Hi guys, I don't know if many of you here are rogue fans but I hope to get your opinions anyway. Rogue is the class I fell in love with and I want to have that feeling back. I don't think I am the whining type; I just have played this class a long time and figured it needed some key cards to get away from the spell centric combo design; which I feel limits the classes viability. I created 4 new cards that I think could help the class and I would like you opinion on them. Are they balanced, restrictive, not in keeping with the theme of the class? Also feel free to create and post ideas you think would help and or be improvements on my ideas.
This card I created to relieve the rogue class of the need feel obligated to use Preparation. Its a simple 3/2 which I feel helps because if you play this on curve you cannot dagger up which is huge to a rogue. Why is this balance because while we get a 3/2 body and the not full prep it makes it harder to combo and if played on curve you most likely want have a spell to play so immediate value is guaranteed
I created this card to get rid of the reliance on blade flurry as our only board clear. The blade flurry combo is great but the pieces you have to put in your deck to make its effect more consistent prevent new decks from being created. I factored in the cost with the knowledge of having prep and you will find it in line with other board clears. When I create combo cards I want them to be able to stand on their own even if you can't get your combo off.
Not much to say about this card. I find it balanced because you have to combo to get the weapon and then you still have to play that weapon. Unlike Blingtron this effect is not a battle-cry and it does not equip the weapon for you.
I like the effect but can't get the balance right. I want to change "incoming" to "directed" I think what will help. I think the combo should just give you 2 tokens no more and no less.
I created this card to get rid of the reliance on blade flurry as our only board clear. The blade flurry combo is great but the pieces you have to put in your deck to make its effect more consistent prevent new decks from being created. I factored in the cost with the knowledge of having prep and you will find it in line with other board clears. When I create combo cards I want them to be able to stand on their own even if you can't get your combo off.
You shouldn't balance a card's cost around it havingPreparation cast on it. This is a very common mistake that people make.Preparation is already balanced in that it costs you a card to make another cheaper, just likeInnervate (Note: Preparation has better cost reduction because it only affects spells). The cost of using up a card is very significant. When you make a card more expensive than you would have otherwise because it could have Preparation cast on it, then you are making the card bad.
You shouldn't balance a card's cost around it havingPreparation cast on it. This is a very common mistake that people make.Preparation is already balanced in that it costs you a card to make another cheaper, just likeInnervate (Note: Preparation has better cost reduction because it only affects spells). The cost of using up a card is very significant. When you make a card more expensive than you would have otherwise because it could have Preparation cast on it, then you are making the card bad.
I didn't really, I think this card stands on its own very well. I wrote that because I wanted people to understand that you cant make the argument of prep make the card op. Plus I think you do have to consider synergy like with prep when designing cards but I think this is balanced.
I think it is a balanced card but what is the point of the stealth is my question. What is this card looking to accomplish; it would help to better understand its creation.
I think it is a balanced card but what is the point of the stealth is my question. What is this card looking to accomplish; it would help to better understand its creation.
Consider how Frostbolt partially protects your board on top of the damage. Giving a guy Stealth protects part of your board.
You shouldn't balance a card's cost around it havingPreparation cast on it. This is a very common mistake that people make.Preparation is already balanced in that it costs you a card to make another cheaper, just likeInnervate (Note: Preparation has better cost reduction because it only affects spells). The cost of using up a card is very significant. When you make a card more expensive than you would have otherwise because it could have Preparation cast on it, then you are making the card bad.
I didn't really, I think this card stands on its own very well. I wrote that because I wanted people to understand that you cant make the argument of prep make the card op. Plus I think you do have to consider synergy like with prep when designing cards but I think this is balanced.
I think it is a little overcosted. Without combo, it is the same as consecration but 2 more mana. With combo, it is a 1 less damage Flamestrike for 1 less mana. I think it should cost 5.
No intention to hijack your post, but I guess it is better to post my ideas here instead of making another thread:
Next to two very obvious "wishes"...
... I made some hopefully more interesting cards to help Rogue:
Nerubian Seer helps to make use of those new cards that allow Rogue to shuffle cards in your opponents (Beneath the Grounds) and your own (Gang Up) deck. But of course it also affects Recycle, Malorne and Iron Juggernaut.
The "Immune while attacking" is meant to be something similar to First Strike (in MtG), which should fit Rogue very well. The Pandaren Wardancer might seem pretty op at the first glance, but remember that he is very easy to destroy on your opponent's turn. It fits Rogue's Tempo play, as you can use cheap spells to clear the board while developing a Pandaren Wardancer and hopefully use its "Immune while attacking" ability to trade favorable on your turn. Really hard to balance though between being useless and op. Maeiv Shadowsong is an upgraded legendary version.
Master Poisoner should be very straightforward, allowing Rogue to get some more value/card creation from her cards. The same counts for Mathias Shaw. Undercity Assassin is an idea to make Stealth/Conceal decks viable. Warp Splinter's Thorn is a Weapon that doesn't completely nullify your Hero POwer.
(Ignoring the hijack attempt. Make your own thread. I don't see "everyone post your Rogue ideas" in the title)
Black Market Salesman: 1 mana cheaper than Fencing Coach, +1 attack, AND a better tempo effect? Sure? It also takes away uniqueness from Sorcerer's Apprentice. Will you give Mage their own SI:7 Agent in return? -- Maybe make it a 3 mana 2/2 that gives you a Preparation?
Weapons dealer: I like the effect but it should be a 3/4 for balance. Getting a free card is pretty powerful, even if it's random. Compare Spellslinger - that guy is 3 mana but the opponent gets a card too. (And I could swear someone posted a very similar card a fee days ago).
Shado-Assassination - isn't that spelled Shadow? Anyway, it's kinda weak. High-cost combo cards are really hard to trigger. Too often, this will be a 6-mana Explosive Trap. Make it 5 mana.
Shroud Caller: Uh what!? Does it negate damage to the hero or to shroud caller? Is the discard random? Do you really want to give your opponent the chance to discard your hand? And WTF is a shroud token? -- You need to go back to the drawing board.
(Ignoring the hijack attempt. Make your own thread. I don't see "everyone post your Rogue ideas" in the title)
Black Market Salesman: 1 mana cheaper than Fencing Coach, +1 attack, AND a better tempo effect? Sure? It also takes away uniqueness from Sorcerer's Apprentice. Will you give Mage their own SI:7 Agent in return? -- Maybe make it a 3 mana 2/2 that gives you a Preparation?
Weapons dealer: I like the effect but it should be a 3/4 for balance. Getting a free card is pretty powerful, even if it's random. Compare Spellslinger - that guy is 3 mana but the opponent gets a card too. (And I could swear someone posted a very similar card a fee days ago).
Shado-Assassination - isn't that spelled Shadow? Anyway, it's kinda weak. High-cost combo cards are really hard to trigger. Too often, this will be a 6-mana Explosive Trap. Make it 5 mana.
Shroud Caller: Uh what!? Does it negate damage to the hero or to shroud caller? Is the discard random? Do you really want to give your opponent the chance to discard your hand? And WTF is a shroud token? -- You need to go back to the drawing board.
Thanks for the feedback the salesman is meant to reduce the reliance on prep but what you forget is that spell order in rogue matter, so if I reduced the cost of my next spell played but I have to play backstab first to combo or kill a minion i lose the reduction even though it already cost 0. I am not fine giving a prep via battle-cry because I feel if you do that you out right kill prep as a card because why put it in the deck at all.
I agree with the objection to weapons deal I want to keep it a 3/5 because the combo effect should not hinder its stats since you have to use a resource to activate the combo. But I feel that it should resemble the Animal Companion and give a random weapon out of a select parameter.
We cannot reduce the cost of the Shado-assassination because you have to consider Preparation. We have really good early game and you have to think about when the class would need the clear. The card seems slow but don't forget how many pieces and mana a blade flurry takes to clear a board its around the same amount of mana and its not consistent.
This card is hard to balance I wanted help to make it better. It is meant to stop any "direct" damage to you or your board. The discard is random but you get 3 seconds to decide to negate the damage. The token is just a 1 mana do nothing spell, you cast it nothing happens but it can start combos. If you have 2 of these out you have to discard 2 card even if you are blocking one source of damage. I am not sure how I feel about this card either, it was meant to service as damage mitigation.
You seem to think Preparation is a free bonus, but it isn't. It's a trade-off. You trade 1 point of card advantage for 3 points of tempo. In that sense, it's the opposite of Arcane Intellect, which trades the same in the other direction. If you would play Preparation -> Arcane Intellect, you don't change your hand size and mana at all.
That's why Preparation is irrelevant for the costing of Rogue spells, in the same way that Mage spells don't care about Arcane Intellect.
The question is what price you usually pay for deal X damage to all enemy minions, and that's about X * 2 (see Consecration. Explosive Trap is too cheap for its effect / huntard is OP, Flamestrike gets the Mage bonus, Lightning Storm kinda matches that).
In your case, you have a conditional 2 or 3 damage. Let's say it's 50/50 because high-mana combos are hard to trigger. A 2.5 damage board clear should cost 5.
Okay let me explain it like this; I liking this to card to Lightning Storm where for 3 mana you get a random AOE damage range from 2-3 which you pay two mana later. Now the downside is huge but I want you all to think about this what if LS dealt 3 damage all the time for the same cost; we all would say OP. LS is a card that would other wise cost 5 mana but if It could deal 3 damage I would assume that it would cost 6 mana and would be a 4 mana overload 2.
If you guys really play rogue you can't tell me you would not play this card. Prep is relevant, why, because it is a card and sometime we have to acknowledge synergy between cards (Grim Paton and Warsong). If I prep and deal 3 damage to all minions for 2 mana that would just be to dang strong.
(Ignoring the hijack attempt. Make your own thread. I don't see "everyone post your Rogue ideas" in the title)
Black Market Salesman: 1 mana cheaper than Fencing Coach, +1 attack, AND a better tempo effect? Sure? It also takes away uniqueness from Sorcerer's Apprentice. Will you give Mage their own SI:7 Agent in return? -- Maybe make it a 3 mana 2/2 that gives you a Preparation?
Weapons dealer: I like the effect but it should be a 3/4 for balance. Getting a free card is pretty powerful, even if it's random. Compare Spellslinger - that guy is 3 mana but the opponent gets a card too. (And I could swear someone posted a very similar card a fee days ago).
Shado-Assassination - isn't that spelled Shadow? Anyway, it's kinda weak. High-cost combo cards are really hard to trigger. Too often, this will be a 6-mana Explosive Trap. Make it 5 mana.
Shroud Caller: Uh what!? Does it negate damage to the hero or to shroud caller? Is the discard random? Do you really want to give your opponent the chance to discard your hand? And WTF is a shroud token? -- You need to go back to the drawing board.
Thanks for the feedback the salesman is meant to reduce the reliance on prep but what you forget is that spell order in rogue matter, so if I reduced the cost of my next spell played but I have to play backstab first to combo or kill a minion i lose the reduction even though it already cost 0. I am not fine giving a prep via battle-cry because I feel if you do that you out right kill prep as a card because why put it in the deck at all.
I agree with the objection to weapons deal I want to keep it a 3/5 because the combo effect should not hinder its stats since you have to use a resource to activate the combo. But I feel that it should resemble the Animal Companion and give a random weapon out of a select parameter.
We cannot reduce the cost of the Shado-assassination because you have to consider Preparation. We have really good early game and you have to think about when the class would need the clear. The card seems slow but don't forget how many pieces and mana a blade flurry takes to clear a board its around the same amount of mana and its not consistent.
This card is hard to balance I wanted help to make it better. It is meant to stop any "direct" damage to you or your board. The discard is random but you get 3 seconds to decide to negate the damage. The token is just a 1 mana do nothing spell, you cast it nothing happens but it can start combos. If you have 2 of these out you have to discard 2 card even if you are blocking one source of damage. I am not sure how I feel about this card either, it was meant to service as damage mitigation.
I know that but to me if they want the game to last for a lot longer than 5 years they will have to break that model at some point. I think if they do allow this type of ability then they will have a equal drawback and a reaction time limit of like 3 or 5 seconds.
Actually it can work. The wording needs to be tweaked. I also removed that additional combo effect which frankly made no sense to me. For balance the "prevention" effect is something that needs to be combo'd. If not combo'd this is a 3/2 for 3 which is trash tier.
Your Hero is covered with Dark Fog (like stealth) until the damage is dealt.
Flavor Text: She used to be a gold digger, but that didn't work out too well for her.
Hi guys, I don't know if many of you here are rogue fans but I hope to get your opinions anyway. Rogue is the class I fell in love with and I want to have that feeling back. I don't think I am the whining type; I just have played this class a long time and figured it needed some key cards to get away from the spell centric combo design; which I feel limits the classes viability. I created 4 new cards that I think could help the class and I would like you opinion on them. Are they balanced, restrictive, not in keeping with the theme of the class? Also feel free to create and post ideas you think would help and or be improvements on my ideas.
This card I created to relieve the rogue class of the need feel obligated to use Preparation. Its a simple 3/2 which I feel helps because if you play this on curve you cannot dagger up which is huge to a rogue. Why is this balance because while we get a 3/2 body and the not full prep it makes it harder to combo and if played on curve you most likely want have a spell to play so immediate value is guaranteed
I like the 4-drop, maybe on the strong side because Rogues with a decent weapon would just about spell the end of anyone :P
Oilhowl and Oilhammer. *shudder*
Make the Card: The biggest thread on the site!
My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
You shouldn't balance a card's cost around it havingPreparation cast on it. This is a very common mistake that people make.Preparation is already balanced in that it costs you a card to make another cheaper, just likeInnervate (Note: Preparation has better cost reduction because it only affects spells). The cost of using up a card is very significant. When you make a card more expensive than you would have otherwise because it could have Preparation cast on it, then you are making the card bad.
Come Play Make the Keyword!!!
Check out my Worgen Class in the Class Competition
I didn't really, I think this card stands on its own very well. I wrote that because I wanted people to understand that you cant make the argument of prep make the card op. Plus I think you do have to consider synergy like with prep when designing cards but I think this is balanced.
What about this?
I think it is a balanced card but what is the point of the stealth is my question. What is this card looking to accomplish; it would help to better understand its creation.
Consider how Frostbolt partially protects your board on top of the damage. Giving a guy Stealth protects part of your board.
Make the Card: The biggest thread on the site!
My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
I think it is a little overcosted. Without combo, it is the same as consecration but 2 more mana. With combo, it is a 1 less damage Flamestrike for 1 less mana. I think it should cost 5.
Come Play Make the Keyword!!!
Check out my Worgen Class in the Class Competition
No intention to hijack your post, but I guess it is better to post my ideas here instead of making another thread:
Next to two very obvious "wishes"...
... I made some hopefully more interesting cards to help Rogue:
Nerubian Seer helps to make use of those new cards that allow Rogue to shuffle cards in your opponents (Beneath the Grounds) and your own (Gang Up) deck. But of course it also affects Recycle, Malorne and Iron Juggernaut.
The "Immune while attacking" is meant to be something similar to First Strike (in MtG), which should fit Rogue very well. The Pandaren Wardancer might seem pretty op at the first glance, but remember that he is very easy to destroy on your opponent's turn. It fits Rogue's Tempo play, as you can use cheap spells to clear the board while developing a Pandaren Wardancer and hopefully use its "Immune while attacking" ability to trade favorable on your turn. Really hard to balance though between being useless and op. Maeiv Shadowsong is an upgraded legendary version.
Master Poisoner should be very straightforward, allowing Rogue to get some more value/card creation from her cards. The same counts for Mathias Shaw. Undercity Assassin is an idea to make Stealth/Conceal decks viable. Warp Splinter's Thorn is a Weapon that doesn't completely nullify your Hero POwer.
- senti
(Ignoring the hijack attempt. Make your own thread. I don't see "everyone post your Rogue ideas" in the title)
Black Market Salesman: 1 mana cheaper than Fencing Coach, +1 attack, AND a better tempo effect? Sure? It also takes away uniqueness from Sorcerer's Apprentice. Will you give Mage their own SI:7 Agent in return? -- Maybe make it a 3 mana 2/2 that gives you a Preparation?
Weapons dealer: I like the effect but it should be a 3/4 for balance. Getting a free card is pretty powerful, even if it's random. Compare Spellslinger - that guy is 3 mana but the opponent gets a card too. (And I could swear someone posted a very similar card a fee days ago).
Shado-Assassination - isn't that spelled Shadow? Anyway, it's kinda weak. High-cost combo cards are really hard to trigger. Too often, this will be a 6-mana Explosive Trap. Make it 5 mana.
Shroud Caller: Uh what!? Does it negate damage to the hero or to shroud caller? Is the discard random? Do you really want to give your opponent the chance to discard your hand? And WTF is a shroud token? -- You need to go back to the drawing board.
Thanks for the feedback the salesman is meant to reduce the reliance on prep but what you forget is that spell order in rogue matter, so if I reduced the cost of my next spell played but I have to play backstab first to combo or kill a minion i lose the reduction even though it already cost 0. I am not fine giving a prep via battle-cry because I feel if you do that you out right kill prep as a card because why put it in the deck at all.
I agree with the objection to weapons deal I want to keep it a 3/5 because the combo effect should not hinder its stats since you have to use a resource to activate the combo. But I feel that it should resemble the Animal Companion and give a random weapon out of a select parameter.
We cannot reduce the cost of the Shado-assassination because you have to consider Preparation. We have really good early game and you have to think about when the class would need the clear. The card seems slow but don't forget how many pieces and mana a blade flurry takes to clear a board its around the same amount of mana and its not consistent.
This card is hard to balance I wanted help to make it better. It is meant to stop any "direct" damage to you or your board. The discard is random but you get 3 seconds to decide to negate the damage. The token is just a 1 mana do nothing spell, you cast it nothing happens but it can start combos. If you have 2 of these out you have to discard 2 card even if you are blocking one source of damage. I am not sure how I feel about this card either, it was meant to service as damage mitigation.
@sentiHS I like the cards overall and my fave is the Warp Thorn but I will say I don't like stealth centered effects because I feel that is a mechanic that is really lack luster and requires a lot of setup and very little pay off. Feel free to keep posting.
You seem to think Preparation is a free bonus, but it isn't. It's a trade-off. You trade 1 point of card advantage for 3 points of tempo. In that sense, it's the opposite of Arcane Intellect, which trades the same in the other direction. If you would play Preparation -> Arcane Intellect, you don't change your hand size and mana at all.
That's why Preparation is irrelevant for the costing of Rogue spells, in the same way that Mage spells don't care about Arcane Intellect.
The question is what price you usually pay for deal X damage to all enemy minions, and that's about X * 2 (see Consecration. Explosive Trap is too cheap for its effect / huntard is OP, Flamestrike gets the Mage bonus, Lightning Storm kinda matches that).
In your case, you have a conditional 2 or 3 damage. Let's say it's 50/50 because high-mana combos are hard to trigger. A 2.5 damage board clear should cost 5.
No, Secrets just get a 2-mana discount because they're Secrets.
Make the Card: The biggest thread on the site!
My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
I like your card but the assassination card is a little high cost to me.Nice cards
Okay let me explain it like this; I liking this to card to Lightning Storm where for 3 mana you get a random AOE damage range from 2-3 which you pay two mana later. Now the downside is huge but I want you all to think about this what if LS dealt 3 damage all the time for the same cost; we all would say OP. LS is a card that would other wise cost 5 mana but if It could deal 3 damage I would assume that it would cost 6 mana and would be a 4 mana overload 2.
If you guys really play rogue you can't tell me you would not play this card. Prep is relevant, why, because it is a card and sometime we have to acknowledge synergy between cards (Grim Paton and Warsong). If I prep and deal 3 damage to all minions for 2 mana that would just be to dang strong.
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The damage stopping card doesn't work in Hearthstone.
I know that but to me if they want the game to last for a lot longer than 5 years they will have to break that model at some point. I think if they do allow this type of ability then they will have a equal drawback and a reaction time limit of like 3 or 5 seconds.
i looooove playing Rogue. And I've made a few cards, myself. hehe
Actually it can work. The wording needs to be tweaked. I also removed that additional combo effect which frankly made no sense to me. For balance the "prevention" effect is something that needs to be combo'd. If not combo'd this is a 3/2 for 3 which is trash tier.
Your Hero is covered with Dark Fog (like stealth) until the damage is dealt.
Flavor Text: She used to be a gold digger, but that didn't work out too well for her.