So, Blizzard have finally revealed all cards from the upcoming expansion and I think it’s an exciting expansion – though I still fear Jades will be very dominant. But that’s not what I want to discuss.
One of the first reveals we saw was Awaken the Makers and what a card. The obvious deck type is of course Nzoth Priest and I was excited to see what deathrattle creatures they would release to empower this archetype. However, after I’ve seen all the new deathrattle cards and compared them to what cards will be available in standard after rotation, I really think the deathrattle cards are very lackluster.
I will not mention all deathrattle cards but rather cards I think could be a part of Nzoth Priest decklist.
Again, I think that the lineup is rather poor. Of course, some of the cards are decent but few of them can help you turn the board if you are falling behind. I really think that we are missing some high impact deathrattle minions like Sylvanas (I do understand why they are rotating her) or even Chillmaw. But perhaps I am not seeing the big picture here. I know we have to see how the decks turn out after the cards become playable but the way I see it the deathrattles are just too poor to build a deck around at the moment. The big Nzoth can more or less be cleared with a flamestrike (at least for Priest players). What do you guys think about the upcoming Nzoth Priest’s potential?
On a last note: I know Priest can get insane card value from their steal effects but it is still RNG based and not a reliable win condition.
And honestly, Mirage Caller makes the quest so easy to complete that you don't really need to focus too much on deathrattles anyway. Just make the rest of your deck strong and enjoy the reward when you finally get it.
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"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
mirage caller doesnt make the quest easy. A good deathrattle minion would do a lot more for the quest at most mirage caller can add one to your quest counter. If priest had half the good earlygame deathrattle minions hunter had, they wouldn't be in the spot they're in. Priest needs standard equivalents of some of the good old deathrattle minions. Sylv, belchers, and deathlords are all cards that would make the cut over every other standard deathrattle minion. I'd even argue the dark cultist is better than the talonpriest in the quest deck (talonpriest is a better card so you might run both). spiritsinger umbra makes deathrattle minions less bad but I'm not convinced its anywhere close to brann. Other than card draw mechanics, most of the deathrattle effects aren't as impactful as battlecry effects so even if they had the same mana cost Spiritsinger Umbra would be worse, let alone at 1 mana more.
As of right now: I actually think N'zoth isn't really great with a Priest-Quest deck. With Sylvanas and Chillmaw gone, what the heck is N'zoth summoning? Filling the board with Loot Hoarders and Mistress of Mixtures? I could be wrong, I'm not an expert at the game. But that's my impression right now. There's just nothing big and impactful for N'zoth to summon in priest like there has been in Paladin.
I think that a lot of the newer deathrattle cards are just stellar for early game play on their own, though. Tortollan Shellraiser, Volatile Elemental, and good old Mistress of Mixtures are all awesome against any sort of aggressive decks and really help dominate the early game board. And Mirage Caller adds a ton of value to all of those cards. (Like turn 1 you play quest, turn 2 you play some combination of Mixtures and Oracle or a Loot Hoarder. Turn 3 you Mirage Caller the one that lived -- probably the mistress or you just Kabal Talonpriest. You've either got a solid board and/or you're half done your quest.
And I think that can just be your early game. While you stall for whatever your late game cards are (Elise, Dragons, whatever).
And honestly, Mirage Caller makes the quest so easy to complete that you don't really need to focus too much on deathrattles anyway. Just make the rest of your deck strong and enjoy the reward when you finally get it.
Well, the thing is that it is a absolut terrible play to summon a 1/1 on turn 4 - especially if you are falling behind on board. And I do fancy Spiritsinger Umbra but the deathrattle that will be triggered from her are not that impressive or RNG based - at least not in Priest. As for completing the quest it is not a wincondition by it self. Sure 40 health and a 8/8 taunt is great but you can still easily lose after playing it. Which brings me back to my point: the deathrattles just seems to weak to reliably contest aggro decks or even late game minions in a value game.
And of course they can be used to simple stall out the game as ShadowAldrius points out and then start dropping value cards. I just have a hard time seeing the kind of deck being viable when Jades are present and discardlock, pirate warrior or whatever might be strong aggro decks.
I don't get why you're trying so hard to convince people this deck will fail. Team 5, who has actually playtested it, says it's quite good, so it seems to me there's nothing to worry about. To me, it's very obviously a playable archetype
I certainly never said the quest was the win condition. Add whatever win condition you like -- unless it's some convoluted OTK thing, it will be easier with the quest than without, I'm pretty sure.
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"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
I don't get why you're trying so hard to convince people this deck will fail. Team 5, who has actually playtested it, says it's quite good, so it seems to me there's nothing to worry about. To me, it's very obviously a playable archetype
I certainly never said the quest was the win condition. Add whatever win condition you like -- unless it's some convoluted OTK thing, it will be easier with the quest than without, I'm pretty sure.
I am not trying to convince anyone that the deck will fail. On the contrary I am trying to understand how the deck will be good because I cannot see it. I love Priest and hated when Priest was trash tier before MSoG and I am worried that it will happen again. I just wanted a discussion about the subject and hoped some people could ease my mind.
Heck no. Hunter's new 1-drop may not be as useful as Alleycat, but it's still viable in both Constructed and Arena. Direhorn Hatchling is amazing for both N'Zoth and Taunt Warrior as well as its token (no more having to use Chillmaw as a Taunt for N'Zoth to resurrect!). Crystalline Oracle is a great 1-drop for Priest, Terrorscale Stalker works really well in many Hunter decks, Tortollan Forager is an amazing 2-drop for Druid bound to see play across the board, Eggnapper has some amount of potential in certain decks, Spiritsinger Umbra might as well become the new Brann Bronzebeard, Volatile Elemental forces your opponent to play around it early on (unless they can just ping it off, but it still has its uses), Tortollan Shellraiser isn't that bad of a Priest card though it probably won't beat out Priest of the Feast, Igneous Elemental generates tons of minions in Elemental decks to the point where you almost never run out of 1/2s, and I probably missed some things on the list but overall the Deathrattle cards for this expansion are really good for several of the classes and I would NOT dismiss them.
Edit: Forgot Tortollan Forager's effect was a Battlecry. Also, I will admit Giant Anaconda may not end up seeing that much play.
Playing Zoth Priest for Months in dousands of variations I playtested so many different Versions of this Deck (cause its cood vs Jade) and in the End there are especially 2 Cards wich are absolutely nesessary for the Deck to be viable.:
-Sylvanas (200% MVP in every Zoth Deck since day1 the Deck exists)
-Chillmaw
Both or them are rotating out, thats a huge Nerf to Zoth Decks. i rly like the new cards, but overall, i thik Priest will go back to Tier 3-4 where he was alrdy placed before Dragon Priest get great with Gadgetzan.
Actually, there is not only one rly nice T1 Deathrattle minion , they're all....OK
Playing Zoth Priest for Months in dousands of variations I playtested so many different Versions of this Deck and in the End there are especially 2 Cards wich are absolutely nesessary for the Deck to be viable.:
-Sylvanas (200% MVP in every Zoth Deck since day1 the Deck exists)
-Chillmaw
Both or them are rotating out, thats a huge Nerf to Zoth Decks. i rly like the new cards, but overall, i thik Priest will go back to Tier 3-4 where he was alrdy placed before Dragon Priest get great with Gadgetzan.
Actually, there is not only one rly nice T1 Deathrattle minion , they're all....OK
Chillmaw is only really important because you dont have other good deathrattles with taunt. Now you have Tortallan Shellraiser so you don't really need it.
Heck no. Hunter's new 1-drop may not be as useful as Alleycat, but it's still viable in both Constructed and Arena. Direhorn Hatchling is amazing for both N'Zoth and Taunt Warrior as well as its token (no more having to use Chillmaw as a Taunt for N'Zoth to resurrect!). Crystalline Oracle is a great 1-drop for Priest, Terrorscale Stalker works really well in many Hunter decks, Tortollan Forager is an amazing 2-drop for Druid bound to see play across the board, Eggnapper has some amount of potential in certain decks, Spiritsinger Umbra might as well become the new Brann Bronzebeard, Volatile Elemental forces your opponent to play around it early on (unless they can just ping it off, but it still has its uses), Tortollan Shellraiser isn't that bad of a Priest card though it probably won't beat out Priest of the Feast, Igneous Elemental generates tons of minions in Elemental decks to the point where you almost never run out of 1/2s, and I probably missed some things on the list but overall the Deathrattle cards for this expansion are really good for several of the classes and I would NOT dismiss them.
Edit: Forgot Tortollan Forager's effect was a Battlecry. Also, I will admit Giant Anaconda may not end up seeing that much play.
Okay my title was perhaps a bit misleading. I think there are lots of great deathrattle minions in this expansion but few of them are available to Priest; and quest Priets needs various deathrattle minions to meet the requirement of playing 7 of them. :-)
I can't believe all this shameless whining from priest players. Priest got good cards. How can you seriously be complaining before even using a single one?
Heck no. Hunter's new 1-drop may not be as useful as Alleycat, but it's still viable in both Constructed and Arena. Direhorn Hatchling is amazing for both N'Zoth and Taunt Warrior as well as its token (no more having to use Chillmaw as a Taunt for N'Zoth to resurrect!). Crystalline Oracle is a great 1-drop for Priest, Terrorscale Stalker works really well in many Hunter decks, Tortollan Forager is an amazing 2-drop for Druid bound to see play across the board, Eggnapper has some amount of potential in certain decks, Spiritsinger Umbra might as well become the new Brann Bronzebeard, Volatile Elemental forces your opponent to play around it early on (unless they can just ping it off, but it still has its uses), Tortollan Shellraiser isn't that bad of a Priest card though it probably won't beat out Priest of the Feast, Igneous Elemental generates tons of minions in Elemental decks to the point where you almost never run out of 1/2s, and I probably missed some things on the list but overall the Deathrattle cards for this expansion are really good for several of the classes and I would NOT dismiss them.
Edit: Forgot Tortollan Forager's effect was a Battlecry. Also, I will admit Giant Anaconda may not end up seeing that much play.
Okay my title was perhaps a bit misleading. I think there are lots of great deathrattle minions in this expansion but few of them are available to Priest; and quest Priets needs various deathrattle minions to meet the requirement of playing 7 of them. :-)
Ah, okay. As for Deathrattle Priest though, all those minions could still work well in unison even if you're going no-duplicates mode for the sake of Kazakus and Raza, the Chained. Plus there's all kinds of cards to fill in the cracks left by the somewhat weaker Deathrattle minions for the sake of curve, in the case of both spells and minions.
And honestly, Mirage Caller makes the quest so easy to complete that you don't really need to focus too much on deathrattles anyway. Just make the rest of your deck strong and enjoy the reward when you finally get it.
Well, the thing is that it is a absolut terrible play to summon a 1/1 on turn 4 - especially if you are falling behind on board. And I do fancy Spiritsinger Umbra but the deathrattle that will be triggered from her are not that impressive or RNG based - at least not in Priest. As for completing the quest it is not a wincondition by it self. Sure 40 health and a 8/8 taunt is great but you can still easily lose after playing it. Which brings me back to my point: the deathrattles just seems to weak to reliably contest aggro decks or even late game minions in a value game.
And of course they can be used to simple stall out the game as ShadowAldrius points out and then start dropping value cards. I just have a hard time seeing the kind of deck being viable when Jades are present and discardlock, pirate warrior or whatever might be strong aggro decks.
Yeah, you're trying to play a midrange game with a deck that is obviously supposed to be control. ShadowAldrius is absolutely right about how this deck will play. If you think Twilight Summoner is bad in this deck, you are not thinking like a control player at all.
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"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
I can't believe all this shameless whining from priest players. Priest got good cards. How can you seriously be complaining before even using a single one?
Where am I whining? I expressed some concern about the upcoming Nzoth Priest because I think it looks weak. That's what forums are for: discussing things. I haven't concluded that Priest will be in a bad spot or anything at all. I just wanted a discussion about it and I've gotten that so far. So
it's intended, no one wants to see Haunted Creeper or Piloted Shredder ever again, you can say that hunters got Infested WolfRat Pack, Kindly Grandmother and all the deathrattle sinergy but tbh, sticky deathrattle should be class restricted, if they want hunter to be the sticky deathrattle class so be it, but no one wants to see sticky deathrattle minions across multiple classes ever again.
edit: if you really want a sticky deathrattle minion just use Harvest Golem
I don't get why you're trying so hard to convince people this deck will fail. Team 5, who has actually playtested it, says it's quite good, so it seems to me there's nothing to worry about. To me, it's very obviously a playable archetype
I certainly never said the quest was the win condition. Add whatever win condition you like -- unless it's some convoluted OTK thing, it will be easier with the quest than without, I'm pretty sure.
Today in my free brawl pack I got Barongeddon, then I had a cup of fresh green tea. As a result of that, I think Priest is OP because my keyboard is not a mechanical one. I hope Blizzard will address this issue.
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Good evening hearthpwn
So, Blizzard have finally revealed all cards from the upcoming expansion and I think it’s an exciting expansion – though I still fear Jades will be very dominant. But that’s not what I want to discuss.
One of the first reveals we saw was Awaken the Makers and what a card. The obvious deck type is of course Nzoth Priest and I was excited to see what deathrattle creatures they would release to empower this archetype. However, after I’ve seen all the new deathrattle cards and compared them to what cards will be available in standard after rotation, I really think the deathrattle cards are very lackluster.
I will not mention all deathrattle cards but rather cards I think could be a part of Nzoth Priest decklist.
From the new expansion: Crystalline Oracle, Tortollan Shellraiser, Igneous Elemental and Volatile Elemental.
To be honest it’s only the class cards I think is remotely good – the other two just seems bad but I guess the deck needs deathrattles.
From the cards, available in standard after rotation:
Mistress of Mixtures, Infested Tauren, Twilight Summoner, Bloodmage Thalnos, Loot Hoarder, Shifting Shade and Cairne Bloodhoof.
Again, I think that the lineup is rather poor. Of course, some of the cards are decent but few of them can help you turn the board if you are falling behind. I really think that we are missing some high impact deathrattle minions like Sylvanas (I do understand why they are rotating her) or even Chillmaw. But perhaps I am not seeing the big picture here. I know we have to see how the decks turn out after the cards become playable but the way I see it the deathrattles are just too poor to build a deck around at the moment. The big Nzoth can more or less be cleared with a flamestrike (at least for Priest players). What do you guys think about the upcoming Nzoth Priest’s potential?
On a last note: I know Priest can get insane card value from their steal effects but it is still RNG based and not a reliable win condition.
Twilight Summoner is fine in Priest since you have good board clears and heals, so board control isn't such a big deal.
Fire Fly might open up a stronger Elemental side-theme.
Spiritsinger Umbra makes any deathrattle card better.
And honestly, Mirage Caller makes the quest so easy to complete that you don't really need to focus too much on deathrattles anyway. Just make the rest of your deck strong and enjoy the reward when you finally get it.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
mirage caller doesnt make the quest easy. A good deathrattle minion would do a lot more for the quest at most mirage caller can add one to your quest counter. If priest had half the good earlygame deathrattle minions hunter had, they wouldn't be in the spot they're in. Priest needs standard equivalents of some of the good old deathrattle minions. Sylv, belchers, and deathlords are all cards that would make the cut over every other standard deathrattle minion. I'd even argue the dark cultist is better than the talonpriest in the quest deck (talonpriest is a better card so you might run both). spiritsinger umbra makes deathrattle minions less bad but I'm not convinced its anywhere close to brann. Other than card draw mechanics, most of the deathrattle effects aren't as impactful as battlecry effects so even if they had the same mana cost Spiritsinger Umbra would be worse, let alone at 1 mana more.
As of right now: I actually think N'zoth isn't really great with a Priest-Quest deck. With Sylvanas and Chillmaw gone, what the heck is N'zoth summoning? Filling the board with Loot Hoarders and Mistress of Mixtures? I could be wrong, I'm not an expert at the game. But that's my impression right now. There's just nothing big and impactful for N'zoth to summon in priest like there has been in Paladin.
I think that a lot of the newer deathrattle cards are just stellar for early game play on their own, though. Tortollan Shellraiser, Volatile Elemental, and good old Mistress of Mixtures are all awesome against any sort of aggressive decks and really help dominate the early game board. And Mirage Caller adds a ton of value to all of those cards. (Like turn 1 you play quest, turn 2 you play some combination of Mixtures and Oracle or a Loot Hoarder. Turn 3 you Mirage Caller the one that lived -- probably the mistress or you just Kabal Talonpriest. You've either got a solid board and/or you're half done your quest.
And I think that can just be your early game. While you stall for whatever your late game cards are (Elise, Dragons, whatever).
I don't get why you're trying so hard to convince people this deck will fail. Team 5, who has actually playtested it, says it's quite good, so it seems to me there's nothing to worry about. To me, it's very obviously a playable archetype
I certainly never said the quest was the win condition. Add whatever win condition you like -- unless it's some convoluted OTK thing, it will be easier with the quest than without, I'm pretty sure.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Heck no. Hunter's new 1-drop may not be as useful as Alleycat, but it's still viable in both Constructed and Arena. Direhorn Hatchling is amazing for both N'Zoth and Taunt Warrior as well as its token (no more having to use Chillmaw as a Taunt for N'Zoth to resurrect!). Crystalline Oracle is a great 1-drop for Priest, Terrorscale Stalker works really well in many Hunter decks, Tortollan Forager is an amazing 2-drop for Druid bound to see play across the board, Eggnapper has some amount of potential in certain decks, Spiritsinger Umbra might as well become the new Brann Bronzebeard, Volatile Elemental forces your opponent to play around it early on (unless they can just ping it off, but it still has its uses), Tortollan Shellraiser isn't that bad of a Priest card though it probably won't beat out Priest of the Feast, Igneous Elemental generates tons of minions in Elemental decks to the point where you almost never run out of 1/2s, and I probably missed some things on the list but overall the Deathrattle cards for this expansion are really good for several of the classes and I would NOT dismiss them.
Edit: Forgot Tortollan Forager's effect was a Battlecry. Also, I will admit Giant Anaconda may not end up seeing that much play.
Playing Zoth Priest for Months in dousands of variations I playtested so many different Versions of this Deck (cause its cood vs Jade) and in the End there are especially 2 Cards wich are absolutely nesessary for the Deck to be viable.:
-Sylvanas (200% MVP in every Zoth Deck since day1 the Deck exists)
-Chillmaw
Both or them are rotating out, thats a huge Nerf to Zoth Decks. i rly like the new cards, but overall, i thik Priest will go back to Tier 3-4 where he was alrdy placed before Dragon Priest get great with Gadgetzan.
Actually, there is not only one rly nice T1 Deathrattle minion , they're all....OK
I can't believe all this shameless whining from priest players. Priest got good cards. How can you seriously be complaining before even using a single one?
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
Comeback of the corrupted healbot? Like in old n'zoth paladin
Just play The Beast and Shadow Madness
it's intended, no one wants to see Haunted Creeper or Piloted Shredder ever again, you can say that hunters got Infested Wolf Rat Pack, Kindly Grandmother and all the deathrattle sinergy but tbh, sticky deathrattle should be class restricted, if they want hunter to be the sticky deathrattle class so be it, but no one wants to see sticky deathrattle minions across multiple classes ever again.
edit: if you really want a sticky deathrattle minion just use Harvest Golem
If you really want some strong Deathrattles, there's this little thing called Wild...
#gNOmeferatu