First off: This is NOT a salty thread. So please don't tell me to stop complaining. It's just an idea. I reach rank 5-2 on average so i know how to adapt. But it's a fact that this forum is flooded with people who are actually complaining about either aggro or control (like Reno or freeze mage) ruining the game.
So how about this solution: Give players the option to choose between a 30-health mode and a (for example) 50-health mode.
The 50 health mode will be favored for midrange / control type decks. Players can go there to have longer and more thoughtful games, and not worry about losing to fast aggro decks in 3 turns without having a chance to react.
An alternative would be to start with 30 health and 10/20 armor, which would be better considering stuff like Reno Jackson and Alextraza.
The 30 health would be favored for aggro decks (like which is currently the case). Players can go there to have faster and more RNG based games, without winning vs control decks because they had no chance to react or losing because they draw the perfect removal at the perfect time.
Please tell me what you think about this idea, i'm open to feedback. I'm not saying it's perfect, it's just a quick idea and i know it has it's downsides, so please don't yell at me for 'not knowing what i'm talking about' : )
I would just play Jade Druid in a 50 Health mode, cause you would win against every other deck. With that amount of health I could safely take all the time in the world and slowly make 15/15+ Golems without a care of being burst down. You've just created an unhealthy meta in a theoretical concept.
If this mode would see any form of life, that would indeed require that the completely broken abomination of a card which is Jade Idol to be nerfed to the ground.
So we currently have this: One half of the player base playing Aggro / Pirate decks, and complaining that Jade / Reno / any other control decks are cancer. The other half vice versa.
So how about this solution: Give players the option to choose between a 30-health mode and a (for example) 50-health mode.
The 50 health mode will be favored for midrange / control type decks. Players can go there to have longer and more thoughtful games, and not worry about losing to fast aggro decks in 3 turns without having a chance to react.
The 30 health would be favored for aggro decks (like which is currently the case). Players can go there to have faster and more RNG based games, without winning vs control decks because they had no chance to react or losing because they draw the perfect removal at the perfect time.
Please tell me what you think about this idea, i'm open to feedback. I'm not saying it's perfect, it's just a quick idea and i know it has it's downsides, so please don't yell at me for 'not knowing what i'm talking about' : )
Lol, Blizzard would never implement something like that. They want this game to be usually super fast, they like to favour people that enjoy playing mindless aggro cancer. Blizzard wants them to feel special and powerful while playing the goddamn game (yeah, I know, it's f..king pathetic), they just want this people to think, at least for some moments, they just outsmarted their opponents, even if that is totally out of touch with reality. By making another mode with just more health (mostly for people that want to play control and midrange decks), Blizzard would be accepting publicly that this cancer aggro decks are blatantly powerful and people who play with them just win because of that. That is never going to happen bro, aggro players are Blizzard's spoiled children, don't you really know that already?
If you think I'm talking nonsense, just ask yourself why Blizzard did really nothing about the aggro problem yet. Do you really think they don't know about it? Lol, they laugh at us. We dream about a control meta, but that is just that, a dream... a dream that will never become true.
Do you know why Blizzard thought more deckslots would be complicated for people? Because they were just thinking like aggro players, that is it. They don't care about control ones, they just don't think about us, they just try to make this game around the mindset of people that play mostly with cancerous shit, but of course, they will ocassionally play with some super stupid gimmicky deck too, which is another reason why they released till now so many expensive and bad cards that only work once in a blue moon, instead of good ones to help control decks (there are some exceptions of course, like Reno Jackson, but as we already know, they are far from being enough). Don't get me wrong, I also enjoy playing with gimmick decks from time to time (and not all of them are stupid :P), but it seems that Blizzard even cares more about them than about control ones.
We have to accept it once and for all, this thing will never change, but at least we can keep complaining and have some fun while doing it. :)
In the end, this game, even if we love it, is nothing else than a joke...
Note: Sorry, I'm probably overreacting, it's just that I'm very pessimistic today. :P
Is a bad idea because the same decks would be played on 30 HP mode, otherwise aggro wouldn´t be the meta as EVERYONE would tech against them, so no, it does not solves those "problems"
One thing to keep in mind, is that having aggro fast decks is mandatory in a card game, people are complaining because they had to leave their comfort zone, but same as control was a big thing when Sludge Belcher was standard legal, aggro need to be a thing in a certain period of the game, rotation is all about eras, if you aim variance et fresh metagames, you MUST have different dominant gamestyles.
Not so long ago people were complaining about ResidentSleeper Control Warrior and asking for an armor cap or spells to destroy armor, and Blizzard killed that with a single card Jade Idol, not with armor cap or any destroy armor spell.
LOL, seriously? Mindless cancerous aggro decks have been a thing in most periods of this game, bro. And about Control Warrior, you realise people ask for nerfs about everything, don't you?
One thing to keep in mind, is that having aggro fast decks is mandatory in a card game, people are complaining because they had to leave their comfort zone, but same as control was a big thing when Sludge Belcher was standard legal, aggro need to be a thing in a certain period of the game, rotation is all about eras, if you aim variance et fresh metagames, you MUST have different dominant gamestyles.
Not so long ago people were complaining about ResidentSleeper Control Warrior and asking for an armor cap or spells to destroy armor, and Blizzard killed that with a single card Jade Idol, not with armor cap or any destroy armor spell.
LOL, seriously? Mindless cancerous aggro decks have been a thing in most periods of this game, bro. And about Control Warrior, you realise people ask for nerfs about everything, don't you?
If it was a thing most period of the game then why complain ? shouldn't be a habit now ? why do I read people talking about Wild, Sludge Belcher and Lightbomb from time to time when there's an aggro rant ?
I know people ask nerfs about everything, I'm familiar with this forum ;) people where asking for armor cap and destroy armor, these are not nerfs, these are game changes the same way would be to introduce a 50 health, not card nerfs but game changes.
Asking for an armor cap IS asking for a nerf to the warrior hero power and armor related cards.
Haha, you're damn right about the control-players complaining about aggro, but never heard an aggro-player complaining about control. So please don't trie to justify all of your whine-threads.
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-let´s negotiate: you concede and I let you live...
I would love to see this as a tavern brawl or something. I love the concept of a 50 health mode. It would be nice to test it out for a few days and see how the meta would shift within the transient environment that a brawl would provide.
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"Most believe there are two types of people who go into a crucible. The ones who become stronger from the experience and survive it, and the ones who die. But there's a third type. The ones who learn to love the fire" - Sebastian Blood
While an interesting concept, it is completely unfeasible. Anything aside from the Jade classes would be nigh-unplayable, and many cards would need rebalancing (especially Reno and Jade Idol). Changing health to 35 might be reasonable, but 50 would completely knock the game out of whack...
Instead of increasing starting health, I'd prefer an increase to starting mana- beginning a game at 3 (or even 4) mana would change the game substantially, but I don't think it would help the Jade decks too much.
I'd also like to see temporary card bans, either as part of a new format or as an addition to Ranked play. I'd be surprised to see them actually implement bans, though- getting an awesome new card and then being unable to use it would suck for a new player.
Today in my free brawl pack I got Barongeddon, then I had a cup of fresh green tea. As a result of that, I think Priest is OP because my keyboard is not a mechanical one. I hope Blizzard will address this issue.
It's been said before, but I'll say it again - simply increasing the health of the heroes does not instantly fix anything, and is not a 'simple' solution to anything. It would actually be a horrendously stale meta, from what I can tell.
You've already mentioned that Jade Idol, a 'completely broken abomination of a card' in your words, would need to be nerfed for this mode to exist, but really, Jade Idol isn't that strong in the current game. It only becomes obscenely broken in this new proposed mode. And it isn't the only problem.
More health means longer games. This means that Warrior will forever be heavily favoured in this mode, since they have the best ability to mitigate fatigue damage (which is almost a guarantee, since you still only have 30 cards in your deck), and also have the best ability to counter one of the most broken cards in this format, Alexstrasza. Next to Alexstrasza, you have Reno Jackson. 49 Health heal? Don't mind if I do! So there's Freeze/Reno Mage and Control Warrior (and Jade Druid if you don't nerf Jade Idol). I can't actually think of a viable deck for the other 6 classes. It would have to be a Reno deck, since its the only way they'd keep up, but Mage would just do it better since they have Ice Block. Maybe Eater of Secrets would be mandatory?
So instead of a varied meta with highs and lows for each class, you have Control Warrior forever dominating, with Freeze/Reno Mage and Jade Druid so long as Reno and Idol exist, and nobody techs in Secret destruction. If that's what's fun to you, then great, it'd be cool if Hearthstone had some sort of custom game mode where you could set hero Health so you could play your 45 minute games with friends. But as an actual gamemode, there is no way enough people would play it for it to be worth implementing.
I have a simpler solution. "What's that? Simpler than my simplest solution?! HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE" you say? Here. Simple. Adapt. Learn to play against the decks that destroy you. Your opinions aren't worth more than those of the people who play the decks you hate. Counter them. If you don't want to lose to the same decks, be better than them. If you don't want to play against them, play casual and hope you aren't against a fuckwit. If that doesn't work, go play wild, if none of these simple solutions appeal to you. Maybe Hearthstone isn't the game for you. Go play shadowverse, or Elder Scrolls Legends, or I assume like, Duelyst is good.
Haha, you're damn right about the control-players complaining about aggro, but never heard an aggro-player complaining about control. So please don't trie to justify all of your whine-threads.
Your opinions aren't worth more than those of the people who play the decks you hate. Counter them. If you don't want to lose to the same decks, be better than them. If you don't want to play against them, play casual and hope you aren't against a fuckwit. If that doesn't work, go play wild, if none of these simple solutions appeal to you. Maybe Hearthstone isn't the game for you.
Just... for fuck sake guys... I'm not complaining or whining here. It's just an idea. And like i said in the last sentence, which you two obviously didn't read: I know it's not perfect, i'm open to feedback. You two are not 'giving feedback', you're just being an asshole.
Besides, i reach rank 4-2 on average each month. So yes, i know how to adapt to my opponents. I just think it's not that fun to play aggro vs control or vice versa, since aggro just throws whatever they have on the board and goes face while the control guy prays to get their removal in time. Not much choices to be made there on both sides.
More health means longer games. This means that Warrior will forever be heavily favoured in this mode, since they have the best ability to mitigate fatigue damage (which is almost a guarantee, since you still only have 30 cards in your deck), and also have the best ability to counter one of the most broken cards in this format, Alexstrasza. Next to Alexstrasza, you have Reno Jackson. 49 Health heal? Don't mind if I do! So there's Freeze/Reno Mage and Control Warrior (and Jade Druid if you don't nerf Jade Idol). I can't actually think of a viable deck for the other 6 classes. It would have to be a Reno deck, since its the only way they'd keep up, but Mage would just do it better since they have Ice Block. Maybe Eater of Secrets would be mandatory?
I can see that there would be a lot of trouble with cards like Reno Jackson and Alexstraza. So how about other solutions like these:
- Both players start the game with 10 armor, like we already do in some Tavern Brawls. (I know the obvious problem with Shield Slam, just forget that one for a second ^^)
- Both heroes are immune for the first 3 turns. That way you can still start building a board in the first turns, but you can get heavily punished for just mindlessly throwing small minions on the board which can get cleared with a single AoE clear.
And for the fatigue problem, it could simply be possible to allow 40 card decks for this game mode?
Anyway, once again, i know this is not perfect and I'm open to solutions. To me, the game is just getting a bit stale in general. I would just really like to see another game mode (besides wild) that actually mixes up the rules a little which would encourage us to try out new decks.
Sounds more like Tavern Brawl then permanent addition. Lots of people like fast games, lots of people like slow games. It depends on the person, but HS seems to be going faster and faster
If this would happen,freeze mage could be top tier again.alexstrasza with deal 35 damage... this mode is unbalancable IMO cause freeze mage and control warrior are real deck types that could work so well.and renolock would stay in the meta,because reno with 35-40 would be so broken.
I don't understand why people wanna play games that last forever, seems really bad to incrase the health. Some people would like to be able to finsish our games before we die. It's already long games. If they would add a 15 sec mode i wouldn't mind 50 health, but as people needs a full minute to do some basic math something have gone wrong.
That would completely kill of Aggro and Combo-decks and make Control overpowered, so its a terrible idea. If you can't handle Aggro in its current variation (without any stupid rng-cards) then you should start teching against them and stop being so greedy. We even got a lot of anti-aggro tools in MSoG, so stop complaining and L2P.
If you would actually read my post instead of just the title you would know that my suggestion was to give players a choice between 30 and 50 health mode.
The whole idea of the 50 health mode is that control would be far better than aggro there, and aggro would be better in the 30 health mode. This way people can choose which deck they want to play against.
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First off: This is NOT a salty thread. So please don't tell me to stop complaining. It's just an idea. I reach rank 5-2 on average so i know how to adapt. But it's a fact that this forum is flooded with people who are actually complaining about either aggro or control (like Reno or freeze mage) ruining the game.
So how about this solution: Give players the option to choose between a 30-health mode and a (for example) 50-health mode.
The 50 health mode will be favored for midrange / control type decks. Players can go there to have longer and more thoughtful games, and not worry about losing to fast aggro decks in 3 turns without having a chance to react.
An alternative would be to start with 30 health and 10/20 armor, which would be better considering stuff like Reno Jackson and Alextraza.
The 30 health would be favored for aggro decks (like which is currently the case). Players can go there to have faster and more RNG based games, without winning vs control decks because they had no chance to react or losing because they draw the perfect removal at the perfect time.
Please tell me what you think about this idea, i'm open to feedback. I'm not saying it's perfect, it's just a quick idea and i know it has it's downsides, so please don't yell at me for 'not knowing what i'm talking about' : )
Interesting Idea actually! I definitely would support it
*Edit - The comment above mine is also true..
>>C-C-Combo!>Unstable Evolution FRENZY (Tavern Brawl)Is a bad idea because the same decks would be played on 30 HP mode, otherwise aggro wouldn´t be the meta as EVERYONE would tech against them, so no, it does not solves those "problems"
the problem is no the aggro . stop complaining and giving stupid recommendation
i play renolock, you know what deck i hate most?
is greedy control deck. 99% loses to them. because they play 20 legendary to out value you.
if blizzard change to 50 hp, you will meet even more that kind of greedy deck. really unhealthy meta and promote pay to win.
1 games also will last 30 min. they will take 80 s move every turn.
Haha, you're damn right about the control-players complaining about aggro, but never heard an aggro-player complaining about control. So please don't trie to justify all of your whine-threads.
-let´s negotiate: you concede and I let you live...
I would love to see this as a tavern brawl or something. I love the concept of a 50 health mode. It would be nice to test it out for a few days and see how the meta would shift within the transient environment that a brawl would provide.
"Most believe there are two types of people who go into a crucible. The ones who become stronger from the experience and survive it, and the ones who die. But there's a third type. The ones who learn to love the fire" - Sebastian Blood
Ranked in general should change every season.
More health, less health. Block some cards for one season. Something broken? No problem. Next season will be different. No needs for nerfs anymore.
Just change Alex to read "set your health to the half"
While an interesting concept, it is completely unfeasible. Anything aside from the Jade classes would be nigh-unplayable, and many cards would need rebalancing (especially Reno and Jade Idol). Changing health to 35 might be reasonable, but 50 would completely knock the game out of whack...
Instead of increasing starting health, I'd prefer an increase to starting mana- beginning a game at 3 (or even 4) mana would change the game substantially, but I don't think it would help the Jade decks too much.
I'd also like to see temporary card bans, either as part of a new format or as an addition to Ranked play. I'd be surprised to see them actually implement bans, though- getting an awesome new card and then being unable to use it would suck for a new player.
#gNOmeferatu
It's been said before, but I'll say it again - simply increasing the health of the heroes does not instantly fix anything, and is not a 'simple' solution to anything. It would actually be a horrendously stale meta, from what I can tell.
You've already mentioned that Jade Idol, a 'completely broken abomination of a card' in your words, would need to be nerfed for this mode to exist, but really, Jade Idol isn't that strong in the current game. It only becomes obscenely broken in this new proposed mode. And it isn't the only problem.
More health means longer games. This means that Warrior will forever be heavily favoured in this mode, since they have the best ability to mitigate fatigue damage (which is almost a guarantee, since you still only have 30 cards in your deck), and also have the best ability to counter one of the most broken cards in this format, Alexstrasza. Next to Alexstrasza, you have Reno Jackson. 49 Health heal? Don't mind if I do! So there's Freeze/Reno Mage and Control Warrior (and Jade Druid if you don't nerf Jade Idol). I can't actually think of a viable deck for the other 6 classes. It would have to be a Reno deck, since its the only way they'd keep up, but Mage would just do it better since they have Ice Block. Maybe Eater of Secrets would be mandatory?
So instead of a varied meta with highs and lows for each class, you have Control Warrior forever dominating, with Freeze/Reno Mage and Jade Druid so long as Reno and Idol exist, and nobody techs in Secret destruction. If that's what's fun to you, then great, it'd be cool if Hearthstone had some sort of custom game mode where you could set hero Health so you could play your 45 minute games with friends. But as an actual gamemode, there is no way enough people would play it for it to be worth implementing.
You can find me here! Good luck everyone!
I have a simpler solution. "What's that? Simpler than my simplest solution?! HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE" you say? Here. Simple. Adapt. Learn to play against the decks that destroy you. Your opinions aren't worth more than those of the people who play the decks you hate. Counter them. If you don't want to lose to the same decks, be better than them. If you don't want to play against them, play casual and hope you aren't against a fuckwit. If that doesn't work, go play wild, if none of these simple solutions appeal to you. Maybe Hearthstone isn't the game for you. Go play shadowverse, or Elder Scrolls Legends, or I assume like, Duelyst is good.
You mean 15 health mode because everyone will run alex.
HE TRAAAAAADES!
I can see that there would be a lot of trouble with cards like Reno Jackson and Alexstraza. So how about other solutions like these:
- Both players start the game with 10 armor, like we already do in some Tavern Brawls. (I know the obvious problem with Shield Slam, just forget that one for a second ^^)
- Both heroes are immune for the first 3 turns. That way you can still start building a board in the first turns, but you can get heavily punished for just mindlessly throwing small minions on the board which can get cleared with a single AoE clear.
And for the fatigue problem, it could simply be possible to allow 40 card decks for this game mode?
Anyway, once again, i know this is not perfect and I'm open to solutions. To me, the game is just getting a bit stale in general. I would just really like to see another game mode (besides wild) that actually mixes up the rules a little which would encourage us to try out new decks.
Sounds more like Tavern Brawl then permanent addition. Lots of people like fast games, lots of people like slow games. It depends on the person, but HS seems to be going faster and faster
Weapon Based Priest is all you need in life
Stops your challenges with a knife
It's a deck that everyone should play
You should make it, try it today.
If this would happen,freeze mage could be top tier again.alexstrasza with deal 35 damage... this mode is unbalancable IMO cause freeze mage and control warrior are real deck types that could work so well.and renolock would stay in the meta,because reno with 35-40 would be so broken.
Sorry for my English.