sad when I can't choose it... ;)
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
LOL, man. Rogue IS probably the best class in arena in the hands of a very good player, and you know why? Because as Kripparrian said in one of his recent videos (I recommend you to watch him), it counters paladins very hard, one of the most popular classes in arena. My average win rate with Rogue in arena now is around 9 wins... yeah, it is that good...
You must be a god. Seeing that in the arena is like seeing a unicorn
just because rouge has a couple of cards that are strong against paladin's hero power doesn't make 'rouges counter paladin'..
maybe in ranked , but in arena i dont think so ...
and if what you're saying is true that rouge does counter paladin... you got mage which typically does counter rouge so yeah rouge still a tier 2 class in arena and a dead class in ranked in my opinion
So you basically created thread to deny facts and push your own agenda together with saltiness that you are not good enough in arena anymore?
You state rogue is "still tier 2" even tho it's tier 1 objectivelly being stronger than mage across playfield and stated to be #1 arena class by large amount of infinite players.
Maybe it's tier 2 class for lower-skill players like you probably because it's harder to draft and harder to play correctly, but if we are talking about it's performance across the board, it's easy to look at the numbers and see objective facts instead.
You also cannot simply state mage counters rogue. First of all it's not truth to my experience and the matchup comes largelly to the skill of rogue player and draft of mage player and there are 2 very different mage archetypes in arena.
The reasons why is rogue so strong vs. paladin in arena also doesn't boil down to your simplistic "good cards vs. pala heropower" - it's the fact that your average rogue deck has very high tempo specially in earlygame removal, performing good vs. shieldbot opener consistentally as the only class for example, higher chance to have mid removal for low hp flooding than any other class, low-rarity class specific cards effective in standart arena matchups for early game compared to some epic-locked cards from other classes.
Part of the reason classes can perform very differently in arena compared to constructed is rarity distribution of cards, not just the nature of draft itself.
you sure know how to be an a**hole when someone disagrees with you...
anyway your logic is vague ...you say that rouge is good in the hand of really good players but bad in the hand of shitty players like myself.. and that makes it the best arena class ?!
but this applies to everything .... mage is really really good in the hand of good players
paladin aswell
and i am sure that warrior is not bad in the hands of good players too
go ahead and play arena and see for yourself the "" incredible rouge meta ""
So you basically created thread to deny facts and push your own agenda together with saltiness that you are not good enough in arena anymore?
You state rogue is "still tier 2" even tho it's tier 1 objectivelly being stronger than mage across playfield and stated to be #1 arena class by large amount of infinite players.
Maybe it's tier 2 class for lower-skill players like you probably because it's harder to draft and harder to play correctly, but if we are talking about it's performance across the board, it's easy to look at the numbers and see objective facts instead.
You also cannot simply state mage counters rogue. First of all it's not truth to my experience and the matchup comes largelly to the skill of rogue player and draft of mage player and there are 2 very different mage archetypes in arena.
The reasons why is rogue so strong vs. paladin in arena also doesn't boil down to your simplistic "good cards vs. pala heropower" - it's the fact that your average rogue deck has very high tempo specially in earlygame removal, performing good vs. shieldbot opener consistentally as the only class for example, higher chance to have mid removal for low hp flooding than any other class, low-rarity class specific cards effective in standart arena matchups for early game compared to some epic-locked cards from other classes.
Part of the reason classes can perform very differently in arena compared to constructed is rarity distribution of cards, not just the nature of draft itself.
Listen to this guy, he really knows what he's talking about.
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so...let's get something over with before we start this thread...
i'm a pretty good player .. i started playing hearthstone right after gvg was released (roughly a year ago) and started taking interest in arena over ranked ..
after some months my skill level increased to the point that i got my first 12-0 with a low tier arena class (Warlock) ( i have screenshots but i dont know how to upload images on hearthpwn ! )
and started averaging like 6,7,8 wins sometimes way higher , odd times where the stars don't along and i get shitty rng i get like 5 wins or something
after blackrock released .. i stopped playing arena and started saving up gold for the expansion and played arena very rarely
then the grand tournament came about...this were everything got screwed
my lowest winrate used to be 5 with the shitiest deck in the world ...now i can hardly past 3 wins
sometimes i even get 2-3 or 1-3
so did arena became too much rng ??
or did the gap between the top teir classes (mages and paladins) and the lower tier ones (warlocks , shamans etc.) became too high and the game mode became too unbalanced
this is driving me insane ...
if anybody could offer some briefing or some info here it would be really appreciated ..
thanks in advance
My Awesome Decks
Luck is a fickle thing. For the past week, I've had really, really bad luck on my main account. I'm probably averaging somewhere between 3-4 wins.. but that was after a month of having a really big hot streak where I probably got 9 legendaries from arena runs. Just keep playing and know that it's luck when lose or when you win.
Btw, when I have managed to win 5 or 6 games, I end up getting 80 gold and a common card.. just overall baaaaaaaaad luck. And it seems like almost every opponent is topdecking against me. My last run was 2-3.. the first game was a Hunter who flared me on turn 3 after I played Mirror Entity + played a Silent Knight.
I’ve tried to adjust to a more value or control approach for TGT and generally play slower in this meta, but that’s not my style and my winrate fell significantly. In GVG/BRM I always liked the aggressive approach, so that’s what I’m doing now and its working in this meta for some classes. I have five 12 win results so far in TGT, three with Rogue, one with Paladin, and one with Warlock. I pretty much play Rogue or Warlock anytime it’s offered.
I’ve given up trying to learn how to draft Druid, Mage, Shaman, and Priest in this meta for now because I want to farm at a high winrate. Maybe OP is in the same situation as me and is only a strong player when going for the aggressive approach.
4x Top 150 arena player
#95 June 2017 6.80, #108 Aug 2017 7.67, #127 Feb 2018 Wildfest 7.7, #33 Nov 2018 7.53
HCT Challenger Finals qualifier: 2018 Season 1, 2, 3
i just heared a new expansion was about to release so i didn't have the balls to spend one penny of my gold
and i dont think rouge and paladin are on top of mage ... i started playing arena daily a a weak ago... mage is by far the most common class i face in arena and the most powerful... an average mage deck can get far better results than a great rouge deck ...
paladin and mage are incomparable with the rest now ...since i very rarely meet other classes at high number of wins(which i dont reach alot btw)
My Awesome Decks
5 12 wins since tgt came out!! thats pretty good ...but what do you say to a person who used to pull 12-11-10 wins maybe twice a day and now cant even get to 7 wins ?!?
My Awesome Decks
Look at 12 win decklists and see how much drafting has changed http://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/the-arena/9759-12-win-decklists?page=81
Also, play the style and classes that you currently feel comfortable with and slowly over time learn the other classes.
And Paladin and Rogue are both better than Mage in TGT. There are lots of Mages because its a class a lot of people feel comfortable with and its still a very good tier 2 class.
4x Top 150 arena player
#95 June 2017 6.80, #108 Aug 2017 7.67, #127 Feb 2018 Wildfest 7.7, #33 Nov 2018 7.53
HCT Challenger Finals qualifier: 2018 Season 1, 2, 3
oh yeah..rouge is the best class in arena ? ... then how do you explain the wild absence of the class in arena as my opponents are all mages and paladins ??!
lol the last time i've seen rouge in arena was when i had a shitty run and i was 1-2 or something :D
past 3-0 they are all mages and paladins .. sometimes other classes but very rarely ...certainly not rouge
My Awesome Decks
POPULARITY != QUALITY
Rogue was top tier arena class forever. It was mage>paladin>rogue>druid>everything else>warrior
After tgt all that happened is that mage and pala swapped places and pala>mage.
But me, and lot of other players have best winrate over large amount of games with rogue over pala and mage, it compliments more tempo-agressive style better and draft is more consistent.
Popularity =/= success rate.
Some references to not talk from my a**:
17.17% of arenas played by our players are as Paladin
10.65% of arenas played by our players are as Rogue
11.32% of arenas played by our players are as Shaman
11.92% of arenas played by our players are as Druid
9.03% of arenas played by our players are as Priest
6.61% of arenas played by our players are as Hunter
6.06% of arenas played by our players are as Warlock
5.57% of arenas played by our players are as Warrior
http://www.arenamastery.com/sitewide.php Showing all history stats, not affected by TGT very much. Rogue is clear 3rd overall.
https://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/3jh5zy/1_week_of_tgt_heartharena_mage_lost_its_throne_in/
Table showing stats from HEARTHARENA before tgt. Rogue clearly 3rd.
Table 25th aug-2nd sep (TGT) from HEARTHARENA showing paladin beating mage, Rogue 2nd ALSO beating mage.
when i get to high wins and all i see is pala and mage doesn't mean they are the most popular ...
it means that they are the only classes the made it this far .. it means the most of the rouge players already lost 3 games ..
how does that make it the best class ?
it maybe the best class according to you .. that fine .. you seem to be confident in your rouge arena drafts .. but i am not and most people are not ...that doesn't make it the best class
iam sure warrior is somebody's best arena class too
My Awesome Decks
Read my post after the edit.
There are REAL numbers across thousands of games for you.
Again - popularity != success rate
Your assumption of "not seeing class = it's bad" is just false. Accept it, it means it is less popular but very successful in hands of players who picks it. Deal with it.
And your try to accuse me "I am sure YOUR picks blah blah.." Yeah i brought statistics with me - you brought your "I don't see that class past 3-0"... So who here is deluding facts with own experience?
LOL, man. Rogue IS probably the best class in arena in the hands of a very good player, and you know why? Because as Kripparrian said in one of his recent videos (I recommend you to watch him), it counters paladins very hard, one of the most popular classes in arena. My average win rate with Rogue in arena now is around 9 wins... yeah, it is that good...
You must be a god. Seeing that in the arena is like seeing a unicorn
"This is our town Scrub"
No, I'm not, but thanks for the comment :P. My average win rate with other classes is not that good, but I find Rogue to be insane in the current "arena meta", and I love that class since I started playing Hearthstone (well, almost in every medieval game I love rogues :P), so maybe having a lot of experience with it, also helps. I'm very sad when I can't choose it... ;)
just because rouge has a couple of cards that are strong against paladin's hero power doesn't make 'rouges counter paladin'..
maybe in ranked , but in arena i dont think so ...
and if what you're saying is true that rouge does counter paladin... you got mage which typically does counter rouge so yeah rouge still a tier 2 class in arena and a dead class in ranked in my opinion
My Awesome Decks
So you basically created thread to deny facts and push your own agenda together with saltiness that you are not good enough in arena anymore?
You state rogue is "still tier 2" even tho it's tier 1 objectivelly being stronger than mage across playfield and stated to be #1 arena class by large amount of infinite players.
Maybe it's tier 2 class for lower-skill players like you probably because it's harder to draft and harder to play correctly, but if we are talking about it's performance across the board, it's easy to look at the numbers and see objective facts instead.
You also cannot simply state mage counters rogue. First of all it's not truth to my experience and the matchup comes largelly to the skill of rogue player and draft of mage player and there are 2 very different mage archetypes in arena.
The reasons why is rogue so strong vs. paladin in arena also doesn't boil down to your simplistic "good cards vs. pala heropower" - it's the fact that your average rogue deck has very high tempo specially in earlygame removal, performing good vs. shieldbot opener consistentally as the only class for example, higher chance to have mid removal for low hp flooding than any other class, low-rarity class specific cards effective in standart arena matchups for early game compared to some epic-locked cards from other classes.
Part of the reason classes can perform very differently in arena compared to constructed is rarity distribution of cards, not just the nature of draft itself.
you sure know how to be an a**hole when someone disagrees with you...
anyway your logic is vague ...you say that rouge is good in the hand of really good players but bad in the hand of shitty players like myself.. and that makes it the best arena class ?!
but this applies to everything .... mage is really really good in the hand of good players
paladin aswell
and i am sure that warrior is not bad in the hands of good players too
go ahead and play arena and see for yourself the "" incredible rouge meta ""
My Awesome Decks
Listen to this guy, he really knows what he's talking about.