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From a design perspective the needs they chose are the logical ones.
Kingsbane is a great mechanic, but the continuous life steal was a problem. And adding “this keeps enchantments except lifesteal” would be dumb.
Druid’s biggest issue has been the effectiveness of its ramp for quite a while. The effectiveness of ramp means it is very dangerous releasing big powerful cards for them and early game cards are often useless. They could have nerfed other cards now to adjust things, but this is the long term action that was needed. And should have been done a long time ago
For Saranite, this doesn’t impact a cool legendary and it provides a minor hit to other annoying decks (valanyr plus Saranite just being dumb, for example)
In general, the lower the rarity the more boring the card and the more attractive the nerf. So yes, unless if you are targeting an archetype you will generally hit the commons that are important components first.
Shudderwock will still be played in Unstable Evolution + Krag'wa, the Frog
HEY BLIZZ! YOU GOT ANYMORE OF THEM ODD MAGES!? *scratches face furiously
Hearthstone is F2P game by definition, you don't need to spend any more on this game. You can play many competitive budget decks, when you expect to play 6K cancerous Kingsbane deck for free, you deserved to get burn.
Dead but dreaming
Why couldn't it be something like - "It keeps all but two enchantments (or something similar)"? That way the flavour of the card survives - you get punished for the opponent destroying it, there's some thought about when to apply buffs and it doesn't last forever. I think Blizz could be way more imaginative with the nerfs...then again 18 deck slots was too complicated so who knows...
The timing of this nerf is just not right, and every tier 1 decks is so called degenerated.
Just take a look back in March and April, seeing after coldlight just rotated out, Kingsbane wasn’t called degenerated and goes into meme decks category. See, one particular archetype does really well in a certain meta(probably tier one or two), people will call it degenerated. I kinda agree those broken archetype are degenerated to play against, but hella fun to play.
What I am trying say that the meta is heavily affecting decks performance, there is more than one way than nerfing cards to weaken a broken deck. They could buff some cards to get rid of some annoying decks or make a new set of rule except wild and standard to play those annoying deck.
Also dust refund doesn’t recover what a player has lost due to a strong nerf, a better refund should be made. For example, blizzard could give two to three pack to players who own copy of that nerf card, which is way more friendly to those F2P players.
So yay, Blizzard kinda screwed the game up somehow.
No
That would utterly destroy Kingsbane.
The problem with Kingsbane was the constant and massive healing, especially when a lack of reliable healing has been a defining characteristic of Rogue. The logical action is to take lifesteal away from it. Getting “creative” is pointless when the problem is right in front of you.
There is no way to have nobody lose out. I feel that this is reasonable (and a few packs would give most people more, but still pale in comparison to the cost of a few legendaries). Some people win and some lose, but that is going to happen no matter what. I think the people saying the nerfs chosen were dead wrong. They are pretty logical, reasonable, and mostly things I have seen requested by many players.
The only complaint I can see as being very strong is “I crafted a deck right after the expansion on the basis that it would be good for at least two months”. I do feel that the timing of nerfs was a reasonable expectation based on past performance and some people would make a different decision if they knew nerfs were possible this soon. In that case the only real option I think would be, if Blizzard can do so, refund heavily impacted epics and legendaries crafted since the expansion launched.
Infinite combo is only dead in standard. We can still play it in wild via Doppelgangster.
You do know Tempo Shudderwok Shaman was a fairly strong meta deck before RR right? That didn't depend on a game winning combo many games.
This thread is getting so derailed so back to the main topic. The dust policy should stay the same. Otherwise, there's no negative consequence for nerfs in many instances. If you get refunded for pretty much an entire deck (if a key card was nerfed) you'd never realistically have to spend your own dust on new decks again. People would just bounce from deck to deck with full, or close to full, dust refunds.
I think in this case ONLY they should allow a refund for Kingsbane, Shudder, Grumble, etc.
Simply for the fact that no warning whatsoever was given to the community that those decks were even being looked at. They release Raiding Party pretty much screaming people to play Kingsbane, and like one week later the deck is pretty much killed? Shudderwock's infinite strategy was explained step-by-step by Ben Brode himself on the set release video and hyped up people to craft it day one. Now you give them the finger.
I can sympathize with anyone that crafted one of the nerfed decks, specially if it was from near scratch, only to have it nuked a few weeks later. Thank God I dodged the bullet here. If I had spent over 6k to 13k dust that took a year and real money to help gather, I would be outraged too.
The funny thing is that when they changed Ranked or something a few months ago and fucked with a lot of people, they came public and apologized for failing to communicate and said would do better in the future. Good job, Blizzard.
Kingsbane released a year ago and Shudderwock in April. Not only you had this long to use these cards, you can STILL play them. They nerfed druid class to the ground, (43% wr LOL) so do you think they should refund every druid legendary that was played? OF COURSE NOT! It's obvious people are acting like victims to get refunds, because they know these cards will rotate out soon and probably get dusted no matter what. They try to create an uproar because they're con artists and people here applaud them for it.
But not everyone crafted Kingsbane a year ago or Shudderwock in April.
Kingsbane was not even being played. They released Raiding Party specifically to power up a Kingsbane deck and one week later pretty much destroy it. Shudderwock had the head designer in a release video explaining step-by-step how to actually play the deck. If they had nerfed UI to 4 armor, draw, minion and damage, Branching Paths to 5 mana, Plague to 1/4 scarabs and DK to 8 mana, people would still play Druid. Instead they butchered it so much that even with those broken cards untouched you are at ~40% winrate.
Look at how they nerfed Even Paladin and Cubelock. They warned people a week or two beforehand that they were looking at various cards of these decks, then nerfed only 3 (Dark Pact, Lackey and Call to Arms).
They didn't destroy a Classic card and neither butchered the archetype. Those decks were still fine. You can play Even Paladin and Cubelock.
For this one they announced directly the nerfs mere hours before it actually went live. No warning whatsoever that the decks/cards were even being looked at. Good luck playing the Shudderwock as the devs themselves intended it to be or trying to do something with Druid now.
Do you know how many of us have had decks killed or heavily nerfed at times due to a key card being nerfed. We weren't refunded (And I didn't feel I was owed a refund anyway). Why should Kingsbane or standard Shudderwok be the exception, because you played it?
T5 can't refund either of this decks without breaking from their current philosophy and setting a precedent for all future nerfs. If they refund players now they will be a big uproar the next time nerfs happen, questioning why players of [Insert random deck here] shouldn't also get dust back. In the end this perpetuates a system where nerfs for any deck simply allows players to reap tons of dust for players who had related key cards of various decks and get dust for them (even if they didn't actually play or use the deck), as well as allowing players to craft whatever they want without really having to spend their own dust.
I'd also like to point out that this is the exact opposite of the common complaints that many players have had for years, about how T5 waits too long for updates. Well, this time they sped it up, when in comparison to how slowly other changes occurred, and still players complain. They can't please everyone at the same time. It just happened you ended up on the other side this time.
Guys, they have already refounded you for Kingsbane: you can fully dust now Deadly Poison, Vanish, Sap and Fan of Knives, in addition to Leeching Poison, all core cards in KBR, so why are you complaining?
"The flow of time is always cruel... its speed seems different for each person, but no one can change it... A thing that does not change with time is a memory of younger days..."
this is the dumbest thing ever written on this site.
I see that this time they did hit the nail with the nerfs, I do not understand why there are people who complain.
Druid will continue to play in addition they will still use wild growth and nourish.
Saronite Chain Gang is used in most decks both defensive and offensive plus for 4 mana to put two 2/3 with taunt I think even if you only have one buff.
Leeching poison can still be played despite it being a turn because now you will think about it when using it.
Level up! it can be used in even and in the odd the expensive cards are Baku that can be used in other decks and corridor creeper that can be optional.
They want to take advantage of the powders that complain but if they took those decks in previous goals they will also rotate the next expansion. And those who created those decks in the first weeks had to wait a month to know the goal basically because the expansion just left and It is not established in such a short time.It's their problem if they did not have patience.
I see that this time they did hit the nail with the nerfs, I do not understand why there are people who complain.
Druid will continue to play in addition they will still use wild growth and nourish.
Saronite Chain Gang is used in most decks both defensive and offensive plus for 4 mana to put two 2/3 with taunt I think even if you only have one buff.
Leeching poison can still be played despite it being a turn because now you will think about it when using it.
Level up! it can be used in even and in the odd the expensive cards are Baku that can be used in other decks and corridor creeper that can be optional.
They want to take advantage of the powders that complain but if they took those decks in previous goals they will also rotate the next expansion. And those who created those decks in the first weeks had to wait a month to know the goal basically because the expansion just left and It is not established in such a short time.It's their problem if they did not have patience.
hi all , i bought the last 3 days in total around 75 packs , more over 120 euros and what i got out of it is really joke ! 4 legendarys , 5 epics rest bs ! and the when i contacted the support team , they come with an post on reddit that is 1 year old about the legendary system.
what i didnt know is . That un Goro packs are before the Legendary system got implied which means ! from my 35 un goro packs i had 0 legendarys . which means, fck that .
there stands nothing on the forums about it , neither in the support forum about it . But hey they got my money now they literally dont give a fck about their ppl it seems.
Otherwise they would have me least for good will helped out a bit or something else. If that shit continues like that . iam faster gone from this as u can spell Fail lizard.
i recorded all my pack openings , you can hit em up on facebook.
today i crafted odd mage kinda , was expensive as fck , i have like 0 cards left . when this gets nerfed also . Than fck this and i play with myself.
Cheers Chris