[Wild Guide] MillZoth Rogue (legend)
- Last updated Apr 18, 2019 (Rise of Shadows)
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Wild
- 15 Minions
- 14 Spells
- Deck Type: Ranked Deck
- Deck Archetype: Mill Rogue
- Crafting Cost: 7460
- Dust Needed: Loading Collection
- Created: 11/6/2018 (Boomsday)
- HackFin
- Registered User
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- 16
- 53
- 121
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Battle Tag:
HackFin
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Region:
EU
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Total Deck Rating
112
April 18th:
I didn't have a lot of time to play lately and all I did was putting in a scheme for one copy of gang-up. The meta did not change too much but the Big Warlock brings a deck which can outtempo you and you should always keep vanish now when facing a Warlock and Vargoth gives Big Priest a cheap and dangerous minion making the a highly favourite matchup for us a bit harder.
Maybe somebody has better ideas and more time and can give advices to us Mill'Zoth players :-)
Wishing you all a good time burning cards!
HackFin
February 17th:
First time top 100 legend with this list :-)
https://imgur.com/a/Aa8mTNo
Update February 16th 2019
Hello friends, I came back for some updates as there are still people writing me PMs about the list and it is actually the 4th most played rogue list on ladder now, yay :-)
I will keep the texts that are still making sense and replace some matchups texts. Greetings, HackFin
At the moment I am testing a few replacements. So far the best feels to have that one Gluttonous Ooze for the Rotten Applebaum, because it is only three mana and helps against most aggressive decks and also deals with CubeLock which is still around.
This month I went 31-25 with MillZoth between rank 4 and legend (I rotated decks of RenoLock, MechaThunLock, and few games of Jade Druid and Odd Warrior) :
https://imgur.com/a/20Y2mgE
Some notes on the data: It looks like quite a few people keep shadowstep, gang up and lab recruiter in the starting hand. The only matchups that can make sense is against warlock, priest and maybe druid and also only if you already got your coldlight oracle. Given how rarely these requirements are met the percentage looks far too high. Especially for lab recruiter, which is pretty much only in the deck for the infinite late game and very seldom to shuffle your first oracle.
Another hint on a mistake I saw in some replays: NEVER play deathlord early against big priests! As this is a more complicated deck the risk of brain farts is high ;)
Feel free to share your experiences!
Replays of rank 1 5 stars into legend games:
November 2018:
https://hsreplay.net/replay/zVUjgyuAdvKybRAwUpB2Mo
February 2019:
https://hsreplay.net/replay/5XyEKdSTgwfJzP8SJiMHr5
Hello folks,
I am HackFin from EU and I started HS in March 2016. I reach legend (in standard mode) like every second or third month depending on the spare time I got.
Wild mode is my playground when I am not up for hardcore laddering in standard. Here I test fun decks and go for different homebrew decks. I remember watching Savjz in 2016 playing a Mill Rogue in standard and I enjoyed it so much that I keep making variations of this deck since then and I posted one of the lists here and now it was time for an update :)
MillZoth Rogue
A deck revolving around either milling with Coldlight Oracle or infinite board refill with N'Zoth, the Corruptor
This deck combines two strategies in the old known mill rogue. With this version, thanks to lab recruiter with DK, you can outvalue any deck out there now with shuffling up to infinite numbers of N'Zoth in your deck.
This season I went from rank 9 to 5 with a 62% winrate. (including a lucky streak in the end against three druids).
Getting harder after that of course - but it is mostly because the high number of even shamans and the occasional odd rogues. The other matchups are all positive so far (even hunter, because you can outvalue Rexxar).If I find the time I can write a small guide. I did^^
Enjoy!
HackFin
Very nice that some people already upvoted, I appreciate it a lot!
Matchups and mulligans
Druid (medium):
I have to change this matchup because now there are some token druid around that can be really quick and kill you too fast. But all the slower druids are easy fodder for us now.
Mulligan for: Backstab, Fan of Knives, Coldlight Oracle, Deathlord and also keep Doomsayer because it is not terrible against their early drops and just in case it is an aggressive druid you really want that.
Okay to keep: Elven Minstrel
Example how to win against (pretty much any) combo druid: https://hsreplay.net/replay/dDSGUuW899usK2ktLfSVj7
Hunter (slightly unfavoured):
I changed this to slightly unfavoured because I mostly faced aggressive mech hunters lately and their damage output is quite high. If there were less of these hunter is pretty balanced and even favoured when you the midrange decks.
Your game plan is to put as many taunts as possible in theirs way and keep searching for your N'Zoth, which usually finishes these games. If they got their Rexxar rolling you should try everything to use Shadowstep on N'Zoth (which is a plan for all the value matchups).
Mulligan for: Doomsayer, Backstab, Deathlord, Mistress of Mixtures and also Fan of Knives.
Okay to keep: Elven Minstrel
Example how to win against secret hunter: https://hsreplay.net/replay/uwKRmQuQLG7Yo6F7yAEyE8
Mage (unfavoured against tempo, highly favoured against control):
The Mana Wyrm nerf helps, but the tempo mages are still around and they hurt. If you face a Reno or Big mage you are good and should win.
So you should always expect tempo.
Mulligan for: Deathlord and Backstab and pray.
In one game I made it to N'zoth and it was amazing, but usually you die before turn 10.
Example how to win against tempo mage: https://hsreplay.net/replay/6qP4YuYXHA82Eo6ZeZeW2U
Paladin (mostly favoured):
You don't find many paladins at the moment. I went 5-1 8-1 so far, but it feels kind of wrong that this deck is heavily favoured against odd paladin. Need to test this more.
But what I can say already is that Doomsayers improve this matchup a lot! And Fan of Knives of course.
-> Update February 2019: The matchup is favoured. All my stats tell me that they have little chance if you make sure that they don't get they value turn 5.
Mulligan for: Fan of Knives, Mistress of Mixtures, Doomsayer and Backstab
Against aggressive paladins you win once N'Zoth comes down or if they draw so much you can even mill them to death before turn 10 sometimes.
Example how to win against odd paladin: https://hsreplay.net/replay/MFqtJRpSoa7TgiGP2qvoYL
Priest (favoured):
Like 90% of the priests are big priests so I stick to the "favoured".
Why?
As long as they don't get Barnes into Ysharrj you just keep milling them while making sure to get Sap and Vanish. Just never kill Ragnaros and you should be fine.
Update February 2019: Now with Reno Priest around it is even better - MillZoth crushes Priest!
If you have to go for board make sure you Shadowstep your N'Zoth ;)
At the moment I am 12-5 against priest. And one loss was against a Velen + Malygos combo priest.
Example how to win against big priest: https://hsreplay.net/replay/M6Lk8tVe9XSxhncZyoGTYQ
Rogue (unfavoured):
Update February 2019: Most Rogues are pirate kingsbane and their damage output can be insane. Deathlords, Fan of Knives, Backstab and then into Sludge Belcher is needed to stay alive - one of the main reasons why I am testing Gluttonous Ooze now. Interestingly I won two games today when they went very aggressively and milled their own deck and underestimated the mill damage :-D
Example how to win against odd rogue: https://hsreplay.net/replay/UCNAPhBsKySFVd7Um6RULA
Shaman (slightly unfavoured):
Update February 2019: At least their early damage potential decreased a little and give a tiny bit more breathing room., but it is still an unfavoured matchup.
Against even shaman you need the perfect curve and your Backstab from Doomsayer into Deathlord into more taunts and for the midgame you might need a Preperation plus Vanish. The problem is, even if you make it to N'Zoth there is Devolve.
Terrible matchup! Queue dodge it when you faced one - but there are many, which brings this decks winratio down a lot!
Mulligan for: Doomsayer, Deathlord and Backstab
Example how to win against even shaman: https://hsreplay.net/replay/zVUjgyuAdvKybRAwUpB2Mo
Warlock (highly favoured):
Reno and other control warlocks are really no problem, together with Shudderwock it is the easiest matchup. They very often surrender as soon as they realise you are mill rogue. Just make sure you can sap Mal'Ganis the turn you mill him them to death. It is the only card that can stop your lethal damage.
And then there is Zoo which is kind of the best among the bad tempo matchups. They usually can't deal with Doomsayer without using important ressources and don't have tools like devolve, so they lose once you get to your N'Zoth. I mean, it is still not a good matchup but much more doable than even shaman and odd rogue.
Example how to win against Reno Warlock: https://hsreplay.net/replay/3enBz47LVVq2EvnGChwdz3
Warrior (fairly favoured): (had to change this, because suddenly pirate warriors pop up more)As there are barely any pirate warriors around this matchup is favoured. The control warriors can't win against the mill and also DMH is not saving them because they can't go infinite the way you can!So even if there are not many pirate warriors you should still mulligan against them. Like the other tempo matchups you really want Doomsayer. Mistress of Mixtures, Deathlord and Backstab are the other cards you want to look for. If you got a Doomsayer and one of the other cards you can also keep one of your five mana taunts. But like all the other aggressive matchups this is looking mostly grim for you. My winrate is at 36% against pirate warrior.
Example how to win against pirate warrior: https://hsreplay.net/replay/sAfoAEwgPNqBkFHkTTA8Xc
The summary: Awesome against anything that can't kill you quickly and vulnerable to early damage. Sometimes I feel kind of bad to punish the control players and give wins to lame aggro players, but the deck is just so much fun to play and the pleasure when you win against aggro is even greater.
Cards to consider
February 2019: Gluttonous Ooze
At the moment my favoured addition. Can replace Rotten Applebaum, Deathlord, or Fan of Knives
February 2019: Walk the Plank
I tested it a little, but it didn't feel good enough, because there are not many even warlocks atm. Against them it is a really good card - and it is okay against even Shaman, but I also didn't find too many on ladder this month.
Azure Drake
pro: high quality card buffing your damage spells
con: another 5 mana card plus drawing cards, making the matchups weird when you want to get rid of hand cards (played it in a version without Elven Minstrel and with: Prince Valanar
pro: can be game winning against some aggro decks
con: you can't play Minstrels which are the best card draw rogue you can get. Furthermore I dies to Soulfire and against divine shield without healing you (and that happened far too often so I changed back to the Minstrel version)
Dark Iron Skulker
pro: clears totems and silver hand recruits
con: clunky in many matchups, board impact against odd shaman very often not enough and the odd paladin matchup is pretty good already anyways
Emperor Thaurissan
pro: really fun against control decks enabling some really early complete mill options
con: very often you just don't find the time to play it and against decks you can it is mostly just a win-more card. you can totally try it, it is insane fun, but makes your bad matchups even worse.
Unstable Ghoul
I must say I did not test it enough, but it is totally a reasonable card.
pro: Improves odd paladin matchup even more and is strong againt all the other aggressive matchups. can replace the Mistress of Mixtures or a version without Doomsayer
con: not easy to find a spot for it, but as I said, I didn't test it a lot.
Gang Up vs Lab Recruiter
Reason #1 for Gang-Up: You can not prep Lab Recruiter!
Reason #2: You don't really want to draw Lab Recruiters with Elven Minstrel against aggro.
Reason #3: You REALY can't prep Lab Recruiter (you will understand you important this can be when you played this for a bit)
Rotten Applebaum yes or no?
pro: yes it is mostly worse on turn 5 than Sludge Belcher, but it comes in handy in longer games when you desperately need a few more HP to survive after N'Zoth.
con: it makes the deck a bit more clunky and in some matchups (like mirror and Kingsbane) you really want to get rid of hand cards)
Mistress of Mixtures
pro: good against early aggression, extra HP in late game and is a 1 mana activator for your minstrels
con: doesn't really help against even shaman because it dies without giving you any health against many things. zoo can use it as a heal activator.
Eviscerate
pro: kills things.
con: what to replace? need activator. might find its home in a version without Doomsayer or only in the non-N'Zoth versions (but then Kingsbane is better anyways)
Unfortunately I don't really have the equipment for quality videos, but I hope the text help people pilot the deck.
Because I played a kind of Mill Rogue since nearly two years now I might forget some things in the guide - please leave me a comment when something is not clear!
Another thing: Try to not get frustrated when you get some games after another and you just can't do anything to win them. My winrate is below 60% now too - this is not a deck for a quick climb if you were looking for that ;)
Oh yes, I also experienced how this deck can anger people, lol. Especially aggro and tempo player that didn't manage to kill you soon enough.
Have you ever tried a Mill rogue with Arcane giant as second win condition? With DK and lots of spells could be good, but I´m really bad at building decks
My favourite miracle rogue version was the one with DK, arcane giants and double vanish, but for a mill deck I don't see how a few giants can become a win condition when the opponent does not really need any removals for the rest of your game plan. I am lacking the imagination to see that deck working, sorry :)
I play this deck similar to yours but with two dancing swords instead. It is an ok deck at 50% win rate 11 wins 11 losses but low sample size
Mill rogue is kind of bad or I am bad at playing it. Also it was funny as i loss against a proper mill rogue.
### *Mill N'zoth
# Class: Rogue
# Format: Wild
# Year of the Raven
#
# 2x (0) Backstab
# 2x (0) Preparation
# 2x (0) Shadowstep
# 1x (1) Mistress of Mixtures
# 2x (2) Doomsayer
# 1x (2) Gang Up
# 1x (2) Lab Recruiter
# 2x (2) Sap
# 2x (3) Coldlight Oracle
# 2x (3) Dancing Swords
# 2x (3) Deathlord
# 2x (3) Fan of Knives
# 2x (4) Elven Minstrel
# 2x (5) Rotten Applebaum
# 1x (5) Sludge Belcher
# 2x (6) Vanish
# 1x (9) Valeera the Hollow
# 1x (10) N'Zoth, the Corruptor
#
AAEBAaIHBoEOgBLgrALexAKA0wLg+gIMigG0AcQB7QLNA5sF+AeGCf4N+Q7b4wLF8wIA
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
# Generated by HDT - https://hsreplay.net
Nice to see that there are more people around testing some MillZoth rogue :)
So the difference between our decks is + 2 Dancing Swords + Rotten Applebaum, - Brann - Gang-Up - Sludge Belcher
I guess playing only one gang-up is reasonable because kingsbane rogue and jade druids got both nerfed and those were the main matchups in which you needed all ways to go infinite. Which matchups do you improve with the dancing swords? To me it looks like a win-more card against already good warlock and priest matches, but it can weaken your N'Zoth walls against the bad matchups. Or how is your experience with the dancing swords fighting back on board against even shaman and odd rogue?
But on the taunt swap: the stats show that sludge belcher is better than baum, so I would not recommend changing that.
Going 0 - 3 with this deck at rank 3... absolute rubbish... what am I doing wrong
Wasted 1600 on Valeera... very dissapointed
Well, I can't think of any deck that didn't give me a 0-3 at one point. And Valeera is a card that will be around forever as it is used in every non-aggro rogue deck.
If the three games were even shaman and odd rogue than you experienced the worst matchups possible. From the amount of information you gave I can not really tell what you did wrong - maybe you want to post your replays?
Even shamans were close ones, if I had Valeera I could beat them up. After crafting Valeera got beaten by murlocs but then faced some control decks. around 40% win rate now. Not sure if it is good to rank up, but beating big priests is good fun enough for me! ))
Alright that sounds better, haha.
No, the deck is not for a quick climb. I am at a 53% winrate after close to 400 games now.
It takes a while to understand all the matchups, but even shaman and odd rogue are both like 35-65 matchups.
I'm trying to figure out how to tweak this deck to survive better early game, because the late game is pretty unstoppable.
Do you really need 2x gang up? One lab recruiter lets you go infinite, and the second gang up is important to get coldlight oracles back into the card pool, but I feel like it's kind of greedy.
Also, how do you feel about walk the plank or shadow strike instead of fan of knives now that odd paladin is seen less? It reduces your cycle but those cards really help against giant-cheating decks (even shaman, even warlock).
Thanks!
Thanks for your ideas!
So with tweaking the early game you most likely mean survivability against even shaman and odd rogue, right?
The candidates are shadow strike, walk the plank, second mistress and eviscerates. As the shadow strikes don't kill giants I guess walk the plan is better there. As kingsbane is not very significant anymore your idea of taking one gang up out is pretty appealing, I would totally try that!
I am not sure if you can afford reducing the cycling and FoK is still a good card against odd rogue and even shaman.. Maybe you can test it and report?! :D
any replacement for brann? I cannot get the adventure with gold.
You can try Spirit of the Shark?! But I didn't test it yet and the one extra mana prevents the 12 card draw with shadowstep.
Or you just play two Mistresses, add an Eviscerate or Dark Iron Skulker. You might wanna test some different things it is a card which is pretty hard to replace.
I'd just bite the bullet and buy the expansion if you have the option, obviously I know that's rich coming from someone who paid for it with gold but I very much got my moneys worth out of those cards so to speak. League of Explorers is one of the best sets in Hearthstone history, with two of it's most important and fun legendaries: Brann and Reno. I'm sure you already know that, but I just wanted to re-emphasize how much of a splash this expansion has made over the years.
That's true. And also the solo player content of LoE is a lot of fun :)
Thank you for the great deck idea and the well written guide! I still love and play this deck.
Thank you a lot :)
Until I find a cool new deck I am also still playing it, hehe.
Alright, so now we've seen all coming cards and it seems like there is no card that would really fit in this deck :(
Walk the Plank and Murloc Tastyfin are something to think about, but the first is not really needed as Sap is much better and the latter messes up your N'Zoth pool...
But there is quite a big threat coming: Shieldbreaker
Maybe I've overseen something and I hope somebody spotted a smart pick :)
Nah, seems like there is nothing that would fit in there. Plus, I don't think that Shieldbreaker is that much of a threat. I mean, it hurts, but, not as much. There are already many anti-board options.
Thank you for the deck, mate, found it 3 weeks ago and since then I'm having a blast. I would consider excluding one Doomsayer and putting another copy of Mistress of Mixtures for a more consistant early game against aggro and more healing. But, it's not much of a change.
I love to hear how you enjoy playing this! :)
You might be right about Shieldbreaker, it was just the card that outright jumped to my face, because Spellbreaker in "edit: I meant even shaman, lol" is already winning games and this is half the cost. But we'll see.
I think there are many reasonable card changes. I also played without Doomsayers early this year and experimented with SI Agents and Eviscerate. But seeing the comments and PMs everybody feels to have different rough matchups and needs for teching.