Hammer of Wrath is the definition of a very balanced card. But it doesn't really... do anything. Paladin doesn't get much from cycling, and 3 damage after turn 3 is pretty underwhelming.
It's just one of those cards they copy-pasted into a couple of classes because they thought they'd want it. I think at one point, when Paladin had a bunch of 'change a minion's stats to 3/3' stuff the idea was to make Hammer of Wrath a little more impactful, but that never really happened.
It's one of those cards I think they should HoF or rework if/when they do a Paladin rework on the basic/classic set.
I myself got now 5000 Paladin wins and consider myself a Pala main. I am playing wild, not standard, but even in wild you are right. you lack the identity, the fire and the fun. Paladin is nice, I mean there has to be a reason why I main it. And don't mistake me. I love the new quest. I made a very nice controlling reborn deck myself which works pretty decent. But as you said, the class feels clunky. And fuck yeah, no decent card draw at all. I am playing high defensive hardcontroldecks to win against most things. And that's the best I can do as Controldeck in Pala nowadays. But guess what? Every fucking combo deck eats me. Every fucking hardcore aggressive deck eats me. Every value cheating decks freaking eats me. I create my decks myself, I work at them, I make them unique and good. And I am proud of them. BUT I am suffering that much on ladder sometimes I wanna hang myself already. It's so good damn frustrating. The fifth game in follow against quest mage. You already now you are beaten. Then pirate warrior with perfect curve. Then millrouge with 20.000 N'Zoth. It's disgusting. Pala has several problems and thank God, I am not the only ****** who does see this. Thank you for this essay my friend. Highly appreciate it. And no matter what let's keep the Paladin flag high in the wind. I will fight with honor!
PS: And don't you start playing this cancer mech or murloc shit. Then you abandoned the way of light. 😉
Thanks! And don't worry, I will fight with honor!
100% agree viability for control is nonexistent. I've been homebrewing a hilarious Recurring Villain paladin deck if you're looking for something fun to try, SoJ and Villain is one of the funniest combo's in the game for me if you're looking for a mess around deck
0 mana sunwalker and Alura legandaries are broken for paladin, it's going to be one of the strongest classes in the new expansion.
Why? What's the wincon there?
Devout Pupil is basically better (not even strictly) Anubisath Defender. It probably doesn't come down on curve very often, and it's not game winning. High Abbess Alura seems better in pala than priest (less spells that screw you), but it's hardly game winnning. Certainly not broken.
Paladin might continue to be decent, but it's probably still going to be in aggro form due to their lack of consistent card draw and late game win conditions. Could be because Blizzard gives them something new every exp, like a toddler with zero attention span.
Devout Pupil is a arguably a better Anubisath Defender. Don't get me wrong, I think it's great, too. But it doesn't win you the game, and by the time it comes down against aggro you're probably either long dead or you've stabilized anyway.
High Abbess Alura looks like a natural inclusion in many decks that run pupil (but not all). But she does have some conflicting synergy - spellburst cards requires smaller spells, but you want a curve bigger spells for her particular payoff. And again, she doesn't win you games against decks that go longer.
You probably have more experience than me in playing paladin but I can tell you this.
Last season I was sitting on rank 5D and said f**k it I'll try some pure paladin since I'm missing only 12 wins on it for golden portrait as I already have all of them golden and some on 1k wins ( That's why I say really not a paladin player because I played since naxx came out).
I actually made it to 2D with an amazing win rate. I wasn't expecting that at all. And It was really fun to play too.
I agree when you said that mostly top tier paladin decks in the past were toxic and not fun and that is true 100%, hence my dislike on paladins altogether.
The only thing I was missing in those games was some sort of finisher. Something I can close the game on easily.
You're thread was really constructive and well written and I really hope they revamp the class in a way everyone would see enjoyable to play.
OP is right, paladin has suffered from a identity crisis a while, it is the class i have played least (except for DH but they are new soo) the biggest turn off for me is the No card draw, no card generating, no real good board clears.
Weaknesses: Direct damage spells, destroying big minions
I Dont wanna be that guy but i dont feel the strenghts of paladin when im playing against them ( secrets are awful, you have to go wide if you play murlocs so minion swarms are "just murlocs" , minions buffs and debuffs are meh librams are good not gonna lie but lack in consistency cuz you know "no card draw",healing is a thing but priest/warlock are just better :( )
Paladin needs a rework or at least un-nerf some cards ( well at least in wild you actually see some strenghts on paladin )
I must agree with the author of the topic. Don't misunderstand me. I think It's a bit harsh to say, that the Paladin needs a complete rework. I really love the themes: Pure Paladin, with librams, amazing! A new in-game deck recipe offers the Honor Roll Duel paladin, awesome! My problem is, that the class is really not viable. When I play against for example a priest, I feel my pure pala-libram deck clunky. Always, when I try to come up with a strongish card, there is a Priest card which immediately destroys it in no time. I think the class is now tries to operate with strong, straight-forward cards, which is great, but I really need a lot of luck, to operate with the librams effectively. If I don't draw the necessary cards in the right order, and plus comes a Bad Luck Albatross, or a Bomber Warrior, I am done. I can do anything, I surely won't win the game. The Paladin really needs some aoe, and board clear. Now the class is absolutely limited in this. Lord Barov is a good approach to solve this problem, I hope it will work. Lack of Card Drawing. I think Hand of A'dal is a nice approach to solve the problem. You use your buff, but you don't feel that you lose with it, because you can draw a card, which is essential with a libram type deck. The First Day of School is a great approach, too. Well, I think the paladin isn't in the best condition now, but the ideas are great. It can win some games, but really needs some help from the card designers to make the class a bit more effective.
Nahh no way Lord Barov is a Paladin card. In control your are just missing the activatores , Consecration alone isnt enough. In all my games with Libram Pally i rarely felt i needed more Equality effects. Its always the pure aoe spell thats missing . Even Viper said Pure Pally would be so much better if Paladin had a 3rd Consecration....
And in aggro Pally you dont wanna play a 3 mana 3/2 wich is bad on curve , and if you cant use him later to kill the opponent, you weaken your own board and let the opponent do the boardclear by simply killing a 3/2..
The biggest problem with Paladin is just one word: Secrets. They failed super hard as a class mechanic (only one true secret deck was competitive in HS history), it doesnt fit the class theme AT ALL, and it makes up for a good chunk of paladins entire class kit, this was probably the biggest mistake the OG Team 5 has made as far as class design goes.
If paladin had decent support for anything else instead of secrets they would feel like a much better class already, literally anything else would be better than shitty useless secrets.
Paladin is so obnoxiously broken and i knew it. paladin was crap so they push the class so hard it's always like that ... well, now it's a matter of time for the nerfs.
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Hammer of Wrath is the definition of a very balanced card. But it doesn't really... do anything. Paladin doesn't get much from cycling, and 3 damage after turn 3 is pretty underwhelming.
It's just one of those cards they copy-pasted into a couple of classes because they thought they'd want it. I think at one point, when Paladin had a bunch of 'change a minion's stats to 3/3' stuff the idea was to make Hammer of Wrath a little more impactful, but that never really happened.
It's one of those cards I think they should HoF or rework if/when they do a Paladin rework on the basic/classic set.
Thanks! And don't worry, I will fight with honor!
100% agree viability for control is nonexistent. I've been homebrewing a hilarious Recurring Villain paladin deck if you're looking for something fun to try, SoJ and Villain is one of the funniest combo's in the game for me if you're looking for a mess around deck
To Arms Men!
Here, I fixed your problem.
https://www.hearthpwn.com/forums/hearthstone-general/general-deck-building/244030-theorycraft-keltroll-paladin
https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/the-comprehensive-scholomance-academy-preview/5/
Read Devout Pupil and High Abbess Alura, i think you will get the idea of why they are broken ... or not.
Devout Pupil is a arguably a better Anubisath Defender. Don't get me wrong, I think it's great, too. But it doesn't win you the game, and by the time it comes down against aggro you're probably either long dead or you've stabilized anyway.
High Abbess Alura looks like a natural inclusion in many decks that run pupil (but not all). But she does have some conflicting synergy - spellburst cards requires smaller spells, but you want a curve bigger spells for her particular payoff. And again, she doesn't win you games against decks that go longer.
You probably have more experience than me in playing paladin but I can tell you this.
Last season I was sitting on rank 5D and said f**k it I'll try some pure paladin since I'm missing only 12 wins on it for golden portrait as I already have all of them golden and some on 1k wins ( That's why I say really not a paladin player because I played since naxx came out).
I actually made it to 2D with an amazing win rate. I wasn't expecting that at all. And It was really fun to play too.
I agree when you said that mostly top tier paladin decks in the past were toxic and not fun and that is true 100%, hence my dislike on paladins altogether.
The only thing I was missing in those games was some sort of finisher. Something I can close the game on easily.
You're thread was really constructive and well written and I really hope they revamp the class in a way everyone would see enjoyable to play.
Priest longs to have the draw paladin has.
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paladin is just the dullest, uninspired class ever imo
it was probably meant to be the middle of the road jack of all trades.... while not being interesting to play whatsoever at the same time
not exactly sure how you would change it, it's bar none my least favorite class to play
the whole class just makes me snore when playing it or against it
PS: the fuck have murlocs to do with paladin? that's just utterly atrocious design, anyway.... can we have monks instead? thanks
OP is right, paladin has suffered from a identity crisis a while, it is the class i have played least (except for DH but they are new soo)
the biggest turn off for me is the No card draw, no card generating, no real good board clears.
Imho paladin is the buff and debuff class. Make small things big or make big things small. It is a pretty strong identity in my mind.
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But i agree murlocs are an odd choice thematicallu. But they do see s ton of buffs, so it works on that level.
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Paladin:
I Dont wanna be that guy but i dont feel the strenghts of paladin when im playing against them ( secrets are awful, you have to go wide if you play murlocs so minion swarms are "just murlocs" , minions buffs and debuffs are meh librams are good not gonna lie but lack in consistency cuz you know "no card draw",healing is a thing but priest/warlock are just better :( )
Paladin needs a rework or at least un-nerf some cards ( well at least in wild you actually see some strenghts on paladin )
Blizzard said they'd rework the paladin next, so no worries bruv
I must agree with the author of the topic. Don't misunderstand me. I think It's a bit harsh to say, that the Paladin needs a complete rework. I really love the themes: Pure Paladin, with librams, amazing! A new in-game deck recipe offers the Honor Roll Duel paladin, awesome! My problem is, that the class is really not viable. When I play against for example a priest, I feel my pure pala-libram deck clunky. Always, when I try to come up with a strongish card, there is a Priest card which immediately destroys it in no time. I think the class is now tries to operate with strong, straight-forward cards, which is great, but I really need a lot of luck, to operate with the librams effectively. If I don't draw the necessary cards in the right order, and plus comes a Bad Luck Albatross, or a Bomber Warrior, I am done. I can do anything, I surely won't win the game. The Paladin really needs some aoe, and board clear. Now the class is absolutely limited in this. Lord Barov is a good approach to solve this problem, I hope it will work. Lack of Card Drawing. I think Hand of A'dal is a nice approach to solve the problem. You use your buff, but you don't feel that you lose with it, because you can draw a card, which is essential with a libram type deck. The First Day of School is a great approach, too.
Well, I think the paladin isn't in the best condition now, but the ideas are great. It can win some games, but really needs some help from the card designers to make the class a bit more effective.
Nahh no way Lord Barov is a Paladin card. In control your are just missing the activatores , Consecration alone isnt enough. In all my games with Libram Pally i rarely felt i needed more Equality effects. Its always the pure aoe spell thats missing . Even Viper said Pure Pally would be so much better if Paladin had a 3rd Consecration....
And in aggro Pally you dont wanna play a 3 mana 3/2 wich is bad on curve , and if you cant use him later to kill the opponent, you weaken your own board and let the opponent do the boardclear by simply killing a 3/2..
The biggest problem with Paladin is just one word: Secrets. They failed super hard as a class mechanic (only one true secret deck was competitive in HS history), it doesnt fit the class theme AT ALL, and it makes up for a good chunk of paladins entire class kit, this was probably the biggest mistake the OG Team 5 has made as far as class design goes.
If paladin had decent support for anything else instead of secrets they would feel like a much better class already, literally anything else would be better than shitty useless secrets.
Paladin is so obnoxiously broken and i knew it. paladin was crap so they push the class so hard it's always like that ... well, now it's a matter of time for the nerfs.