So I am currently looking at the warlock class cards that have been released, we still have 4 more cards 1 is the Deathknight Hero. Now just from what has been shown so far I think Defile is the best card by far, other than that there is no card that is great.
Blood-Queen Lana'thelis on the other spectrum where I think she is underrated, yes she is not great but she isn't the worst card I have seen.
Treachery is cool but I don't see this being played much maybe one of for the combo with Doomsayer in a handlock.
Unwilling Sacrifice is kind of weak, yes it works on egg type of cards but, this is a straight up worst version of Deadly Shot. Warlock already has pretty powerful removal as it.
Sanguine Reveler seems ok but is not a 1 mana card, you would never play this on turn one unless you have coin with Possessed Villager which isn't bad but don't feel it is that great either.
Just wondering what everyone else is thinking am I alone feeling warlock is getting the short end of the stick this expansion?
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Yep, pretty much. The only good thing warlock got is Defile. And even that, the more I think of it, is it really what warlock needs? Another AoE? The card is obviously insane, but they gave us something we are good at. Warlock needs a good 2 mana minion, either discover a card or lifesteal. Warlock needs an early effective removal like Darkbomb. And obviously a little bit of healing wouldn't hurt.
I really think that Warlock doesn't need anything but heal. Defile is the best card by far in this set but it will not change Warlock's current situation. If Warlock gets some heal, Defile will make Warlock's power level higher but this is it.
Even if they would give Warlock the most OP cards in the game, I believe that Warlock will not see play unless they get some healing.
PS: I am not talking about Zoo, I am talking about midrange or control Warlock types.
By the way: I still think that Gnomeferatu is a card with potential and I will put at least one Gnomeferatu in my deck. Because there were lots of classes which have some key cards and combos. People play 4 mana 2/4 against just one specific class, 2 mana 2/3 against three classes and 1 mana 1/2 against one specific class. So, Gnomeferatu might see play.
I really think that Warlock doesn't need anything but heal. Defile is the best card by far in this set but it will not change Warlock's current situation. If Warlock gets some heal, Defile will make Warlock's power level higher but this is it.
Even if they would give Warlock the most OP cards in the game, I believe that Warlock will not see play unless they get some healing.
PS: I am not talking about Zoo, I am talking about midrange or control Warlock types.
By the way: I still think that Gnomeferatu is a card with potential and I will put at least one Gnomeferatu in my deck. Because there were lots of classes which have some key cards and combos. People play 4 mana 2/4 against just one specific class, 2 mana 2/3 against three classes and 1 mana 1/2 against one specific class. So, Gnomeferatu might see play.
I wasn't sure from what I was seeing I was thinking warlock will easily still be the weakest class still. I agree yes people play 1 of a few tech choice cards but that is only if you are seeing a lot of that specific class. I won't slot in an Eater of Secrets until I know mage is super popular when I am currently playing. Gnomeferatu just isn't the same, if you burn Archmage Antonidas in a mage that doesn't mean they instantly lost because you are playing warlock. Your hero helps out their goal of burning you down.
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I really think that Warlock doesn't need anything but heal. Defile is the best card by far in this set but it will not change Warlock's current situation. If Warlock gets some heal, Defile will make Warlock's power level higher but this is it.
Even if they would give Warlock the most OP cards in the game, I believe that Warlock will not see play unless they get some healing.
PS: I am not talking about Zoo, I am talking about midrange or control Warlock types.
By the way: I still think that Gnomeferatu is a card with potential and I will put at least one Gnomeferatu in my deck. Because there were lots of classes which have some key cards and combos. People play 4 mana 2/4 against just one specific class, 2 mana 2/3 against three classes and 1 mana 1/2 against one specific class. So, Gnomeferatu might see play.
I wasn't sure from what I was seeing I was thinking warlock will easily still be the weakest class still. I agree yes people play 1 of a few tech choice cards but that is only if you are seeing a lot of that specific class. I won't slot in an Eater of Secrets until I know mage is super popular when I am currently playing. Gnomeferatu just isn't the same, if you burn Archmage Antonidas in a mage that doesn't mean they instantly lost because you are playing warlock. Your hero helps out their goal of burning you down.
You are not playing Gnomeferatu just for Mages. Paladins have lots of key cards: Tarim, Warleader, Equality, Tirion and most importantly Curator or N'zoth. Burning a Jade card or Gadgetzan Auctioneer against a Druid might be essential. I can give lots of examples but these should be enough. This is why I think that this card might see some play as a tech choice. And a tech that isn't completely garbage against other matchups. Golakka is the most significant example. All of hunters and Token Druids are playing it as a Vanilla 2/3 because it isn't bad. And this card can give you win against pretty much all classes. It is not a card that shines in just one specific matchup, it can shine pretty much all matchups.
Against mages, Warlock needs healing. I say that and I also said that if Warlock doesn't get some healing, it will be still unplayable. Even though they get the best cards from the set.
Yes there are key cards I don't disagree with you on that but paladin has Stonehill Defender so if you burn one tarim or tirion then it will just be replaced. I just think the card is almost like a vanilla 2/3 it will see no play. I am not saying you can't play it and try your luck but the card you discard is essentially their last card in the deck. Most games don't go to fatigue so it doesn't really matter. Jade druid won't be much of a thing. Just due to the fact that most people will play new decks and jade isn't getting anything to help it.
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Warlock will get shit until discardlock manages to be a thing.Blizzard is like that kid we all had in our childhood.The one who was so stubborn in doing something that no matter how many times he failed or how many times you tried to reason with,he was still trying while getting pissed with everyone until by dump luck he managed to succeed.
It's been three years that blizzard pushes discolock,they managed to create a variance of zoo with discard in karazhan but apparently they don't want just a zoo variance,unfortunatelly for us,they want a pure discolock to be satisfied...Just be patient...they will achieve what they want and move on...sometime...hopefully?
Troggzor was a decent card and wasn't able to be killed by BGH back then when it still was 3 mana. Troggzor's biggest problem was Dr. Boom. Why do you compare a warlock 2 drop with a neutral legendary anyways (?) .
Blood-Queen sounds kinda nice - but strange at the same time. We all experienced combo cards can get discarded.
Stancifka's recent deck showed Warlock has potential in the right hands. I would rather call it a Hearthstone problem or StarthandStone how I like to call it at this point, since a good aggro hand that curves out is hardly gonna lose. With the Spring rotation too many tools disappeared. I guess we need to wait until the Winter expansion to hopefully get more tools against swarm decks.
I mean look at the Shaman Hero Card. Everyone that lost 10 times to Evolve Shaman can understand this 5 MANA card is absolutely broken and I am still baffled people rant about Skulking Geist being so bad for Jade Druid. Geist is a big help against Evolve Shaman and a much needed card. I mean, who fears a Jade Druid that wins turn 10 when you lost against Evolve Shaman on turn 6 or 7..?
Warlock has cards like Syphon Soul. That is a very strong card, agreed? And that is a complete useless card at the same time against an evolving Shaman that can Evolve into 3 6 drops - with the new Hero abilities even further. The power levels of the classes are just unbalanced.
I am curious for the Warlock Hero Card. The demon theme kinda went off the radar. I would like to see something in that direction.
edit: Defile i like very much against flodded boards (maybe you can play a minion in between to fill the health gaps for combo).
Troggzor was a decent card and wasn't able to be killed by BGH back then when it still was 3 mana. Troggzor's biggest problem was Dr. Boom. Why do you compare a warlock 2 drop with a neutral legendary anyways (?) .
Blood-Queen sounds kinda nice - but strange at the same time. We all experienced combo cards can get discarded.
Stancifka's recent deck showed Warlock has potential in the right hands. I would rather call it a Hearthstone problem or StarthandStone how I like to call it at this point, since a good aggro hand that curves out is hardly gonna lose. With the Spring rotation too many tools disappeared. I guess we need to wait until the Winter expansion to hopefully get more tools against swarm decks.
I mean look at the Shaman Hero Card. Everyone that lost 10 times to Evolve Shaman can understand this 5 MANA card is absolutely broken and I am still baffled people rant about Skulking Geist being so bad for Jade Druid. Geist is a big help against Evolve Shaman and a much needed card. I mean, who fears a Jade Druid that wins turn 10 when you lost against Evolve Shaman on turn 6 or 7..?
Warlock has cards like Syphon Soul. That is a very strong card, agreed? And that is a complete useless card at the same time against an evolving Shaman that can Evolve into 3 6 drops - with the new Hero abilities even further. The power levels of the classes are just unbalanced.
I am curious for the Warlock Hero Card. The demon theme kinda went off the radar. I would like to see something in that direction.
edit: Defile i like very much against flodded boards (maybe you can play a minion in between to fill the health gaps for combo).
The hype that was around Troggzor is very similar to the hype that people have for Gnomeferatu, has nothing to do with the power levels or a comparison except for the hype pre-release of an expansion.
Im waiting for some more eggs to be released this set for a nice egglock using Reveler, Pterrordax, and Unwilling Sacrifice. Maybe only viable in Wild otherwise, Runic egg is lame and the others are expensive.
I think discolock will be slightly more stable this time, and we need more reveals to find out what control cards Handlock has been given.
The Rogue DK have a passive hero power, maybe the Warlock one can have too. For example: you choose which card(s) you want to discard. It is not likely that they will ever print a card like this, but it world make Warlock not just playable but broken.
Yeah, as long as they keep pushing discardlock... warlock is in the dumpster. Only thing that works with discard is zoo, and when they HOFed PO and peddler rotated that ship sailed.
Plus discard is dreadful to play even when it's good. Rolling dice to see if you win is just tedious.
Like you said, half of the cards still need to.be released including the dk. It's too early to make these kind of threads, although i have to agree that the cards already released are not enough to make warlock tier 2 or 1.
At this rate the class will be the worst again. I don't think it is too early because warlock is in such a shit state already. Shaman was like this at one point and blizzard gave them tunnel trogg and totem golem.
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What I've noted in KotFT is that some classes gets a "theme" - like the Druid seemingly getting Taunt minions, The Paladin getting more Divine-shield bonuses and the Shaman getting a Freeze-shaman thing going on, for example - and others are just all over the map with no real "connection" between the cards (mostly for Warlock and Mage I feel).
In part, I don't like this at all. True, I prefer it better than if they'd pushed Discard more, but they still kinda did when they made one of the warlocks Leggies into a Discard-centered card. So far, it feels more like all the new warlock cards are drop-offs that they had planned to release with other expansions first, but then they just piled up and released them all in this one instead.
There's just no focus or connection with the cards released, they're all over the place. In a sense, I get why, since they would then be used to reinforce warlock as a whole, instead of making just the one deck being the workable solution - but the problem therein lies in that only one of the cards is really good, one is alright, and the rest so far I very much doubt will see any real play.
Warlock will get shit until discardlock manages to be a thing.Blizzard is like that kid we all had in our childhood.The one who was so stubborn in doing something that no matter how many times he failed or how many times you tried to reason with,he was still trying while getting pissed with everyone until by dump luck he managed to succeed.
It's been three years that blizzard pushes discolock,they managed to create a variance of zoo with discard in karazhan but apparently they don't want just a zoo variance,unfortunatelly for us,they want a pure discolock to be satisfied...Just be patient...they will achieve what they want and move on...sometime...hopefully?
I mean I don't know if you play Wild, but I think the Fel Reaver Mill Warlock is gonna be pretty cool! Especially as they see their cards burn before their eyes, helpless and unable to stop it. You only need a 3-card combo Fel Reaver, Treachery and finally Glacial Shard. I would also wait for Guldangerous since it might be a pretty strong Control card with lifesteal (in the comic he was hinted to be a Vampire) and at 10 mana its probably a control card.
Discard does need to either change, making it discard a specific card (either stated in the text or by changing the mechanic) such as discarding the lowest cost card in your hand, a spell or even smth else. Or you could add cards like the one I designed for the last Design Competition, which you can see below:
But Blizzard is going to be Blizzard so who knows how long it takes for them to make some Discard playable. I just hope they stop sacrificing so much of the Warlock set if they aren't going to make it consistent.
Well the good thing about warlock is that the death knight, almost no matter what it is as long as it doesn't entirely have to do with discolock, will make handlock great again. The value a DK offers as well as hand locks ability to both draw cards and make it to 10 mana very easily means that consistency with getting your DK out every game is much better for warlock.
However, since warlock already has jaraxus, there's a good chance that the DK could do entirely with discolock in which case warlock will again not be played this expansion.
The problem is that Gul'dan HC is a 10 mana card. So, damn slow. We will need consistency to survive until late game...
However, we should really do something to make Discardlock real. I didn't follow the entire issue about "Quest Rogue Nerf". How fans make it happen? The did online petitions? They complained about it through email or on social media? I start thinking we should do the same to implement –in the mechanic of the game or in some cards (first of all in Lakkari Sacrifice, for sure)– the possibility of choosing cards to discard. Or I'm afraid we will never see discard playable in competitive environment.
So I am currently looking at the warlock class cards that have been released, we still have 4 more cards 1 is the Deathknight Hero. Now just from what has been shown so far I think Defile is the best card by far, other than that there is no card that is great.
Gnomeferatu is easily one of the most over hyped cards I have seen since Troggzor the Earthinator.
Blood-Queen Lana'thel is on the other spectrum where I think she is underrated, yes she is not great but she isn't the worst card I have seen.
Treachery is cool but I don't see this being played much maybe one of for the combo with Doomsayer in a handlock.
Unwilling Sacrifice is kind of weak, yes it works on egg type of cards but, this is a straight up worst version of Deadly Shot. Warlock already has pretty powerful removal as it.
Sanguine Reveler seems ok but is not a 1 mana card, you would never play this on turn one unless you have coin with Possessed Villager which isn't bad but don't feel it is that great either.
Just wondering what everyone else is thinking am I alone feeling warlock is getting the short end of the stick this expansion?
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Warlock seems pretty weak and I think it will continue to be until they drop Discard as a focus.
It's not Dragon Priest, you can't force it. Short of choosing what to discard, there is no way to make losing 20% of your deck good.
Yep, pretty much. The only good thing warlock got is Defile. And even that, the more I think of it, is it really what warlock needs? Another AoE? The card is obviously insane, but they gave us something we are good at. Warlock needs a good 2 mana minion, either discover a card or lifesteal. Warlock needs an early effective removal like Darkbomb. And obviously a little bit of healing wouldn't hurt.
I really think that Warlock doesn't need anything but heal. Defile is the best card by far in this set but it will not change Warlock's current situation. If Warlock gets some heal, Defile will make Warlock's power level higher but this is it.
Even if they would give Warlock the most OP cards in the game, I believe that Warlock will not see play unless they get some healing.
PS: I am not talking about Zoo, I am talking about midrange or control Warlock types.
By the way: I still think that Gnomeferatu is a card with potential and I will put at least one Gnomeferatu in my deck. Because there were lots of classes which have some key cards and combos. People play 4 mana 2/4 against just one specific class, 2 mana 2/3 against three classes and 1 mana 1/2 against one specific class. So, Gnomeferatu might see play.
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Yes there are key cards I don't disagree with you on that but paladin has Stonehill Defender so if you burn one tarim or tirion then it will just be replaced. I just think the card is almost like a vanilla 2/3 it will see no play. I am not saying you can't play it and try your luck but the card you discard is essentially their last card in the deck. Most games don't go to fatigue so it doesn't really matter. Jade druid won't be much of a thing. Just due to the fact that most people will play new decks and jade isn't getting anything to help it.
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Warlock will get shit until discardlock manages to be a thing.Blizzard is like that kid we all had in our childhood.The one who was so stubborn in doing something that no matter how many times he failed or how many times you tried to reason with,he was still trying while getting pissed with everyone until by dump luck he managed to succeed.
It's been three years that blizzard pushes discolock,they managed to create a variance of zoo with discard in karazhan but apparently they don't want just a zoo variance,unfortunatelly for us,they want a pure discolock to be satisfied...Just be patient...they will achieve what they want and move on...sometime...hopefully?
Troggzor was a decent card and wasn't able to be killed by BGH back then when it still was 3 mana. Troggzor's biggest problem was Dr. Boom. Why do you compare a warlock 2 drop with a neutral legendary anyways (?) .
Blood-Queen sounds kinda nice - but strange at the same time. We all experienced combo cards can get discarded.
Stancifka's recent deck showed Warlock has potential in the right hands. I would rather call it a Hearthstone problem or StarthandStone how I like to call it at this point, since a good aggro hand that curves out is hardly gonna lose. With the Spring rotation too many tools disappeared. I guess we need to wait until the Winter expansion to hopefully get more tools against swarm decks.
I mean look at the Shaman Hero Card. Everyone that lost 10 times to Evolve Shaman can understand this 5 MANA card is absolutely broken and I am still baffled people rant about Skulking Geist being so bad for Jade Druid. Geist is a big help against Evolve Shaman and a much needed card. I mean, who fears a Jade Druid that wins turn 10 when you lost against Evolve Shaman on turn 6 or 7..?
Warlock has cards like Syphon Soul. That is a very strong card, agreed? And that is a complete useless card at the same time against an evolving Shaman that can Evolve into 3 6 drops - with the new Hero abilities even further. The power levels of the classes are just unbalanced.
I am curious for the Warlock Hero Card. The demon theme kinda went off the radar. I would like to see something in that direction.
edit: Defile i like very much against flodded boards (maybe you can play a minion in between to fill the health gaps for combo).
From the cards released, i think there's only one good card in the set and that is Defile.
Lana'thel could be playable even without discarding any cards, if you drop her like on turn 6 (5 if you have a coin in hand) followed by Bonemare.
Neutrals, so far, are kinda underwhelming as well, aside from the above mentioned horse.
There's still hope that DK will be actually good. And 3 more class cards. But i guess we'll see.
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Im waiting for some more eggs to be released this set for a nice egglock using Reveler, Pterrordax, and Unwilling Sacrifice. Maybe only viable in Wild otherwise, Runic egg is lame and the others are expensive.
I think discolock will be slightly more stable this time, and we need more reveals to find out what control cards Handlock has been given.
memecombo deck with Treachery when it was revealed.It has to be snakes.
The Rogue DK have a passive hero power, maybe the Warlock one can have too. For example: you choose which card(s) you want to discard. It is not likely that they will ever print a card like this, but it world make Warlock not just playable but broken.
Yeah, as long as they keep pushing discardlock... warlock is in the dumpster. Only thing that works with discard is zoo, and when they HOFed PO and peddler rotated that ship sailed.
Plus discard is dreadful to play even when it's good. Rolling dice to see if you win is just tedious.
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What I've noted in KotFT is that some classes gets a "theme" - like the Druid seemingly getting Taunt minions, The Paladin getting more Divine-shield bonuses and the Shaman getting a Freeze-shaman thing going on, for example - and others are just all over the map with no real "connection" between the cards (mostly for Warlock and Mage I feel).
In part, I don't like this at all. True, I prefer it better than if they'd pushed Discard more, but they still kinda did when they made one of the warlocks Leggies into a Discard-centered card. So far, it feels more like all the new warlock cards are drop-offs that they had planned to release with other expansions first, but then they just piled up and released them all in this one instead.
There's just no focus or connection with the cards released, they're all over the place. In a sense, I get why, since they would then be used to reinforce warlock as a whole, instead of making just the one deck being the workable solution - but the problem therein lies in that only one of the cards is really good, one is alright, and the rest so far I very much doubt will see any real play.
Well the good thing about warlock is that the death knight, almost no matter what it is as long as it doesn't entirely have to do with discolock, will make handlock great again. The value a DK offers as well as hand locks ability to both draw cards and make it to 10 mana very easily means that consistency with getting your DK out every game is much better for warlock.
However, since warlock already has jaraxus, there's a good chance that the DK could do entirely with discolock in which case warlock will again not be played this expansion.
The problem is that Gul'dan HC is a 10 mana card. So, damn slow. We will need consistency to survive until late game...
However, we should really do something to make Discardlock real. I didn't follow the entire issue about "Quest Rogue Nerf". How fans make it happen? The did online petitions? They complained about it through email or on social media? I start thinking we should do the same to implement –in the mechanic of the game or in some cards (first of all in Lakkari Sacrifice, for sure)– the possibility of choosing cards to discard. Or I'm afraid we will never see discard playable in competitive environment.
P.S. sorry for my english!