Regarding netdecking, people often don't realize that not everybody is a deck-designer at heart (or even likes to do that at all). For many, it's learning to pilot a deck and the actual gameplay that's the fun part - and this is perfectly fine (even well, normal).
Of course, making a homebrew that wins (and wins at top level) is probably the most rewarding thing one can do - but let's be honest, there is no room for many such decks.
The original post is in contention for the most misguided post of the year award.
The Quest rewards for Rogue and Druid are insufficient to make them competitive decks. People are playing them now because they are new and kind of fun. But both classes have better decks to play. And Quest Paladin isn't even close to being competitive, so it's certainly not "degenerate". LUL.
If the game is only fun for you when people have no idea what they are doing and play original/creative decks that suck, the game is not for you. This is the age of information. There is absolutely no reason not to use it.
If we find "netdecks" or simply effective decks the most fun, can you really blame us? Hearthstone is a game where you want to win, and if the deck that lets you win, also makes you have fun, I don't care what you play.
Ask yourself this; How do you know the netdecks are the most fun? Did you experiment at all?
If we find "netdecks" or simply effective decks the most fun, can you really blame us? Hearthstone is a game where you want to win, and if the deck that lets you win, also makes you have fun, I don't care what you play.
Starting to really hate these topics. We're not all here to play homebrew tier 9-decks. I will not be shamed in saying that I enjoy ranking up, and that I really, REALLY, hate losing. So I went online, and looked at good Shaman decks. Found a solid Quest Control Shaman-list, and made some small changes. Having a shit ton of fun.
If you want to play your own bad decks, find some friends on this forum or in the game, and set up private matches. You can't expect to go into Hearthstone thinking your homebrew decks will beat highly optimized decks, it's still too big of a game for that.
Regarding netdecking, people often don't realize that not everybody is a deck-designer at heart (or even likes to do that at all). For many, it's learning to pilot a deck and the actual gameplay that's the fun part - and this is perfectly fine (even well, normal).
Of course, making a homebrew that wins (and wins at top level) is probably the most rewarding thing one can do - but let's be honest, there is no room for many such decks.
That (Casual vs Ranked) is a totally different topic, but there are a ton of possible reasons/replies...
a) There is no fundamental difference between a netdeck and any other deck. Any good deck will end up being a "netdeck". What about seeing a deck online you like and then taking that idea and refining it yourself? I don't pretend to get many "new" deck ideas, but I do get inspired by what I see online and like to refine it to my liking. Most of my "new" ideas fail when being battle tested. Some rare have a degree of success, and it feels awesome :) b) "Netdecking" is just a process of creating a deck, and has no relevance to deck strength. There are meme netdecks, and why not play them in casual? c) That said, deck strength has no relevance to where it should or shouldn't be played. d) Personal observation/viewpoint: Casual for me is a mode where I play when I want exactly that - a casual game. It means I'm either doing quests (not going to do that in ranked), or my private environment/conditions mean I don't want to play a ranked game (e.g. unstable connection, unreliable time frame, chance to be interrupted). Playing Casual will not affect my deck choice, it will be a consequence of my RL circumstances. e) If homebrewing, I tend to take the deck straight to ladder. It's a better place to test if it works (however, due to the nature of ladder, I will probably do that on the 5-10-15 steps and use a reliable deck I have experience with to climb between the levels).
Hopefully this sheds some light on a different approach to the game. I see a lot of frustration that comes from how people perceive Casual mode should be used, while not understanding that others may see it differently with valid reasoning. Not everyone playing a powerful deck in casual is there to farm on weak decks.
I get what you say and i also agree somehow but...
A) A good deck does NOT end up as a netdeck per se. As long as it is creator doesn't post it and people don't pick up on it then for most people it will prolly look like a meme deck for most (although it might has very good results).
B) Netdecking is NOT a process of creating a deck but YES, it does'nt say anythign about the strength. I play 'meme decks' in casual because almost allways the refined decks (the most popular decks most people play) are just better.
C/D) Agreed, but it is still a hot topic for most and not being touched by Blizzard. If they don;t do something about this i guess it will be the downfall of Hearthstone.
E) Confuses me a bit.. You are willing to lose points / ranks to test a deck, but not for reason you mentioned in D).
And why not do quests in ranked??? There is allways a chance you get a disconnect or get interrupted.
Casual really have some braindead players who need stamp fun decks with "ladder decks". But u cant say "u have used all decks?", "why u dont create ur own deck?" Some players dont have many cards, many dust, and dont want waste with no reason.
I dont play casual, only ladder, or in some rare moments with meme decks.
About only have druid/shaman/rogue quest in ladder have many differents decks, but almost nobody wants use low winrate decks on ladder.
Some bad legendary cards see play after some expansions, u cant ask for all be better then others class decks.
I get what you say and i also agree somehow but...
A) A good deck does NOT end up as a netdeck per se. As long as it is creator doesn't post it and people don't pick up on it then for most people it will prolly look like a meme deck for most (although it might has very good results).
B) Netdecking is NOT a process of creating a deck but YES, it does'nt say anythign about the strength. I play 'meme decks' in casual because almost allways the refined decks (the most popular decks most people play) are just better.
C/D) Agreed, but it is still a hot topic for most and not being touched by Blizzard. If they don;t do something about this i guess it will be the downfall of Hearthstone.
E) Confuses me a bit.. You are willing to lose points / ranks to test a deck, but not for reason you mentioned in D).
And why not do quests in ranked??? There is allways a chance you get a disconnect or get interrupted.
A) You're right, and Blizz even mentioned a few such gems existing high up with very high WR. Would actually love to see them posted somewhere e.g. after each rotation, but I understand the authors might want to keep them hidden, esp. if they rely on surprise factor to win.
B) Sorry, expressed myself wrongly. By "creating" I meant just really assembling it in game, not thinking it out. Wrong word.
C/D) Agreed again. I see it angers many and the only thing I can do is try to make them see why others do it, in hopes they will not be angry once they understand the reasons. I think simply having two casual modes would solve most of the issue = adding one which would neither give gold nor reward quests, so there would really be no incentive to play there for anything other than fun. Sure, you'd still have people who like to stomp on others for "fun", but with questers and gold farmers out, it might just be a good enough change to create a nice comfortable game mode. People testing / getting used to competitive decks would probably still want to get gold for it, and also would probably prefer to do so against other more competitive decks than against full casuals. Basically, there should be casual, (no rewards of any kind), unranked (current casual) and ranked.
E) Nah. That's why I said I do my testing on Ranks 15-10-5, where you can't lose ranks. It's also a nice mental break, ladder 5 ranks, then do some craziness for a bit, then ladder on, do more craziness. Actually only works now because I played Wild ranked past months, so my Standard got down to R20 and I can rank up again :) Otherwise, I'd first rank to R5 and then fool around (never gathered the time and motivation to really push for legend so far).
That said, I'm now doing random crap with a new style + custom deck at Wild R7, just because I think the deck is ok-ish and there's plenty of time to reach R5 by end of the month lol
However, that question of yours is very cool: "You are willing to lose points / ranks to test a deck, but not for reason you mentioned in D)"
When I think about it, actually, YES! :D I guess it's just a mental thing, but I absolutely hate losing ranked to outside circumstances (and it would make me very irritated if someone wants to talk to me while playing ranked... I have a toddler at home who demands random attention, I don't want to juggle a ranked game with baby play/communication :D). It basically means no HS while she's awake, but sometimes casual or questing is fine if she's busy with something else. Ranked - hell no.
If I play ranked, I want to do that on the time I know I will not have to juggle it with something else. And yeah, if I lose ranked to a disconnect, I get annoyed. If I lose to my misplay or opponent's luck, I don't. I'm ok with losing while testing a deck. My choice, my fault. It's the random stuff that annoys me ;)
Regarding netdecking, people often don't realize that not everybody is a deck-designer at heart (or even likes to do that at all).
For many, it's learning to pilot a deck and the actual gameplay that's the fun part - and this is perfectly fine (even well, normal).
Of course, making a homebrew that wins (and wins at top level) is probably the most rewarding thing one can do - but let's be honest, there is no room for many such decks.
The original post is in contention for the most misguided post of the year award.
The Quest rewards for Rogue and Druid are insufficient to make them competitive decks. People are playing them now because they are new and kind of fun. But both classes have better decks to play. And Quest Paladin isn't even close to being competitive, so it's certainly not "degenerate". LUL.
If the game is only fun for you when people have no idea what they are doing and play original/creative decks that suck, the game is not for you. This is the age of information. There is absolutely no reason not to use it.
Ask yourself this; How do you know the netdecks are the most fun? Did you experiment at all?
Why not play the netdecks only on ladder??
That (Casual vs Ranked) is a totally different topic, but there are a ton of possible reasons/replies...
a) There is no fundamental difference between a netdeck and any other deck. Any good deck will end up being a "netdeck". What about seeing a deck online you like and then taking that idea and refining it yourself? I don't pretend to get many "new" deck ideas, but I do get inspired by what I see online and like to refine it to my liking. Most of my "new" ideas fail when being battle tested. Some rare have a degree of success, and it feels awesome :)
b) "Netdecking" is just a process of creating a deck, and has no relevance to deck strength. There are meme netdecks, and why not play them in casual?
c) That said, deck strength has no relevance to where it should or shouldn't be played.
d) Personal observation/viewpoint: Casual for me is a mode where I play when I want exactly that - a casual game. It means I'm either doing quests (not going to do that in ranked), or my private environment/conditions mean I don't want to play a ranked game (e.g. unstable connection, unreliable time frame, chance to be interrupted). Playing Casual will not affect my deck choice, it will be a consequence of my RL circumstances.
e) If homebrewing, I tend to take the deck straight to ladder. It's a better place to test if it works (however, due to the nature of ladder, I will probably do that on the 5-10-15 steps and use a reliable deck I have experience with to climb between the levels).
Hopefully this sheds some light on a different approach to the game. I see a lot of frustration that comes from how people perceive Casual mode should be used, while not understanding that others may see it differently with valid reasoning. Not everyone playing a powerful deck in casual is there to farm on weak decks.
@dzquetzal
I get what you say and i also agree somehow but...
A) A good deck does NOT end up as a netdeck per se. As long as it is creator doesn't post it and people don't pick up on it then for most people it will prolly look like a meme deck for most (although it might has very good results).
B) Netdecking is NOT a process of creating a deck but YES, it does'nt say anythign about the strength. I play 'meme decks' in casual because almost allways the refined decks (the most popular decks most people play) are just better.
C/D) Agreed, but it is still a hot topic for most and not being touched by Blizzard. If they don;t do something about this i guess it will be the downfall of Hearthstone.
E) Confuses me a bit.. You are willing to lose points / ranks to test a deck, but not for reason you mentioned in D).
And why not do quests in ranked??? There is allways a chance you get a disconnect or get interrupted.
Casual really have some braindead players who need stamp fun decks with "ladder decks". But u cant say "u have used all decks?", "why u dont create ur own deck?" Some players dont have many cards, many dust, and dont want waste with no reason.
I dont play casual, only ladder, or in some rare moments with meme decks.
About only have druid/shaman/rogue quest in ladder have many differents decks, but almost nobody wants use low winrate decks on ladder.
Some bad legendary cards see play after some expansions, u cant ask for all be better then others class decks.
This thread is so fucking stupid.
Anything constructive to add?
A thread full of this much bullshit doesn't require anything constructive.
The set is less than 3 gotdam days old.
A) You're right, and Blizz even mentioned a few such gems existing high up with very high WR. Would actually love to see them posted somewhere e.g. after each rotation, but I understand the authors might want to keep them hidden, esp. if they rely on surprise factor to win.
B) Sorry, expressed myself wrongly. By "creating" I meant just really assembling it in game, not thinking it out. Wrong word.
C/D) Agreed again. I see it angers many and the only thing I can do is try to make them see why others do it, in hopes they will not be angry once they understand the reasons.
I think simply having two casual modes would solve most of the issue = adding one which would neither give gold nor reward quests, so there would really be no incentive to play there for anything other than fun. Sure, you'd still have people who like to stomp on others for "fun", but with questers and gold farmers out, it might just be a good enough change to create a nice comfortable game mode.
People testing / getting used to competitive decks would probably still want to get gold for it, and also would probably prefer to do so against other more competitive decks than against full casuals.
Basically, there should be casual, (no rewards of any kind), unranked (current casual) and ranked.
E) Nah. That's why I said I do my testing on Ranks 15-10-5, where you can't lose ranks.
It's also a nice mental break, ladder 5 ranks, then do some craziness for a bit, then ladder on, do more craziness.
Actually only works now because I played Wild ranked past months, so my Standard got down to R20 and I can rank up again :)
Otherwise, I'd first rank to R5 and then fool around (never gathered the time and motivation to really push for legend so far).
That said, I'm now doing random crap with a new style + custom deck at Wild R7, just because I think the deck is ok-ish and there's plenty of time to reach R5 by end of the month lol
However, that question of yours is very cool:
"You are willing to lose points / ranks to test a deck, but not for reason you mentioned in D)"
When I think about it, actually, YES! :D
I guess it's just a mental thing, but I absolutely hate losing ranked to outside circumstances (and it would make me very irritated if someone wants to talk to me while playing ranked... I have a toddler at home who demands random attention, I don't want to juggle a ranked game with baby play/communication :D). It basically means no HS while she's awake, but sometimes casual or questing is fine if she's busy with something else. Ranked - hell no.
If I play ranked, I want to do that on the time I know I will not have to juggle it with something else.
And yeah, if I lose ranked to a disconnect, I get annoyed. If I lose to my misplay or opponent's luck, I don't.
I'm ok with losing while testing a deck. My choice, my fault. It's the random stuff that annoys me ;)
@1xbenx1
I saw enough good replies in this topic, unlike yours. I also saw then many of your 4,377 posts / replies are like these.
That is the last thing i will say about your reply because it only pollutes this topic.
Thanks for all your thoughtful insights and contributory comments. You're an hero!
Ok, let's cool it down here, guys.
No need for the ad hominems and trollery.
Take a step back.