I don’t hate playing against control decks. Control Shaman has been my favorite deck to play since the start of this meta and it’s a deck I enjoy playing against as well. Even the mirror requires interesting decisions and I enjoy playing against it when I’m playing other decks. And there’s plenty of room for customization, improvisation and adaptation in the archetype. It’s an example of a creative control deck where games play out differently every time and the pilot can be punished for mistakes.
But like a lot of other players, I find Control Warrior to be tedious in the current standard meta. The games are always the same, the power level of their core cards makes control easy to play, etc. Everything that’s ostensibly interesting or challenging about control is neutered by the fact that Warrior has access to the perfect tools for any situation. And because of its armor gain and access to removal, it has a higher margin for error than a control deck should.
Need to clear a single minion? Shield Slam, Execute and Omega Devastator have you covered. Yes, the last one is only playable after turn 10, but are you worried about getting to turn 10?
Need to clear a wide board? Warpath has you covered. The Shaman analogue, Lightning Storm, only guarantees 2 damage per minion and has overload.
Need to clear every minion on the board? Brawl has you covered. Yes, there’s a chance the one big scary minion is left over, but then you can drop Omega Devastator, Execute or Shield Slam.
Running out of minions? Don’t worry, Omega Assembly and Delivery Drone have you covered. Bonus points because those minions have rush! Yes, you’re not guaranteed to get the most useful minion, but you’re guaranteed a rush minion if Dr. Boom has been played.
And when you’re floating mana, just armor up! Or better yet, play a Shield Block, draw a card and boost your Shield Slam. 4-mana, draw a card, deal 5 damage to a minion. Sounds good.
For any conceivable board state, Warrior has an efficient answer that requires no thought or creativity. It’s boring. And if your deck isn’t built to withstand its defenses, you’re sinply going to lose. That’s not how HS should work.
This is why we need more reliable OTK decks.
You forgot just one little detail:
Wanna fatigue your opponent? Archivist Elysiana!! LOL
I think control decks are fine and I play them here and there. What I do hate is the attitude a lot of control players has thinking that control warrior takes more skill than aggro decks for example.
Control decks shouldn't be about aiming not to lose, that's my biggest issue with decks such as Control/Fatigue Warrior. Take Control Shaman as an example, it can generate a finite amount of extra value (in case Hagatha the Witch shows up early enough before you drew most of your minions) and also doesn't have access to a gazillion board clears/target removals. That's why they can't opt for a pure value grind and at some point during a game have to switch their playstyle to actually kill the opponent. Yea, there is Archivist Elysiana but that card in its current state is a problem by itself (mana cost must be increased to prevent the Youthful Brewmaster/Baleful Banker follow up and it should become unable to be discovered off other cards/itself)
Lol, every expansion we have these "aggro/control decks are awful" threads. C'mon, let's get real for a sec and just say the thing we really want to say which is, "I don't like the thing the opponent played against what I'm using". Losing to control makes you feel bad because they have a ton of answers, usually expensive to craft ones, that shames you for just belching your hand onto the board. Vice versa, control players hate losing to everything else because they know that the reality of the aggro/control tug-of-war favors aggro because while sometimes the control player will draw into bad answers or unplayable cards, the aggro player will never draw any "bad threats".
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
I personally hate playing against Control Warrior because it's the deck type that my homebrewed Rush Warrior deck struggles the most with. But honestly, people just need something to dislike. When their game plan works decently against most decks but gets countered to shreds by one archetype, It feels terrible. Then again, a meta that's dominated by ridiculous tempo decks (read: odd rogues and odd paladins pre-Level Up! and Cold Blood nerfs) got just as much hate. Looking at the hsreplay statistics right now, the tier 1 and 2 decks are a healthy mix of crazy tempo, midrange and control decks. There is always one or two things that just tilts you to insanity.
Started in 2015 playing control.. Still play control everyday, my favorite, more difficult decisions and play making. Not just play 1 and 2 mana cost minions and smack face. I still love playing control matchups, they take a little while but alot of enjoyment in them. Nowadays everyone is looking for quick wins no1 cares about control, especially that certain control vs control matchups can take over 40kins to complete 1 game
there should be an option on your poll saying that control decks are fine and you don't hate them
I really don't mind to much when I am fighting control or aggro, and I enjoy playing control decks because I feel like there is more room to do things when the games are longer. I am fine playing aggro, but if I could be playing control instead I will.
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Rejoice, for even in death, you have become children of Thanos.
I enjoy playing control decks that actively fight for the board and have a win condition beyond accumulating massive amounts of armor or depleting my opponent of its resources. Control Mind Blast Priest is probably my favorite deck of all time- sure there were some blow out games where I drew the nuts, but most of the time I had to carefully manage my resources and work out a way to actually finish my opponent off while engaging with my opponent's board. Even with big spell mage you could win by overwhelming other control decks with late game threats, as opposed to grinding out to fatigue or renoing with Jaina. I know that many hated Jaina, but she was never an issue for me personally. Both of these decks were easily countered, and the high level of power existing in the meta meant that they never felt oppressive or unbeatable. My issue is when armor gain, removal and resource generation/ uninteractable win condition are all present in the same deck- control/ otk druids and control warriors have always felt miserable to play against, at least for me. Yes they can and could be countered, but it rarely feels fun for me.
I dislike the obsession over control because not all classes are given a fair shot at having control as a playstyle option nearly as often as they should be given the freedom to. For example, I've loved the idea of a slow attrition non-Kingsbane rogue for the longest time. We have that in wild ever since N'Zoth and Valeera became a thing, but too often the insistence of not having rogue break its dumb class identity that often (tempo, tempo, tempo, aggro, tempo, miracle, miracle, tempo, OTK/combo, tempo, tempo). Similar things can be said for shaman, paladin, & druid as well. It gets really really old seeing mostly the same four classes (warlock, priest, warrior, & mage of late be the poster children for control).
That is why I carry some dislike for control. I'd care for it more if HS actually broke the mold for the playstyle in a much more refreshing way than it has for the past many years.
I hate this poll because it's the missing the real option that would be picked the most, which is specifically people hate Ctrl WARRIOR and not bitching about any other Ctrl class in standard. I have not heard anyone yapping about Ctrl Pally being too good... nobody talking about Ctrl Priest, nobody talking about Ctrl Druid, or Ctrl Shaman. It's fricking Dr Boom + Omega Destoryer. Fuck those 2 cards.
I don't think its just a newer player base, there are a lot of commuters on Hearthstone, a 15 minute busride could be a fun game or two, or it can be a control roper that you eventually have to concede when you get into work. Everytime I queue into control, I know that I'm going to be in for a long game, even if I win, it doesn't feel all that great because I could have played two games.
It's not just control, really. There are several decks in this meta and the last that are just not fun. The reason is that they are too polarizing.
A certain amount of rock-paper-scissors is unavoidable, but ideally you want rock to beat paper every once in a while.
In the current meta, the rocks have such a tiny, tiny chance of beating paper that it just doesn't seem worthwhile to even play the game. You might as well drop Hearthstone and actually play rock-paper-scissors.
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"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
I don't have any problems playing against Control, but Warrior with Dr.Boom aura + Omega Devastator, Dynomatics, and finding even more of those from a freaking Hero Power and a 1 mana cost card is just bullshit.
Not that Rogue isn't either, but at least the games are faster.
About 50 min long game and at the end i was able to put down 20 to 30 worth of stats down each turn for about 10 turns yet the warrior was able to answer every one of them plus put down his own board...
People hate control because the decks take skill and intelligence to pilot.
Lol more like a tiny amount of classes are given the busted value cards/removal so during slow matches equally skilled players will always win when playing the class that has the most greedy vomited into said classes' laps.
There's absolutely nothing skillful about playing a class that beat other slow classes that have less removal, less value, and/or less anti-fatigue than you by a landslide.
I hate playing with and against control warrior now for the same reason I hated play with or against the aggro decks before can easily kill in turn 4 like prenerf pirate warrior and token druid.
HAVE UNFAIR ADVANTAGES!!!
Put a 1/1 + 1/3 weapon + 1/1 charge for a single mana spending a single card in an aggro deck is unfair.
Discover a 4/5 for 4 manas and kill a big and mid opponent minions using a hero power and don't spend any resource in a control deck is unfair, especially vs a class don't have acess to hero cards.
The aggro decks was nerfed and this control BS need to be massively overnerfed to the ground now.
You forgot just one little detail:
Wanna fatigue your opponent? Archivist Elysiana!! LOL
I think control decks are fine and I play them here and there. What I do hate is the attitude a lot of control players has thinking that control warrior takes more skill than aggro decks for example.
Control decks shouldn't be about aiming not to lose, that's my biggest issue with decks such as Control/Fatigue Warrior. Take Control Shaman as an example, it can generate a finite amount of extra value (in case Hagatha the Witch shows up early enough before you drew most of your minions) and also doesn't have access to a gazillion board clears/target removals. That's why they can't opt for a pure value grind and at some point during a game have to switch their playstyle to actually kill the opponent. Yea, there is Archivist Elysiana but that card in its current state is a problem by itself (mana cost must be increased to prevent the Youthful Brewmaster/Baleful Banker follow up and it should become unable to be discovered off other cards/itself)
Lol, every expansion we have these "aggro/control decks are awful" threads. C'mon, let's get real for a sec and just say the thing we really want to say which is, "I don't like the thing the opponent played against what I'm using". Losing to control makes you feel bad because they have a ton of answers, usually expensive to craft ones, that shames you for just belching your hand onto the board. Vice versa, control players hate losing to everything else because they know that the reality of the aggro/control tug-of-war favors aggro because while sometimes the control player will draw into bad answers or unplayable cards, the aggro player will never draw any "bad threats".
"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
I personally hate playing against Control Warrior because it's the deck type that my homebrewed Rush Warrior deck struggles the most with. But honestly, people just need something to dislike. When their game plan works decently against most decks but gets countered to shreds by one archetype, It feels terrible. Then again, a meta that's dominated by ridiculous tempo decks (read: odd rogues and odd paladins pre-Level Up! and Cold Blood nerfs) got just as much hate. Looking at the hsreplay statistics right now, the tier 1 and 2 decks are a healthy mix of crazy tempo, midrange and control decks. There is always one or two things that just tilts you to insanity.
Started in 2015 playing control.. Still play control everyday, my favorite, more difficult decisions and play making. Not just play 1 and 2 mana cost minions and smack face. I still love playing control matchups, they take a little while but alot of enjoyment in them. Nowadays everyone is looking for quick wins no1 cares about control, especially that certain control vs control matchups can take over 40kins to complete 1 game
People will always hate on the best decks and i agree that warior just feel horabole to play against
Enjoy countering warriors and lose to rogues all the time
there should be an option on your poll saying that control decks are fine and you don't hate them
I really don't mind to much when I am fighting control or aggro, and I enjoy playing control decks because I feel like there is more room to do things when the games are longer. I am fine playing aggro, but if I could be playing control instead I will.
Rejoice, for even in death, you have become children of Thanos.
I enjoy playing control decks that actively fight for the board and have a win condition beyond accumulating massive amounts of armor or depleting my opponent of its resources. Control Mind Blast Priest is probably my favorite deck of all time- sure there were some blow out games where I drew the nuts, but most of the time I had to carefully manage my resources and work out a way to actually finish my opponent off while engaging with my opponent's board. Even with big spell mage you could win by overwhelming other control decks with late game threats, as opposed to grinding out to fatigue or renoing with Jaina. I know that many hated Jaina, but she was never an issue for me personally. Both of these decks were easily countered, and the high level of power existing in the meta meant that they never felt oppressive or unbeatable. My issue is when armor gain, removal and resource generation/ uninteractable win condition are all present in the same deck- control/ otk druids and control warriors have always felt miserable to play against, at least for me. Yes they can and could be countered, but it rarely feels fun for me.
I dislike the obsession over control because not all classes are given a fair shot at having control as a playstyle option nearly as often as they should be given the freedom to. For example, I've loved the idea of a slow attrition non-Kingsbane rogue for the longest time. We have that in wild ever since N'Zoth and Valeera became a thing, but too often the insistence of not having rogue break its dumb class identity that often (tempo, tempo, tempo, aggro, tempo, miracle, miracle, tempo, OTK/combo, tempo, tempo). Similar things can be said for shaman, paladin, & druid as well. It gets really really old seeing mostly the same four classes (warlock, priest, warrior, & mage of late be the poster children for control).
That is why I carry some dislike for control. I'd care for it more if HS actually broke the mold for the playstyle in a much more refreshing way than it has for the past many years.
I hate this poll because it's the missing the real option that would be picked the most, which is specifically people hate Ctrl WARRIOR and not bitching about any other Ctrl class in standard. I have not heard anyone yapping about Ctrl Pally being too good... nobody talking about Ctrl Priest, nobody talking about Ctrl Druid, or Ctrl Shaman. It's fricking Dr Boom + Omega Destoryer. Fuck those 2 cards.
I don't think its just a newer player base, there are a lot of commuters on Hearthstone, a 15 minute busride could be a fun game or two, or it can be a control roper that you eventually have to concede when you get into work. Everytime I queue into control, I know that I'm going to be in for a long game, even if I win, it doesn't feel all that great because I could have played two games.
It's not just control, really. There are several decks in this meta and the last that are just not fun. The reason is that they are too polarizing.
A certain amount of rock-paper-scissors is unavoidable, but ideally you want rock to beat paper every once in a while.
In the current meta, the rocks have such a tiny, tiny chance of beating paper that it just doesn't seem worthwhile to even play the game. You might as well drop Hearthstone and actually play rock-paper-scissors.
"Why, you never expected justice from a company, did you? They have neither a soul to lose nor a body to kick." -- Lady Saba Holland
I don't have any problems playing against Control, but Warrior with Dr.Boom aura + Omega Devastator, Dynomatics, and finding even more of those from a freaking Hero Power and a 1 mana cost card is just bullshit.
Not that Rogue isn't either, but at least the games are faster.
some people just want it to be over in seconds. i prefer playing the game.
After months of control players hating on combo decks, it's funny to see this kind of thread now. Are you gonna cry everytime for no reason?
This game is why control decks are not fun...
https://hsreplay.net/replay/VoCR4ckRG28tAjUPJRKPLb
About 50 min long game and at the end i was able to put down 20 to 30 worth of stats down each turn for about 10 turns yet the warrior was able to answer every one of them plus put down his own board...
Lol more like a tiny amount of classes are given the busted value cards/removal so during slow matches equally skilled players will always win when playing the class that has the most greedy vomited into said classes' laps.
There's absolutely nothing skillful about playing a class that beat other slow classes that have less removal, less value, and/or less anti-fatigue than you by a landslide.
I hate playing with and against control warrior now for the same reason I hated play with or against the aggro decks before can easily kill in turn 4 like prenerf pirate warrior and token druid.
HAVE UNFAIR ADVANTAGES!!!
Put a 1/1 + 1/3 weapon + 1/1 charge for a single mana spending a single card in an aggro deck is unfair.
Discover a 4/5 for 4 manas and kill a big and mid opponent minions using a hero power and don't spend any resource in a control deck is unfair, especially vs a class don't have acess to hero cards.
The aggro decks was nerfed and this control BS need to be massively overnerfed to the ground now.