have you seen the décklist linked... its ridicúlous. Also TempoStorm fails miserably at putting DemonHandlock in every meta snapshot. They implemented it when it was way popular... then it disappeared... reappeared. And you dare to post their link on my thread... ha ha.éYou are funny.
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Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
The problem with Handlock or Demon lock is that you're basically doing nothing on board until turn 4 most of the times (not counting the times where you can Ancient Watcher Owl or Taunt for the sake of the argument) and it doesn't suit the current meta very well. By turn 4 your hp will be already low, the board flooded and i'm not even accounting for the Paladins and their stupid secrets that will resurrect their stuff or lower the hp of big Giants.
Not sure CW woks better since it has always been weak to Paladin but at least their early game is more pro active than ours... I've been playing Demonlock yesterday for a daily and it was much harder than before TGT was released that's for sure!
Zoo is faster so you might know if you're about to win or concede earlier, that always help when trying to get at least to rank 7 or 8. Overall i think we are simply hurt that we didn't get any new viable archetype or cards to put into old Warlock decks, kinda like Rogue. I can't even remember last time i played against a Rogue on ladder...
This is exactly the problem currently, decks post TGT are too fast and "good draw" needs to be cleared early and often.
I agree with the previous poster that I feel ancient watchers are a bit obsolete in the current meta. Too many times vs hunters, pals, and mages you need to trade by turn 3-4.
To the people talking about handlock fairing well vs secret pally, I can assure you that's from a small sample size. A great draw from a secret pal vs a great draw from handlock you will lose majority of the time. If they drop christmas tree on turn 6 and were able to get you into the 15-20 range by that time (which you probably got yourself there tapping) it's essentially over and you can auto concede.
My experiences on Handlock this season, fluctuating ranks 13-16 playing 3-5 games a day before bed.
1. Completely dominating warriors and priests. Only losing to druids that get a great draw and land a tough savage roar combo.
2. Even/balanced matchups vs rogues/mages. If I play well I and don't make mistakes, no when to push face/when to trade I win.
3. Getting wrecked by all hunters, secret/aggro pal, and mech shams. If they get a good draw I'm usually conceding turn 5, I can easily explain these scenarios.
Hunter is by far the worst. The window from when you establish board control + finish the game is soo small. We are usually so low that we have essentially 2 turns to finish them till their hero power or a luck top deck (beast + kill command) wins them the game. Frost trap completely wrecks me and I don't feel I have the time to play around it.
TL;DR - Remove hunters and pals from ladder and I bet I could get legend
For the time being (catching up on dailies) I went to my priest deck, I'm 5-0 and back up to rank 12, mainly farming aggro hunter. I'm wracking my brain trying to come up with techs/changes to handlock to stabilize vs this current meta. I can't run demon lock b/c I don't have Mal'Ganis so feels like a waste. Hopefully I'll be able to craft him in the next week or so.
Was thinking about a DragonHandlock-ish Deck lately, with the new 3/6 4mana Dragon and some early game to keep up with the tempo of the current Paladins (muster, bot) Hunters (Scientists) and Druids (innervate, Aspirant...). Will look into it and see if I can get something working or at least a base. The dragons would serve as early game presence and the Giants, Jaraxxus as a late game help/finisher. What do other people think about this idea ?
Was thinking about a DragonHandlock-ish Deck lately, with the new 3/6 4mana Dragon and some early game to keep up with the tempo of the current Paladins (muster, bot) Hunters (Scientists) and Druids (innervate, Aspirant...). Will look into it and see if I can get something working or at least a base. The dragons would serve as early game presence and the Giants, Jaraxxus as a late game help/finisher. What do other people think about this idea ?
I highly doubt it will work as you need alot of dragons to get the correct amount of synergy. You would have to remove to many core cards and the deck wouldn't work properly.
Was thinking about a DragonHandlock-ish Deck lately, with the new 3/6 4mana Dragon and some early game to keep up with the tempo of the current Paladins (muster, bot) Hunters (Scientists) and Druids (innervate, Aspirant...). Will look into it and see if I can get something working or at least a base. The dragons would serve as early game presence and the Giants, Jaraxxus as a late game help/finisher. What do other people think about this idea ?
I highly doubt it will work as you need alot of dragons to get the correct amount of synergy. You would have to remove to many core cards and the deck wouldn't work properly.
You don't need as many dragons as you think since a lot of times handlock is rolling with 8-9 cards in hand (nearly 33% of your deck).
I ran a few games with 2xtwilight drake + 1xtwilight guardian and didn't really have that many "dead hand" situations with the guardian. For high hand volume decks like handlock I feel like 4 ish dragons is all you need.
The problem with Handlock or Demon lock is that you're basically doing nothing on board until turn 4 most of the times (not counting the times where you can Ancient Watcher Owl or Taunt for the sake of the argument) and it doesn't suit the current meta very well. By turn 4 your hp will be already low, the board flooded and i'm not even accounting for the Paladins and their stupid secrets that will resurrect their stuff or lower the hp of big Giants.
Not sure CW woks better since it has always been weak to Paladin but at least their early game is more pro active than ours... I've been playing Demonlock yesterday for a daily and it was much harder than before TGT was released that's for sure!
Zoo is faster so you might know if you're about to win or concede earlier, that always help when trying to get at least to rank 7 or 8. Overall i think we are simply hurt that we didn't get any new viable archetype or cards to put into old Warlock decks, kinda like Rogue. I can't even remember last time i played against a Rogue on ladder...
This is exactly the problem currently, decks post TGT are too fast and "good draw" needs to be cleared early and often.
I agree with the previous poster that I feel ancient watchers are a bit obsolete in the current meta. Too many times vs hunters, pals, and mages you need to trade by turn 3-4.
To the people talking about handlock fairing well vs secret pally, I can assure you that's from a small sample size. A great draw from a secret pal vs a great draw from handlock you will lose majority of the time. If they drop christmas tree on turn 6 and were able to get you into the 15-20 range by that time (which you probably got yourself there tapping) it's essentially over and you can auto concede.
My experiences on Handlock this season, fluctuating ranks 13-16 playing 3-5 games a day before bed.
1. Completely dominating warriors and priests. Only losing to druids that get a great draw and land a tough savage roar combo.
2. Even/balanced matchups vs rogues/mages. If I play well I and don't make mistakes, no when to push face/when to trade I win.
3. Getting wrecked by all hunters, secret/aggro pal, and mech shams. If they get a good draw I'm usually conceding turn 5, I can easily explain these scenarios.
Hunter is by far the worst. The window from when you establish board control + finish the game is soo small. We are usually so low that we have essentially 2 turns to finish them till their hero power or a luck top deck (beast + kill command) wins them the game. Frost trap completely wrecks me and I don't feel I have the time to play around it.
TL;DR - Remove hunters and pals from ladder and I bet I could get legend
Don't get me wrong, but you are probably playing Handlock way too wrong. Firstly, Handlock can reach far beyond rank 12 (in your case). Second of all secret paladin isn't a bad match up! I don't know how you are playing against it, but it definitely isn't. I've played over 100 games on ranked at rank 4 - 7 so I can definitely say it's not because of the sample size... You are probably doing something wrong with, that's all.
Ok this Picture doesn´t give the full month cause a couple of Days ago i changed the deck but its still a fair sample at rank 7-8ish (swapped ancient watchers for refreshment vendor and one owl for ragnaros).
And as you can see i have a negative ratio vs paladin (playing standard handlock), i can imagine demon handlock is better due to earlier boardpresence.
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Strive for constant improvement and achieve your full potential.
Yes, the early presence of the Demon version is much better right now than the standard version. It helps fight the aggression while not needing the Watcher + Owl combo to be effective. Can't say about the Paladin MU since i haven't played enough of them to make a definitive opinion on them.
The problem with Handlock or Demon lock is that you're basically doing nothing on board until turn 4 most of the times (not counting the times where you can Ancient Watcher Owl or Taunt for the sake of the argument) and it doesn't suit the current meta very well. By turn 4 your hp will be already low, the board flooded and i'm not even accounting for the Paladins and their stupid secrets that will resurrect their stuff or lower the hp of big Giants.
Not sure CW woks better since it has always been weak to Paladin but at least their early game is more pro active than ours... I've been playing Demonlock yesterday for a daily and it was much harder than before TGT was released that's for sure!
Zoo is faster so you might know if you're about to win or concede earlier, that always help when trying to get at least to rank 7 or 8. Overall i think we are simply hurt that we didn't get any new viable archetype or cards to put into old Warlock decks, kinda like Rogue. I can't even remember last time i played against a Rogue on ladder...
This is exactly the problem currently, decks post TGT are too fast and "good draw" needs to be cleared early and often.
I agree with the previous poster that I feel ancient watchers are a bit obsolete in the current meta. Too many times vs hunters, pals, and mages you need to trade by turn 3-4.
To the people talking about handlock fairing well vs secret pally, I can assure you that's from a small sample size. A great draw from a secret pal vs a great draw from handlock you will lose majority of the time. If they drop christmas tree on turn 6 and were able to get you into the 15-20 range by that time (which you probably got yourself there tapping) it's essentially over and you can auto concede.
My experiences on Handlock this season, fluctuating ranks 13-16 playing 3-5 games a day before bed.
1. Completely dominating warriors and priests. Only losing to druids that get a great draw and land a tough savage roar combo.
2. Even/balanced matchups vs rogues/mages. If I play well I and don't make mistakes, no when to push face/when to trade I win.
3. Getting wrecked by all hunters, secret/aggro pal, and mech shams. If they get a good draw I'm usually conceding turn 5, I can easily explain these scenarios.
Hunter is by far the worst. The window from when you establish board control + finish the game is soo small. We are usually so low that we have essentially 2 turns to finish them till their hero power or a luck top deck (beast + kill command) wins them the game. Frost trap completely wrecks me and I don't feel I have the time to play around it.
TL;DR - Remove hunters and pals from ladder and I bet I could get legend
Don't get me wrong, but you are probably playing Handlock way too wrong. Firstly, Handlock can reach far beyond rank 12 (in your case). Second of all secret paladin isn't a bad match up! I don't know how you are playing against it, but it definitely isn't. I've played over 100 games on ranked at rank 4 - 7 so I can definitely say it's not because of the sample size... You are probably doing something wrong with, that's all.
Please explain how you handle full Christmas tree on turn 6.
Is anyone here having solid success against Aggro Paladin with any form of handlock/demonlock? Attached is the handlock I'm running with. It's standard handlock but I've added two zombies and a 2nd argus to help with paladin aggro. I'm doing well against every class except Paladin. I think I'm having some bad luck because even when I mulligan perfectly they steamroll me with a dream aggro mulligan that curves out to perfection.
Also, Does Demonlock do better vs Aggro Paladin than Handlock? One issue I've had with DemonLock (that I don't have with Handlock) Is that my jaraxxus sometimes gets popped out of my hand from a VoidCaller when I need him for heal :-\
Has anyone spent a lot of time teching in Blood Knight to steal divine shields from Aggro Paladins? I'm wondering at what point that becomes valuable to add just 1 of these minions considering the amount of paladin out there
Is anyone here having solid success against Aggro Paladin with any form of handlock/demonlock? Attached is the handlock I'm running with. It's standard handlock but I've added two zombies and a 2nd argus to help with paladin aggro. I'm doing well against every class except Paladin. I think I'm having some bad luck because even when I mulligan perfectly they steamroll me with a dream aggro mulligan that curves out to perfection.
Also, Does Demonlock do better vs Aggro Paladin than Handlock? One issue I've had with DemonLock (that I don't have with Handlock) Is that my jaraxxus sometimes gets popped out of my hand from a VoidCaller when I need him for heal :-\
Has anyone spent a lot of time teching in Blood Knight to steal divine shields from Aggro Paladins? I'm wondering at what point that becomes valuable to add just 1 of these minions considering the amount of paladin out there
Remhouse's demonhandlock has 4 AOE spells that are great against aggro, particularly paladins.
have you seen the décklist linked... its ridicúlous. Also TempoStorm fails miserably at putting DemonHandlock in every meta snapshot. They implemented it when it was way popular... then it disappeared... reappeared. And you dare to post their link on my thread... ha ha.éYou are funny.
Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
This is exactly the problem currently, decks post TGT are too fast and "good draw" needs to be cleared early and often.
I agree with the previous poster that I feel ancient watchers are a bit obsolete in the current meta. Too many times vs hunters, pals, and mages you need to trade by turn 3-4.
To the people talking about handlock fairing well vs secret pally, I can assure you that's from a small sample size. A great draw from a secret pal vs a great draw from handlock you will lose majority of the time. If they drop christmas tree on turn 6 and were able to get you into the 15-20 range by that time (which you probably got yourself there tapping) it's essentially over and you can auto concede.
My experiences on Handlock this season, fluctuating ranks 13-16 playing 3-5 games a day before bed.
1. Completely dominating warriors and priests. Only losing to druids that get a great draw and land a tough savage roar combo.
2. Even/balanced matchups vs rogues/mages. If I play well I and don't make mistakes, no when to push face/when to trade I win.
3. Getting wrecked by all hunters, secret/aggro pal, and mech shams. If they get a good draw I'm usually conceding turn 5, I can easily explain these scenarios.
Hunter is by far the worst. The window from when you establish board control + finish the game is soo small. We are usually so low that we have essentially 2 turns to finish them till their hero power or a luck top deck (beast + kill command) wins them the game. Frost trap completely wrecks me and I don't feel I have the time to play around it.
TL;DR - Remove hunters and pals from ladder and I bet I could get legend
For the time being (catching up on dailies) I went to my priest deck, I'm 5-0 and back up to rank 12, mainly farming aggro hunter. I'm wracking my brain trying to come up with techs/changes to handlock to stabilize vs this current meta. I can't run demon lock b/c I don't have Mal'Ganis so feels like a waste. Hopefully I'll be able to craft him in the next week or so.
Was thinking about a DragonHandlock-ish Deck lately, with the new 3/6 4mana Dragon and some early game to keep up with the tempo of the current Paladins (muster, bot) Hunters (Scientists) and Druids (innervate, Aspirant...).
Will look into it and see if I can get something working or at least a base. The dragons would serve as early game presence and the Giants, Jaraxxus as a late game help/finisher.
What do other people think about this idea ?
I highly doubt it will work as you need alot of dragons to get the correct amount of synergy. You would have to remove to many core cards and the deck wouldn't work properly.
You don't need as many dragons as you think since a lot of times handlock is rolling with 8-9 cards in hand (nearly 33% of your deck).
I ran a few games with 2xtwilight drake + 1xtwilight guardian and didn't really have that many "dead hand" situations with the guardian. For high hand volume decks like handlock I feel like 4 ish dragons is all you need.
Don't get me wrong, but you are probably playing Handlock way too wrong. Firstly, Handlock can reach far beyond rank 12 (in your case). Second of all secret paladin isn't a bad match up! I don't know how you are playing against it, but it definitely isn't. I've played over 100 games on ranked at rank 4 - 7 so I can definitely say it's not because of the sample size... You are probably doing something wrong with, that's all.
Ok this Picture doesn´t give the full month cause a couple of Days ago i changed the deck but its still a fair sample at rank 7-8ish (swapped ancient watchers for refreshment vendor and one owl for ragnaros).
And as you can see i have a negative ratio vs paladin (playing standard handlock), i can imagine demon handlock is better due to earlier boardpresence.
Strive for constant improvement and achieve your full potential.
Yes, the early presence of the Demon version is much better right now than the standard version. It helps fight the aggression while not needing the Watcher + Owl combo to be effective. Can't say about the Paladin MU since i haven't played enough of them to make a definitive opinion on them.
Whats your current demonlock decklist? Feel i need a change since i fell back to rank 9 from 7 today.
Strive for constant improvement and achieve your full potential.
I updated it.
For myself, I hitted rank 3 tonight.
Used to be a proud Handlock player.
Legend 17 times.
Still flirting with the ladder from times to times with Renolock.
Please explain how you handle full Christmas tree on turn 6.
Is anyone here having solid success against Aggro Paladin with any form of handlock/demonlock? Attached is the handlock I'm running with. It's standard handlock but I've added two zombies and a 2nd argus to help with paladin aggro. I'm doing well against every class except Paladin. I think I'm having some bad luck because even when I mulligan perfectly they steamroll me with a dream aggro mulligan that curves out to perfection.
My Handlock
Also, Does Demonlock do better vs Aggro Paladin than Handlock? One issue I've had with DemonLock (that I don't have with Handlock) Is that my jaraxxus sometimes gets popped out of my hand from a VoidCaller when I need him for heal :-\
Has anyone spent a lot of time teching in Blood Knight to steal divine shields from Aggro Paladins? I'm wondering at what point that becomes valuable to add just 1 of these minions considering the amount of paladin out there
demonhandlock has better chances against it because its better against aggro.
you could try keeping BGH in your starting hand to kill challenger.
also you need another 3 drop, my choice ould be farseer to slow them don
the ay you in the match up is by racing them. drop your giants, taunt them up and go face.
that hy demon handlock is stronger , you can race better ith voidcaller
Remhouse's demonhandlock has 4 AOE spells that are great against aggro, particularly paladins.
What is your current rank with this deck? I would like to try this deck, im on rank 3 right now and im not sure if i can get legen with this deck!
Btw, what do you think to include 1 Siphon soul? I think is a good car againts a lot of big minions( ysera, tirion, chromaggus, chillmaw, etc)
I'm not ranked as high as you, so I will defer to Remhouse to answer your question.
Would you say Alexstrasza is a viable switch for Lord Jaraxxus until I get enough dust for it?
It's an OK switch, but definitely not as good as JJ..
Agreed! The weapon and ability to make a 6/6 each turn helps a lot in the late game. Alexstrasza is a lot easier to remove.