Witchwood Quest Rogue
- Last updated Apr 14, 2018 (Witchwood)
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Wild
- 21 Minions
- 8 Spells
- Deck Type: Ranked Deck
- Deck Archetype: Quest Rogue
- Crafting Cost: 8460
- Dust Needed: Loading Collection
- Created: 4/14/2018 (Witchwood)
- Aezuriel
- Registered User
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- 4
- 18
- 41
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Battle Tag:
N/A
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Region:
US
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Total Deck Rating
99
Another Oldie but goodie updated for Witchwood with a few notable inclusions from the new set... in surprising places.
As before, your goal is to play a minion 5 times in order to activate your quest, and then either smash the instant beatdown with charge guys or take back the board through sheer synergy/combos and massively beefed up dudes. The instant beatdown plan is a little less consistent with one of out best bouncers rotating out, but the newer cards coming in give us some surprising reach and utility that we did not have before.
The Slow Plan:
Fire Fly plus Igneous Elemental give us a bunch of Elementals by which to trigger our quest. Its not fast or fancy, but it gets the job done in slower games where you can't afford to give up a lot of early advantage to play tempo. Bear in mind it is usually better to drop a Firefly on turn 1 rather than your quest, and in many matchups you may even want to slow roll your Quest until you have at least 3 elementals in hand.
The Fast Plan:
Sonya Shadowdancer + Stonetusk Boar (or optionally, Southsea Deckhand), can set your Quest up in record time. You usually lose a significant amount of tempo to set up this way, but depending on your hand, can make it back up the next turn.
New Additions:
Cursed Castaway Gives us a midgame answer to something on board, while replacing itself with Vilespine Slayer, Elven Minstrel, or Plague Scientist.
Vicious Scalehide fills an important gap from previous iterations. While more expensive than something like Southsea deckhand (and having Rush instead of Charge), his lifesteal is absolutely invaluable versus decks that just try to zerg you down once they realize your plan. He may not seem like much, but versus other Aggro decks, he buys you time early. Later in the game (as a 5/5) And potentially with Valeera active, he can single-handedly save you from Lethal counter-play.
Golden Oldies:
Valeera the Hollow comes back as lategame card advantage that can save you from Some OTK plays if you tempo her stealth right. This is most notable when paired with Vanish in hand, which can be used to disrupt cubelock decks, or just generally reset the board so you can reload with your quest activated.
Preparation gives you shortcuts on either your Quest, or Vanish. It can be cut for other things, but there are times where it is extremely useful to have at your disposal.
Backstab is cheap removal that can be invaluable for high tempo turns, especially if you need to activate one of your Combo cards early.
Slow-playing your Quest:
A one-drop that always starts the game in your hand can be an important tool in the arsenal of a skilled rogue player. Many games you will want to hold back your quest for a number of reasons.
The moment you play your quest, they know exactly what you are doing, and in most cases, exactly what they need to do to defeat you. There is very little in the early game that distinguishes you from any other of Rogue's archetypes, Aggro, Miracle, Tempo, etc. Since we no longer have the bouncers to rely on just replaying any old creature, you should withhold this information from your opponent until you are more comfortable in your ability to fulfill your quest, or at the very least, can use it as a cheap activator for one of your combo cards.
In some matchups it can still be ok to just play it asap to conserve mana plays, but always think things through. Many times you can gain a lot more if you just have a little patience, and use every resource at your disposal, rather than just trying to run-and-gun for the combo out.
This list seems a blast to play but I question how this is even close to the meta quest decklists people are using. I love quest rogue but your list seems to be too slow and unfocused to win the matchups quest rogue dominates.
Not knowing what "meta" decklists you are referring to makes it even harder to asses how to answer your question(?), comment(?), criticism?
If your problem with quest rogue is that it is slow and unfocused, then don't play quest rogue. Miracle is still good. Smorc Rogue is fairly simplistic and easy to pick up, if that is what you are looking for.
But every Quest rogue list lost the same cards that were part of how the deck functions. I can't imagine someone has a list that is any faster than this one at setting up the quest and winning. Moreover, I doubt there is a list that is more consistent. If you want to try and highroll the quest, maybe there's some weird-assed list out there I haven't seen yet.
But if you'd like to be specific about any of the vague "questions" you have about my list. I'd be happy to answer them.
He's referring to decklists like this. Edit: By the way, the reason they run Vicious Scalehide is to help make the deck able to come back from taking a beating against aggro decks, which is this archetype's weakness. I'm sure you knew that, but I didn't really understand how important that was until I tried it.
https://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/1098234-rank-1-legend-rages-quest-rogue
Also, I'd like to explain my echo combo again, hopefully you understand it this time.
Concept: Just put in 2 copies of Phantom Militia and hard mulligan for them and Shadowstep every game
Turn 6: Phantom Militia, Phantom Militia, Shadowstep
Turn 7: Phantom Militia, Phantom Militia, Phantom Militia
Turn 8: Crystal Core
The Echo method of Trying to use quest is ok. But that's it. Just ok. It is quaint in theory, but in practice, you are going to be hard pressed well before turn 6 before you can BEGIN to put a full two turns (three if you count the quest itself) of work to get rolling. If you are up against some slow control junk, maybe(?) thats ok ... but we should be winning versus control anyway so I don't see the appeal.
Meanwhile trying to hard mull into two cards with a deck that is required to keep one in hand is a recipe for disappointment. The math just isn't there.
It's not that the idea is infeasible. More simply, in practice, you are going to be better off playing more mana efficient and using Shadowstep on something more valuable so that you aren't completely giving up the board to chase the quest. You are almost always behind on board anyway until you get the quest active. So even getting to turn 6 is questionable. Even more rare is the turn 6 where I feel the best play is burn one of the most valuable spells in my deck (shadowstep) to pass turn turn leaving only a single 2/4 taunt in play.
It might be worth it if It finished the quest so that it could be ACTIVE the next turn. but as a setup into a setup, you are asking to lose too much tempo.
Such a fun deck! Suprisingly good in the current meta, even though I made some changes to it.
+2 Tar Creeper
-1Vilespine Slayer
-1Zola the Gorgon
+1Mimic Pod
-1Cursed Castaway
helped me a lot against those pesky aggro decks.
so no need for zola ?
I love mimic pod, but I hate the tempo it loses. Any list that runs mimic is 2xPrep Mandatory, even if it hurts your consistency.
Zola is sort of a redundancy to Sonya Shadowdancer. It is another way to copy a needed effect back to your hand. It is extremely valuable, but it might be the most expendable slot in the list.
Zola with dk Valeera is broken and wins games. Scalehide zola then echo Zola the Zola. Still have both minions in hand.
You are making a big mistake in not including 2 x Vicious Scalehide. It has much more value than Cursed Castaway in both the early and late game. I have completed the quest against paladins bouncing Vicious Scalehide while killing their silver hand recruits and healing myself. in the late game, rushing 5/5 s with drain life turns the game in your favor. Cursed Castaway is just too expensive for this deck.
Also, not including 2 copies of Preparation is another mistake. You need 1 copy for each Vanish and ideally 1 more for Crystal Core. Cutting one is another big mistake.
The deck runs fine for me as is. Scalehide is more useful as a 5/5 rather than burning bounce on something that may never finish your quest.
Preparation was a tougher choice. but it was a choice. I had too many games where 2xPrep was dead in my hand and I needed something else. As a singleton, it can sit in my hand and wait for setup with Vanish, Valeera, or Quest, without messing up another draw step. Truth be told, I rarely even need it for casting my quest. I'd rather have a more proactive card.
I know that feeling when you lose with 2 Preparation in your hand. It makes you hate the card. But if you think about it, it wasn't because of Preparation. it was because you didn't draw a Vanish. In my experience, the chances you have to win without playing at least one Vanish are very, very low. Drawing at least one Vanish is a win condition, because it resets the game in your favor. Under that point of view, you have 2 guaranteed uses for Preparation. One for Vanish, and the second one for Crystal Core or even the second Vanish. If you happen to get stuck with 2 Preparation is because you didn't draw one Vanish.
If you have a build that works for you, that's fine. I don't feel a burning need to have preparation every game, and 2 of them in hand often costs me a win, since that one less cards to enable my quest, even before I can cast it.
I'm not saying it is without merit... but part of this list is about slowing down a little and feeling out the combo. not throwing cards left and right and hoping for the best.
What would you cut for a 2nd Preparation?
If I absolutely had to? Maybe a Glacial Shard. They both serve the purpose of buying time, and don't necessarily impact other cards in the deck.
Have you considered the new echo cards?
After a bunch of testing, I found I drew 1 of my 4 echo cards and 1 of my 4 bounce cards by turn 6 about 90% of the time, increases consistency dramatically. Works best with Phantom Militia and Shadowstep. Gameplan is to play the echo card twice on 6 and shadowstep, then play 3 copies on turn 7.
I'd recommend trying it and see if you think it's worth it. Personally, I find the consistency of it is good enough to build the entire deck around so you can fit more to fight for the board early.
I find Rogue's Echo cards to be anti-synergistic with the Quest. Phantom Militia does have a little bit of wiggle room, but the end game takes too long, with about 9-12 mana in chunks of 3 over multiple turns to activate. Other methods are more mana efficient and less tempo draining.
Well, That's another purpose for Vilespine you are talking about. You brute force a lot of things with this deck. But then, when all your stuff is cheap and 5/5 you can kinda get away with it.
Replacing Valera however is not so easy. One of the best tricks you have at your disposal with this deck is to sit and set up your quest while your opponent slowly out-builds you on board. Drop Valeera and then Vanish when your stealth expires. If your Quest hasn't finished yet for some reason, Valeera should help you top it off. Also, she allows you a significant card advantage tool that allows you to keep throwing and reusing cheap stuff without running out of gas. She's also one of your 2 recovery options, as her armor can prop you up a bit in a close game.
Back when we could just blitz the Quest and smash face by turn 4/5 you could do without Valeera. Maybe you could still try that style. But now that I have played her in the deck, I'm not sure I could ever want to take her out.
Vanish tends to be enough for Cubelock so I never worried much about sap. The body is nice, and it plays well with some of the other synergies/copy effects, but you can replace it if you need to. Fire Plume Phoenix would be my first thought, as it would serve a similar function.
Isn't sap a bit better than Vilespine in the current meta because of Cubelock? How can I replace 1 of them, since I only have 1?