This is too funny OP playing rogue complaining about the Sac nerf. I've been playing strictly Gala lock in legend post nerf and have a record of 32-3 against DH atm, and haven't changed my list either.
LMAO, OP fails.
Uhm, I hate to tell you this, but Highlander Rogue and Galakrond Warrior are two differents deck mate.
I don't doubt you are doing fine with Warlock with all the healings and removals the deck has. But my point is that Sac is not a viable option with Zephrys anymore, and that is a huge deal, specially in a class that has zero healing tools (except the armor of Galakrond and Kronx)
"Since the nerf of Sacrificial Pact Zephris doesn't offer it anymore (and we all know how crucial was that 5hp extra)"
Playing rogue, complaining about another class card nerf. lol.
Ok, between your LMAOs and LOLs, added to the absolute zero of the contribute of your answers, I guess you are still pretty young. If not anagraphically, mentally. Bye mate :)
Although I agree with your points, I do like your rant. As I hate rogues into my inner core. Lackey here, Lackey there, one more Lackey. Noooo 3 moe lackeys. 39 minutes games. Ugh.
DH isn't a problem, it's OP, yes, but I played druid, hunter, and priest, with over 60% each, and if I deduct HLs, it's over 70% easy. The weapon? OP, yes, but much like skull - it doesn't win alone.
You play Rogue, which is the OP darling of blizz it seems, the amount of power creep legs that can be shadowstepped, the 5-7 card draw that cost ZERO, a secret fitting shaman abilities, the only 3/1 at 1 has stealth, and 1/5 at 2 (both priest and mage would exchange their 2/3 epics with 1/5 leg), more lackeys than cards played from the deck, and you talk about DH...
I don't mind losing to rogue, everyone has a worse matchup, but puzzle box infuriates me more - why would a 5 minion board be left unharmed while my face take 12 damage? Or opponent's for that matter (not fun of a win)? At least DH works with minimal RNG, like the whole game should. That's why it's more consistent.
The only nerf, if any, is indeed the 3/4 weapon. There's a 4/4 overkill for 6, this one just bashes on and on and on regardless whether the minion had been slain or not, and frankly, flavorwise, I don't get it. Why does a DH who works attack like druid has weapons, while it's a warlock/mage/druid toon? Ok, it has, but what weapons - 3/4 worth of stats at 2, an already nerfed Basic weapon, the OP 3/4, and the other one. 4 weapons, 2nd to warrior. It should've been behind hunter as well, but it's way past it.
P.S. Sac Pact got the nerf it should've had, much like battlefiend, but albatross and altrius should've been treated differently, the rest I don't really care.
I think the problem stems from the fact that in order to make a new class (in this case DH) competitive from day 1. As a new class it has access to significantly fewer cards than any other class (no Classic, SoU, RoS, GA) and therefore the cards it got had to be a bit OP to account for this. Did they do it perfectly? Obviously not, hence the 2 rounds of nerfs already, but right now it seems that DH is not really better than other top tier decks which means that eventually some sort of balance was achieved. I wonder though what would happen in the next 1-2 expansions when the number of cards available to DH will double creating a new world of possibilities for synergies/combos...
OP using Rogue you have about zero rights to whine
There are like 5 or 6 decks/classes that are more than competitive in the current meta (Rogue being one of them) and that can definitely keep up with DH. I'm sorry, but if after 2 rounds of nerfs (that had a strong impact, despite the constant whining) you're still always losing to DH, you're either:
- Not playing a competitive deck (your choice)
- Playing a competitive deck that has a bad matchup vs DH (but hopefully good against other competitive decks, so that's your choice again)
- Playing a competitive deck that is good or at least decent against DH, but you're bad at piloting it
I wonder though what would happen in the next 1-2 expansions when the number of cards available to DH will double creating a new world of possibilities for synergies/combos...
My hope is that they will stop with the DH aggro tools and will actually focus on the control / big demons part of the class, which has some great cards and it's a shame they are shadowed.
Oh buhu im so sorry mr galakrond rogue, you have a matchup that is about 50% winrate. Thats not fair, gala rogue should have 70% winrate against every class ofcourse. Honestly i rather see them buff demonhunters so i dont have to constantly play fucking rogues all the time.
I actually quit the game a week after Dh release .. i only watch streams till then .. This expansion along with Dh is the most boring ever you cant have fun Dh is everywhere 75% of the games are against Dh they can destroy u with 0 board at turn 7 cuz of Altruis .. Every other class is almost unplayable and i dont see any balance changes coming soon as Blizz said.
Dh isnt playing any neutral cards in all decks cuz there is no reason too, the class cards are so strong and Blizz cant see or simply doesnt admit as Op says thats fucked up.
The game will be fucked up for so long cuz Blizz showed time after time that they are incapable of making actual good Balance changes, They can only make a class unplayble and im sure as hell they wont do that to Dh cuz its bad advertisment in a way.. So the only way is to wait a long time before its ok for them to nerf to hell Dh
No i don't mean DH. In fact I don't even like DH, pick rogue like everyone else and go to town. Rogue is obviously S tier and climbs back out of any dump in the meta and just wins. Not only that, it's fun as hell.
I did play Rogue quite a lot (78-57 at legend) . Highlander tho, no full galakrond. But I stopped because DH felt unbeatable with it, with no health gain (or very little) and no taunts. But yes, it's definitely the most fun class.
i litterly win almoste every game met highlander rogue against DH so , maybe you should admit you are bad
Oh buhu im so sorry mr galakrond rogue, you have a matchup that is about 50% winrate. Thats not fair, gala rogue should have 70% winrate against every class ofcourse.
Sigh, do you guys even read -.-'' ? Yes, I ALSO played Rogue this season (Highlander Rogue, not full Galakrond, which seems to be the most popular). 20-23 vs DH,32% of my encounters. Before that I did the climb D5 - Legend with Highlander Priest. (22-23 vs DH, 34% of my encounters). I'm currently using Kibler's Quest Warrior (13-15 vs DH, 39% of my encounters ).
Quite different playstyles.
So, the point you guys are missing (big time) IS NOT "buhu, Rogue is unfavored vs DH", but IS ACTUALLY "buhu, DH is still not balanced at all after 2 rounds of nerfs, the second of which was basically a joke and actually made the class stronger thanks to the nerf to sac pac. It's making the game experience toxic and I don't like it at all".
I genuinely don't think I can explain it in a clearer way.
Why should Rouge be good against Demon Hunter? Honestly you are complaining because you have one bad matchup. Furthermore you complain because a totally justified nerf to sac pact hit your class. They should never not nerf a card because another class might need it.
You are right Demon Hunter is strong. But not so strong it's unbeatable. They did fine by nerfing the cards, and while some are less significant than others Demon Hunter is worse than it was before. I do think the basic set is too strong though, and after one or two expansions they need to nerf the whole set to be able to actually make new powerful cards. And I would love if they made it more control oriented. Just make all the damage to all enemies minions only do damage to minions.
And when people say play something else, get better or they don't have a problem you just say they have nothing to contribute. And while they could make a better argument someone can contribute even though they don't agree with you. As someone said Heathstone is a competitive game, and sometimes if you want to win you will have to adapt to the meta, and that will mean your deck won't always be the one you love the most. You can play other decks but then you should not expect it to be the best performing.
And no all 10 classes can not be equal. Some will always be better than others for the game to actually be good. And some classes will be good against other classes. See Rouge for example. The core of the class will always be bad against Demon Hunter because of the split damage. And that is fine, you have a good matchup against other decks.
And then you blame Blizzard for people wanting to play the new class. First of all people will play it because its new. Some of that has gone down, but you will still see that, because people want to hit 500 or 1000 wins. Secondly it's much cheaper than the others, so more people can afford it. I think it's good they made it that way. Last but not least Demon Hunter can do a lot, therefore both people who love control and people loving aggro can play it. Here I think Blizzard dropped the ball and I hope they decide on a concept and stick with it in the next expansion.
DH broke the whole game, but this was forecastable since they showed the first of their imbalanced cards during card release.
The nerfs haven't been enough and the nerf of SP was absolutely unnecessary, since it was the only card that punished people for playing this overpowered bullshitty class.
It's just a pity that people are that desperate and pathetic, that they keep abusing OP classes and cards and tend to swarm the ladder with DH's. It has been the same with Deathstalker Rexxar, which also was way to powerful for the game at that time.
Since release I haven't played one single game as DH in ranking ladder, cause I absolutely hate how this class destroyed the game. Also I tend to look for real challenges and am not that miserable to be reliant on broken, lame cards/classes.
Only thing we can do is stop spending money for this broken game. Since the publication of Kayn Sunfury, Blizz didn't see a single Dollar from my side.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Control is like Chess - using your given resources wisely.
Aggro is like Russian Roulette - Hope to topdeck the right card/ hope for the opponent to topdeck the wrong card.
Parallels to the IQ of the players of both games are, of course, coincidental ;)
I started this morning my grind from D5 trying to get to legend with Spell Druid. Suddenly there are no more easy matchups (of course) but I can't say there is any single deck/class that stands out. I have faced a more or less even amount of Rogues (Gala/Secret and 1-2 Highlander), Gala Warlocks, Reno Mages, DHs and occasionally some Hunter. After 17 games today I am 3-3 vs Rogue, 2-2 vs Warlock, 2-2 vs DH, 1-1 vs Hunter and 2-1 vs Mage. So I'd say that the meta is quite balanced right now without a single deck dominating in terms of either frequency or strength.
P.S.: I am surprised I haven't met any single other Spell Druid deck, neither today nor the previous days when I was going up from D10 to D5
Why should Rouge be good against Demon Hunter? Honestly you are complaining because you have one bad matchup. Furthermore you complain because a totally justified nerf to sac pact hit your class. They should never not nerf a card because another class might need it.
You are right Demon Hunter is strong. But not so strong it's unbeatable. They did fine by nerfing the cards, and while some are less significant than others Demon Hunter is worse than it was before. I do think the basic set is too strong though, and after one or two expansions they need to nerf the whole set to be able to actually make new powerful cards. And I would love if they made it more control oriented. Just make all the damage to all enemies minions only do damage to minions.
And when people say play something else, get better or they don't have a problem you just say they have nothing to contribute. And while they could make a better argument someone can contribute even though they don't agree with you. As someone said Heathstone is a competitive game, and sometimes if you want to win you will have to adapt to the meta, and that will mean your deck won't always be the one you love the most. You can play other decks but then you should not expect it to be the best performing.
And no all 10 classes can not be equal. Some will always be better than others for the game to actually be good. And some classes will be good against other classes. See Rouge for example. The core of the class will always be bad against Demon Hunter because of the split damage. And that is fine, you have a good matchup against other decks.
And then you blame Blizzard for people wanting to play the new class. First of all people will play it because its new. Some of that has gone down, but you will still see that, because people want to hit 500 or 1000 wins. Secondly it's much cheaper than the others, so more people can afford it. I think it's good they made it that way. Last but not least Demon Hunter can do a lot, therefore both people who love control and people loving aggro can play it. Here I think Blizzard dropped the ball and I hope they decide on a concept and stick with it in the next expansion.
I wanted to add something to my post and for some reason I couldn't edit on my phone.
I saw you said it's not just Rogue but you are currently playing warrior. And you don't win a lot with that. But Kibler does. So here I would say you probably just need to get better. The deck plays a lot different than Rouge, and maybe it's because your playstile with the deck is unfavorable against Demon Hunter. This is not something Blizzard should do something about
Does no one else see the problem with the 'play one of 2 or 3 top tier decks and you'll be fine' argument?
No I don't. Why should every deck be equal? That will never be healthy for the game. It should not be only two or three possible decks either, but you have enough decent decks for it to be a relatively healthy meta. Can it be better yes, but when you release new cards every 4 months you won't have a perfect meta all the time.
Ok, between your LMAOs and LOLs, added to the absolute zero of the contribute of your answers, I guess you are still pretty young.
If not anagraphically, mentally. Bye mate :)
Although I agree with your points, I do like your rant. As I hate rogues into my inner core. Lackey here, Lackey there, one more Lackey. Noooo 3 moe lackeys. 39 minutes games. Ugh.
DH has destroyed the game for me. Its just way too consistent even after all the nerfs. A joke.
Wait till it gets better in next expansions. DH will be ridiculous. Problem is 0 mana cards of DH and hero power.
DH isn't a problem, it's OP, yes, but I played druid, hunter, and priest, with over 60% each, and if I deduct HLs, it's over 70% easy. The weapon? OP, yes, but much like skull - it doesn't win alone.
You play Rogue, which is the OP darling of blizz it seems, the amount of power creep legs that can be shadowstepped, the 5-7 card draw that cost ZERO, a secret fitting shaman abilities, the only 3/1 at 1 has stealth, and 1/5 at 2 (both priest and mage would exchange their 2/3 epics with 1/5 leg), more lackeys than cards played from the deck, and you talk about DH...
I don't mind losing to rogue, everyone has a worse matchup, but puzzle box infuriates me more - why would a 5 minion board be left unharmed while my face take 12 damage? Or opponent's for that matter (not fun of a win)? At least DH works with minimal RNG, like the whole game should. That's why it's more consistent.
The only nerf, if any, is indeed the 3/4 weapon. There's a 4/4 overkill for 6, this one just bashes on and on and on regardless whether the minion had been slain or not, and frankly, flavorwise, I don't get it. Why does a DH who works attack like druid has weapons, while it's a warlock/mage/druid toon? Ok, it has, but what weapons - 3/4 worth of stats at 2, an already nerfed Basic weapon, the OP 3/4, and the other one. 4 weapons, 2nd to warrior. It should've been behind hunter as well, but it's way past it.
P.S. Sac Pact got the nerf it should've had, much like battlefiend, but albatross and altrius should've been treated differently, the rest I don't really care.
I think the problem stems from the fact that in order to make a new class (in this case DH) competitive from day 1. As a new class it has access to significantly fewer cards than any other class (no Classic, SoU, RoS, GA) and therefore the cards it got had to be a bit OP to account for this. Did they do it perfectly? Obviously not, hence the 2 rounds of nerfs already, but right now it seems that DH is not really better than other top tier decks which means that eventually some sort of balance was achieved. I wonder though what would happen in the next 1-2 expansions when the number of cards available to DH will double creating a new world of possibilities for synergies/combos...
OP using Rogue you have about zero rights to whine
There are like 5 or 6 decks/classes that are more than competitive in the current meta (Rogue being one of them) and that can definitely keep up with DH. I'm sorry, but if after 2 rounds of nerfs (that had a strong impact, despite the constant whining) you're still always losing to DH, you're either:
- Not playing a competitive deck (your choice)
- Playing a competitive deck that has a bad matchup vs DH (but hopefully good against other competitive decks, so that's your choice again)
- Playing a competitive deck that is good or at least decent against DH, but you're bad at piloting it
My hope is that they will stop with the DH aggro tools and will actually focus on the control / big demons part of the class, which has some great cards and it's a shame they are shadowed.
Oh buhu im so sorry mr galakrond rogue, you have a matchup that is about 50% winrate. Thats not fair, gala rogue should have 70% winrate against every class ofcourse. Honestly i rather see them buff demonhunters so i dont have to constantly play fucking rogues all the time.
DH is OP: Correct
Nerfs did nothing: Incorrect
I'm a rogue player: GTFO
I actually quit the game a week after Dh release .. i only watch streams till then .. This expansion along with Dh is the most boring ever you cant have fun Dh is everywhere 75% of the games are against Dh they can destroy u with 0 board at turn 7 cuz of Altruis .. Every other class is almost unplayable and i dont see any balance changes coming soon as Blizz said.
Dh isnt playing any neutral cards in all decks cuz there is no reason too, the class cards are so strong and Blizz cant see or simply doesnt admit as Op says thats fucked up.
The game will be fucked up for so long cuz Blizz showed time after time that they are incapable of making actual good Balance changes, They can only make a class unplayble and im sure as hell they wont do that to Dh cuz its bad advertisment in a way.. So the only way is to wait a long time before its ok for them to nerf to hell Dh
Good luck playing the game guys ..
i litterly win almoste every game met highlander rogue against DH so , maybe you should admit you are bad
Sigh, do you guys even read -.-'' ?
Yes, I ALSO played Rogue this season (Highlander Rogue, not full Galakrond, which seems to be the most popular). 20-23 vs DH,32% of my encounters.
Before that I did the climb D5 - Legend with Highlander Priest. (22-23 vs DH, 34% of my encounters).
I'm currently using Kibler's Quest Warrior (13-15 vs DH, 39% of my encounters ).
Quite different playstyles.
So, the point you guys are missing (big time) IS NOT "buhu, Rogue is unfavored vs DH", but IS ACTUALLY "buhu, DH is still not balanced at all after 2 rounds of nerfs, the second of which was basically a joke and actually made the class stronger thanks to the nerf to sac pac. It's making the game experience toxic and I don't like it at all".
I genuinely don't think I can explain it in a clearer way.
Why should Rouge be good against Demon Hunter? Honestly you are complaining because you have one bad matchup. Furthermore you complain because a totally justified nerf to sac pact hit your class. They should never not nerf a card because another class might need it.
You are right Demon Hunter is strong. But not so strong it's unbeatable. They did fine by nerfing the cards, and while some are less significant than others Demon Hunter is worse than it was before. I do think the basic set is too strong though, and after one or two expansions they need to nerf the whole set to be able to actually make new powerful cards. And I would love if they made it more control oriented. Just make all the damage to all enemies minions only do damage to minions.
And when people say play something else, get better or they don't have a problem you just say they have nothing to contribute. And while they could make a better argument someone can contribute even though they don't agree with you. As someone said Heathstone is a competitive game, and sometimes if you want to win you will have to adapt to the meta, and that will mean your deck won't always be the one you love the most. You can play other decks but then you should not expect it to be the best performing.
And no all 10 classes can not be equal. Some will always be better than others for the game to actually be good. And some classes will be good against other classes. See Rouge for example. The core of the class will always be bad against Demon Hunter because of the split damage. And that is fine, you have a good matchup against other decks.
And then you blame Blizzard for people wanting to play the new class. First of all people will play it because its new. Some of that has gone down, but you will still see that, because people want to hit 500 or 1000 wins. Secondly it's much cheaper than the others, so more people can afford it. I think it's good they made it that way. Last but not least Demon Hunter can do a lot, therefore both people who love control and people loving aggro can play it. Here I think Blizzard dropped the ball and I hope they decide on a concept and stick with it in the next expansion.
Silver Hand Recruit
Absolutely agreeing with you in every point.
DH broke the whole game, but this was forecastable since they showed the first of their imbalanced cards during card release.
The nerfs haven't been enough and the nerf of SP was absolutely unnecessary, since it was the only card that punished people for playing this overpowered bullshitty class.
It's just a pity that people are that desperate and pathetic, that they keep abusing OP classes and cards and tend to swarm the ladder with DH's. It has been the same with Deathstalker Rexxar, which also was way to powerful for the game at that time.
Since release I haven't played one single game as DH in ranking ladder, cause I absolutely hate how this class destroyed the game. Also I tend to look for real challenges and am not that miserable to be reliant on broken, lame cards/classes.
Only thing we can do is stop spending money for this broken game. Since the publication of Kayn Sunfury, Blizz didn't see a single Dollar from my side.
Control is like Chess - using your given resources wisely.
Aggro is like Russian Roulette - Hope to topdeck the right card/ hope for the opponent to topdeck the wrong card.
Parallels to the IQ of the players of both games are, of course, coincidental ;)
I started this morning my grind from D5 trying to get to legend with Spell Druid. Suddenly there are no more easy matchups (of course) but I can't say there is any single deck/class that stands out. I have faced a more or less even amount of Rogues (Gala/Secret and 1-2 Highlander), Gala Warlocks, Reno Mages, DHs and occasionally some Hunter. After 17 games today I am 3-3 vs Rogue, 2-2 vs Warlock, 2-2 vs DH, 1-1 vs Hunter and 2-1 vs Mage. So I'd say that the meta is quite balanced right now without a single deck dominating in terms of either frequency or strength.
P.S.: I am surprised I haven't met any single other Spell Druid deck, neither today nor the previous days when I was going up from D10 to D5
I wanted to add something to my post and for some reason I couldn't edit on my phone.
I saw you said it's not just Rogue but you are currently playing warrior. And you don't win a lot with that. But Kibler does. So here I would say you probably just need to get better. The deck plays a lot different than Rouge, and maybe it's because your playstile with the deck is unfavorable against Demon Hunter. This is not something Blizzard should do something about
Silver Hand Recruit
Does no one else see the problem with the 'play one of 2 or 3 top tier decks and you'll be fine' argument?
No I don't. Why should every deck be equal? That will never be healthy for the game. It should not be only two or three possible decks either, but you have enough decent decks for it to be a relatively healthy meta. Can it be better yes, but when you release new cards every 4 months you won't have a perfect meta all the time.
Silver Hand Recruit
When did I even say every deck should be equal you tool.