While I DO understand the benefit of playing an Argent Squire early, I simply feel that the negative benefit to drawing it late game severely outweighs the positive benefits of getting them early. I mean if you draw one of these in your opening hand great. Right on. Unless you also have a say Flametongue Totem to go with it, it is still just a 1/1 and if you draw one of these LATE game...well again...it is just a 1/1. Discuss.
Yup, Argent Squire isn't a good card on its own. It is brilliant in decks with cards like Abusive Sergeant, Defender of Argus, Shattered Sun Cleric etc that can buff its attack. Divine shield gives great value on a buffed minion. Otherwise it's just a bad Elven Archer most of the time.
Rockbiter is convincing enough to run argent squire for me. It is also a valuable 1-drop against aggro decks if you get it early. Why not run her?
Its a great card for playing mind games. People will usually go out of their way to get rid of it for the fear of it getting buffed and being a problem later. This allows for you to set other things up. Also like everyone said, its great when its buffed (1 mana for a 1/1 divine that can take out something bigger, great value).
It's good at any time in decks with a variety of buffing minions. Whether it be Abusive, Dark Iron Dwarf, Defender of Argus (making it a 2/2 taunt with divine shield), Shattered sun cleric; etc..
It's good to ease out the mana curve. Since sometimes you get overloaded and only have 1 or 3 mana. The squire is useful in these situations. If you plan to finish the opponent quickly before game gets ultra late, argent squire is valuable.
I have spent a ton of time playing Shaman and would agree with you. I have never felt the need to have a turn one play in constructed. Against aggro I would rather carry two axes to increase my odds of getting one in my opening hand. If you get Axe, Unbound, LB and Lightening Storm in your opening hand with the coin you can actually out zoo the zoo decks. Anyway just my two cents. People can play whatever they want but I have found it to be a wasted card slot.
i only run one in my shaman decks usually. Its a very good card if you can boost it in any way. shaman deck is all about value the more you get the better off you will be and this card can provide insane value. Some people run 2 squires and one blood knight. That lets you use a weak squire in late game with the blood knight to at least get a good body on the board. something to think about if you run 2 of them. personally i think 1 is good enough.
i use it for the trades. squire and flametounge/rockbiter can remove some decent stuff. 2 mana to kill an Azure Drake and still have a minion on the board? Seems ok to me.
hmmm, the reason I run a Bloodknight in my decks that use Argent Squire. Nothing more fun than a 6/6 Bloodknight on turn 3. Or in late game, placing a forceful minion on the board. I personally like squires in some of my decks.
While I DO understand the benefit of playing an Argent Squire early, I simply feel that the negative benefit to drawing it late game severely outweighs the positive benefits of getting them early.
If it's not in your deck you have 0% of gaining the benefit of possibly drawing it early.
After some playtesting, with and without argent squires, I came to the conclusion theyre more than needed in the shaman decks, the sinergy is too big, and dropping it means also dropping argus (having argus on shaman without squire is just a no-no! tried without squires AND with tazdingos instead of argus, it worked but squires and argus are just better). Therefore I think OPs argument is invalid and should be discarded. Keep using argent squires in your shaman decks, they work.
I agree with Nuba. Also the mana effeciency is the thing here. Overload or nuke and setup sth for your next turn which then can carry out whatever planyou want them to. Of course a Ragnaros topdeck on turn 8 with an empty hand is better than a squire topdeck. But you need to get there in the first place. Shaman has alot of removal already, but beeing able to have more and setting up/securing the game with it is awesome.
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While I DO understand the benefit of playing an Argent Squire early, I simply feel that the negative benefit to drawing it late game severely outweighs the positive benefits of getting them early. I mean if you draw one of these in your opening hand great. Right on. Unless you also have a say Flametongue Totem to go with it, it is still just a 1/1 and if you draw one of these LATE game...well again...it is just a 1/1. Discuss.
That is why Bloodknight's exist in almost every single shaman deck I own minus my burn deck. Squires are invaluable to me. I like a 6/6 minion on turn 3 with my shaman deck. So I get a choice, can use as a trade minion early on, make a 6/6 turn 3-5 or make a outstanding combo later. Argent Squires do great! I think there are many players who do not know how to use them. They are a great 3/1 creature when a flametongue is up. Especially sitting near my unbound :-)
I was very skeptical of it myself and am still not sure how great it really is, but it definitely feels strong and relevant on turn 1. Simple because Shaman has no early plays, it can add pressure against control and keep up with Zoo better. It gets crazy with Flametongue in control games.
My problem with Argent Squire is the fact it doesn't cycle itself. If the opponent doesn't use 2 cards to deal with it, it's an instant disadvantage. I'd rather have bigger cards in my deck so I can win before fatigue, and even if I ran it instead of big cards my ideal hand vs rush decks wouldn't include a Squire anyway. I can see why people run it in Bloodlust decks and other archetypes, but it doesn't fit in my (only 1 flametongue, anti-control focused) shaman deck,
While I DO understand the benefit of playing an Argent Squire early, I simply feel that the negative benefit to drawing it late game severely outweighs the positive benefits of getting them early. I mean if you draw one of these in your opening hand great. Right on. Unless you also have a say Flametongue Totem to go with it, it is still just a 1/1 and if you draw one of these LATE game...well again...it is just a 1/1. Discuss.
Did you know that if you draw Arcane Intellect with one card left in your deck the card isn't very good? Discuss.
People play them to have something sticky early game. Generally people will attack your totems. So why use 2 card slots for 2 wimpy 1/1 cards?
Yup, Argent Squire isn't a good card on its own. It is brilliant in decks with cards like Abusive Sergeant, Defender of Argus, Shattered Sun Cleric etc that can buff its attack. Divine shield gives great value on a buffed minion. Otherwise it's just a bad Elven Archer most of the time.
Rockbiter is convincing enough to run argent squire for me. It is also a valuable 1-drop against aggro decks if you get it early. Why not run her?
later they work well with argus and still are usefull to deal that final damage. early game they are necessary
Its a great card for playing mind games. People will usually go out of their way to get rid of it for the fear of it getting buffed and being a problem later. This allows for you to set other things up. Also like everyone said, its great when its buffed (1 mana for a 1/1 divine that can take out something bigger, great value).
It's good at any time in decks with a variety of buffing minions. Whether it be Abusive, Dark Iron Dwarf, Defender of Argus (making it a 2/2 taunt with divine shield), Shattered sun cleric; etc..
It's good to ease out the mana curve. Since sometimes you get overloaded and only have 1 or 3 mana. The squire is useful in these situations. If you plan to finish the opponent quickly before game gets ultra late, argent squire is valuable.
I have spent a ton of time playing Shaman and would agree with you. I have never felt the need to have a turn one play in constructed. Against aggro I would rather carry two axes to increase my odds of getting one in my opening hand. If you get Axe, Unbound, LB and Lightening Storm in your opening hand with the coin you can actually out zoo the zoo decks. Anyway just my two cents. People can play whatever they want but I have found it to be a wasted card slot.
i only run one in my shaman decks usually. Its a very good card if you can boost it in any way. shaman deck is all about value the more you get the better off you will be and this card can provide insane value. Some people run 2 squires and one blood knight. That lets you use a weak squire in late game with the blood knight to at least get a good body on the board. something to think about if you run 2 of them. personally i think 1 is good enough.
i use it for the trades. squire and flametounge/rockbiter can remove some decent stuff. 2 mana to kill an Azure Drake and still have a minion on the board? Seems ok to me.
hmmm, the reason I run a Bloodknight in my decks that use Argent Squire. Nothing more fun than a 6/6 Bloodknight on turn 3. Or in late game, placing a forceful minion on the board. I personally like squires in some of my decks.
If it's not in your deck you have 0% of gaining the benefit of possibly drawing it early.
Poetic.
After some playtesting, with and without argent squires, I came to the conclusion theyre more than needed in the shaman decks, the sinergy is too big, and dropping it means also dropping argus (having argus on shaman without squire is just a no-no! tried without squires AND with tazdingos instead of argus, it worked but squires and argus are just better). Therefore I think OPs argument is invalid and should be discarded. Keep using argent squires in your shaman decks, they work.
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I agree with Nuba. Also the mana effeciency is the thing here. Overload or nuke and setup sth for your next turn which then can carry out whatever planyou want them to. Of course a Ragnaros topdeck on turn 8 with an empty hand is better than a squire topdeck. But you need to get there in the first place. Shaman has alot of removal already, but beeing able to have more and setting up/securing the game with it is awesome.
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Argent Squires is a staple in Shaman decks for me.
*South Park Guy Voice* - "If you let Argent Squire just sit there.....you're gonna have a bad time"
That is why Bloodknight's exist in almost every single shaman deck I own minus my burn deck. Squires are invaluable to me. I like a 6/6 minion on turn 3 with my shaman deck. So I get a choice, can use as a trade minion early on, make a 6/6 turn 3-5 or make a outstanding combo later. Argent Squires do great! I think there are many players who do not know how to use them. They are a great 3/1 creature when a flametongue is up. Especially sitting near my unbound :-)
I was very skeptical of it myself and am still not sure how great it really is, but it definitely feels strong and relevant on turn 1. Simple because Shaman has no early plays, it can add pressure against control and keep up with Zoo better. It gets crazy with Flametongue in control games.
My problem with Argent Squire is the fact it doesn't cycle itself. If the opponent doesn't use 2 cards to deal with it, it's an instant disadvantage. I'd rather have bigger cards in my deck so I can win before fatigue, and even if I ran it instead of big cards my ideal hand vs rush decks wouldn't include a Squire anyway. I can see why people run it in Bloodlust decks and other archetypes, but it doesn't fit in my (only 1 flametongue, anti-control focused) shaman deck,