Man. I'm facing this flesh since my hs's gamelife start. Everyday. Every Start.
If we care about this, we should meet each other (online) and play togheter! I just started a reddit sub about it: https://www.reddit.com/r/HSBuilders/
Why can't you understand that you're not alone in this world and everyone has his own idea of what fun means ?
Also, you blame people for not giving a shit about deck building, but your type of people doesn't strike me as particularly good deck builder. You're that guy who never plays or builds aggro decks because they require no skill, and that guy who never plays or builds T1-T2 decks because they are too popular, right ?
Last but not least, please show me a deck you've built that you consider not "copy and paste", and I will prove you wrong.
Because the only way to have fun is to WIN with a GOOD DECK right? I want to win or lose with my shitty/"good" deck while playing against more than 3 decks played by what essentially 3 different mindless drones. I have my own fun when I lose or win. Do you have a problem with the way I have fun?
If the only way to have fun is to WIN then half the player base would quit after losing.
I don't care about the way you have fun, go ahead and play your shit T5 homebrew I will gladly crush it with my T2 homebrew, you're the one with a problem here. I never said the only way to have fun is to win with a good deck. Make up whatever story you like to feel better about your selfishness but do not pretend that I told you the story.
All I'm saying is you shouldn't care about how I enjoy the game, and I shouldn't and certainly won't care about how you enjoy the game. It is for everyone and if the majority says "I want to netdeck to win more games", then you're going to face a majority of netdecks, and it's fine, and these people aren't intellectually inferior to you.
Now as I said, please show me one of your homebrew decks, I'll show you 1000 other people that have had the same idea for a deck and that you're nothing more than another robot.
There are about 23.5 million players in Hearthstone of course there will be 1000 players that share my deck idea. The question and problem is, why are they only 1000 players and where are they??? do I need to face 1000 Netdeck Paladin and 1000 Netdeck Mage to finally find someone with a semi unique deck idea?
This is the most "entitled kiddo" thing I read in a while. As if random players on the Internet are just here for your entertainment. Should we all just stop playing strong decks, just so you can have your fun?
I have seen aggro shaman, elemental spell damage shaman, evolve shaman (wtf, why?), beast druid, freeze mage, stronger versions of ctrl warrior/dr dh and so on. I really can't see your problem.
I've noticed that a LOT of my opponents are not playing decks that I WANT them to play. They're playing lame and unoriginal netdecks while I am playing my subpar "Special Snowflake" deck.
Could you at least have the decency to submit your deck list ahead of time so that I may let you know if I approve of your deck? If not, you are wasting MY valuable time.
Also, please don't try to tell me that I should let people play what THEY want. This is my internet and my game. Thank you in advance.
Sincerely,
Your Arrogant Little Special Snowflake
Always that one player that defends the opposing side for no reason other than to troll. Yes, you are completely right. This is my internet and I want everyone to behave like the way I do. It is not like the majority of Hearthstone's "internet" aren't behaving like "mindless drones by copy pasting decks with no original thought or display of unique individuality" already.
Now after we established that, now what? Are you happy? Did I gain your approval Mr. Random person on the internet?
Did you? You are the one whos complaining calling other people mindless robots because they dont play the game the way you like. Honestly the fact that you seem to be unaware that is what you are doing is baffling.
If you like the game, play it. If you dont like it dont. If you think you can make it better with at change voice your opinion, but do not shit on people for liking a game you so obliviously dont
Please convince me that people who netdeck aren't mindless robots. Why would I consider the two players "FaceHugger" and "FaceMelter" ,that both play the same Aggro Hunter deck with the same "play a card as soon you draw it" basic strategy, as two different individuals if humans at all even? If the game had more decision making that really differentiate between player A and player B then I will start considering people as humans and not robots again.
Decision making? In Hearthstone? Get out of here you bot. If you want decision making I suggest chess.
i always netdeck because i lack the skill to create a deck. But i never play tier 1 decks and brainless aggro or some broken uninteractive combo. so i'd say i don't think netdecking is the problem, the problem is that 95% play the same boring stuff.
It would be amazing if people could earn gold/exp playing just their friends. Then we could go all out with crazy stuff. But it's prone to botting and stuff so we'll probably never see it
Show me a game where people don't share strategies, builds, decks etc.
This complaint is so incredibly childish and naive. The game is designed for decks to be shared, that's why they implemented a deck code feature. It's really basic, human nature, to look for and share efficient, effective ways of doing things. It's across all industries, game guides, walkthroughs, cheat codes etc have existed for decades.
Plenty of people craft strong, synergistic decks, others simply don't have the time, so they use resources that share these, like this site.
What this boils down to is you want to be able to make a bad deck and win with it. That's what your complaint is. If your deck is consistently losing, it's a bad deck. You can call it a homebrew to get your little sense of superiority all you like but if it's losing consistently, you clearly aren't good at identifying a win condition and building a strategy around it.
You're obviously building ineffective decks, literally anyone can do that but it's inefficient, time consuming and less fun. You know it's less fun because otherwise you wouldn't be here kicking off about it.
If I want to play football using my own set of made up rules, like only being able to take 2 touches before I have to pass, only being able to shoot from outside the box and no sprinting, I can cry all I like abiut my 'own' way of playing football and that nobody is playing by my rules and so I'm getting crushed and why can't people be original and do things like only use their weaker foot, that makes the game more fun to me!?!?
Because it's shite, that's why and if I want to impose my own crappy rules on how I play that'd fine but I guarantee as soon as I start to complain that other people are just copying each other and playing properly, so I'm not having fun, then I'm getting laughed off the pitch.
You aren't cool or original for making a crappy deck, if that's how you have fun then fine, but you are in the minority, your way of having fun isn't shared by the majority of players. So get off your high horse and accept that if you play the way you want to play, you're going to win less, because you're using bad decks and you aren't as good a deck builder as you think you are. I can make a homebrew using yeti and co because 'it's fun for me' but the fact that I'm playing a unique deck doesn't mean it's a good thing, it doesn't mean I'm playing 'correctly'. It means I'm playing a shitty deck and there's probably a good reason other people haven't designed it. I'm not special for coming up with a crap deck that others wouldn't think of putting together.
Such a lame, boring thing that a minority of snowflakes seem to love complaining about. It's literally all in your head, you're winding yourself up and blaming other people.
I've noticed that a LOT of my opponents are not playing decks that I WANT them to play. They're playing lame and unoriginal netdecks while I am playing my subpar "Special Snowflake" deck.
Could you at least have the decency to submit your deck list ahead of time so that I may let you know if I approve of your deck? If not, you are wasting MY valuable time.
Also, please don't try to tell me that I should let people play what THEY want. This is my internet and my game. Thank you in advance.
Sincerely,
Your Arrogant Little Special Snowflake
Always that one player that defends the opposing side for no reason other than to troll. Yes, you are completely right. This is my internet and I want everyone to behave like the way I do. It is not like the majority of Hearthstone's "internet" aren't behaving like "mindless drones by copy pasting decks with no original thought or display of unique individuality" already.
Now after we established that, now what? Are you happy? Did I gain your approval Mr. Random person on the internet?
Did you? You are the one whos complaining calling other people mindless robots because they dont play the game the way you like. Honestly the fact that you seem to be unaware that is what you are doing is baffling.
If you like the game, play it. If you dont like it dont. If you think you can make it better with at change voice your opinion, but do not shit on people for liking a game you so obliviously dont
Please convince me that people who netdeck aren't mindless robots. Why would I consider the two players "FaceHugger" and "FaceMelter" ,that both play the same Aggro Hunter deck with the same "play a card as soon you draw it" basic strategy, as two different individuals if humans at all even? If the game had more decision making that really differentiate between player A and player B then I will start considering people as humans and not robots again.
I mean I would try to, but there are no point arguing with stupid people online... If you are in doubt ask yourself why do I lose with a deck more than other people?
Net decking is actively supported by blizzard. The codes ready to be copied and pasted, the bundle to buy a battle ready deck, the fact they allow trackers, you name it.
It works for them as it makes match making much easier, they can control win rates whilst collecting data from the same 10 decks rather than hundreds dyi ones. As long as blizzard actively promotes net decking, it will be a feature of the game we like it or not
I was thinking, is not just every game there is "netdecked"?
Even games like FIFA, which is far ahead from HS you find the same builds on ultimate team because they work the best.
Or lets say Runescape where people copy the best player killer styles from online pro's.
Every game there is people are looking on the internet for the best strategies. Then it is up to YOU to make the best of the deck and master it with skill. And you can't break a game which is played by millions and millions of people just because your Nagrand Slam pops of your Clown and makes it corrupt. Then be angry because you were to slow and call everyone else brainless aggro people. I am honestly trying to get the point you are making, but i just don't get it.
No, I will not waste my time for the part of the game I don't find interesting just to prove anything to you. I like piloting decks and recognizing how to do it optimally to maximize my winrate, not building them. If I know there is a guy, or training group, or data analyst who can produce better builds, why would I compete with them? I already build decks every time when I play the mode where I should do it and every deck is different (Arena), I build my decks eventually for the mode I don't care about my winrate and just need one win (Tavern Brawl). In constructed it would only hurt my gaming experience unless I want to try specific tech choice or something. That doesn't make me or anyone with the same mindset a mindless robot.
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English is not my native language, so, with a high probability, mistakes were made.
OP doesn't understand that to have fun in hearthstone you don't have to craft decks from scratch. You can, for example, netdeck but change a card or two or three. You will feel that you made something of your own, especially if you suprise your opponents.
Netdecking is here to stay, probably best if you came to terms with it, not even someone's fault in particular, it's already part of the fabric of the game. In contrast to game design decisions like priest playing 3 soul mirrors by turn 9. For that you can actually blame someone.
If you are not a robot then please prove that you have a sense of individuality by going to the dreaded forbidden deck builder menu, create your own deck and play it for at least 10 games.
Bronze rank, no one creates their own decks. Silver none, Gold none, etc. Even casual mode have standard netdecked decks lurking around.
I'd consider myself more sane when I watch paint dry everyday than to force myself to play against another copy and paste deck.
1. Not everyone plays TCGs to make decks
2. Deckbuilding is a relatively advanced skill in TCGs
3. All good homebrew players have built meta knowledge by playing netdecks extensively
What some people don't see is that strong synergies in such a small card pool as the standard format is are always limited. If you don't want to play an arena deck in standard mode, which is not a good idea, you will always come back to the same basic archetypes a class offers. If you play Paladin for example, you can choose between a Secret package, a Dude package, a Libram package, a Menagerie package, a Commencement package and a Rally! package, or a combination of those. Basically anything else doesn't have enough synergy for a good deck. The only room for optimization now is basically to swap around certain cards to adapt to a specific meta, but the core will remain the same. Playing Libram of Hope without Aldor Attendant and Aldor Truthseeker is not a show of individualism, but of stubbornness or stupidity. If you count all those basic archetypes from all classes together, there might be something around 40 or 50 core builds in standard mode (just a very rough estimate), out of which probably only 10-20 are competitive enough to have a positive winrate (depending on the player's skill, maybe some more). These only differ by very few cards (up to 5 or 6, I'd say) and form the meta as it stands.
And yes, there are people like Mark McKz, Chump or Roffle playing super fun combo meme decks and I enjoy watching and sometimes even playing those. But those will mostly never be competitive as much as you'd like them to be. So they're not usual ladder material, since it is a competitive mode.
What I will always agree to though, is that it is pointless to play meta decks on lower ranks with a decent star bonus. When you can climb with 30% winrate, then that's the time to experiment. People that play Face Hunter on those stages are an enigma to me. But still, they're entitled to do so.
Why can't you understand that you're not alone in this world and everyone has his own idea of what fun means ?
Also, you blame people for not giving a shit about deck building, but your type of people doesn't strike me as particularly good deck builder. You're that guy who never plays or builds aggro decks because they require no skill, and that guy who never plays or builds T1-T2 decks because they are too popular, right ?
Last but not least, please show me a deck you've built that you consider not "copy and paste", and I will prove you wrong.
Because the only way to have fun is to WIN with a GOOD DECK right? I want to win or lose with my shitty/"good" deck while playing against more than 3 decks played by what essentially 3 different mindless drones. I have my own fun when I lose or win. Do you have a problem with the way I have fun?
If the only way to have fun is to WIN then half the player base would quit after losing.
Who are you to say what makes the game fun or not for someone? You are so worked up about people not playing the way you want them to play based on your idea of fun that you made a thread on an online message board in order to vent. If the subject matter bothers you so much then find a dedicated group of players with homebrew decks on Discord or something; that way you can all take part in a form of competition more suited to your style of play while enjoying the smell of your own farts and relishing the fact that you're all SO much better than everyone else.
I mean, they're all at low ranks because they're playing bad decks.
I do often wonder, though, why people netdeck just so they can win some games. And it's not just a problem in Hearthstone or CCGs!
Look at the NFL, for example. So many teams are just full of mindless robots, using big offensive linemen, fast wide receivers, and the best quarterbacks they can find. Why don't they try mixing it up a little bit, instead of just copying what every other team does?
Basketball too! When was the last time you saw a center under 6' tall? Or a team go a whole game without running a pick and roll?
Heck, even in a pickup game of kickball the other day, the other team had their defense lined up like other "traditional" teams do! Sure we lost by ten runs, but at least we diversified some and played our entire defense backwards, in the infield. No mindless robots here!
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Man. I'm facing this flesh since my hs's gamelife start. Everyday. Every Start.
If we care about this, we should meet each other (online) and play togheter!
I just started a reddit sub about it: https://www.reddit.com/r/HSBuilders/
This is the most "entitled kiddo" thing I read in a while. As if random players on the Internet are just here for your entertainment. Should we all just stop playing strong decks, just so you can have your fun?
I have seen aggro shaman, elemental spell damage shaman, evolve shaman (wtf, why?), beast druid, freeze mage, stronger versions of ctrl warrior/dr dh and so on. I really can't see your problem.
Decision making? In Hearthstone? Get out of here you bot. If you want decision making I suggest chess.
i always netdeck because i lack the skill to create a deck. But i never play tier 1 decks and brainless aggro or some broken uninteractive combo.
so i'd say i don't think netdecking is the problem, the problem is that 95% play the same boring stuff.
It would be amazing if people could earn gold/exp playing just their friends. Then we could go all out with crazy stuff. But it's prone to botting and stuff so we'll probably never see it
Meta sucks, but at least Shaman is playable now.
Show me a game where people don't share strategies, builds, decks etc.
This complaint is so incredibly childish and naive. The game is designed for decks to be shared, that's why they implemented a deck code feature. It's really basic, human nature, to look for and share efficient, effective ways of doing things. It's across all industries, game guides, walkthroughs, cheat codes etc have existed for decades.
Plenty of people craft strong, synergistic decks, others simply don't have the time, so they use resources that share these, like this site.
What this boils down to is you want to be able to make a bad deck and win with it. That's what your complaint is. If your deck is consistently losing, it's a bad deck. You can call it a homebrew to get your little sense of superiority all you like but if it's losing consistently, you clearly aren't good at identifying a win condition and building a strategy around it.
You're obviously building ineffective decks, literally anyone can do that but it's inefficient, time consuming and less fun. You know it's less fun because otherwise you wouldn't be here kicking off about it.
If I want to play football using my own set of made up rules, like only being able to take 2 touches before I have to pass, only being able to shoot from outside the box and no sprinting, I can cry all I like abiut my 'own' way of playing football and that nobody is playing by my rules and so I'm getting crushed and why can't people be original and do things like only use their weaker foot, that makes the game more fun to me!?!?
Because it's shite, that's why and if I want to impose my own crappy rules on how I play that'd fine but I guarantee as soon as I start to complain that other people are just copying each other and playing properly, so I'm not having fun, then I'm getting laughed off the pitch.
You aren't cool or original for making a crappy deck, if that's how you have fun then fine, but you are in the minority, your way of having fun isn't shared by the majority of players. So get off your high horse and accept that if you play the way you want to play, you're going to win less, because you're using bad decks and you aren't as good a deck builder as you think you are. I can make a homebrew using yeti and co because 'it's fun for me' but the fact that I'm playing a unique deck doesn't mean it's a good thing, it doesn't mean I'm playing 'correctly'. It means I'm playing a shitty deck and there's probably a good reason other people haven't designed it. I'm not special for coming up with a crap deck that others wouldn't think of putting together.
Such a lame, boring thing that a minority of snowflakes seem to love complaining about. It's literally all in your head, you're winding yourself up and blaming other people.
I mean I would try to, but there are no point arguing with stupid people online... If you are in doubt ask yourself why do I lose with a deck more than other people?
Silver Hand Recruit
Net decking is actively supported by blizzard. The codes ready to be copied and pasted, the bundle to buy a battle ready deck, the fact they allow trackers, you name it.
It works for them as it makes match making much easier, they can control win rates whilst collecting data from the same 10 decks rather than hundreds dyi ones. As long as blizzard actively promotes net decking, it will be a feature of the game we like it or not
I was thinking, is not just every game there is "netdecked"?
Even games like FIFA, which is far ahead from HS you find the same builds on ultimate team because they work the best.
Or lets say Runescape where people copy the best player killer styles from online pro's.
Every game there is people are looking on the internet for the best strategies. Then it is up to YOU to make the best of the deck and master it with skill. And you can't break a game which is played by millions and millions of people just because your Nagrand Slam pops of your Clown and makes it corrupt. Then be angry because you were to slow and call everyone else brainless aggro people. I am honestly trying to get the point you are making, but i just don't get it.
Is someone complaining about Netdecks?
Crazy talk.
It's 2021. The internet has been around more than 30 years. Information is going to spread.
When my self made decks keep losing, yes I am going to netdeck .... at least as a starting point.
To not do so is foolish. I'm not here to be fodder to cancer decks, I'm here to play the decks that feed on the cancer decks.
No, I will not waste my time for the part of the game I don't find interesting just to prove anything to you. I like piloting decks and recognizing how to do it optimally to maximize my winrate, not building them. If I know there is a guy, or training group, or data analyst who can produce better builds, why would I compete with them? I already build decks every time when I play the mode where I should do it and every deck is different (Arena), I build my decks eventually for the mode I don't care about my winrate and just need one win (Tavern Brawl). In constructed it would only hurt my gaming experience unless I want to try specific tech choice or something. That doesn't make me or anyone with the same mindset a mindless robot.
English is not my native language, so, with a high probability, mistakes were made.
OP doesn't understand that to have fun in hearthstone you don't have to craft decks from scratch. You can, for example, netdeck but change a card or two or three. You will feel that you made something of your own, especially if you suprise your opponents.
Netdecking is here to stay, probably best if you came to terms with it, not even someone's fault in particular, it's already part of the fabric of the game. In contrast to game design decisions like priest playing 3 soul mirrors by turn 9. For that you can actually blame someone.
1. Not everyone plays TCGs to make decks
2. Deckbuilding is a relatively advanced skill in TCGs
3. All good homebrew players have built meta knowledge by playing netdecks extensively
4. All netdecks are just good homebrews
5. You're an idiot.
What some people don't see is that strong synergies in such a small card pool as the standard format is are always limited. If you don't want to play an arena deck in standard mode, which is not a good idea, you will always come back to the same basic archetypes a class offers. If you play Paladin for example, you can choose between a Secret package, a Dude package, a Libram package, a Menagerie package, a Commencement package and a Rally! package, or a combination of those. Basically anything else doesn't have enough synergy for a good deck. The only room for optimization now is basically to swap around certain cards to adapt to a specific meta, but the core will remain the same. Playing Libram of Hope without Aldor Attendant and Aldor Truthseeker is not a show of individualism, but of stubbornness or stupidity. If you count all those basic archetypes from all classes together, there might be something around 40 or 50 core builds in standard mode (just a very rough estimate), out of which probably only 10-20 are competitive enough to have a positive winrate (depending on the player's skill, maybe some more). These only differ by very few cards (up to 5 or 6, I'd say) and form the meta as it stands.
And yes, there are people like Mark McKz, Chump or Roffle playing super fun combo meme decks and I enjoy watching and sometimes even playing those. But those will mostly never be competitive as much as you'd like them to be. So they're not usual ladder material, since it is a competitive mode.
What I will always agree to though, is that it is pointless to play meta decks on lower ranks with a decent star bonus. When you can climb with 30% winrate, then that's the time to experiment. People that play Face Hunter on those stages are an enigma to me. But still, they're entitled to do so.
Ceterum censeo classum magi esse delendam.
Who are you to say what makes the game fun or not for someone? You are so worked up about people not playing the way you want them to play based on your idea of fun that you made a thread on an online message board in order to vent. If the subject matter bothers you so much then find a dedicated group of players with homebrew decks on Discord or something; that way you can all take part in a form of competition more suited to your style of play while enjoying the smell of your own farts and relishing the fact that you're all SO much better than everyone else.
I mean, they're all at low ranks because they're playing bad decks.
I do often wonder, though, why people netdeck just so they can win some games. And it's not just a problem in Hearthstone or CCGs!
Look at the NFL, for example. So many teams are just full of mindless robots, using big offensive linemen, fast wide receivers, and the best quarterbacks they can find. Why don't they try mixing it up a little bit, instead of just copying what every other team does?
Basketball too! When was the last time you saw a center under 6' tall? Or a team go a whole game without running a pick and roll?
Heck, even in a pickup game of kickball the other day, the other team had their defense lined up like other "traditional" teams do! Sure we lost by ten runs, but at least we diversified some and played our entire defense backwards, in the infield. No mindless robots here!