It's a super strong class with the miracle variety and the jade version is in need of optimization. That said, miracle is the only competitive archetype rogue has atm and it's stale. Blizzard has failed to provide rogue an exciting new deck to play.
I just wish they would allow rogue to have a bursty, combo based deck, that didn't need to rely on auctioneer. Like old oil rogue.
But if blizzard doesn't want to give rogue healing or taunt based cards then why would you give rogue a control oriented card? Also weapon removal tech is a thing
The issue with Rogue, and this has been backed up by tweets and interviews with Blizz staff, is that Rogue's skillset is so very easily bordering on OP, not to mention so many of those skills are non-interactive and don't need board presence. I think to compensate, Rogue is consistently given card which needs to be creatively used in order to get results. This lessens the chance that they will completely break the class.
Consider Patron Warrior. It wasn't actually OP because it took such a high skill ceiling to be able to pilot it well. However, by the time it was nerfed, even bad players could pilot it effectively through sheer attrition.Rogue also has the same types of combo effects scene in Patron, but the complication is that Rogue is quite difficult to play, therefore, people think it's bad. And when a deck appears which is obviously really good, that balance has become disrupted. The exception being Quest Rogue, which I thought was totally fine. I have a feeling that Valeera is going to, in the next few months, going to come out as one of the best Death Knights.
rogue has never been terrible. what are you talking about? miracle is always viable and just last season they had a broken deck that got nerfed. just because people don't play it much it doesn't mean it's not good. you actually have to think when playing rogue, that's why not many people play it.
As it has already been stated, average Rogue deck (Miracle) is complicated to play, and unless you master the strategy, you always feel like being extremely vulnerable. You need winrates to decide Rogue's state on the meta, and I bet it's fairly high.
However, it is true however that no new reliable archetype has been given to Rogue yet, which also helps explaining why Rogue population on ladder is so low.
While Burgle, Deathrattle, Jade and now weapon archetypes (and mixes of all) are waiting for a little bit of serious support to become competitive. Without even speaking of Pirate and Mill decks. Rogue does have archetypes to develop, some of which are also inherently safe from OPness (ie. Burgle and Mill).
I expect when the meta shakes out miracle rogue will be about where it was during Ungoro: Low tier 2ish, played a lot by enthusiasts and useful as a counter to slow druid and priest decks.
Right now I think few people are playing rogue because they want to try the shiny new cards other classes got.
Because it is not friendly class for new players. Miracle rogue for example needs 1 million dust and some skill to play.
I think the Rogue class is mostly for Johnny's, people who like experimenting with things and winning in unusual ways. However, I don't feel super excited about Miracle as an archetype because it hasn't changed much at all and isn't anything new really. That and the popular lists nearly always have 5-6+ legendary minions in it. While I have crafted most of them by now, it still carries a certain stigma for me for that reason.
The rogue numbers are traditionally low because the class usually has decks that do require a lot of skill to play well. That usually doesn't translate well to overall winrate percentages.
People complained about quest rogue (rightly so imo), but even that deck required skill to pilot 100% efficiently, I don't think anyone can deny that.
That being said, it does seem underrepresented on ladder so far, like hunter and mage, at least in my experience. Trump is doing well with his miracle rogue so far, so let's hope it's not be a dead class this expansion.
I certainly agree with you on the skill aspect as I saw people complaining about how Quest Rogue took no skill all the time despite the statistical evidence that showed that the higher your rank was the better your winrate became, a classic sign of a higher skill ceiling. It wasn't until two to three months later just before the nerf that the win rate at the lower ranks approached what skilled players were doing at legend. I, too, hope Rogue isn't a dead class this expansion, but if Miracle is the only success we have as a class I think that will be terrible.
It's a super strong class with the miracle variety and the jade version is in need of optimization. That said, miracle is the only competitive archetype rogue has atm and it's stale. Blizzard has failed to provide rogue an exciting new deck to play.
^ So much this, though Rogue archetypes typically seem to take time to gel, so there is still time. I was hoping for some support from Blizzard for a late game Quest Rogue but Bone Baron by itself doesn't cut it. Seeing Grim Necromancer was such a huge letdown when I realized it summoned those tokens directly to the board instead of to your hand.
But if blizzard doesn't want to give rogue healing or taunt based cards then why would you give rogue a control oriented card? Also weapon removal tech is a thing
Corpsetaker may be the card Rogue needs and deserves in this regard for healing and taunts but time will tell.
But if blizzard doesn't want to give rogue healing or taunt based cards then why would you give rogue a control oriented card? Also weapon removal tech is a thing
I think I have the answer to this.
The issue with Rogue, and this has been backed up by tweets and interviews with Blizz staff, is that Rogue's skillset is so very easily bordering on OP, not to mention so many of those skills are non-interactive and don't need board presence. I think to compensate, Rogue is consistently given card which needs to be creatively used in order to get results. This lessens the chance that they will completely break the class.
Consider Patron Warrior. It wasn't actually OP because it took such a high skill ceiling to be able to pilot it well. However, by the time it was nerfed, even bad players could pilot it effectively through sheer attrition.Rogue also has the same types of combo effects scene in Patron, but the complication is that Rogue is quite difficult to play, therefore, people think it's bad. And when a deck appears which is obviously really good, that balance has become disrupted. The exception being Quest Rogue, which I thought was totally fine. I have a feeling that Valeera is going to, in the next few months, going to come out as one of the best Death Knights.
rogue has never been terrible. what are you talking about? miracle is always viable and just last season they had a broken deck that got nerfed. just because people don't play it much it doesn't mean it's not good. you actually have to think when playing rogue, that's why not many people play it.
As it has already been stated, average Rogue deck (Miracle) is complicated to play, and unless you master the strategy, you always feel like being extremely vulnerable.
You need winrates to decide Rogue's state on the meta, and I bet it's fairly high.
However, it is true however that no new reliable archetype has been given to Rogue yet, which also helps explaining why Rogue population on ladder is so low.
While Burgle, Deathrattle, Jade and now weapon archetypes (and mixes of all) are waiting for a little bit of serious support to become competitive. Without even speaking of Pirate and Mill decks.
Rogue does have archetypes to develop, some of which are also inherently safe from OPness (ie. Burgle and Mill).
I expect when the meta shakes out miracle rogue will be about where it was during Ungoro: Low tier 2ish, played a lot by enthusiasts and useful as a counter to slow druid and priest decks.
Right now I think few people are playing rogue because they want to try the shiny new cards other classes got.