So many people copy each others decks, I only see original decks at the beginning few days of an expansion release. It's really sad to my eyes.
What do you guys think? I think it's one of the main reasons why HS becomes boring (couldn't find a better word) very quickly, and it's more of a grinding procedure playing the most flawless/high-performing decks.
You create a brand new deck, original AF, start playing.
You lose. You lose again. And again.
Even if you don't go to netdeck immediately, you do see what other people play. And built a deck after their example. And maybe win a game or two.
And the next guy who plays you thinks you're just netdecking, even if all you did was just recreating the deck you lost over and over against from memory.
In a competitive game, people play the things that win the most. If high winrate decks exist, the motivation is very low to innovate new decks that may or may not also have high winrates.
Side note: You're completely wrong that no one ever innovates new decks beyond the first few days after expac/balance patch. It took a solid couple of months before someone invented Keleseth Rogue.
Edit: there is a reason why people brag about having a high winrate with their "homebrew" decks -- homebrew decks are rarely, if ever, better than the established, high performing decks.
There once was a tale of Timmy, Johnny and Spike. Three Magic players.
Timmy liked to have fun and do weird and strange things and just have fun. Enjoying a deck is the most important part for this player.
Johnny likes to make decks and see if he can make an interesting card work. He sees making deck not as a part of card game, but THE part of the card game.
And Spike likes winning and to feel powerful. For the Spikes of this world winning equals fun. If they are not winning they aren´t having fun. They don´t care where the deck comes from, they care if it wins.
This applies to every card game. Now it´s difficult to fit exactly into this and a lot of people have a bit from another, but these are the general archetypes of the players that exist in card games.
Moral of this story everyone plays the game for a different reason, and neither of them is playing the one true way to play a card game. And neither of them is entitled to another player playing the game their way.
I don‘t know why so many people are complaining about this.. Why do you expect people playing bad decks?
Deckbuilding is time consuming and can be very frustrating, that‘s not everyones cake. I bet most people try something every now and then, get beaten up and return to netdecks. Because guess what, losing is not fun!
Every class has pretty much staples in their classic set and every expansion has only a few really good cards. Even if everybody would build their deck without netdecking the decks of people who understand the game would look really similar.
I really like deckbuilding but in hearthstone the synergies are very clear and if you dont want to end up with a trash deck you will use the same cards as most other people. The most used deckbuilding skill in hearthstone is swapping tech choices according to your matchups.
On the other side people dont have unlimited dust so obviously everybody wants to craft the strongest cards possible. So if you want to stay up to date with your collection you just cant craft gimmicky cards every expension if you dont want to invest a large amount of money.
Well it depends. I usually create theorycraft decks and play with them anywhere. Like I got in wild to 15 just playing a meme Dragon Paladin deck with 30 minions. I'm not really that interested in ranked and have just a Token Druid for when I want to play a few ranked games. Other than that I go full theorycraft. Yeah, you lose quite a lot with theorycraft decks and it may get frustrating facing netdecks in casual, but I can cope with that, knowing I used my mind to create my deck and didn't just copy someone else's deck.
by original, I mean things like Rat Trap + King Mukla sort of thing, which is a combo I've been using for a while, but I don't really see others using that sort of wacky combination of cards.
Expansion after expansion, I just strongly get the impression that ...
A. people net-deck for the highest win-rate. B. people fully copy a deck they saw on a video/stream.
the thing is, there are only so many possible decks with the cards available. I could find a deck on hearthpwn for every deck type I could think of. they are not all played on ladder, but that is to be expected.
not every deck type is good, and not every decktype is fun. but every decktype I could think of has been discovered and experimented with. then people go to ladder with the best few.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Rejoice, for even in death, you have become children of Thanos.
This happens with all card games. Like others have already said though why would you play less optimized decks in formats where you are either trying to hit a rank bench mark quickly, hit legend for the first time, or get in the top 100 of legend to try to accumulate legend points to qualify for things like HCTs?
As for casual I know I play fairly original decks, but even then you can only get so original before you start playing something that is very similar to somebody else's original idea. An original idea is only unique the very first time a single person makes it. After that your originality only comes in the form of how you adapt another person's invention.
Lose enough games with your own homebrew in casual. The more you lose the worse decks you'll see.
Don't go over rank 10, preferably rank 15. Whenever you're about to reach rank 15, just concede few games and then replay. At rank 20-10 you'll have a much higher chance to face original decks.
Stay at rank 5, 10, 15 or 20. Whenever you reach 1 rank higher, concede games until you drop to 0 stars at floor rank.
It does work. You'll still face a lot of meta decks, but now you will also start meeting more tier 3/4 decks as well as original homebrews.
I have 2 friends who like the game Hearthstone. Playing cards, minons, spells, the flavor of the game etc. but they cant build a deck. It is just not their thing. The knowledge of game mechanics, deckbuilding and everything is just not enough. So after every new expansion or after nerfs i take their accounts and search for some easy to play decks which they can use and win some games even if they make a lot of mistakes.
They would win 5% games with a selfmade deck ... and would have left the game after 2 weeks
There once was a tale of Timmy, Johnny and Spike. Three Magic players.
Timmy liked to have fun and do weird and strange things and just have fun. Enjoying a deck is the most important part for this player.
Johnny likes to make decks and see if he can make an interesting card work. He sees making deck not as a part of card game, but THE part of the card game.
And Spike likes winning and to feel powerful. For the Spikes of this world winning equals fun. If they are not winning they aren´t having fun. They don´t care where the deck comes from, they care if it wins.
This applies to every card game. Now it´s difficult to fit exactly into this and a lot of people have a bit from another, but these are the general archetypes of the players that exist in card games.
Moral of this story everyone plays the game for a different reason, and neither of them is playing the one true way to play a card game. And neither of them is entitled to another player playing the game their way.
You forgot Octav, the guy who plays nothing but Arena.
I agree that constructed becomes boring, but this is an inevitability, and I try not to roll my eyes when I'm up against a world champion deck at rank 17. Sometimes I fail to suppress my annoyance.
It's natural that, if there's 30 cards in a deck, people will try to use statistics to try to find what the best 30-card combination is. No one is giving out bonus points for originality. I personally have never directly copied a deck, but I can't because I don't own all the cards. I have other priorities, and I like deckbuilding more than I like even playing. It's okay if others prefer competition, and using statistics to find the best 30-card combination gives people a competitive advantage.
So many people copy each others decks, I only see original decks at the beginning few days of an expansion release. It's really sad to my eyes.
What do you guys think? I think it's one of the main reasons why HS becomes boring (couldn't find a better word) very quickly, and it's more of a grinding procedure playing the most flawless/high-performing decks.
Why does it make you sad that people who aren't good at deckbuilding are still unable to enjoy the game?
If you don't like playing against the competitive meta, make a bunch of friends who play original decks and play against them. You'll still be able complete quests and enjoy everything about Hearthstone, apart from cardbacks.
I really don't understand why all the people who constantly complain about this haven't banded together to form an off-meta league. (And if they have, I don't understand why they are still complaining.)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
So many people copy each others decks, I only see original decks at the beginning few days of an expansion release.
It's really sad to my eyes.
What do you guys think?
I think it's one of the main reasons why HS becomes boring (couldn't find a better word) very quickly, and it's more of a grinding procedure playing the most flawless/high-performing decks.
I guess the reason is this:
You create a brand new deck, original AF, start playing.
You lose. You lose again. And again.
Even if you don't go to netdeck immediately, you do see what other people play. And built a deck after their example. And maybe win a game or two.
And the next guy who plays you thinks you're just netdecking, even if all you did was just recreating the deck you lost over and over against from memory.
In a competitive game, people play the things that win the most. If high winrate decks exist, the motivation is very low to innovate new decks that may or may not also have high winrates.
Side note: You're completely wrong that no one ever innovates new decks beyond the first few days after expac/balance patch. It took a solid couple of months before someone invented Keleseth Rogue.
Edit: there is a reason why people brag about having a high winrate with their "homebrew" decks -- homebrew decks are rarely, if ever, better than the established, high performing decks.
There once was a tale of Timmy, Johnny and Spike. Three Magic players.
Timmy liked to have fun and do weird and strange things and just have fun. Enjoying a deck is the most important part for this player.
Johnny likes to make decks and see if he can make an interesting card work. He sees making deck not as a part of card game, but THE part of the card game.
And Spike likes winning and to feel powerful. For the Spikes of this world winning equals fun. If they are not winning they aren´t having fun. They don´t care where the deck comes from, they care if it wins.
This applies to every card game. Now it´s difficult to fit exactly into this and a lot of people have a bit from another, but these are the general archetypes of the players that exist in card games.
Moral of this story everyone plays the game for a different reason, and neither of them is playing the one true way to play a card game. And neither of them is entitled to another player playing the game their way.
I don‘t know why so many people are complaining about this.. Why do you expect people playing bad decks?
Deckbuilding is time consuming and can be very frustrating, that‘s not everyones cake. I bet most people try something every now and then, get beaten up and return to netdecks. Because guess what, losing is not fun!
What does the term original even mean here?
Every class has pretty much staples in their classic set and every expansion has only a few really good cards. Even if everybody would build their deck without netdecking the decks of people who understand the game would look really similar.
I really like deckbuilding but in hearthstone the synergies are very clear and if you dont want to end up with a trash deck you will use the same cards as most other people. The most used deckbuilding skill in hearthstone is swapping tech choices according to your matchups.
On the other side people dont have unlimited dust so obviously everybody wants to craft the strongest cards possible. So if you want to stay up to date with your collection you just cant craft gimmicky cards every expension if you dont want to invest a large amount of money.
Well it depends. I usually create theorycraft decks and play with them anywhere. Like I got in wild to 15 just playing a meme Dragon Paladin deck with 30 minions. I'm not really that interested in ranked and have just a Token Druid for when I want to play a few ranked games. Other than that I go full theorycraft. Yeah, you lose quite a lot with theorycraft decks and it may get frustrating facing netdecks in casual, but I can cope with that, knowing I used my mind to create my deck and didn't just copy someone else's deck.
by original, I mean things like Rat Trap + King Mukla sort of thing, which is a combo I've been using for a while, but I don't really see others using that sort of wacky combination of cards.
Expansion after expansion, I just strongly get the impression that ...
A. people net-deck for the highest win-rate.
B. people fully copy a deck they saw on a video/stream.
A and B both become viral.
the thing is, there are only so many possible decks with the cards available. I could find a deck on hearthpwn for every deck type I could think of. they are not all played on ladder, but that is to be expected.
not every deck type is good, and not every decktype is fun. but every decktype I could think of has been discovered and experimented with. then people go to ladder with the best few.
Rejoice, for even in death, you have become children of Thanos.
This happens with all card games. Like others have already said though why would you play less optimized decks in formats where you are either trying to hit a rank bench mark quickly, hit legend for the first time, or get in the top 100 of legend to try to accumulate legend points to qualify for things like HCTs?
As for casual I know I play fairly original decks, but even then you can only get so original before you start playing something that is very similar to somebody else's original idea. An original idea is only unique the very first time a single person makes it. After that your originality only comes in the form of how you adapt another person's invention.
There are a few ways to face homebrews:
It does work. You'll still face a lot of meta decks, but now you will also start meeting more tier 3/4 decks as well as original homebrews.
If i am playing an original deck, if i have success im gonna share it so it becomes a netdeck then. You cant escape it...
I have 2 friends who like the game Hearthstone. Playing cards, minons, spells, the flavor of the game etc. but they cant build a deck. It is just not their thing. The knowledge of game mechanics, deckbuilding and everything is just not enough. So after every new expansion or after nerfs i take their accounts and search for some easy to play decks which they can use and win some games even if they make a lot of mistakes.
They would win 5% games with a selfmade deck ... and would have left the game after 2 weeks
You forgot Octav, the guy who plays nothing but Arena.
This will not change until they remove gold-farming from casual.
I agree that constructed becomes boring, but this is an inevitability, and I try not to roll my eyes when I'm up against a world champion deck at rank 17. Sometimes I fail to suppress my annoyance.
It's natural that, if there's 30 cards in a deck, people will try to use statistics to try to find what the best 30-card combination is. No one is giving out bonus points for originality. I personally have never directly copied a deck, but I can't because I don't own all the cards. I have other priorities, and I like deckbuilding more than I like even playing. It's okay if others prefer competition, and using statistics to find the best 30-card combination gives people a competitive advantage.
Another reason: u test and optimize your own deck alone, w/ a handful of games per day. The netdecks are tested by millions of people.
I don't think you've used the term "literally" correctly
I believe OP is saying "Fuck Spike Players" and I agree.
Johnny all the way!
Why does it make you sad that people who aren't good at deckbuilding are still unable to enjoy the game?
If you don't like playing against the competitive meta, make a bunch of friends who play original decks and play against them. You'll still be able complete quests and enjoy everything about Hearthstone, apart from cardbacks.
I really don't understand why all the people who constantly complain about this haven't banded together to form an off-meta league. (And if they have, I don't understand why they are still complaining.)
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland