Hearthpwn

Please help me understand why this draft got 12 wins, I’m quite perplexed.  I have never built a Paladin draft like this before, to me it looks like a Shockadin draft with minimum card draw mechanics.  I’m used to having TrueSilver Champion and playing more of a controlled style.  And only two 4 drop minions seems like a terrible draft.  This is also my first 12 win draft with Paladin.

I’m looking for strategy advice to playing with a more aggressive draft so I can have more 12 win runs.  And please feel free to comment on draft picks.

My understanding of the deck before playing
- This is a tempo deck and I am on a clock to win
- I will have to hit face more than I trade minions
- I have to understand how much burst is left in my hand and deck
- I need to effectively use the weapons for reach

Some notes after playing
- If I have the coin, I almost always coined out a 2 drop to start early pressure.  The first 2 drop would be 4 out of the 7 non minibots, to ensure a 1/1 or weak minion, or Mage ping would not pop the divine shield of the minibot.
- I almost always have to use equality, consecration, and mind control tech for tempo plays and not hold these cards for value
- Blessed Champion is not a bad pick in this type of deck, it won 4 games and was never used on sea giant, usually just on 4 drop minions.

The 30 picks, I don’t use drafting programs or sites like Hearth Arena.  Pick 21 is a very questionable pick because I have only one 4 drop minion and after a 2-2 start I almost retired this draft in sheer frustration that the 3rd minibot had destroyed this arena run.  Other interesting picks include picking Stonesplinter Trogg, Bloodsail Raider, and Haunted Creeper over 3 mad bombers on picks 8, 22, and 29.  Picks 24 and 30 are also interesting late arena picks.  And yes I understand that the Arena Gods blessed the last 6 picks because the curve was looking awful.

Pick 1: Abomination over Mana Addict and Ancient Watcher
Pick 2: Earthen Ring Farseer over Light’s Justice and Southsea Deckhand
Pick 3: Muster for Battle over Injured Blademaster and Ancient Mage
Pick 4: Dark Iron Dwarf over Blessing of Wisdom and Explosive Sheep
Pick 5: Argent Commander over Blessed Champion and Arcane Golem
Pick 6: Shielded Minibot over Explosive Sheep and Stormwind Knight
Pick 7: Clockwork Gnome over Core Hound and Reckless Rocketeer
Pick 8: Stonesplinter Trogg over Mad Bomber and Lord of the Arena
Pick 9: Avenge over Mad Scientist and Unstable Ghoul
Pick 10: Equality over Bloodsail Corsair and Gnomish Experimenter
Pick 11: Repentance over Murloc Raider and Shieldbearer
Pick 12: Razorfen Hunter over Explosive Sheep and Holy Light
Pick 13: Sea Giant over Enhance-o Mechano and Doomsayer
Pick 14: Hammer of Wrath over Dragonling Mechanic and Core Hound
Pick 15: Azure Drake over Murloc Tidecaller and Goblin Sapper
Pick 16: Emperor Cobra over Blessed Champion and Sunfury Protector
Pick 17: Gilblin Stalker over Ship’s Cannon and Clockwork Gnome
Pick 18: Shielded Minibot over Seal of Light and Redemption
Pick 19: Seal of Light over Cogmaster and Mogu’shan Warden
Pick 20: Coghammer over Lay on Hands and Shade of Naxxramas
Pick 21: Shielded Minibot over Burly Rockjaw Trogg and Voodoo Doctor
Pick 22: Bloodsail Raider over Mad Bomber and Holy Light
Pick 23: Earthen Ring Farseer over Bloodsail Raider and Murloc Tidehunter
Pick 24: Mind Control Tech over Wailing Soul and Master Swordsmith
Pick 25: Blessing of Kings over Hand of Protection and Mad Scientist
Pick 26: Consecration over Cogmaster and Priestess of Elune
Pick 27: Piloted Shredder over Avenge and Gnomeregan Infantry
Pick 28: Fen Creeper over River Crocolisk and Wolfrider
Pick 29: Haunted Creeper over Mad Bomber and Blessing of Might
Pick 30: Blessed Champion over Equality and Imp Master

You know, sometimes it doesn't hurt to recognize the skill you truly possess :P

But if you want a decent answer, all I can say is that you had  good early aggro alongside with some good protection cards like Coghammer to help you survive, and aggro is sometimes highly effective and unpredictable in arena 

BUT like I said, sometimes it doesn't hurt to recognize your own skill 

I'm sure Sea Giant pulled its weight for you. Along with a solid curve.

Lesson about Paladin: Shielded Minibot is broken. Remember that.

Pick 30: Blessed Champion over Equality and Imp Master

Waaaaaaat?

Despite this terrible pick, the deck has solid minion quality & a good curve.

I'd be confident predicting 7+, so it's not a huge surprise it reached 12.

Quote from Superwoshi »

You know, sometimes it doesn't hurt to recognize the skill you truly possess :P

But if you want a decent answer, all I can say is that you had  good early aggro alongside with some good protection cards like Coghammer to help you survive, and aggro is sometimes highly effective and unpredictable in arena 

BUT like I said, sometimes it doesn't hurt to recognize your own skill 

You’re right I am being modest with my skill.  I’m a legend constructed player with Midrange and Control Paladin and Shaman decks transitioning to arena.  My last 3 shaman arena runs were 8, 10, and 12 wins with 18-20 cards that cost 3 mana or less.  It just feels like opposite world to me that I’m finding success with a low mana curve playing style for Shaman and Paladin. 

Quote from ThePsiclone »

I'm sure Sea Giant pulled its weight for you. Along with a solid curve.

Sadly, Sea Giant only showed up in 4/14 games and instantly died in two games.  I’m sure this card would have performed well. 

Quote from mastersuperfan »

Lesson about Paladin: Shielded Minibot is broken. Remember that.

Yup, Minibot is OP, lesson learned.  I’m starting to favor 2/3 minions over 3/2 minions because of cards like minibot.

Quote from hintM »

Looks like an awesome deck to me. Great curve and a lot of awesome cards. Shielded minibot is the best 2-drop in HS and you have 3 of them. Muster is the best 3-drop, coghammer is the best weapon, shredder is the best 4-drop and sea giant is the perfect big drop for this deck. Only few below average cards(repentance, blessed champ), but even they kinda fit due to faster nature of this deck as card advantage is not your main win condition. This is the kind of paladin deck I'd like to draft every time when I choose that class instead of getting stuck with slow and boring nutrition decks.

You’re right about the strong early game cards to seize board control.  And Repentance and Blessed champion actually put in work.  Repentance was used midgame and caught my opponents by surprise and usually killed 5+ health creatures.  Blessed Champion was my poor man’s Guardian of Kings and helped me apply pressure on my opponents after I was ahead.

Quote from TehJumpingJawa »

Pick 30: Blessed Champion over Equality and Imp Master

Waaaaaaat?

Despite this terrible pick, the deck has solid minion quality & a good curve.

I'd be confident predicting 7+, so it's not a huge surprise it reached 12.

Blessed Champion actually performed well in this draft because I needed another damage boost/win condition.

Congrats on the 12 wins! Blessed Champion is not as bad as it appears to be. I once pulled a BoK + Blessed Champion combo on my Ravenhold Assassin for 22 damage to the face for an instant win.

I noticed you are really allergic toward Mad Bomber. 
 I personally like the card, because it might help you kill 1 drop for free, or clear board after equality. 

For mage, a 2/3 is better than 3/2, since mage can easily deal 1 damage, but for paladin even 1 damage is hard to get, which is why mad bomber is sometimes invaluable.

Anyway the reason you can get 12 win is because you have strong tempo card for early game. Minibot, muster, Dark iron dwarf is strong card, coghammer is usually the winning card though (you can 4-for-1 with it).

Quote from hyude1107 »

I noticed you are really allergic toward Mad Bomber. 
 I personally like the card, because it might help you kill 1 drop for free, or clear board after equality.

Yeah, i think Mad Bomber is the best neutral 2-drop out there. It has a 50% chance to kill enemy 3/2 for free which can just win you the game instantly, it messes with enemy plans to leave one HP creatures on board behind taunts etc. vs non-mage, it pops divine shields for free. There are so many chances to have a good play with a Mad Bomber.

Quote from futhead_IamPd »

I'm not sure why you think that it's an unusual curve or "shockadin" draft, it seems just like the curve that you always want to pick up in arena if you can get it. You have enough high tier drops throughout the curve to compromise the lack of 4s and you have solid reach to finish. Blessing of Kings is also a spell that you can mostly slam on turn 4. Seems like a reasonable 12 win deck to me.

I disagree that you have to go face more than trade though. You have to go face a bit more than with other arena decks, sure. But you should still trade most of the time. You want to have board control at every time, never let your opponent set a foot on the board and get the initiative, so you always get the favorable trades and ride that tempo advantage until you can set up for lethal.

I’ve spent most of my time in Hearthstone playing constructed, so I’m still transitioning to arena.  This is my first 12 win draft with Paladin and I only have two 12 win drafts.  The lack of 4’s really scared me and the 2-2 start scared me even more. 

In time I will look back at this thread and laugh at the first post.  I’ve been playing arena for three months, in January I had a 4.2 win average, February a 5.7 win average, this month I have a 6.5 win average and two 12 win drafts.

What I should have said about going face is that mid and late game when my opponent starts having stronger stat minions than me that I would have to make tough decisions on whether to go face or trade.  I understand and you are right that trading early and having board control from the start is important, especially with a draft like this one.

Quote from hyude1107 »

I noticed you are really allergic toward Mad Bomber. 
 I personally like the card, because it might help you kill 1 drop for free, or clear board after equality. 

For mage, a 2/3 is better than 3/2, since mage can easily deal 1 damage, but for paladin even 1 damage is hard to get, which is why mad bomber is sometimes invaluable.

Anyway the reason you can get 12 win is because you have strong tempo card for early game. Minibot, muster, Dark iron dwarf is strong card, coghammer is usually the winning card though (you can 4-for-1 with it).

I think Mad and Madder Bomber have lower value in Paladin because of the divine shields, muster for battle, and hero power.  There is too much self-inflicting damage and board control loss in a tempo deck with these two cards. 

Quote from Ellestar »

Quote from hyude1107 »

I noticed you are really allergic toward Mad Bomber. 
 I personally like the card, because it might help you kill 1 drop for free, or clear board after equality.

Yeah, i think Mad Bomber is the best neutral 2-drop out there. It has a 50% chance to kill enemy 3/2 for free which can just win you the game instantly, it messes with enemy plans to leave one HP creatures on board behind taunts etc. vs non-mage, it pops divine shields for free. There are so many chances to have a good play with a Mad Bomber.

I would put mad bomber as the third best neutral 2 drop, I think knife juggler and acidic swamp ooze are better. 

Mad Bomber also hurts three of my favorite early game cards, haunted creeper, worgen infiltrator, and imp master :( 

So if I pick Mad Bomber it has to fit the right draft.

Quote from nd_ohnoes »

I would put mad bomber as the third best neutral 2 drop, I think knife juggler and acidic swamp ooze are better.

Mad Bomber also hurts three of my favorite early game cards, haunted creeper, worgen infiltrator, and imp master :( 

So if I pick Mad Bomber it has to fit the right draft.

Well, i guess for Paladin with Argent Protectors Knife Juggler is better, and Mad Bomber can pop friendly shields.

Wow, you actually like Worgen Infiltrator? I think it's just too weak to pings etc. Well, i guess it ruins and/or enables many good turn 2 plays, just like Zombie Chow.

People may laugh at Blessed Champion, but I have been robbed a number of times by that card. It's one of those cards that is often completely useless, sometimes reasonable, and very occasionally game-winning. OP might have just drawn it at the right times. On Sea Giant it's no laughing matter...

But yeah, Shielded Minibot for the win!

Even on a sea giant, blessed champion is nothing special (8 dmg for 5 mana that requires board presence and can't bypass taunt).

It's a win more combo card; that it occasionally wins you a game 1 turn earlier than you might otherwise have done does not make it good, most of the time it'll either be a dead card, or a terrible value trade.