Anyone else kinda bummed out by how badly Warlocks core mechanics have aged? Using hp as a resource SUCKS, very very much ever since DH got added (zoolock is now just a worse aggro DH and control needs OP levels of heal to compete).
Rogue going back to weapon aggro roots was the absolute worst scenario too, so the class rn feels super useless. All warlock can hope for is a broken heal next expac, does this feel right to you guys?
Warlock core sets are not as bad as Paladin and Shaman but they are pretty bad too, mainly cuz the hero power is very strong and puts a lot of restraint on card design, to the point of actually harming the class in the long run imo.
Does warlock need a complete rework? Is it fine to just wait for a broken heal every year to feel like a great class?
Play Wild, the new cards for Warlock are amazing. Being a bit weak in Standard to face damage seems reasonable when the class is amazing at churning out aggressive boards of minions at low mana costs. If warlocks were that good at healing, the class would be way too strong. Every deck needs a way to be beat to be balanced.
Warlock has arguably the best hero power which is why it’s cards have often been lower powered.
Yes, warlock is weak to quick decks such as face rogue but then every class has its weaknesses. You can tweak your deck to make it better against the match up or change deck. It has strong match ups against the rest of the meta.
Play Wild, the new cards for Warlock are amazing. Being a bit weak in Standard to face damage seems reasonable when the class is amazing at churning out aggressive boards of minions at low mana costs. If warlocks were that good at healing, the class would be way too strong. Every deck needs a way to be beat to be balanced.
I dont think that applies anymore. Warlock used to have a niche in Standard until March: the go-to class at the start of a rotation, later to be outclassed by everything else once more expansions were added (unless control got a broken heal).
DH pretty much broke that cycle, theres no reason to EVER play zoolock again (aggro DH is zoolock 2.0, better in every way), and DH has added a shit ton of baseline burn dmg that will always be in standard, so the start of a rotation is no longer safe for control lock. The class just feels redundant now, the whole self-dmg mechanic became horribly outdated, so what is left for this class?
I'd rather have a weaker hero power and higher quality sets honestly, the power creep has reached a point where life tap just cant carry the class on its own anymore.
Its not very visible rn cuz Shaman is still the bottom class, but next rotation all Warlocks weaknesses will be super exposed: no zoolock, that deck became completely obsolete (aggro w/o weapons? LUL), no control lock cuz there are now 03 aggressive classes (Hunter, DH and Rogue) with lots of core burn/weapons.. what is Warlock supposed to play then?
Its more than just "current meta counters my class", Warlock actually lost its niche (dominant at the start of a rotation) and I dont see it finding another one w/o a rework..
I'd rather have a weaker hero power and higher quality sets honestly, the power creep has reached a point where life tap just cant carry the class on its own anymore.
Its not very visible rn cuz Shaman is still the bottom class, but next rotation all Warlocks weaknesses will be super exposed: no zoolock, that deck became completely obsolete (aggro w/o weapons? LUL), no control lock cuz there are now 03 aggressive classes (Hunter, DH and Rogue) with lots of core burn/weapons.. what is Warlock supposed to play then?
Its more than just "current meta counters my class", Warlock actually lost its niche (dominant at the start of a rotation) and I dont see it finding another one w/o a rework..
Demon Hunter is so similar to Warlock that it steals all the cards it could potentially have they need to start giving the stronger cards to Warlock and weaker ones to demon hunter and class that is crazy strong with just Kayn Sunfury being the only legendary in the deck.
I'd rather have a weaker hero power and higher quality sets honestly, the power creep has reached a point where life tap just cant carry the class on its own anymore.
Its not very visible rn cuz Shaman is still the bottom class, but next rotation all Warlocks weaknesses will be super exposed: no zoolock, that deck became completely obsolete (aggro w/o weapons? LUL), no control lock cuz there are now 03 aggressive classes (Hunter, DH and Rogue) with lots of core burn/weapons.. what is Warlock supposed to play then?
Its more than just "current meta counters my class", Warlock actually lost its niche (dominant at the start of a rotation) and I dont see it finding another one w/o a rework..
Demon Hunter is so similar to Warlock that it steals all the cards it could potentially have they need to start giving the stronger cards to Warlock and weaker ones to demon hunter and class that is crazy strong with just Kayn Sunfury being the only legendary in the deck.
Which demon hunter cards would you want in warlock? (Aside from draw)
I'd rather have a weaker hero power and higher quality sets honestly, the power creep has reached a point where life tap just cant carry the class on its own anymore.
Its not very visible rn cuz Shaman is still the bottom class, but next rotation all Warlocks weaknesses will be super exposed: no zoolock, that deck became completely obsolete (aggro w/o weapons? LUL), no control lock cuz there are now 03 aggressive classes (Hunter, DH and Rogue) with lots of core burn/weapons.. what is Warlock supposed to play then?
Its more than just "current meta counters my class", Warlock actually lost its niche (dominant at the start of a rotation) and I dont see it finding another one w/o a rework..
Demon Hunter is so similar to Warlock that it steals all the cards it could potentially have they need to start giving the stronger cards to Warlock and weaker ones to demon hunter and class that is crazy strong with just Kayn Sunfury being the only legendary in the deck.
Which demon hunter cards would you want in warlock? (Aside from draw)
Some big demons to mesh with Archwitch Willow would be a good start. DH has multiple big demons that are wasted in the class.
Some big demons to mesh with Archwitch Willow would be a good start. DH has multiple big demons that are wasted in the class.
As someone who has been playing demon hunter, I think you might be surprised by how weak the big demons are. Archwitch Willow might be enough justification to play them but it might not.
Some big demons to mesh with Archwitch Willow would be a good start. DH has multiple big demons that are wasted in the class.
As someone who has been playing demon hunter, I think you might be surprised by how weak the big demons are. Archwitch Willow might be enough justification to play them but it might not.
Yeah because cards like Sap and Kayn Sunfury exist.
I disagree, the new soul shard cards really offset a lot of the self damage. They aid the questlock format a lot too. And Gandling makes egg warlock and lackeys cooler. would be nice to see some big new demons though. Demon Hunter gets all the cool big demons.
Willow is ass since the only big demon is dreadlord. I made a soul fragment/big demon deck that looked decent on paper but even if I won the game its always so long and boring. Autolose to priest. It's a poor swing turn that can be countered by so many things and what do you have left?
I've made a big demon DH that's more annoying because if anything sticks, you're going to lose and there are a few ways to get big bois out sooner than 8+ mana.
I used to play priest/lock more than any class but they are both boring as fuck now. I have a cabal res priest with keymaster thats kind of fun, but general both classes are boring af.
I miss cards like Nzoth.
Currently, the only class that full board in one turn is Druid..but fuck druid.
I disagree, the new soul shard cards really offset a lot of the self damage. They aid the questlock format a lot too. And Gandling makes egg warlock and lackeys cooler. would be nice to see some big new demons though. Demon Hunter gets all the cool big demons.
Very unreliable heal, far from enough to make Warlock survive against aggro. Just play over 20 matches with any soulshard lock deck and you'll realize how big a problem this is.
The moment aggro stopped caring about their board was the moment Warlocks toolkit took a nose dive into shit, you lose hp to get a stronger board/swing the tempo, and what does the aggro do? Weapon to your face..
Itd be fine if this was just one expansion thing, but to everyones misery, DH is staying FOREVER, meaning theres a new aggro with tons of burn that will never go away..
Zoo is still viable deck that sees regular play and coasts as a tier 2 deck in legend and high legend
How many zoolocks have you seen at the start of this years rotation? Not many right? Thats when zoolock was supposed to be GREAT, it only gets harder for it to compete once more expacs are added. Sure you can still have some success with it but.. Why would you bother? Why not just play aggro DH, which has the same flavor and its stronger in every way? That deck is staying forever..
Last I checked Lock could still heal for 16, when needed, had other heals, cheap board clears and could put up huge ass taunts. I played Malygos Warlock almost exclusively in Standard for the last part of the last format, and even though, just like every slow control, it was vulnerable to hyper aggro, I have never felt the deck has not enough heal or board control. I had some games won vs aggro with full hp.
Dudes, i just got legend easily with the pain list without the gandling and it felt pretty nice. Also got Shadow Gul'Dan. So just build the gandling list and do your things, thats all.
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Anyone else kinda bummed out by how badly Warlocks core mechanics have aged? Using hp as a resource SUCKS, very very much ever since DH got added (zoolock is now just a worse aggro DH and control needs OP levels of heal to compete).
Rogue going back to weapon aggro roots was the absolute worst scenario too, so the class rn feels super useless. All warlock can hope for is a broken heal next expac, does this feel right to you guys?
Warlock core sets are not as bad as Paladin and Shaman but they are pretty bad too, mainly cuz the hero power is very strong and puts a lot of restraint on card design, to the point of actually harming the class in the long run imo.
Does warlock need a complete rework? Is it fine to just wait for a broken heal every year to feel like a great class?
All control tools given to demon hunter, all aggro tools given to warlock.
A classic bit
Play Wild, the new cards for Warlock are amazing. Being a bit weak in Standard to face damage seems reasonable when the class is amazing at churning out aggressive boards of minions at low mana costs. If warlocks were that good at healing, the class would be way too strong. Every deck needs a way to be beat to be balanced.
Warlock has arguably the best hero power which is why it’s cards have often been lower powered.
Yes, warlock is weak to quick decks such as face rogue but then every class has its weaknesses. You can tweak your deck to make it better against the match up or change deck. It has strong match ups against the rest of the meta.
I dont think that applies anymore. Warlock used to have a niche in Standard until March: the go-to class at the start of a rotation, later to be outclassed by everything else once more expansions were added (unless control got a broken heal).
DH pretty much broke that cycle, theres no reason to EVER play zoolock again (aggro DH is zoolock 2.0, better in every way), and DH has added a shit ton of baseline burn dmg that will always be in standard, so the start of a rotation is no longer safe for control lock. The class just feels redundant now, the whole self-dmg mechanic became horribly outdated, so what is left for this class?
Warlock needs more life draining cards.
Rusty Recycler
Ironic. It could recycle others, but not itself.
My Handlock is the deck that has the most success against Paladin now. There's so much big removal.
Big Demon Warlock is really fun and pretty strong at times but it can't work because of cards like Sap that just destroy your entire turn with 2 mana.
Keymaster Alabaster come faster
I'd rather have a weaker hero power and higher quality sets honestly, the power creep has reached a point where life tap just cant carry the class on its own anymore.
Its not very visible rn cuz Shaman is still the bottom class, but next rotation all Warlocks weaknesses will be super exposed: no zoolock, that deck became completely obsolete (aggro w/o weapons? LUL), no control lock cuz there are now 03 aggressive classes (Hunter, DH and Rogue) with lots of core burn/weapons.. what is Warlock supposed to play then?
Its more than just "current meta counters my class", Warlock actually lost its niche (dominant at the start of a rotation) and I dont see it finding another one w/o a rework..
Demon Hunter is so similar to Warlock that it steals all the cards it could potentially have they need to start giving the stronger cards to Warlock and weaker ones to demon hunter and class that is crazy strong with just Kayn Sunfury being the only legendary in the deck.
Keymaster Alabaster come faster
Which demon hunter cards would you want in warlock? (Aside from draw)
Some big demons to mesh with Archwitch Willow would be a good start. DH has multiple big demons that are wasted in the class.
:)
https://hsreplay.net/replay/27u2NJTZZJgToJ6k6n5BTM
As someone who has been playing demon hunter, I think you might be surprised by how weak the big demons are. Archwitch Willow might be enough justification to play them but it might not.
Yeah because cards like Sap and Kayn Sunfury exist.
Keymaster Alabaster come faster
I disagree, the new soul shard cards really offset a lot of the self damage. They aid the questlock format a lot too. And Gandling makes egg warlock and lackeys cooler.
would be nice to see some big new demons though. Demon Hunter gets all the cool big demons.
Zoo is still viable deck that sees regular play and coasts as a tier 2 deck in legend and high legend
Willow is ass since the only big demon is dreadlord. I made a soul fragment/big demon deck that looked decent on paper but even if I won the game its always so long and boring. Autolose to priest. It's a poor swing turn that can be countered by so many things and what do you have left?
I've made a big demon DH that's more annoying because if anything sticks, you're going to lose and there are a few ways to get big bois out sooner than 8+ mana.
I used to play priest/lock more than any class but they are both boring as fuck now. I have a cabal res priest with keymaster thats kind of fun, but general both classes are boring af.
I miss cards like Nzoth.
Currently, the only class that full board in one turn is Druid..but fuck druid.
Fun > Meta
Very unreliable heal, far from enough to make Warlock survive against aggro. Just play over 20 matches with any soulshard lock deck and you'll realize how big a problem this is.
The moment aggro stopped caring about their board was the moment Warlocks toolkit took a nose dive into shit, you lose hp to get a stronger board/swing the tempo, and what does the aggro do? Weapon to your face..
Itd be fine if this was just one expansion thing, but to everyones misery, DH is staying FOREVER, meaning theres a new aggro with tons of burn that will never go away..
How many zoolocks have you seen at the start of this years rotation? Not many right? Thats when zoolock was supposed to be GREAT, it only gets harder for it to compete once more expacs are added. Sure you can still have some success with it but.. Why would you bother? Why not just play aggro DH, which has the same flavor and its stronger in every way? That deck is staying forever..
Last I checked Lock could still heal for 16, when needed, had other heals, cheap board clears and could put up huge ass taunts. I played Malygos Warlock almost exclusively in Standard for the last part of the last format, and even though, just like every slow control, it was vulnerable to hyper aggro, I have never felt the deck has not enough heal or board control. I had some games won vs aggro with full hp.
Dudes, i just got legend easily with the pain list without the gandling and it felt pretty nice. Also got Shadow Gul'Dan. So just build the gandling list and do your things, thats all.