Valeera and Jaina DK must have the cost reduced for 8 or, for balance, DK priest increase the cost for 9.
Jaina at 8 mana would be nuts, I hope you see why.
Ok, in this case why the much more powerful, unfair, unbalanced, insanely OP, totally broken priest DK don't need to cost 9 for the same reasons?
I really don't think DK Jaina or Valeera for 8 manas will break the game with aggro and tempo decks can play very strong 1° turns and 0 manas 5/5 in turn 3.
On topic, though... probably LITERALLY EVERY BOARD CLEAR PRINTED BEFORE KARAZAN.
If you look at other card games with similar monster growth rates as this game, they typically set the mana cost of board clears at 1 mana per damage dealt to ALL monsters (allied or otherwise) and an additional 1-2 mana cost for 'monsters your enemies control' instead.
Guardian of Kings says hello ! Seriously this card could be 5 mana without problems.
The funny part is there was the time in the Beta and Pre-Naxxramas release where one of these in Paladin decks was standard. Now it has been FAR outclassed by later releases.
Valeera and Jaina DK must have the cost reduced for 8 or, for balance, DK priest increase the cost for 9.
Jaina at 8 mana would be nuts, I hope you see why.
Ok, in this case why the much more powerful, unfair, unbalanced, insanely OP, totally broken priest DK don't need to cost 9 for the same reasons?
I really don't think DK Jaina or Valeera for 8 manas will break the game with aggro and tempo decks can play very strong 1° turns and 0 manas 5/5 in turn 3.
Because the Priest DK isn't "insanely unfair, OP, unbalanced, totally broken." It's only ridiculously strong in combination with Raza, and ONLY if you build your deck around it.
It's used in non Raza lists because it's a strong and fair card, as most of the other DKs are.
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Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination.
Never in the history of Hearthstone has a card been directly buffed. It'll never happen.
Unleash the hounds have a cost reduction from 4 to 3 for once.
It used to cost 2. They partially backtracked on the nerf from 4 to 3 eventually. No card has ever been buffed from its original version; they simply get superseded by newer and better cards
Murloc warleader used to give +2/+1 to ENEMY murlocs as well.
Abusive sergeant used to be a 1/1, then buffed to a 2/1, then nerfed to a 1/1.
Battle rage used to cost 3 mana.
Injured blademaster used to be a 3/7.
Buffs have happened. Stop lying to yourselves and others.
Maybe adjusting Murloc Warleader could be considered a buff if you ignored that it's initial affect also worked in your favor for your board too if you also played murlocs - but fine, I'll give you this one.
Including card changes from Alpha and Beta releases where massive balancing of the core cards was occurring prior to official release of the game, you can just fuck right off with that shit.
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
Never in the history of Hearthstone has a card been directly buffed. It'll never happen.
Depends on whether you count the change to Bane of Doom as a DIRECT buff.
They changed it from only being able to pull a few crappy demons to being able to pull any collectible demon in the game.
I mean "direct" buffs, where altering the card has made it singularly better, otherwise one would say that Knife Juggler was buffed by Call to Arms. Just because one or more cards makes it good to run something again, doesn't mean it's buffed because if the "buff" is conditional on how good the other cards make something, it's not really a "buff", is it?
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
Never in the history of Hearthstone has a card been directly buffed. It'll never happen.
Unleash the hounds have a cost reduction from 4 to 3 for once.
It used to cost 2. They partially backtracked on the nerf from 4 to 3 eventually. No card has ever been buffed from its original version; they simply get superseded by newer and better cards
Murloc warleader used to give +2/+1 to ENEMY murlocs as well.
Abusive sergeant used to be a 1/1, then buffed to a 2/1, then nerfed to a 1/1.
Battle rage used to cost 3 mana.
Injured blademaster used to be a 3/7.
Buffs have happened. Stop lying to yourselves and others.
Maybe adjusting Murloc Warleader could be considered a buff if you ignored that it's initial affect also worked in your favor for your board too if you also played murlocs - but fine, I'll give you this one.
Including card changes from Alpha and Beta releases where massive balancing of the core cards was occurring prior to official release of the game, you can just fuck right off with that shit.
All you said was 'original' and you can't get more original than alpha.
But even if we ignore alpha/beta, i already pointed out murloc warleader, but there's also Lord Jaraxxus not being hit by secrets in KotFT, Wickerflame Burnbristle no longer infinite looping on Auchenai Soulpriest, naga sea witch's MASSIVE overhaul, and any number of cards not having a tribal tag later being given them. (It does matter to arena that mana geode, Hallazeal the Ascended, and Jade Spirit are elementals, and they DID spend an entire patch as not elementals)
Never in the history of Hearthstone has a card been directly buffed. It'll never happen.
Unleash the hounds have a cost reduction from 4 to 3 for once.
It used to cost 2. They partially backtracked on the nerf from 4 to 3 eventually. No card has ever been buffed from its original version; they simply get superseded by newer and better cards
Murloc warleader used to give +2/+1 to ENEMY murlocs as well.
Abusive sergeant used to be a 1/1, then buffed to a 2/1, then nerfed to a 1/1.
Battle rage used to cost 3 mana.
Injured blademaster used to be a 3/7.
Buffs have happened. Stop lying to yourselves and others.
Maybe adjusting Murloc Warleader could be considered a buff if you ignored that it's initial affect also worked in your favor for your board too if you also played murlocs - but fine, I'll give you this one.
Including card changes from Alpha and Beta releases where massive balancing of the core cards was occurring prior to official release of the game, you can just fuck right off with that shit.
All you said was 'original' and you can't get more original than alpha.
But even if we ignore alpha/beta, i already pointed out murloc warleader, but there's also Lord Jaraxxus not being hit by secrets in KotFT, Wickerflame Burnbristle no longer infinite looping on Auchenai Soulpriest, naga sea witch's MASSIVE overhaul, and any number of cards not having a tribal tag later being given them. (It does matter to arena that mana geode, Hallazeal the Ascended, and Jade Spirit are elementals, and they DID spend an entire patch as not elementals)
Timmylol mentioned "original", not me, but as for the other stuff:
Changing game mechanics that affect the way all cards operate isn't buffing a single card, but if it is a buff it's indirect. What I'm saying is that they have yet to take a card and modify it's cost or card text in a way so as to make it more useful and likely to be played as a result. Like Timmylol said, they just release newer cards that supercede them like River Crocolisk and Plated Beetle - if there was a beast deck that needed a 2 mana 2/3 Beast, the Crocolisk just lost the running.
As for the adding the Elemental tribe, this is the closest thing that could be argued to be a buff, except it was created not for the benefit of previous cards that were retconned as elementals so much as it was for the benefit of the new cards being introduced in Un'goro that generated the synergy and the value of the tribal tag gained. Without those newer cards that manufactured the synergy, the older cards as a standalone gain no direct benefit as a standalone buff. If it's a true buff, the card should be inherently better because of the changed card text, otherwise the benefit is conditional on other cards and can't really be a buff.
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
The cards I listed gaining the elemental tag were released prior to ungoro BUT importantly - they did not receive the elemental tag until the patch where rogue quest was nerfed. Thats a pretty sizable time for those cards to exist in a meta where elementals existed, but they didn't count.
And there are a few other minor other examples sprinkled throughout other expansions (Silithid Swarmer wasn't a beast when it was released, for example) but the second wave elementals are the obvious ones, rather than the first wave ones like fire elemental and earth elemental just getting them right away.
The importance of GAINING said tag is that it allows said cards to activate synergistic effects they previously hadn't. If they removed the elemental tag from Water Elemental (for some reason) at this moment, you absolutely would call that a nerf. Why would adding the tag after the fact be any different?
The cards I listed gaining the elemental tag were released prior to ungoro BUT importantly - they did not receive the elemental tag until the patch where rogue quest was nerfed. Thats a pretty sizable time for those cards to exist in a meta where elementals existed, but they didn't count.
And there are a few other minor other examples sprinkled throughout other expansions (Silithid Swarmer wasn't a beast when it was released, for example) but the second wave elementals are the obvious ones, rather than the first wave ones like fire elemental and earth elemental just getting them right away.
The importance of GAINING said tag is that it allows said cards to activate synergistic effects they previously hadn't. If they removed the elemental tag from Water Elemental (for some reason) at this moment, you absolutely would call that a nerf. Why would adding the tag after the fact be any different?
Fair point, I'll concede adding the tag for a whole new tribe is a buff for a whole group of cards. Still, though, my point remains that no card that was unplayable has been looked at by Team 5 and had the dev team say, "Hey, you know what we should do? Take X card that people aren't using because stats say it's included in .01% of decks and add some (Attack/Health) and lower the mana cost by 1" - that's for sure never happened.
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
It will never happen, and I understand why it wont. I agree with it. However, I would like if some of the cooler cards were buffed. Poor Illidan is so bad.
The cards I listed gaining the elemental tag were released prior to ungoro BUT importantly - they did not receive the elemental tag until the patch where rogue quest was nerfed. Thats a pretty sizable time for those cards to exist in a meta where elementals existed, but they didn't count.
And there are a few other minor other examples sprinkled throughout other expansions (Silithid Swarmer wasn't a beast when it was released, for example) but the second wave elementals are the obvious ones, rather than the first wave ones like fire elemental and earth elemental just getting them right away.
The importance of GAINING said tag is that it allows said cards to activate synergistic effects they previously hadn't. If they removed the elemental tag from Water Elemental (for some reason) at this moment, you absolutely would call that a nerf. Why would adding the tag after the fact be any different?
Fair point, I'll concede adding the tag for a whole new tribe is a buff for a whole group of cards. Still, though, my point remains that no card that was unplayable has been looked at by Team 5 and had the dev team say, "Hey, you know what we should do? Take X card that people aren't using because stats say it's included in .01% of decks and add some (Attack/Health) and lower the mana cost by 1" - that's for sure never happened.
Oh. Pft. Yeah.
+1 attack/health, -1 cost, +1 damage, etc? Yeah. Never happened since beta. All of the buffs they HAVE done have been relatively obtuse or related to the mechanics said card interacts with, rather than the stats themselves.
Should they?
Hmmmm dunno.
Theres a risk to just upgrading something by such discrete numbers, and its a problem we saw with Abusive Sergeant, bacj in alpha it was a 1/1 that they felt wasn't used enough, so they buffed it to a 2/1. And then they later reverted it to a 1/1 because that +1 attack was WAY out of line. I'm kind of alright with just changing text and rearranging a card in a way that is clearly better/worse than the original, but unclear if it wa worth or not. The Plated Beetle/River Crocolisk example is a good example, just giving a 2/3 beast +3 armor was all it took for crocolisk to become viable.
But at the same time, without River Crocolisk, players don't have a reasonable baseline to judge further cards released. I think that the vanilla cards are FINE being unbuffed. Some of the weirder effects.... hmmm maybe? But like I said, certainly wouldn't want them just brute force buffed because the discreteness of those stats don't allow much fine tuning in terms of balance.
1. Patches is shuffled back into your deck when he dies. Is now a 2/2. Is now a basic card.
2. Raza no longer requires a highlander deck and is moved to a basic card.
3. Call to Arms now gives summoned minions charge and divine shield.
4. Psychic scream costs 6 and now causes shuffled minions to cost 3 more.
5. Corridor Creeper now has its cost reduced even when its in your deck. At the start of the game, if both players have Creepers, 1 player’s Creepers at random get destroyed. Creepers are too big to fit in the corridor.
6. Bonemare now costs 5. If there is no friendly minion on board, it now summons a 1/1 minion immune to spells which it casts its battlecry on.
7. Jade Idols now summon Jade Golems with charge. All Jade Cards moves to basic.
On topic, though... probably LITERALLY EVERY BOARD CLEAR PRINTED BEFORE KARAZAN.
If you look at other card games with similar monster growth rates as this game, they typically set the mana cost of board clears at 1 mana per damage dealt to ALL monsters (allied or otherwise) and an additional 1-2 mana cost for 'monsters your enemies control' instead.
Think he meant windfury
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
Changing game mechanics that affect the way all cards operate isn't buffing a single card, but if it is a buff it's indirect. What I'm saying is that they have yet to take a card and modify it's cost or card text in a way so as to make it more useful and likely to be played as a result. Like Timmylol said, they just release newer cards that supercede them like River Crocolisk and Plated Beetle - if there was a beast deck that needed a 2 mana 2/3 Beast, the Crocolisk just lost the running.
"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
The cards I listed gaining the elemental tag were released prior to ungoro BUT importantly - they did not receive the elemental tag until the patch where rogue quest was nerfed. Thats a pretty sizable time for those cards to exist in a meta where elementals existed, but they didn't count.
And there are a few other minor other examples sprinkled throughout other expansions (Silithid Swarmer wasn't a beast when it was released, for example) but the second wave elementals are the obvious ones, rather than the first wave ones like fire elemental and earth elemental just getting them right away.
The importance of GAINING said tag is that it allows said cards to activate synergistic effects they previously hadn't. If they removed the elemental tag from Water Elemental (for some reason) at this moment, you absolutely would call that a nerf. Why would adding the tag after the fact be any different?
"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
It will never happen, and I understand why it wont. I agree with it. However, I would like if some of the cooler cards were buffed. Poor Illidan is so bad.
1. Patches is shuffled back into your deck when he dies. Is now a 2/2. Is now a basic card.
2. Raza no longer requires a highlander deck and is moved to a basic card.
3. Call to Arms now gives summoned minions charge and divine shield.
4. Psychic scream costs 6 and now causes shuffled minions to cost 3 more.
5. Corridor Creeper now has its cost reduced even when its in your deck. At the start of the game, if both players have Creepers, 1 player’s Creepers at random get destroyed. Creepers are too big to fit in the corridor.
6. Bonemare now costs 5. If there is no friendly minion on board, it now summons a 1/1 minion immune to spells which it casts its battlecry on.
7. Jade Idols now summon Jade Golems with charge. All Jade Cards moves to basic.
And remove standard. So classic tag will be irrelevant.
+1 health to all basic cards could be a start
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