I Just can't understand people hating on powerful cards (e.g. DKs) with strong effects ,rexxar Is honestly the only One i Can (kind of) understand because that's not high Power level,that's infinite value aka the Worst mechanic introduced to the game (everyone LOVED Jade druid before geist right?) But even rexxar Is (kinda) slow and (semi) inconsistent (exept not really) wich keeps him in check
Every other DK (whatever you May want to Say) even the ever so hated Jaina and gul'dan are really strong but can always be played around/beaten/outvalued (i Will aknowledge raza anduin was a problem but still the issue Lied in a 2 card sinergy that was fixed when it reached otk levels of uninteractiveness,they took their time fixing It but that's NOT my point don't start this discussion here please)
Same goes for (rip druid as a class) taunt druid,It was REALLY obnoctious and REALLY strong i'll give you that and It could highroll you into oblivion but you Always had a chance to beat It (with a powerful enough deck and PRAISING THE GEIST) by saving your removals well enough or outvalueing him on the board(to sum up it could get it's combo done perfectly and every player still had every chance to win) and i honestly really enjoyed those matchups barring when they got the Absolute nut draw
There are other examples that i can't think of right now but i think you All got the point,the kind of extreme Powerlevel lategame matchups with gigantc boardswings every other turn (the Key Is that whatever happens you MUST Always have a realistic way of stopping your opopponent that doesn't involve SMORCing him to death) are IMO the best kind of games and cards that allow it are not to hate but to be encouraged.
This post ended up being way longer than i intended and i'm sorry but still i would like to know your opinion on this.
Thanks in Advance for not starting a salt thtead in here😊
I guess my thought is that, yes, you're right - every one of those decks and cards can be stopped if you know in advance you're facing it and can tech accordingly. But 1) you don't know in advance and so get crushed by a different deck to the one you teched against and 2) where's the fun in always having to react to someone else's plan without being able to try out a plan of your own?
I posted this by only looking at my point of view (the idiot that doesn't like playing with a win condition that's not "Fair" fatigue: 1 Copy of dmh,Elise,jaina and stuff) and i'm sorry for that but i hinted at other ways of winning in the taunt druid part when i said you Can Also win the board vs them and then THEY have to respond (if you ever played overload/spellstone shaman vs them you know what i mean)
As for the First part of your post a good deck needs techs for as many popular strong decks as possibile but something (my bad) i forgot to add Is that (even though i's going to be WAY harder) you Can win vs those decks without tech cards if your deck Is strong enough on its own
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
I'm Sorry to be this Blunt but WTF??
rexxar Is anche autoinclude in any non odd hunter (that,s not a problem IMO,it's Just to state it's Powerlevel) while jaina/gul Dan at least only fit in the slower decks,gul Dan only Summons disgusting boards of you supercommit to Building a deck around that and jaina countering weapons...ever Heard of removals and taunts?
Still the point Is that a good deck Can win the value game vs them (or...SMORC before they happen but i personally hate that strategy)
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
I'm Sorry to be this Blunt but WTF??
rexxar Is anche autoinclude in any non odd hunter (that,s not a problem IMO,it's Just to state it's Powerlevel) while jaina/gul Dan at least only fit in the slower decks,gul Dan only Summons disgusting boards of you supercommit to Building a deck around that and jaina countering weapons...ever Heard of removals and taunts?
Still the point Is that a good deck Can win the value game vs them (or...SMORC before they happen but i personally hate that strategy)
Also rexxar goes to infinity and beyond,the others don't
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
I'm Sorry to be this Blunt but WTF??
rexxar Is anche autoinclude in any non odd hunter (that,s not a problem IMO,it's Just to state it's Powerlevel) while jaina/gul Dan at least only fit in the slower decks,gul Dan only Summons disgusting boards of you supercommit to Building a deck around that and jaina countering weapons...ever Heard of removals and taunts?
Still the point Is that a good deck Can win the value game vs them (or...SMORC before they happen but i personally hate that strategy)
Jaina is auto conclude in any Mage deck and Golden in any warlock deck that can play those cards so what's your point? All three of them, Rexxar, Jain, Golden, will be played in every deck of their class unless restricted by even/odd mechanic. They are all totally OP.
Gul'Dan and Hadronnox could be played around. Not sure why it is often the opinion that Gul'Dan is lite-mode in explosive valuetown fairness while Hadronnox was "Zomg skeezy cheater town!".
They both produced boards that were easy to deal with for some classes and boards that absolutely destroyed other classes.
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
I'm Sorry to be this Blunt but WTF??
rexxar Is anche autoinclude in any non odd hunter (that,s not a problem IMO,it's Just to state it's Powerlevel) while jaina/gul Dan at least only fit in the slower decks,gul Dan only Summons disgusting boards of you supercommit to Building a deck around that and jaina countering weapons...ever Heard of removals and taunts?
Still the point Is that a good deck Can win the value game vs them (or...SMORC before they happen but i personally hate that strategy)
Jaina is auto conclude in any Mage deck and Golden in any warlock deck that can play those cards so what's your point? All three of them, Rexxar, Jain, Golden, will be played in every deck of their class unless restricted by even/odd mechanic. They are all totally OP.
Zoolock and tempo mage don't run DKs,whereas rexxar's only restriction is baku,here's my point
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
I'm Sorry to be this Blunt but WTF??
rexxar Is anche autoinclude in any non odd hunter (that,s not a problem IMO,it's Just to state it's Powerlevel) while jaina/gul Dan at least only fit in the slower decks,gul Dan only Summons disgusting boards of you supercommit to Building a deck around that and jaina countering weapons...ever Heard of removals and taunts?
Still the point Is that a good deck Can win the value game vs them (or...SMORC before they happen but i personally hate that strategy)
Jaina is auto conclude in any Mage deck and Golden in any warlock deck that can play those cards so what's your point? All three of them, Rexxar, Jain, Golden, will be played in every deck of their class unless restricted by even/odd mechanic. They are all totally OP.
Zoolock and tempo mage don't run DKs,whereas rexxar's only restriction is baku,here's my point
Yeah because those decks are so aggressive that you don't plan to arrive at turn 10 very often, otherwise you would run them
Gul'Dan and Hadronnox could be played around. Not sure why it is often the opinion that Gul'Dan is lite-mode in explosive valuetown fairness while Hadronnox was "Zomg skeezy cheater town!".
They both produced boards that were easy to deal with for some classes and boards that absolutely destroyed other classes.
If you are talking about "aggro classes" i Can see your point but still...they cost 9/10 mana,an aggro deck should have already won by that point (idk about the First thing,people complain a lot about guldan as well)
I'm fine with the DK's too. I mean I hated raza priest with a passion (I don't like anduin though and his voice really annoys me. I did not discover squelch till late last year)
Anduin is only as powerful in a raza deck though, so you only got worry about him in wild. and even then in wild we have access to a far greater selection of cards to counter other things. it's not as bad as having a god priest in standard (it was truly horrific)
Rexxar actually used to be bad till they added more keywords to his repertoire (seriously the lifesteal is extremely testing. it wouldn't be so bad if every 9 out of 10 players wasn't playing f'ing hunter... this is why I'm playing wild now, sick of hunters)
Jaina is great, but not overbearing as you only see her once in a while and it takes bit of skill to use her right.
Dan is pretty OP in the right set up. cubelock for instance. but again it takes great skill to pull this off sop it's not a problem.
Sexy rogue lady is perfect. she only works in a few decks that have bellow 40% winrates. only weird idiots like me have this card and play it on ladder in a competitive environment.
I can't really speak on the other 3 guys as I don't know much about them. I have faced all 3 of them on occasion, but druid, warrior and shaman are my least played classes so I don't feel I can comment on them accurately enough, so I just won't bother.
So in short.. anduin was a problem, not so much any more (although in wild priest is still a dick) rexxar was UP but now is OP and that lifesteal is completely broken. hunter needs tweaked I think in order to balance the game further.
dan and jaina are OP, but take skill to use them right so are fine. (OK you can easy rex minion with dan in any deck, I mean he's best in cubes and cubes takes skill)
valeera is really cool, but doesn't get many chances to really shine. she is perfect in pogos, but pogos sucks at competitive play so is probably bottom of the list really (I still love this card though and probs will keep it till HS dies)
the other 3 I don't know enough about. someone else do them?
(and yes, I realize I said "in short" then just wrote just as much as I'd previously written, completely nullifying the TL;DR aspect)
I Just can't understand people hating on powerful cards (e.g. DKs) with strong effects ,rexxar Is honestly the only One i Can (kind of) understand because that's not high Power level,that's infinite value aka the Worst mechanic introduced to the game (everyone LOVED Jade druid before geist right?) But even rexxar Is (kinda) slow and (semi) inconsistent (exept not really) wich keeps him in check
Every other DK (whatever you May want to Say) even the ever so hated Jaina and gul'dan are really strong but can always be played around/beaten/outvalued (i Will aknowledge raza anduin was a problem but still the issue Lied in a 2 card sinergy that was fixed when it reached otk levels of uninteractiveness,they took their time fixing It but that's NOT my point don't start this discussion here please)
Same goes for (rip druid as a class) taunt druid,It was REALLY obnoctious and REALLY strong i'll give you that and It could highroll you into oblivion but you Always had a chance to beat It (with a powerful enough deck and PRAISING THE GEIST) by saving your removals well enough or outvalueing him on the board(to sum up it could get it's combo done perfectly and every player still had every chance to win) and i honestly really enjoyed those matchups barring when they got the Absolute nut draw
There are other examples that i can't think of right now but i think you All got the point,the kind of extreme Powerlevel lategame matchups with gigantc boardswings every other turn (the Key Is that whatever happens you MUST Always have a realistic way of stopping your opopponent that doesn't involve SMORCing him to death) are IMO the best kind of games and cards that allow it are not to hate but to be encouraged.
This post ended up being way longer than i intended and i'm sorry but still i would like to know your opinion on this.
Thanks in Advance for not starting a salt thtead in here😊
I guess my thought is that, yes, you're right - every one of those decks and cards can be stopped if you know in advance you're facing it and can tech accordingly. But 1) you don't know in advance and so get crushed by a different deck to the one you teched against and 2) where's the fun in always having to react to someone else's plan without being able to try out a plan of your own?
I'm me - who are you?
I posted this by only looking at my point of view (the idiot that doesn't like playing with a win condition that's not "Fair" fatigue: 1 Copy of dmh,Elise,jaina and stuff) and i'm sorry for that but i hinted at other ways of winning in the taunt druid part when i said you Can Also win the board vs them and then THEY have to respond (if you ever played overload/spellstone shaman vs them you know what i mean)
As for the First part of your post a good deck needs techs for as many popular strong decks as possibile but something (my bad) i forgot to add Is that (even though i's going to be WAY harder) you Can win vs those decks without tech cards if your deck Is strong enough on its own
Frostlich Jaina and DK Guldan are just way too unfair imo , at least hunter has the need of dk rexxar to play the control game . DK Jaina just shits on weapon dec0ks because of her water elementals. DK Guldan not only summons a whole board of minions (3/9 taunts and spawn more taunts and 5/7 charge)but also get a really good heropower (which has no drawback whatsoever since warlock heropower is worthless in lategame.) These 2 hero cards are the worse offender of balance not cards like spreading plague.
I'm Sorry to be this Blunt but WTF??
rexxar Is anche autoinclude in any non odd hunter (that,s not a problem IMO,it's Just to state it's Powerlevel) while jaina/gul Dan at least only fit in the slower decks,gul Dan only Summons disgusting boards of you supercommit to Building a deck around that and jaina countering weapons...ever Heard of removals and taunts?
Still the point Is that a good deck Can win the value game vs them (or...SMORC before they happen but i personally hate that strategy)
Also rexxar goes to infinity and beyond,the others don't
And here we have people realizing that others have different opinions. amazing.
Unpopular opinion: Rogue is OP
Jaina is auto conclude in any Mage deck and Golden in any warlock deck that can play those cards so what's your point? All three of them, Rexxar, Jain, Golden, will be played in every deck of their class unless restricted by even/odd mechanic. They are all totally OP.
The fact is that all three cards could be nerfed to still playability if Blizzard only wanted:
REXXAR: buckets made just by Classic and Frozen Throne Beasts
JAINA: ONLY Water Elementals have Lifesteal
GUL'DAN: I really don't know lol, it's the fairest of the three
Gul'Dan and Hadronnox could be played around. Not sure why it is often the opinion that Gul'Dan is lite-mode in explosive valuetown fairness while Hadronnox was "Zomg skeezy cheater town!".
They both produced boards that were easy to deal with for some classes and boards that absolutely destroyed other classes.
Zoolock and tempo mage don't run DKs,whereas rexxar's only restriction is baku,here's my point
Yeah because those decks are so aggressive that you don't plan to arrive at turn 10 very often, otherwise you would run them
If you are talking about "aggro classes" i Can see your point but still...they cost 9/10 mana,an aggro deck should have already won by that point (idk about the First thing,people complain a lot about guldan as well)
What?
How do I downvote posts? Asking for a friend.
Fun > Meta
What?
Deathstalker Rexxar is the only card in HS history that gets buff with every new expensin and continue to get buff even after rotation.
I'm fine with the DK's too. I mean I hated raza priest with a passion (I don't like anduin though and his voice really annoys me. I did not discover squelch till late last year)
Anduin is only as powerful in a raza deck though, so you only got worry about him in wild. and even then in wild we have access to a far greater selection of cards to counter other things. it's not as bad as having a god priest in standard (it was truly horrific)
Rexxar actually used to be bad till they added more keywords to his repertoire (seriously the lifesteal is extremely testing. it wouldn't be so bad if every 9 out of 10 players wasn't playing f'ing hunter... this is why I'm playing wild now, sick of hunters)
Jaina is great, but not overbearing as you only see her once in a while and it takes bit of skill to use her right.
Dan is pretty OP in the right set up. cubelock for instance. but again it takes great skill to pull this off sop it's not a problem.
Sexy rogue lady is perfect. she only works in a few decks that have bellow 40% winrates. only weird idiots like me have this card and play it on ladder in a competitive environment.
I can't really speak on the other 3 guys as I don't know much about them. I have faced all 3 of them on occasion, but druid, warrior and shaman are my least played classes so I don't feel I can comment on them accurately enough, so I just won't bother.
So in short.. anduin was a problem, not so much any more (although in wild priest is still a dick) rexxar was UP but now is OP and that lifesteal is completely broken. hunter needs tweaked I think in order to balance the game further.
dan and jaina are OP, but take skill to use them right so are fine. (OK you can easy rex minion with dan in any deck, I mean he's best in cubes and cubes takes skill)
valeera is really cool, but doesn't get many chances to really shine. she is perfect in pogos, but pogos sucks at competitive play so is probably bottom of the list really (I still love this card though and probs will keep it till HS dies)
the other 3 I don't know enough about. someone else do them?
(and yes, I realize I said "in short" then just wrote just as much as I'd previously written, completely nullifying the TL;DR aspect)
what?
anyway my question was,why a nerf?