I've been a bit disappointed by how many of the MSG cards I've actually seen. Don't know whether it's because the offering bonus is different, the card pool is larger or I've just been unlucky (have only played 6 runs so far) but on half my runs I haven't been offered a SINGLE class card from MSG.
The occurance bonus of MSG is only +50%. You will still see new cards often but they won't be seen as much as that in Karazhan. Consider the card pool is larger and that there are a lot of neutral commons in this expac, you will at most draft 2-3 of the same common class card, sometimes not at all.
I just had my first 12-run in Arena - I did it as Priest. I have to say, MSG has been unbelievably positive on the Priest Arena potential.
Kabal Talonpriest (I had 3) seems to be the most broken card in the deck. Compare with Dark Cultist (I had 1). Same stats, but one is a random Deathrattle, the other is a targeted Battlecry (which can also target untargetable minions - which is HUGE).
With the Kabal Talonpriest cards and the ability to heal, my small, early-game minions became seriously sticky mid-game sized minions, especially when combined with the likes of Kooky Chemist. These cards are impossible to overstate - the effect is like pre-healing before what would otherwise be a trade. They needed to fix Priest, and they did, in spades.
1- Still Mages all the time, everywhere, playing the exact same old cards with one Flamestrike on average per deck. Seriously almost every Mage I've played still cast Flamestrike at least once. When will it end?
2- The tri-class discover cards and the dude who makes potions can be really game-breaking or total garbage. I don't know how I feel about that. I like the discover aspect better because at least you get a choice, the one who gives a random potion... eh. The variance is too large. You can get a useless freeze of a giant board clear and no one can predict which will happen. I find that pretty stupid and unfun, generally.
3- So many Daring Reporters
4- Haven't seen a single person make any Jade cards work in any of my games nor any of the games I've watched.
5- Bomb Squad is really insane
6- Mistress of Mixtures add another annoying one drop that heavily favors all 1 damage hero power classes, or just Priest's stupid Talonpriest / power word. Could have done without that.
7- Abyssal Enforcer is ridiculous
8- Unliscensed Apothecary makes you die really fast but no one wants to kill it, it's kind of like a Fel Reaver
The hand buff mechanic hasn't been too strong against me. Really wish they had done something about Mage and not helped Priest with a really unfair card, though I really don't see that many priests anyway. Mage is still just stupidly better, or maybe people just default to that class at the start of every expansion. I don't know. Certainly if they finally just removed Flamestrike, it might change that.
Just did a 10-3 warlock run with 2 of this big dudes in my deck. Always MVP. If Doomguard didn't discard any in those 2-3 games I could've gone higher than 10 wins.
4- Haven't seen a single person make any Jade cards work in any of my games nor any of the games I've watched.
This is very telling in Arena.
Whereas for constructed, it can be game-breaking, subpar Jade synergy cards are popping up in the choices for Druid/Shaman/Rogue, effectively making them worse in Arena. Potions (effectively another word for spells) need no synergy, and so effectively buff Kabal classes in Arena.
Hand-buff cards can be strong, but slow down the game slightly, and so have a somewhat neutral effect on Arena.
I've played 36 arenas since MSG came out, and at over 7 wins, I've seen (Not all my games are tracked, this is just what I found in my tracker):
4- Haven't seen a single person make any Jade cards work in any of my games nor any of the games I've watched.
This is very telling in Arena.
Whereas for constructed, it can be game-breaking, subpar Jade synergy cards are popping up in the choices for Druid/Shaman/Rogue, effectively making them worse in Arena. Potions (effectively another word for spells) need no synergy, and so effectively buff Kabal classes in Arena.
Hand-buff cards can be strong, but slow down the game slightly, and so have a somewhat neutral effect on Arena.
I've played 36 arenas since MSG came out, and at over 7 wins, I've seen (Not all my games are tracked, this is just what I found in my tracker):
30% Mage
16% Paladin
16% Rogue
16%Priest
16% Warlock
6% Warrior
36 arenas in around 6 days!!! That is crazy. Either you really suck ( what i don't think ) or you play 9 hours arena a day.
4- Haven't seen a single person make any Jade cards work in any of my games nor any of the games I've watched.
This is very telling in Arena.
Whereas for constructed, it can be game-breaking, subpar Jade synergy cards are popping up in the choices for Druid/Shaman/Rogue, effectively making them worse in Arena. Potions (effectively another word for spells) need no synergy, and so effectively buff Kabal classes in Arena.
Hand-buff cards can be strong, but slow down the game slightly, and so have a somewhat neutral effect on Arena.
I've played 36 arenas since MSG came out, and at over 7 wins, I've seen (Not all my games are tracked, this is just what I found in my tracker):
30% Mage
16% Paladin
16% Rogue
16%Priest
16% Warlock
6% Warrior
36 arenas in around 6 days!!! That is crazy. Either you really suck ( what i don't think ) or you play 9 hours arena a day.
Been playing a crazy amount.. Win average of 4.5, which sucks according to most people online, but I'm quite happy with, especially including a 12-win.
I don't try for typical "strong minions only" arena decks - I often gamble with synergies. For example, I pick dragons, hoping I'll get more. Sometimes it pays off well, sometimes I end up with junk. I'm sure my winrate would be slightly higher if I only took high-tier cards/minions, but I don't really find that so fun.
I actually just attempted a Jade Golem Rogue arena - photo below. I took stuff like Coldlight, Gang Up, Shadowstep, etc. which are generally considered weak, and put together something OKish. But I couldn't get the golems above 5.
Just did a 10-3 warlock run with 2 of this big dudes in my deck. Always MVP. If Doomguard didn't discard any in those 2-3 games I could've gone higher than 10 wins.
Well I'm hoping they'll carry me because I just drafted a Warlock deck with only 1 2-drop (although a couple of 1-drops) but a ton of removal and 3x Abyssal Enforcers as well as a Dread Infernal, 3x Voidcallers, Kabal Trafficker, 3x Imp Gang Boss and 2x Crystalweaver, among other things. Not sure if I will be able to come back from the lack of early-game consistently but should be a fun deck. (And I wasn't even really that greedy in drafting, just didn't get offered any 2-drops past my 5th pick).
In my draft I only have 2 1-drops and 3 real 2 drops, but 2 Darkbombs are what makes me stay on the board until mid to late game. In this meta 2 drops are really rare, which makes decks hard to curve out well. I suggest you mulligan anything but 1, 2 ,3 drops because you won't be able to stablize if you take too much face damage in the early game.
I actually just attempted a Jade Golem Rogue arena - photo below. I took stuff like Coldlight, Gang Up, Shadowstep, etc. which are generally considered weak, and put together something OKish. But I couldn't get the golems above 5.
Yeah same thing when I tried Jade druid. I picked every single Jade card I could, was never good. They are only good when you get to like number 4 played, which means your deck would need like 8+.
I think only Shaman can get away with this because they have good standalone jade guys. The weapon is great, the jade lightning is AMAZING and the dude who makes a taunted jade is also pretty nice.
Shaman also benefits a lot more from multiple minions because of Flametongue totem, so even a 1/1 or 2/2 jade guy can trade up well.
For Rogue it seems bad. The 1/1 stealth is super terrible. The first one you play is a much much worse haunted creeper. People just ignore it and slap your face.
I think Blizzard should reconsider rebalancing some of the jade cards to make them more common in arena. I understand that buffing them or creating new ones would risk destroying Ranked, but in Arena they should all be at common rarity instead of half of them being rare. I don't think that would be degenerate and it would be the first time in arena that you get to actually craft a specific deck instead of just broad archetypes.
Yeah I'm really really hating the Kabal Chemist in arena. There's too many potions and too big a range between them. You can get a polymorph, which does literally nothing as your opponent always knowns what it is, or you can get the felfire potion, which threatens to clear any board or to deal 5 burst.
It's way too random and swingy, I hate that card, and it's common. What a huge mistake to have that in arena at that rarity imo
I actually just attempted a Jade Golem Rogue arena - photo below. I took stuff like Coldlight, Gang Up, Shadowstep, etc. which are generally considered weak, and put together something OKish. But I couldn't get the golems above 5.
Yeah same thing when I tried Jade druid. I picked every single Jade card I could, was never good. They are only good when you get to like number 4 played, which means your deck would need like 8+.
I think only Shaman can get away with this because they have good standalone jade guys. The weapon is great, the jade lightning is AMAZING and the dude who makes a taunted jade is also pretty nice.
Shaman also benefits a lot more from multiple minions because of Flametongue totem, so even a 1/1 or 2/2 jade guy can trade up well.
For Rogue it seems bad. The 1/1 stealth is super terrible. The first one you play is a much much worse haunted creeper. People just ignore it and slap your face.
I think Blizzard should reconsider rebalancing some of the jade cards to make them more common in arena. I understand that buffing them or creating new ones would risk destroying Ranked, but in Arena they should all be at common rarity instead of half of them being rare. I don't think that would be degenerate and it would be the first time in arena that you get to actually craft a specific deck instead of just broad archetypes.
Well I think what they do to put Jade cards not so common is really clever. If these cards are everywhere, the jade lotus classes will surely dominate the arena because of how powerful this synergy is. No skill is needed when you can just dump cards with low cost large stat (mid to late game). No doubt there would be some insane decks at high wins consist of a bunch of Jade cards, but overall keeping the Jade golem cards not too common is good for arena balance.
I agree that if Jade cards were too common then it would be pretty annoying to play against over and over, but as it is now they're too rare to make any impact ( usually ) so it's kind of a waste. Like you won't pick jade cards even early because the expected number you'll get is too low to make the risk worth it.
I really don't think the jade mechanic is that great in arena anyway, it could use a boost. The best part too is that even if it's a little too good, when the next expansion rolls around it'll kill the jade mechanic automatically anyway.
Talonpriest is so much worse than you'd think. I can't get a minion to ever live to be buffed and that's insane. You mostly only get the buff if you play it the same turn, or later in the game.
Like. The game is so degenerate that just having a minion live a turn = you win anyway lol.
I just went 12 with a sick Priest deck and I think I managed to on-curve buff something like one time out of 14 games. Makes me sad. But I guess it's good that it's not as insane as it seemed because it'd get real stupid real fast to play against. I don't know if I have some kind of PTSD but in the pre-naxx arena it felt like every time someone argent protectored your 2 drop it was an auto-loss lol. That was THE WORST THING EVER so I was scared that Priest would degenerate like that but in over 10 arenas I haven't seen the buff much of anything on-curve, only later in the game.
Maybe people are avoiding Priest and just defaulting to Mage?
I don't think Talonpriest alone does that much to help Priest suck less though. Even potion of madness is sort of awkward and more a mid-game play than that dream run a loot hoarder into a 3/2 scenario on turn 2 :p
Btw I love Warlock now.
The BlastCrystal potion is stupid as hell, Fellfire potion is sick as a finisher or a clear and same for Abyssal Enforcer which often can help trade your board of smaller guys into a bigger board. It makes it so awkward for your opponent to kill your small minions because they know on turn 7 it's Enforcer time, so they can't leave anything at 3.
Every single warlock I've faced at high wins had been sitting on an enforcer on turn 7. I played around it every time and eventually would see them just discard it to a soulfire lol.
Lol. Aggressive decks should just not be a thing in arena.
I'm beyond sick of these games where I don't even get to play or make a single decision.
edit: Seriously hearthstone is not a game where good one drops are viable. If I pay gold or money to play arena, I don't want to be kicked out of the game even before it starts just because my opponent goes like 1, 2, 1-2, 1-2-1 or some horeshit. Then I don't get to play my deck, I don't get to make decisions and if I lose I just have wasted my money and I'm frustrated. It's one of the worst experiences you can have in this game and they don't care AT ALL.
I had back to back games like this yesterday. I had drafted what I thought was a pretty sweet deck, but got just absolutely wrecked by aggro 1-2 drops before I could get established.
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"To build or destroy...only you decide which joy." - Last Crack
Like look at this shitty game: Implosion hits for 2, leaving the priest with a 3 health minion instead of nothing. Instant loss. But later I get another chance! I make a kazakus potion. Only the order I get is wrong, I have to pick polymorph effect before being offered damage. Great! Now I roll the polymorph one in two. Hit a 1/1 instead of the big minion.
? These are the most unfun games that can happen and why RNG and aggression has to be kept to an absolute strict minimum, because this is just downright stupid and practically a scam.
A card like Kabal Chemist shouldn't exist. They should stop making this kind of thing. Even Kazakus I thought at first was always a non-random pick, but they made it random for some absurdly dumb reason I can't fathom. So now the order and the choices are random and sometimes awful, sometime amazing. What could have been an incredibly complex high-skill card now turns into a dumb lottery half the time.
So thousands of games of hearthstone will now happen where players win or lose on coin flips, again, and no one likes those outcomes. Drawing poorly is part of card games. Sometimes your most important card is at the bottom, sometimes your starting hand is bad even if your deck is curved correctly. That's fine, that's part of the game, you can't change that.
But to constantly lose games because you didn't get a coin flip to go your way is stupid as hell.
Like. Why is Implosion designed this way? It should just be 3 damage and summon imps equal to the damage. That's the same card exactly on average, but it generates zero totally idiotic games. People would still play it and absolutely no one anywhere ever would go "Man wish this card's damage and imps were random".
Did they break paladin? 71% of games out of my 22 arena runs since launch have been against paladin and every single one of them have had insane decks and un-come-backable situations caused by all the Grimestreets and Smuggler Runs.
Look, I want to tell you something because you're very dear to me. And I hope you understand that it comes from the bottom of my damaged, damaged heart. You are the finest piece of ass I've ever had and I don't care who knows it. I am so glad that I got to roam those hillsides.
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I just had my first 12-run in Arena - I did it as Priest. I have to say, MSG has been unbelievably positive on the Priest Arena potential.
Kabal Talonpriest (I had 3) seems to be the most broken card in the deck. Compare with Dark Cultist (I had 1). Same stats, but one is a random Deathrattle, the other is a targeted Battlecry (which can also target untargetable minions - which is HUGE).
With the Kabal Talonpriest cards and the ability to heal, my small, early-game minions became seriously sticky mid-game sized minions, especially when combined with the likes of Kooky Chemist. These cards are impossible to overstate - the effect is like pre-healing before what would otherwise be a trade. They needed to fix Priest, and they did, in spades.
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So after like 10 arenas, what I notice:
1- Still Mages all the time, everywhere, playing the exact same old cards with one Flamestrike on average per deck. Seriously almost every Mage I've played still cast Flamestrike at least once. When will it end?
2- The tri-class discover cards and the dude who makes potions can be really game-breaking or total garbage. I don't know how I feel about that. I like the discover aspect better because at least you get a choice, the one who gives a random potion... eh. The variance is too large. You can get a useless freeze of a giant board clear and no one can predict which will happen. I find that pretty stupid and unfun, generally.
3- So many Daring Reporters
4- Haven't seen a single person make any Jade cards work in any of my games nor any of the games I've watched.
5- Bomb Squad is really insane
6- Mistress of Mixtures add another annoying one drop that heavily favors all 1 damage hero power classes, or just Priest's stupid Talonpriest / power word. Could have done without that.
7- Abyssal Enforcer is ridiculous
8- Unliscensed Apothecary makes you die really fast but no one wants to kill it, it's kind of like a Fel Reaver
The hand buff mechanic hasn't been too strong against me.
Really wish they had done something about Mage and not helped Priest with a really unfair card, though I really don't see that many priests anyway. Mage is still just stupidly better, or maybe people just default to that class at the start of every expansion. I don't know. Certainly if they finally just removed Flamestrike, it might change that.
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Just did a bad 9-3 with mage. Again half the games won with Flamestrike, every mage I played had flamestrike and I played a ton of them.
MSG changed nothing. They can release all the cards they want, until they remove Flamestrike or change the rarity, nothing will be different.
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I am not a Site Moderator
They are only good when you get to like number 4 played, which means your deck would need like 8+.
I think only Shaman can get away with this because they have good standalone jade guys. The weapon is great, the jade lightning is AMAZING and the dude who makes a taunted jade is also pretty nice.
Shaman also benefits a lot more from multiple minions because of Flametongue totem, so even a 1/1 or 2/2 jade guy can trade up well.
For Rogue it seems bad. The 1/1 stealth is super terrible. The first one you play is a much much worse haunted creeper. People just ignore it and slap your face.
I think Blizzard should reconsider rebalancing some of the jade cards to make them more common in arena. I understand that buffing them or creating new ones would risk destroying Ranked, but in Arena they should all be at common rarity instead of half of them being rare. I don't think that would be degenerate and it would be the first time in arena that you get to actually craft a specific deck instead of just broad archetypes.
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Yeah I'm really really hating the Kabal Chemist in arena.
There's too many potions and too big a range between them. You can get a polymorph, which does literally nothing as your opponent always knowns what it is, or you can get the felfire potion, which threatens to clear any board or to deal 5 burst.
It's way too random and swingy, I hate that card, and it's common. What a huge mistake to have that in arena at that rarity imo
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I agree that if Jade cards were too common then it would be pretty annoying to play against over and over, but as it is now they're too rare to make any impact ( usually ) so it's kind of a waste.
Like you won't pick jade cards even early because the expected number you'll get is too low to make the risk worth it.
I really don't think the jade mechanic is that great in arena anyway, it could use a boost. The best part too is that even if it's a little too good, when the next expansion rolls around it'll kill the jade mechanic automatically anyway.
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Talonpriest is so much worse than you'd think. I can't get a minion to ever live to be buffed and that's insane.
You mostly only get the buff if you play it the same turn, or later in the game.
Like. The game is so degenerate that just having a minion live a turn = you win anyway lol.
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I just went 12 with a sick Priest deck and I think I managed to on-curve buff something like one time out of 14 games. Makes me sad.
But I guess it's good that it's not as insane as it seemed because it'd get real stupid real fast to play against. I don't know if I have some kind of PTSD but in the pre-naxx arena it felt like every time someone argent protectored your 2 drop it was an auto-loss lol. That was THE WORST THING EVER so I was scared that Priest would degenerate like that but in over 10 arenas I haven't seen the buff much of anything on-curve, only later in the game.
Maybe people are avoiding Priest and just defaulting to Mage?
I don't think Talonpriest alone does that much to help Priest suck less though. Even potion of madness is sort of awkward and more a mid-game play than that dream run a loot hoarder into a 3/2 scenario on turn 2 :p
Btw I love Warlock now.
The BlastCrystal potion is stupid as hell, Fellfire potion is sick as a finisher or a clear and same for Abyssal Enforcer which often can help trade your board of smaller guys into a bigger board. It makes it so awkward for your opponent to kill your small minions because they know on turn 7 it's Enforcer time, so they can't leave anything at 3.
Every single warlock I've faced at high wins had been sitting on an enforcer on turn 7. I played around it every time and eventually would see them just discard it to a soulfire lol.
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God I'm sick of getting wrecked by one drops.
Lol.
Aggressive decks should just not be a thing in arena.
I'm beyond sick of these games where I don't even get to play or make a single decision.
edit: Seriously hearthstone is not a game where good one drops are viable. If I pay gold or money to play arena, I don't want to be kicked out of the game even before it starts just because my opponent goes like 1, 2, 1-2, 1-2-1 or some horeshit.
Then I don't get to play my deck, I don't get to make decisions and if I lose I just have wasted my money and I'm frustrated. It's one of the worst experiences you can have in this game and they don't care AT ALL.
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"To build or destroy...only you decide which joy." - Last Crack
Like look at this shitty game: Implosion hits for 2, leaving the priest with a 3 health minion instead of nothing. Instant loss. But later I get another chance! I make a kazakus potion. Only the order I get is wrong, I have to pick polymorph effect before being offered damage. Great! Now I roll the polymorph one in two. Hit a 1/1 instead of the big minion.
?
These are the most unfun games that can happen and why RNG and aggression has to be kept to an absolute strict minimum, because this is just downright stupid and practically a scam.
A card like Kabal Chemist shouldn't exist. They should stop making this kind of thing. Even Kazakus I thought at first was always a non-random pick, but they made it random for some absurdly dumb reason I can't fathom.
So now the order and the choices are random and sometimes awful, sometime amazing. What could have been an incredibly complex high-skill card now turns into a dumb lottery half the time.
So thousands of games of hearthstone will now happen where players win or lose on coin flips, again, and no one likes those outcomes. Drawing poorly is part of card games. Sometimes your most important card is at the bottom, sometimes your starting hand is bad even if your deck is curved correctly.
That's fine, that's part of the game, you can't change that.
But to constantly lose games because you didn't get a coin flip to go your way is stupid as hell.
Like. Why is Implosion designed this way? It should just be 3 damage and summon imps equal to the damage. That's the same card exactly on average, but it generates zero totally idiotic games. People would still play it and absolutely no one anywhere ever would go "Man wish this card's damage and imps were random".
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Yeah Blastcrystal Potion is really insane. I got Deathwing and Kel'Thuzad in 2 separate drafts, both got Blastcrystal Potioned and of course i lose the game. It is even harder to play around Warlock's various boardclears. If you trade, they will have Hellfire or Abyssal Enforcer. If you don't trade and try to go face, they will somehow have Power Overwhelming plus Shadowflame.
Did they break paladin? 71% of games out of my 22 arena runs since launch have been against paladin and every single one of them have had insane decks and un-come-backable situations caused by all the Grimestreets and Smuggler Runs.
Look, I want to tell you something because you're very dear to me. And I hope you understand that it comes from the bottom of my damaged, damaged heart. You are the finest piece of ass I've ever had and I don't care who knows it. I am so glad that I got to roam those hillsides.