While I've liked what I've seen so for from KotFT, one realization I had due the hero card concept with DKs is we probably aren't going to see DK as a separate class. Seems if they were going to do it they'd implement it with this expansion. However, I'm not necessarily surprised because adding a class would require a significant number of new cards just for that class which would mean either (1) less cards for other classes if they are still targeting 130-140 new cards with an expansion or (2) a much larger expansion requiring more development time to add the normal 130-140 expansion cards + catch up class cards for a new class.
It would be interesting, but when you think about it, every expansion should, at leat in theory, shake the meta enough with new mechanics and cards so we wouldn't miss having Monks or DKs as hero classes.
But if they're planning on new classes for the future, I'd say DK won't be the first we'll get after those hero cards...
It was pretty much already confirmed before it was even talked about, that Hearthstone would never add a 10th class, but this pretty much removes the possibility even further They've had to change the UI (because the class selection is 3x3), they'd have to add over 100 Death Knight class cards into the game at once all with even distribution across all sets so they wouldn't have an advantage in number of class cards, and balancing 9 classes is already difficult enough. Adding another class into the mix would make it even harder. It would probably also be a bit overwhelming for returning players to see that all of a sudden, a whole new class has been added into the game.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Click the image to go to my custom Time Traveler class.
I think adding a new class is about the same kind of work as adding an expansion or adventure. I enjoyed the adventures a lot more than being told to buy 200 packs and still not get all the cards. The adventures themselves were fun, and everyone got the cards, then had enough time to try and fill the holes in their collection from classic and other sets.
They then decided adventures don't keep Brode in flannel, and to scrap them. They could just as easily decide to bring them back, or when they run out of ideas people are willing to drop a ton of cash on, they might think adventures, or a new class are just the kind of spice we need to separate us from our gold, virtual and otherwise.
Whats a DK? A warlock/mage/warrior combo? and whats a Monk? ... a.. uh... warrior with some druidyishkinda inner yoga magic with some wind stuff?
Balance issues probably aren't the main issue here. Though its likely a major one.
They are unique, but they aren't exclusive, unlike most of the other classes. For this reason you wont ever see combo classes... Though Paladin is the exception here since its a clerical warrior and all, but lets not talk about that. XD
Even Paladin has its own flavor though, since it's not about the enrage style effects of Warrior or the shadowy side of Priest, but rather an extremely pure, protective version of the extremes of those 2 classes. With Death Knight, you're mostly just a Warrior with zombies, and you can't go too far with any of its themes without becoming either a Warlock-style zoo deck with undead or a Warrior style deck that's very tanky and control based. You can't even focus on freeze or anti-spell effects without moving into Mage's territory by a lot, so there's really very little new flavor to go with in Death Knights. I completely agree, there's essentially no point in adding any of the 3 extra classes of WoW, since their flavors are so deeply similar to those that are already in the game.
I told this one on an other thread about classes. But what if you could combine two classes?
Like most people saying, adding a new class would be a colossal piece of work. And what do you do with all the previous expansion that are now in wild? I don't see how it will be possible to add it. And I quite enjoy those 9 classes, it's more than enough :)
But combining these 9 classes, that could be a great idea! You choose a class and a second sub-class, and you could have for example two hero powers, or you could mix cards of two classes in one deck or both ! This way, no need of modifying the card pool that is already existing, no need to create a brand new class and you would open a new way of making decks to bring many new fun and insane archetypes !!
Yeah, on the subject of exclusivity between class identity, its nothing new were mentioning here.
I do however love the idea of mixing classes, and its been done really well with The Elder Scrolls CG. The main upside is that they designed the game with that in mind from the get-go and has been a staple identity of the Elder Scrolls franchise. You've never been pinned to one type of play-style in those games and it would have been strange of them to design it any other way.
This is the opposite for Hearthstone/World of Warcraft. The design really hampers with class identity and screws around with the whole hero concept (something ES:O CG doesnt exactly have). IMO, certain balance issues would continuously rule the meta and you'd likely devolve the game into what aggro works best. In the end, it would lead to what cards we have now being rotated out and the new cards we see are extremely underwhelming to make up for the fact that they can be abused in specific setups. Compared to what we have now with some super exciting and OP cards that make us happy peppered heavily with trash we'll never use.
We won't see new class. I think like never ever. Because it seems for Blizzard it's easier to introduce DK's mechanic to all 9 classes instead of making Death Knight class itself.
Even Paladin has its own flavor though, since it's not about the enrage style effects of Warrior or the shadowy side of Priest, but rather an extremely pure, protective version of the extremes of those 2 classes. With Death Knight, you're mostly just a Warrior with zombies, and you can't go too far with any of its themes without becoming either a Warlock-style zoo deck with undead or a Warrior style deck that's very tanky and control based. You can't even focus on freeze or anti-spell effects without moving into Mage's territory by a lot, so there's really very little new flavor to go with in Death Knights. I completely agree, there's essentially no point in adding any of the 3 extra classes of WoW, since their flavors are so deeply similar to those that are already in the game.
Also note that Paladin being a 'thing' became a major problem for a long while since blizzard didn't have a clue what to really DO with them. It's why they have secrets in fact (1 mana secrets used to be a rogue thing). This helps explain why paladin has such a hard time getting themselves together as, even now, the only things that really 'syncs' with them is heavy self healing and minion buffing, both of which never really worked.
Note that the current decks that work are murloc based, which is rather....random for a class like Paladin to have.
And that's for a class that's had years to work on themselves. And we're assuming DK can just fit in just fine?
As I said elsewhere, would we really be talking about needing another class if WoW didn't have those 3 extra classes? If not then do we REALLY need the classes just to sync up with WoW?
We don't need any more dispersion of class cards, especially for f2p.
Also, we don't need one more factor for possible balance issues.
The hero cards are the best solution to implement dk flavour, and actually better for differentiation, since each class becomes a particular kind of dk.
To add death knight, they would literally have to dedicate an entire expansion to catching him up on class cards. So its unlikely the further hs goes. Tbh, if I was in charge of blizzard what I would have done with this expansion is add the lich king as the 10th class and made every card available a death night class card or a neutral. I would then sell the entire expansion, everything included for 50 bucks.
Also, lmao at anyone claiming balance is the issue. This is arguably the most balanced the game has ever been and warlock is almost unplayable, with decks running around that decided games on turn 1. I dont want to hear it. Hearthstone will be just as unbalanced with or without a death knight class. Just give people what they want at this point. You can't act like balance is even close to blizzard's top priority.
Undoubtedly adding a class will increase complexity but I hardly think that's a reason not to add a class. Adding keywords and cards increases complexity also but those events still occur.
Undoubtedly adding a class will increase complexity but I hardly think that's a reason not to add a class. Adding keywords and cards increases complexity also but those events still occur.
Adding a class adds literally no value to the game. If you just want a different playstyle, then play a different deck.
It's an absolute nightmare for them to add another class at this point, they would have to design a whole new set of class cards for each of the previous expansions, either remake adventures to integrate the extra class reward cards or just dump the card rewards at the end which would be ugly.
They then have to balance this extra class both via wild and standard on top of the current cycle of class balancing both at a new expansion and inter-expansion.
There's also the issue of how previously rotated sets with the new class would be obtained, it's quite acceptable to make wild cards pay only when they could have been acquired via gold for a long time. It's sort of a "you should have been there when it was released" mentality. It's a different issue entirely to make the extra class cards from goblins for example completely money aquirable.
All this and then there's still the issue that all classes we have currently aren't always competitive. Adding another class is just another chance for one to sit on the sideline for an expansion.
Tl,dr: It's too much effort with barely any pay off.
They already said several times they had no plans or interest in making more classes for the game, it's not even on their radar. People have asked about DK and Monk class forever and Blizzard has never once given a favorable response about it. That's why they are designing the next expansion this way, so that people can somewhat have what they've been begging for.
Undoubtedly adding a class will increase complexity but I hardly think that's a reason not to add a class. Adding keywords and cards increases complexity also but those events still occur.
Adding a class adds literally no value to the game. If you just want a different playstyle, then play a different deck.
Based on that "logic" they shouldn't add any cards either.
Undoubtedly adding a class will increase complexity but I hardly think that's a reason not to add a class. Adding keywords and cards increases complexity also but those events still occur.
Adding a class adds literally no value to the game. If you just want a different playstyle, then play a different deck.
Based on that "logic" they shouldn't add any cards either.
What he means I think is that adding the class doesn't add anything that can't already be added now with the 9 we have. The theory is that any mechanic could easily fit into either a current class or as a neutral element (ala Quests, or murlocs). Hybrids also can be nestled into a current class as well. The original idea people had for DK is that it would be 'the deathrattle/graveyard' class. Then the concept was put into Priest.
We not only have 9 different classes, but we have the ability to change them into different heros with different hero powers and flat out redesign their archetype (see what just happened with DK hunters). Meanwhile, we have formally pulled ourselves away from the need to 'mimic' WoW, so we really don't have to incorporate anything just because WoW had it that way. That ends the whole "WoW had DK/Monk/DH so we should too." Argument.
So given that we can do all that, what DOES adding a completely new class add to the game that can't be added another way.
(note, if anything, I could see an argument for HS having too many classes as is. Paladin is clearly a "class we needed because WoW had it" element and has been suffering from identity issues since then. It's also hurt Rogue and Priest who's secrets and buffing/healing mechanics were taken/diminished so that they could give Paladins some kind of identity.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
While I've liked what I've seen so for from KotFT, one realization I had due the hero card concept with DKs is we probably aren't going to see DK as a separate class. Seems if they were going to do it they'd implement it with this expansion. However, I'm not necessarily surprised because adding a class would require a significant number of new cards just for that class which would mean either (1) less cards for other classes if they are still targeting 130-140 new cards with an expansion or (2) a much larger expansion requiring more development time to add the normal 130-140 expansion cards + catch up class cards for a new class.
I honestly dont think we need more classes...
It would be interesting, but when you think about it, every expansion should, at leat in theory, shake the meta enough with new mechanics and cards so we wouldn't miss having Monks or DKs as hero classes.
But if they're planning on new classes for the future, I'd say DK won't be the first we'll get after those hero cards...
It was pretty much already confirmed before it was even talked about, that Hearthstone would never add a 10th class, but this pretty much removes the possibility even further They've had to change the UI (because the class selection is 3x3), they'd have to add over 100 Death Knight class cards into the game at once all with even distribution across all sets so they wouldn't have an advantage in number of class cards, and balancing 9 classes is already difficult enough. Adding another class into the mix would make it even harder. It would probably also be a bit overwhelming for returning players to see that all of a sudden, a whole new class has been added into the game.
Click the image to go to my custom Time Traveler class.
yes.
Release the Kraken!
I think adding a new class is about the same kind of work as adding an expansion or adventure. I enjoyed the adventures a lot more than being told to buy 200 packs and still not get all the cards. The adventures themselves were fun, and everyone got the cards, then had enough time to try and fill the holes in their collection from classic and other sets.
They then decided adventures don't keep Brode in flannel, and to scrap them. They could just as easily decide to bring them back, or when they run out of ideas people are willing to drop a ton of cash on, they might think adventures, or a new class are just the kind of spice we need to separate us from our gold, virtual and otherwise.
Whats a DK? A warlock/mage/warrior combo? and whats a Monk? ... a.. uh... warrior with some druidyishkinda inner yoga magic with some wind stuff?
Balance issues probably aren't the main issue here. Though its likely a major one.
They are unique, but they aren't exclusive, unlike most of the other classes. For this reason you wont ever see combo classes... Though Paladin is the exception here since its a clerical warrior and all, but lets not talk about that. XD
Even Paladin has its own flavor though, since it's not about the enrage style effects of Warrior or the shadowy side of Priest, but rather an extremely pure, protective version of the extremes of those 2 classes. With Death Knight, you're mostly just a Warrior with zombies, and you can't go too far with any of its themes without becoming either a Warlock-style zoo deck with undead or a Warrior style deck that's very tanky and control based. You can't even focus on freeze or anti-spell effects without moving into Mage's territory by a lot, so there's really very little new flavor to go with in Death Knights. I completely agree, there's essentially no point in adding any of the 3 extra classes of WoW, since their flavors are so deeply similar to those that are already in the game.
I told this one on an other thread about classes. But what if you could combine two classes?
Like most people saying, adding a new class would be a colossal piece of work. And what do you do with all the previous expansion that are now in wild? I don't see how it will be possible to add it. And I quite enjoy those 9 classes, it's more than enough :)
But combining these 9 classes, that could be a great idea! You choose a class and a second sub-class, and you could have for example two hero powers, or you could mix cards of two classes in one deck or both ! This way, no need of modifying the card pool that is already existing, no need to create a brand new class and you would open a new way of making decks to bring many new fun and insane archetypes !!
What do you think about that?
@CheddarMaster
Yeah, on the subject of exclusivity between class identity, its nothing new were mentioning here.
I do however love the idea of mixing classes, and its been done really well with The Elder Scrolls CG. The main upside is that they designed the game with that in mind from the get-go and has been a staple identity of the Elder Scrolls franchise. You've never been pinned to one type of play-style in those games and it would have been strange of them to design it any other way.
This is the opposite for Hearthstone/World of Warcraft. The design really hampers with class identity and screws around with the whole hero concept (something ES:O CG doesnt exactly have). IMO, certain balance issues would continuously rule the meta and you'd likely devolve the game into what aggro works best. In the end, it would lead to what cards we have now being rotated out and the new cards we see are extremely underwhelming to make up for the fact that they can be abused in specific setups. Compared to what we have now with some super exciting and OP cards that make us happy peppered heavily with trash we'll never use.
We won't see new class. I think like never ever. Because it seems for Blizzard it's easier to introduce DK's mechanic to all 9 classes instead of making Death Knight class itself.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.
We don't need any more dispersion of class cards, especially for f2p.
Also, we don't need one more factor for possible balance issues.
The hero cards are the best solution to implement dk flavour, and actually better for differentiation, since each class becomes a particular kind of dk.
To add death knight, they would literally have to dedicate an entire expansion to catching him up on class cards. So its unlikely the further hs goes. Tbh, if I was in charge of blizzard what I would have done with this expansion is add the lich king as the 10th class and made every card available a death night class card or a neutral. I would then sell the entire expansion, everything included for 50 bucks.
Also, lmao at anyone claiming balance is the issue. This is arguably the most balanced the game has ever been and warlock is almost unplayable, with decks running around that decided games on turn 1. I dont want to hear it. Hearthstone will be just as unbalanced with or without a death knight class. Just give people what they want at this point. You can't act like balance is even close to blizzard's top priority.
Undoubtedly adding a class will increase complexity but I hardly think that's a reason not to add a class. Adding keywords and cards increases complexity also but those events still occur.
Make the Card: The biggest thread on the site!
My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
It's an absolute nightmare for them to add another class at this point, they would have to design a whole new set of class cards for each of the previous expansions, either remake adventures to integrate the extra class reward cards or just dump the card rewards at the end which would be ugly.
They then have to balance this extra class both via wild and standard on top of the current cycle of class balancing both at a new expansion and inter-expansion.
There's also the issue of how previously rotated sets with the new class would be obtained, it's quite acceptable to make wild cards pay only when they could have been acquired via gold for a long time. It's sort of a "you should have been there when it was released" mentality. It's a different issue entirely to make the extra class cards from goblins for example completely money aquirable.
All this and then there's still the issue that all classes we have currently aren't always competitive. Adding another class is just another chance for one to sit on the sideline for an expansion.
Tl,dr: It's too much effort with barely any pay off.
Always the extra class demon hunter;)
AJAX AMSTERDAM
They already said several times they had no plans or interest in making more classes for the game, it's not even on their radar. People have asked about DK and Monk class forever and Blizzard has never once given a favorable response about it. That's why they are designing the next expansion this way, so that people can somewhat have what they've been begging for.
One does not simply walk into Mordor,
unless they want to be the best they can be.