Hearthpwn

First off the card itself:

Bolvar Fordragon Effect reads: Whenever a friendly minion dies while this is in your hand, gain +1 Attack. 

THIS IS SCARY GOOD. If you look closely, it doesn't say until the end of turn. Almost every person I saw reviewing this card thinks that this was crap because of this.  BUT IT DOESNT. It retains the stacks it obtains throughout the entire game until you play it. 

SInce Paladins got a severe boost in early game, Having 5 or 6 of your minions dying before turn 5 or 6 is not uncommon. So at a minimum this will be a 5/7 or a 6/7 by turn 5.  This could also be played late game as a super powerful 10+ attack card for 5 mana, because again IT RETAINS THAT STACKS IT RECEIVES.

Sure it has a weakness to silence, but a lot of classes already suffer from that with cards they play. 

Long story short this card isn't as trash as people were saying and I think this will be in every pally deck I make from now on.

Everyone knew it kept the stacks of attack; however since you want to keep it in the starting hand to get more attack you are pretty much playing down one card. Also it is a horrible top deck at any later part of the game. 

Quote from HESJ »

Quote from Shwab »

First off the card itself:

Bolvar Fordragon Effect reads: Whenever a friendly minion dies while this is in your hand, gain +1 Attack. 

THIS IS SCARY GOOD. If you look closely, it doesn't say until the end of turn. Almost every person I saw reviewing this card thinks that this was crap because of this.  BUT IT DOESNT. It retains the stacks it obtains throughout the entire game until you play it. 

SInce Paladins got a severe boost in early game, Having 5 or 6 of your minions dying before turn 5 or 6 is not uncommon. So at a minimum this will be a 5/7 or a 6/7 by turn 5.  This could also be played late game as a super powerful 10+ attack card for 5 mana, because again IT RETAINS THAT STACKS IT RECEIVES.

Sure it has a weakness to silence, but a lot of classes already suffer from that with cards they play. 

Long story short this card isn't as trash as people were saying and I think this will be in every pally deck I make from now on.

You have to keep it in your hand the entire time. If you're severely far behind and you top deck him, it's a dead draw for the first 5 or 6 turns. You're only looking at the positive scenario. Unless you could run 2 of these(so there is more chance you have him in your hand at any given time) this card is only good in very, very specific circumstances. 

People seem to have this mindset that his effect is something that takes several turns to set up. It isn't. You can buff him to reasonable levels in just one or two turns. Even on the turn you draw him. He's only bad when you topdeck him with absolutely no board or other cards, and you can say that for a lot of otherwise great cards. 

And in the pretty likely scenario that he's in your hand for multiple turns he's amazing. 

Quote from Shwab »

If you look closely, it doesn't say until the end of turn. Almost every person I saw reviewing this card thinks that this was crap because of this. 

I don´t know where the hell you were looking but is was certainly not this forum. It´s absolutly clear that the effect doesn´t end at the end of the turn.

But even if you can pull of a 7/7 Bolvar it´s still garbage because a simple silence oder sap ruins it all.

I don't think comparisons with Boulderfist Ogre hold up because of the mana cost.  Feugen seems like a better comparison, and Bolvar easily has a better value than Feugen.  7 health is hard to kill, and it doesn't take much to get Bolvar past 4 health, giving you solid value.

I also don't think being vulnerable to silence or removal is a problem for a 5 mana card.  A lot of decks would consider it a win to see their opponent spend hard removal or silence on such a cheap card.  And Paladins have a range of buffs to undo the silence should it happen, or else to draw out the silence before Bolvar is even played.

Finally, Bolvar lets you choose whether to play it early or hold it and let it build up power.  Having that kind of decision to make gives the card versatility and raises the skill level involved in playing the game.

I think Bolvar is a card that's good for the game.

Quote from TazdingoHS »

The problem is that everybody has some sort of answer with removal/silence in competitive constructed ranks, you can't expect to put a huge attack minion on board and have it live to deal that sort of damage to swing the game for you. 

Your argument of "Sure it has a weakness to silence, but a lot of classes already suffer from that with cards they play. " is bad. Sure other classes play cards like Cairne and Sylvanas which have bulls-eyes on their backs to silence, but at least those cards will often require at least a 2 for 1, a 4/5 and 5/5 body after silence is still strong on the board. When you play a 5 mana x/7 just to have it silenced to a 1/7 that does nothing afterwards, it's mediocre.

 

As well complain about Twilight Drake. A similar effect, even weaker against Silence than Bolvar and yet it's a great card. Silence isn't that powerful, and most decks will only run one or two. Whereas on the other side most decks run multiple things that need silencing. If you Silence Bolvar you can't Silence Tirion and visa versa. Or Sylvanas, or Cairne or whatever else needs to be silenced. 

Continuing the Twilight Drake comparison, Bolvar being bad when topdecking is not a problem for the same reason Twilight being bad while topdecking is not a problem - it's not a scenario that's going to come up if you're a good player. You put Bolvar into a control deck, you're always going to have a decent hand. Just as Handlock should never be topdecking. If you are you're doing something wrong and the problem is not Twilight or Bolvar it's you.

Bolvar is just terrible when it comes to silence. 

I think it would be completely fine of it started off as a 4/7 instead of a 1/7.

You would need to still deal with him, and he wouldn't be a useless when the hoot comes to boot. 

OR it should be redesigned, and be something like a 5/8 for 12 that costs 1 less whenever a minion dies.

I kinda want to try some slooow paladin deck with Bolvar Fordragon, Faceless Manipulator and Blessed Champion.

Have a bunch of dudes die and let cards like Tirion Fordring and Sylvanas Windrunner eat opposing silences, then drop some 15+ power Bolvar and clone it on the same turn. Pretty unlikely that the opponent can deal with both in a single turn and then just Blessed Champion the surviving copy and hit for lethal.

Quote from Shwab »

First off the card itself:

Bolvar Fordragon Effect reads: Whenever a friendly minion dies while this is in your hand, gain +1 Attack. 

THIS IS SCARY GOOD. If you look closely, it doesn't say until the end of turn. Almost every person I saw reviewing this card thinks that this was crap because of this.  BUT IT DOESNT. It retains the stacks it obtains throughout the entire game until you play it. 

SInce Paladins got a severe boost in early game, Having 5 or 6 of your minions dying before turn 5 or 6 is not uncommon. So at a minimum this will be a 5/7 or a 6/7 by turn 5.  This could also be played late game as a super powerful 10+ attack card for 5 mana, because again IT RETAINS THAT STACKS IT RECEIVES.

Sure it has a weakness to silence, but a lot of classes already suffer from that with cards they play. 

Long story short this card isn't as trash as people were saying and I think this will be in every pally deck I make from now on.

Why is this card bad? Because I'd rather run a Boulderfist Ogre.  No conditions have to be met, and he can't be silenced and I can run 2...for 1 mana more. 

A better question is why would someone pay 1600 dust for Bolvar Fordragon.  If you randomly get him in a pack go nuts and try him out...but his downside seems too great for a 5 mana 1/7.  Mogu'shan Warden is 1 mana less and has taunt.

Bottom line ogre is better, and if Bolvar gets silenced he's a worse mogushaun... good luck!

Quote from Metzelmax »

Druid of the fang 7/7 for 5 mana, only requires a beast.

7/7 Bolvar requires you to lose the entire early and mid game...

Yeah! All you need is one of those many druid beast cards in play! Ya know... The one playable one. That card is awful.

It really seems like they wanted to give him Charge, but realized he would be broken. Which he would be. He probably should have +1/1 and taunt for an extra mana or something. He'd be more playable for sure.

Because people are comparing him to Tirion Fordring rather than The Beast or some other actually bad legendary. Depending on how easy it is for his ability to ramp his attack (which is the hardest to predict), I actually think he could have a place. If most games he could end up a 10/7 or more for 5 mana he'd be great, even if silenceable. Doubt it though since he has to be in your hand.

If you consider the fact that Control Pally almost always has a big hand, and the games often stretch out for a long time, there's a good chance for Bolvar to be huge. 

Quote from Protar »

And in the pretty likely scenario that he's in your hand for multiple turns he's amazing. 

The fact that generally Feugen is better and more reliable then a class legendary says it all. Tirion is a 10/10, Bolvar is a 5/10. Not worth the slot imo. Much rather play Quartermaster.

I've posted this elsewhere, but his intro is really cool. It changes in intensity depending on how big he is when he hits the board. Compare 7:31 to 32:50 (I believe it is)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYl27wJPuP4&feature=youtu.be&t=7m30s

Will be easier for him to see play if he were 2/7 when silenced. Would still be tough body and capable of killing most of the smallest minions. Nowadays is tough to see a scenario where this guy is good enough (I think is not so bad, but is he good enough to take place in paladin decks?)

Quote from MvonTzeskagrad »

Will be easier for him to see play if he were 2/7 when silenced. Would still be tough body and capable of killing most of the smallest minions. Nowadays is tough to see a scenario where this guy is good enough (I think is not so bad, but is he good enough to take place in paladin decks?)

I think all it needs to be good is for it to become a 2/8.

If Fuegan is a neutral legendary that has the base stats of 4/7. You expect a class legendary to be +1/+1 with an equally devastating mechanic. Which Bolvar has.

You could average out Bolvar to be a 5/8, which is really good on turn 5. But it is still not a great draw and silence still makes it not great.

 It either needs to become 4 Mana (which I strongly disagree with since Paladin has to many 4 drops) or just gain a base +1/+1.