I played the The Darkness against a priest who on the next turn played Grand Archivist, which pulled a Darkness Candle from his deck. Even though the text of Grand Archivist says "cast" the spell, the spell did not "cast," i.e., it did not lower the candle count on my The Darkness. Essentially it disabled The Darkness. This seems like a bug, as figured The Darkness was a counter to big spell decks. If not, this really lowers the value of The Darkness imo
Well technically the darkness says that when the candle is drawn, grand archivist says casts so the keyword is different so won’t interact with the darkness.
You can get a Spider Ambush! in your hand, and when you cast it, it does actually summon the spider, this is the exact same situation. So it's a bug, especially because the wording of the 4-mana candle spell is "Snuff out a candle. ..." So no matter how is this spell cast, it would have to snuff out a candle.
It’s pretty clear that the darkness says “when drawn” but the grand archivist casts a spell from the deck, it doesn’t draw the spell from your deck then cast it.
To me it seems pretty clear that this is a bug. The candle's text says that you "snuff out" a candle so there's no reason why it shouldn't do it when you cast the spell. It's true that The Darkness says "when drawn" but I think that's just an explanation of how the card works on a simple level and not an actual condition that has to be met.
It’s pretty clear that the darkness says “when drawn” but the grand archivist casts a spell from the deck, it doesn’t draw the spell from your deck then cast it.
Sorry but I don’t think this is a bug
Why would the candle spell have text at all then? Why even make it a spell if it does nothing when cast?
You think a keyword as important as “drawn” isn’t how the card needs to be activated?
I could be wrong but think about how auctioneer reacts when yogg casts spells, you don’t draw becuase yogg casts the spells, I’m pretty sure blizzard and team 5 are clever enough to work out the way that this should react becuase it’s cast, not drawn.
It’s pretty clear that the darkness says “when drawn” but the grand archivist casts a spell from the deck, it doesn’t draw the spell from your deck then cast it.
Sorry but I don’t think this is a bug
Why would the candle spell have text at all then? Why even make it a spell if it does nothing when cast?
Because it never gets cast, in order to be cast by the player it would have to be in their hand, which the candle never is
Well as I’ve said I may be wrong but I read the darkness as the main force in this, grand archivist doesn’t draw the card, the darkness clearly says “when drawn, this awakens”
This in a way makes grand archivist a counter to the darkness, other wise the darkness would be a card without a counter.
But I’ll say again since this seems to be irking some of you, I could be wrong but those are my thoughts
It’s pretty clear that the darkness says “when drawn” but the grand archivist casts a spell from the deck, it doesn’t draw the spell from your deck then cast it.
Sorry but I don’t think this is a bug
Why would the candle spell have text at all then? Why even make it a spell if it does nothing when cast?
Because it never gets cast, in order to be cast by the player it would have to be in their hand, which the candle never is
I imagine to make sure that if there’s cards that’s cast a spell with a particular cost it would be included, or if for some reason priest stole it with any of the “copy a card from your opponents deck” it would prevent a bug where you couldn’t cast it I’m assuming.
Once again though I’ll say I could be wrong, but once again, casting is not the same as drawing a card, the language is pretty clear
I see your point thedougalbug with regard to the text of The Darkness, but the text of the Darkness Candle should do the opposite. One of the two is wrong and needs to be fixed. As another poster said earlier, The Darkness is so mediocre it should be fixed so that the candle cards control and not The Darkness.
I see your point thedougalbug with regard to the text of The Darkness, but the text of the Darkness Candle should do the opposite. One of the two is wrong and needs to be fixed. As another poster said earlier, The Darkness is so mediocre it should be fixed so that the candle cards control and not The Darkness.
Love this response, it’s an interesting topic for sure, and a good point with deck of wonders becuase those activate when drawn, so they’re not cast.
I wonder if, because the candles are cards generated from a minion, they follow the rules for the minion rather than anything else?
Ok let some look at another card that sits dormant - sherazin, if let’s say grand archivist casts a spell does it count towards the cards you played that’s turn and count towards activating him? Cos if not I imagine the darkness would have to act in the same way?
You think a keyword as important as “drawn” isn’t how the card needs to be activated?
I could be wrong but think about how auctioneer reacts when yogg casts spells, you don’t draw becuase yogg casts the spells, I’m pretty sure blizzard and team 5 are clever enough to work out the way that this should react becuase it’s cast, not drawn.
Auctioneer is different. It draws a card when YOU cast a spell. Yogg obviously doesn't match that. But if you only look at the 4 mana spell Darkness Candle, it has the text "Snuff out a candle. " So if you were to cast it from your hand, as a normal spell, it would still snuff out the candle and draw you a card. And this is stronger than any other assumption.
I believe it is a bug because the Darkness Candle is NOT a spell. Nowhere on the it does it say it's a spell. It's a candle. Grand Archivist clearly states that it draws a SPELL from the deck and casts it.
Since the candle is not a spell it should not have been cast.
Well as I’ve said I may be wrong but I read the darkness as the main force in this, grand archivist doesn’t draw the card, the darkness clearly says “when drawn, this awakens”
This in a way makes grand archivist a counter to the darkness, other wise the darkness would be a card without a counter.
But I’ll say again since this seems to be irking some of you, I could be wrong but those are my thoughts
The counters to The Darkness are
a) rush your opponent down before the candles are drawn (aka aggro decks)
b) since chances are he awakens on your turn if at all, cast removal on him (ie SW:Death, Twisting Nether, Siphon Soul, Execute, Naturalize, Hunter's Mark, etc) - Control decks all should have some removal available, and save it for this.
So Aggro and Control both have ways to beat this... You don't need some weird, unintuitive interaction to beat this.
It’s pretty clear that the darkness says “when drawn” but the grand archivist casts a spell from the deck, it doesn’t draw the spell from your deck then cast it.
Sorry but I don’t think this is a bug
^This.
Read the text on the Darkness minion, not the text on the candle spell. It clearly says the candles need to be DRAWN, and Archivist is casting it from your deck.
While is is ABSOLUTELY STUPID AND RIDICULOUS, it does not appear to be a bug; rather, a VERY POOR design decision by Blizzard.
Now, what I think they should do, is change Archivist's coding to DRAW the spell and then CAST it, so that way the interaction with the dormant Darkness still triggers. Alternatively, they change the text on the Darkness minion to "When drawn..." to "When all 3 are snuffed out..."
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Well as I’ve said I may be wrong but I read the darkness as the main force in this, grand archivist doesn’t draw the card, the darkness clearly says “when drawn, this awakens”
This in a way makes grand archivist a counter to the darkness, other wise the darkness would be a card without a counter.
But I’ll say again since this seems to be irking some of you, I could be wrong but those are my thoughts
The counters to The Darkness are
a) rush your opponent down before the candles are drawn (aka aggro decks)
b) since chances are he awakens on your turn if at all, cast removal on him (ie SW:Death, Twisting Nether, Siphon Soul, Execute, Naturalize, Hunter's Mark, etc) - Control decks all should have some removal available, and save it for this.
So Aggro and Control both have ways to beat this... You don't need some weird, unintuitive interaction to beat this.
I hear what’s you’re saying, but you can’t seriously suggest a card counter is “win before your opponent does” - that’s essentially your point in rushing before darkness awakens. Although technically I guess that a counter to every card.
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I played the The Darkness against a priest who on the next turn played Grand Archivist, which pulled a Darkness Candle from his deck. Even though the text of Grand Archivist says "cast" the spell, the spell did not "cast," i.e., it did not lower the candle count on my The Darkness. Essentially it disabled The Darkness. This seems like a bug, as figured The Darkness was a counter to big spell decks. If not, this really lowers the value of The Darkness imo
Well technically the darkness says that when the candle is drawn, grand archivist says casts so the keyword is different so won’t interact with the darkness.
Hope that helps
You can get a Spider Ambush! in your hand, and when you cast it, it does actually summon the spider, this is the exact same situation. So it's a bug, especially because the wording of the 4-mana candle spell is "Snuff out a candle. ..." So no matter how is this spell cast, it would have to snuff out a candle.
Either it's a bug, or the wording of candle needs changing to "Draw a card. Snuff out a candle and cast this when drawn.".
The Darkness is such a cool concept but given how bad it is performing, it really doesn't need game logic interpretations working against it.
It’s pretty clear that the darkness says “when drawn” but the grand archivist casts a spell from the deck, it doesn’t draw the spell from your deck then cast it.
Sorry but I don’t think this is a bug
To me it seems pretty clear that this is a bug. The candle's text says that you "snuff out" a candle so there's no reason why it shouldn't do it when you cast the spell. It's true that The Darkness says "when drawn" but I think that's just an explanation of how the card works on a simple level and not an actual condition that has to be met.
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You think a keyword as important as “drawn” isn’t how the card needs to be activated?
I could be wrong but think about how auctioneer reacts when yogg casts spells, you don’t draw becuase yogg casts the spells, I’m pretty sure blizzard and team 5 are clever enough to work out the way that this should react becuase it’s cast, not drawn.
Well as I’ve said I may be wrong but I read the darkness as the main force in this, grand archivist doesn’t draw the card, the darkness clearly says “when drawn, this awakens”
This in a way makes grand archivist a counter to the darkness, other wise the darkness would be a card without a counter.
But I’ll say again since this seems to be irking some of you, I could be wrong but those are my thoughts
I imagine to make sure that if there’s cards that’s cast a spell with a particular cost it would be included, or if for some reason priest stole it with any of the “copy a card from your opponents deck” it would prevent a bug where you couldn’t cast it I’m assuming.
Once again though I’ll say I could be wrong, but once again, casting is not the same as drawing a card, the language is pretty clear
When Grand Archivist pulls Scroll of Wonder, it does "cast a random spell" as the card says, but when Grand Archivist pulls a Darkness Candle it does NOT "snuff out a candle" as the card says.
I see your point thedougalbug with regard to the text of The Darkness, but the text of the Darkness Candle should do the opposite. One of the two is wrong and needs to be fixed. As another poster said earlier, The Darkness is so mediocre it should be fixed so that the candle cards control and not The Darkness.
Designer: "Ehi, when Darkness candle is drawn, and only if drawn, remove the candle counter"
Programmer: "Ok"
DarknessCandleSpell::OnDrawn(){ ExecuteEffect(); }
DarknessCandleSpell::OnCast(){ //Left empty by design, only apply effect when drawn}
Is it a bug? It depends. Given current card text, it seems a bug to me. I would have added "Cast this ONLY IF drawn".
I believe it is a bug because the Darkness Candle is NOT a spell. Nowhere on the it does it say it's a spell. It's a candle. Grand Archivist clearly states that it draws a SPELL from the deck and casts it.
Since the candle is not a spell it should not have been cast.
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